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This is the end of Trump Some blows are fatal, even for the Donald


December 16, 2022   4 mins

On Thursday, Donald Trump made the “major announcement” on Truth Social that he’d teased the day before. Since declaring for the 2024 presidency in mid-November, he’s done precious little campaigning; many expected him to release rally dates or issue some sort of platform. Instead, he informed his supporters that they could purchase Trump-themed NFT trading cards for the low price of $99.

It was a farcical conclusion to a very bad week for the former president. Earlier in the week, USA Today published a poll finding that Republican voters preferred Florida governor Ron DeSantis to the ex-president by a 2-to-1 margin, 56% to 33%. Early hopes among Trump die-hards that this result was “biased” were then thoroughly dashed on Wednesday, when the Wall Street Journal and CNN came out with polls showing strikingly similar results. In the Journal poll, DeSantis led Trump 52-38. CNN worded its questions differently, but found that Republican voters preferred a “different candidate” over Trump by a 62-38 margin. DeSantis was the most popular alternative.

It is a dangerous business to predict the political demise of Trump, who has been making pundits look stupid since he stepped onto the national stage. Few took him seriously as a candidate when he first declared in 2015, few believed he could defeat Hillary Clinton in 2016, and few believed he could come within a few tens of thousands of votes of re-election in 2020. But this time is different. Trump really is done. 

Analysis of his political fortunes has always been somewhat distorted by the fact that he is universally loathed by the American media class — or at least those who exist outside the self-contained bubble of conservative media. How could people vote for such an obviously unfit candidate? Well, pundits said, because they were racists, or economically anxious, or conspiracy-addled lunatics in thrall to lurid theories about paedophile elites. Perhaps it was because the Left had become too woke and abandoned the working class. But, surely, the man was so ludicrous and criminal that the American people would eventually come to their senses and chuck him out. 

The truth was always a lot simpler. Most Trump supporters — aside from a numerically small but electorally important slice of Obama-Trump voters in the Midwest — liked him because they were Republicans and he was the Republican candidate. Recall that Trump won a plurality, not a majority, of the GOP primary vote in 2016, and that was against a fatally crowded establishment field — similar to what Bernie Sanders accomplished in 2020 before Barack Obama intervened to unify his party’s establishment behind Joe Biden. But the voters who backed other GOP candidates were not about to cast a vote for Hillary Clinton, no matter what Trump did or said. 

Once Trump was the nominee and, later, the president, the most powerful force in American politics, negative partisanship, was there to do the heavy lifting. For most Right-leaning Americans, you could always tell yourself something along these lines: “Sure, Trump is a loose cannon with a complicated relationship to the truth. But I like his policies, the economy is doing great, the media is biased against him and exaggerates his flaws, and in any case, better him than a Democrat.”

Trump’s talent for polarising the entire political field made it easy for him to shore up Republican support. Whatever he did, good or bad, one could be sure that at least one prominent Democrat (and probably more than one) would respond with something so outrageous to the sensibilities of Republican voters that they would feel they had no choice but to support their man. 

Then, 2020 changed all that. There was, of course, the loss itself, the refusal to concede, and the debacle of January 6, although the latter meant more to voters who were already inclined to dislike him. The bigger problem for Trump was simply that he was no longer president. No more White House press briefings, no more Twitter account, and no more 24/7 Trump news cycle, despite the best efforts of CNN and the January 6 committee. Trump was, of course, still the most famous Republican in the country, and still beloved by most of the base — for a time. But for a man whose singular political genius was his ability to command attention and turn it to his advantage, being one option among many for 2024 — not to mention one with eight years of political baggage in a country where voters are notoriously fickle — was always going to be an uphill battle. 

It took the midterms and their aftermath, however, to deliver the death blow. Everyone in the GOP knew that Trump had backed a number of bad candidates in winnable races, but in the last few months before the election, most believed the hype about an incoming red wave (I did too). But the red wave was fake news, and Trump candidates sank the GOP ticket in major swing states such as Pennsylvania, Georgia, and Arizona. Trump responded by lashing out against DeSantis, one of the few Republicans to make an impressive showing in an otherwise disastrous year. In 2016, he had ridiculed candidates such as Jeb Bush and Marco Rubio, and it had worked because voters believed in their hearts that they really were low-energy losers. Now Trump was the loser attempting to bully the winner, and the jokes weren’t funny anymore. 

The month and a half since the midterms has been one long, rolling disaster for Trump. Against the wishes of his advisors, he announced his reelection bid barely a week after the electoral bloodbath, earning the endorsement of only one senator. Rupert Murdoch abandoned him. His company was found guilty of criminal tax evasion in Manhattan. He hosted Kanye West and the white nationalist Nick Fuentes in Mar a Lago; following a massive backlash, his camp was forced to claim that he had been tricked by the rapper’s entourage, only for Kanye to go on Alex Jones a few days later and sing the praises of Hitler. After the release of the “Twitter Files” — internal documents relating to the company’s decision to ban Trump after the Capitol Riot — Trump seemingly called for the suspension of the Constitution. By the time he announced the NFTs, it was hard not to wonder if even he had given up hope. 

If Trump were still president, no doubt he’d be able to rally more support. But he’s only an ex-president, and one who seems more embittered and desperate by the day. Unlike in 2016, he only has one rival. And unluckily for Trump, DeSantis looks like a man who can win.

***

Order your copy of UnHerd’s first print edition here. 


Park MacDougald is Deputy Literary Editor for Tablet

hpmacd

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Hugh Bryant
Hugh Bryant
1 year ago

De Santis does look like the return of wholesome, grown up politics after the infantile and sordid shenanigans of the past seven years. Good luck to him. I wish we had someone like that in the UK instead of the endlessly grovelling and apologetic shower that we have now.

Fred Paul
Fred Paul
1 year ago
Reply to  Hugh Bryant

Mr. Bryant, I’m a Canadian living in Florida. De Santis is not honourable, and doesn’t think twice about bullying anyone. He’s a Trump with brains.

Mr Bellisarius
Mr Bellisarius
1 year ago
Reply to  Fred Paul

He’s a Trump with brains.
That would still be an improvement.

Samuel Ross
Samuel Ross
1 year ago
Reply to  Fred Paul

Respectfully, then, go back home to Canada. No one is making you stay.

Mr Bellisarius
Mr Bellisarius
1 year ago
Reply to  Fred Paul

He’s a Trump with brains.
That would still be an improvement.

Samuel Ross
Samuel Ross
1 year ago
Reply to  Fred Paul

Respectfully, then, go back home to Canada. No one is making you stay.

Fred Paul
Fred Paul
1 year ago
Reply to  Hugh Bryant

Mr. Bryant, I’m a Canadian living in Florida. De Santis is not honourable, and doesn’t think twice about bullying anyone. He’s a Trump with brains.

Hugh Bryant
Hugh Bryant
1 year ago

De Santis does look like the return of wholesome, grown up politics after the infantile and sordid shenanigans of the past seven years. Good luck to him. I wish we had someone like that in the UK instead of the endlessly grovelling and apologetic shower that we have now.

Matt Hindman
Matt Hindman
1 year ago

I think Trump is done. The mainstream media, both parties political establishments, pop culture, the administrative state, the CIA, and the Justice Department have spent years trying to destroy him and failing. Now it feels strange to write this. At the end of the day, the only thing that could start to bring about the end of Trump was Trump. Considering his own narcissism and ego is what is bringing him down after all that, it is really quite impressive.
Honestly, I think he is just tired of it all and I’m not sure he is even serious anymore or even still wants to be president. In 2015 he was hammering his opponents on trade, foreign policy, and immigration. He may have been in your face about it and needed a bigger vocabulary, but you understood what he was messaging on. I cannot even tell what his big campaign sales pitch is supposed to be right now. He feels like he is just screwing around without knowing what to do and he cannot just go away, because his enemies need him to stay. The man who ended the Clinton, Cheney, and Bush dynasties now feels as low energy as Jeb.

Last edited 1 year ago by Matt Hindman
Brett H
Brett H
1 year ago
Reply to  Matt Hindman

“I think he is just tired of it all â€œ
I think you might be right. The amount of vitriol thrown at him, the constant harassment and “bombshell” stories has also tired us out. There’s only so much of this anyone can put up with.

Dominic A
Dominic A
1 year ago
Reply to  Brett H

Poor Donald – he never asked for this, never wanted any of it, did nothing to deserve it.

Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  Brett H

Therefore, the left wins and the strategy worked.

Bill Bailey
Bill Bailey
1 year ago
Reply to  Warren Trees

Not at all, De Santis does where Trump promised, ask Disney.

Bill Bailey
Bill Bailey
1 year ago
Reply to  Warren Trees

Not at all, De Santis does where Trump promised, ask Disney.

Dominic A
Dominic A
1 year ago
Reply to  Brett H

Poor Donald – he never asked for this, never wanted any of it, did nothing to deserve it.

Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  Brett H

Therefore, the left wins and the strategy worked.

Brian Villanueva
Brian Villanueva
1 year ago
Reply to  Matt Hindman

What all the elite powers of the world could not accomplish for 4 years, Trump has managed to do to himself. Even many who supported him said he was his own worst enemy. They were rigiht.

Bill Bailey
Bill Bailey
1 year ago
Reply to  Matt Hindman

Anyone who tries to flog NFTs at this point in time is done!

Fred Paul
Fred Paul
1 year ago
Reply to  Matt Hindman

Mr. Hindman, I originally thought Trump was the evil dumping on America. Unfortunately, he’s just a mirror reflecting the true values of Americans. Close to 45%. That far-right mentality is not good.

Andrew Fisher
Andrew Fisher
1 year ago
Reply to  Fred Paul

Don’t just use lazy clichĂ©d terms like ‘Far Right’. The number of black people in work soared, so did their income and from a low based more of them voted for Trump in 2020 than for any Republican candidate for decades. Many establishment parties, in Europe as well as the US have become increasingly detached from their working class (especially) voters because of issues such as off shoring jobs and mass and seemingly uncontrolled immigration. Good perhaps for the wealthy, not so much for ordinary folk.

Andrew Fisher
Andrew Fisher
1 year ago
Reply to  Fred Paul

Don’t just use lazy clichĂ©d terms like ‘Far Right’. The number of black people in work soared, so did their income and from a low based more of them voted for Trump in 2020 than for any Republican candidate for decades. Many establishment parties, in Europe as well as the US have become increasingly detached from their working class (especially) voters because of issues such as off shoring jobs and mass and seemingly uncontrolled immigration. Good perhaps for the wealthy, not so much for ordinary folk.

Brett H
Brett H
1 year ago
Reply to  Matt Hindman

“I think he is just tired of it all â€œ
I think you might be right. The amount of vitriol thrown at him, the constant harassment and “bombshell” stories has also tired us out. There’s only so much of this anyone can put up with.

Brian Villanueva
Brian Villanueva
1 year ago
Reply to  Matt Hindman

What all the elite powers of the world could not accomplish for 4 years, Trump has managed to do to himself. Even many who supported him said he was his own worst enemy. They were rigiht.

Bill Bailey
Bill Bailey
1 year ago
Reply to  Matt Hindman

Anyone who tries to flog NFTs at this point in time is done!

Fred Paul
Fred Paul
1 year ago
Reply to  Matt Hindman

Mr. Hindman, I originally thought Trump was the evil dumping on America. Unfortunately, he’s just a mirror reflecting the true values of Americans. Close to 45%. That far-right mentality is not good.

Matt Hindman
Matt Hindman
1 year ago

I think Trump is done. The mainstream media, both parties political establishments, pop culture, the administrative state, the CIA, and the Justice Department have spent years trying to destroy him and failing. Now it feels strange to write this. At the end of the day, the only thing that could start to bring about the end of Trump was Trump. Considering his own narcissism and ego is what is bringing him down after all that, it is really quite impressive.
Honestly, I think he is just tired of it all and I’m not sure he is even serious anymore or even still wants to be president. In 2015 he was hammering his opponents on trade, foreign policy, and immigration. He may have been in your face about it and needed a bigger vocabulary, but you understood what he was messaging on. I cannot even tell what his big campaign sales pitch is supposed to be right now. He feels like he is just screwing around without knowing what to do and he cannot just go away, because his enemies need him to stay. The man who ended the Clinton, Cheney, and Bush dynasties now feels as low energy as Jeb.

Last edited 1 year ago by Matt Hindman
Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago

The best outcome is that Trump just hoofs off.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago

I read this comment before posting but I did not recall your name in connection your later posts. I hope we can be less harsh and accusatory interlocutors (so to speak) in future…let me emend that to say I hope I will be.

Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Good!

Jerry Carroll
Jerry Carroll
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Do you drink tea with your pinky finger out?

Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Good!

Jerry Carroll
Jerry Carroll
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Do you drink tea with your pinky finger out?

Johnathan Galt
Johnathan Galt
1 year ago

Best for Russia and China, maybe.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago

I read this comment before posting but I did not recall your name in connection your later posts. I hope we can be less harsh and accusatory interlocutors (so to speak) in future…let me emend that to say I hope I will be.

Johnathan Galt
Johnathan Galt
1 year ago

Best for Russia and China, maybe.

Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago

The best outcome is that Trump just hoofs off.

John 0
John 0
1 year ago

Decent overview here, but some important things are missing. The FBI actively undermined his 2016 campaign, then his presidency, then his reelection. This is not acceptable, no matter what candidate is involved.

Fred Paul
Fred Paul
1 year ago
Reply to  John 0

Mr. John O. I would like to see your sources for this. I’m quite interested.

Billy Bob
Billy Bob
1 year ago
Reply to  John 0

The authorities also publicly investigated Clinton’s emails just before the election, something those on the left complained was politically motivated.
With a candidate such as Trump with multiple bankruptcies, businesses dotted all over and many interconnected commercial interests making him ripe for blackmail and corruption by bad actors, I’d be worried if the authorities didn’t keep a close eye on him to be honest.
Perhaps the FBI was simply doing what it is paid to do, and those it investigated saw into it whatever suited their narrative at the time?

Matt Hindman
Matt Hindman
1 year ago
Reply to  Billy Bob

You could make that argument in 2018. You cannot make that argument at the end of 2022 with a strait face. The days of pretending the FBI were innocent actors just doing their jobs are long over.

Last edited 1 year ago by Matt Hindman
Matt Hindman
Matt Hindman
1 year ago
Reply to  Billy Bob

You could make that argument in 2018. You cannot make that argument at the end of 2022 with a strait face. The days of pretending the FBI were innocent actors just doing their jobs are long over.

Last edited 1 year ago by Matt Hindman
Fred Paul
Fred Paul
1 year ago
Reply to  John 0

Mr. John O. I would like to see your sources for this. I’m quite interested.

Billy Bob
Billy Bob
1 year ago
Reply to  John 0

The authorities also publicly investigated Clinton’s emails just before the election, something those on the left complained was politically motivated.
With a candidate such as Trump with multiple bankruptcies, businesses dotted all over and many interconnected commercial interests making him ripe for blackmail and corruption by bad actors, I’d be worried if the authorities didn’t keep a close eye on him to be honest.
Perhaps the FBI was simply doing what it is paid to do, and those it investigated saw into it whatever suited their narrative at the time?

John 0
John 0
1 year ago

Decent overview here, but some important things are missing. The FBI actively undermined his 2016 campaign, then his presidency, then his reelection. This is not acceptable, no matter what candidate is involved.

Steve White
Steve White
1 year ago

Trump was the populist candidate. He won because he spoke to issues that American’s wanted addressed. Even now, he just vowed if reelected that he would protect free speech, and create a digital bill of rights. 
 He promised to dismantle the government systems that facilitate the censorship.  And sign an executive order banning any federal agency from censoring or limiting the free speech of American citizens.
Who else is taking about that? I mean, they will be now possibly, but he leads by creating his own path, people like it, and they follow. 
The author didn’t seem to understand any of this about Trump, but this is the reason he can’t be counted out.

Last edited 1 year ago by Steve White
JR Stoker
JR Stoker
1 year ago
Reply to  Steve White

He is 76. If he stood and won he will be 82 by the end of his term. His time has passed; time to hand the baton on. Geriatric presidents are not good; Joe.
The 2024 election is wide open for the GOP if they choose an attractive candidate, Greg or Ron or Nikki, but not Donald, not in 2024

Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  Steve White

You are quite correct. I know of many farmers in their 50’s and 60’s who never voted for any president in their lives until Trump came along. Someone who tills the land all their lives to make a living has a keen sense of who is truly on their side and who is totally full of BS.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Warren Trees

And that person is a soft-handed, draft-dodging, contractor-stiffing billionaire who cheats at every possible opportunity?

Allison Barrows
Allison Barrows
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Hmmm. What, exactly, are Hunter Biden’s qualifications for his various foreign board seats? Trump as a teen knew construction first hand – literally doing the work side by side with the hard hats and dock mafia. Was it corrupt? Of course, Tell me what isn’t? (I wouldn’t go to the Vatican for absolution: those guys are messed). The whole “my guy is better than your guy” thing is so done. We are either minions or free people. I know who I’d rather be.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago

Hmm. Maybe no better than Jared Kushner’s qualifications for anything of importance. Yet he had a massively more significant role than Hunter does.
Trump didn’t do much real labor–why would you even claim that he did?!

Samuel Ross
Samuel Ross
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Jared Kushner, Abraham Accords. Need I say more?

Samuel Ross
Samuel Ross
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Jared Kushner, Abraham Accords. Need I say more?

Billy Bob
Billy Bob
1 year ago

Hunter Biden has no qualifications, he merely got where he was due to family contacts much like Trump, Jared Kushner and many before and after. However this article isn’t about the many public failings of Biden’s kid

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago

Hmm. Maybe no better than Jared Kushner’s qualifications for anything of importance. Yet he had a massively more significant role than Hunter does.
Trump didn’t do much real labor–why would you even claim that he did?!

Billy Bob
Billy Bob
1 year ago

Hunter Biden has no qualifications, he merely got where he was due to family contacts much like Trump, Jared Kushner and many before and after. However this article isn’t about the many public failings of Biden’s kid

Allison Barrows
Allison Barrows
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Hmmm. What, exactly, are Hunter Biden’s qualifications for his various foreign board seats? Trump as a teen knew construction first hand – literally doing the work side by side with the hard hats and dock mafia. Was it corrupt? Of course, Tell me what isn’t? (I wouldn’t go to the Vatican for absolution: those guys are messed). The whole “my guy is better than your guy” thing is so done. We are either minions or free people. I know who I’d rather be.

Julian Moruzzi
Julian Moruzzi
1 year ago
Reply to  Warren Trees

Trump is on nobody’s side but Trump’s. Never has been, never will be. Conceivably that attitude may have resulted in some collateral benefits to the USA and the world, it may have been worth a roll of the dice – not a risk I would have taken, but I can understand why others may have given it a go – but his embarrassing incompetence in office and unbridled narcissism disqualifies him from holding any public office again.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Warren Trees

And that person is a soft-handed, draft-dodging, contractor-stiffing billionaire who cheats at every possible opportunity?

Julian Moruzzi
Julian Moruzzi
1 year ago
Reply to  Warren Trees

Trump is on nobody’s side but Trump’s. Never has been, never will be. Conceivably that attitude may have resulted in some collateral benefits to the USA and the world, it may have been worth a roll of the dice – not a risk I would have taken, but I can understand why others may have given it a go – but his embarrassing incompetence in office and unbridled narcissism disqualifies him from holding any public office again.

Fred Paul
Fred Paul
1 year ago
Reply to  Steve White

Mr White, will regard free speech and the constitution; The government cannot pass any laws that interfere with a person’s wish to say whatever they want to say. However, it does not protect the person who says libellous things and is sued. Hence, the government cannot get involved in any form of censorship as this would be unconstitutional. Also, entities and individuals are not forced to publish anything on their media. It belongs to them, and they have the right to decide what they publish, irrespective of who wrote the piece. Again, the government cannot step in because it would be unconstitutional.

JR Stoker
JR Stoker
1 year ago
Reply to  Steve White

He is 76. If he stood and won he will be 82 by the end of his term. His time has passed; time to hand the baton on. Geriatric presidents are not good; Joe.
The 2024 election is wide open for the GOP if they choose an attractive candidate, Greg or Ron or Nikki, but not Donald, not in 2024

Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  Steve White

You are quite correct. I know of many farmers in their 50’s and 60’s who never voted for any president in their lives until Trump came along. Someone who tills the land all their lives to make a living has a keen sense of who is truly on their side and who is totally full of BS.

Fred Paul
Fred Paul
1 year ago
Reply to  Steve White

Mr White, will regard free speech and the constitution; The government cannot pass any laws that interfere with a person’s wish to say whatever they want to say. However, it does not protect the person who says libellous things and is sued. Hence, the government cannot get involved in any form of censorship as this would be unconstitutional. Also, entities and individuals are not forced to publish anything on their media. It belongs to them, and they have the right to decide what they publish, irrespective of who wrote the piece. Again, the government cannot step in because it would be unconstitutional.

Steve White
Steve White
1 year ago

Trump was the populist candidate. He won because he spoke to issues that American’s wanted addressed. Even now, he just vowed if reelected that he would protect free speech, and create a digital bill of rights. 
 He promised to dismantle the government systems that facilitate the censorship.  And sign an executive order banning any federal agency from censoring or limiting the free speech of American citizens.
Who else is taking about that? I mean, they will be now possibly, but he leads by creating his own path, people like it, and they follow. 
The author didn’t seem to understand any of this about Trump, but this is the reason he can’t be counted out.

Last edited 1 year ago by Steve White
Jonas Moze
Jonas Moze
1 year ago

”Analysis of his political fortunes has always been somewhat distorted by the fact that he is universally loathed by the American media class — or at least those who exist outside the self-contained bubble of conservative media.”

I know lots of American Middle Class – they all vote for him. This writer must exist in the coastal Liberal Bubbles.

That the absolutely Insane Biden regime exists is totally a product of the completely captured and owned MSM, Social Media, Tech, and Finance oligarchs buying him the position.

They out spend the Republicans 10 to one, the cheat, they lie, buy votes, and they block all truth and promote all propaganda so shamefully lord Haw-Haw is the only media figure one can use as a comparison.

I think a lot was learned by this midterms. The conmen won again – but I do not see it happening in 2024 – lessons have been learned.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Jonas Moze

So you see Trump as honorable, not just someone you’d prefer to Biden?
You offered no examples of what makes Biden ‘insane’ with a capital I, but here are a few that make Trump a bad candidate for any position of public trust: his fake university; his fraudulent charity; stiffing contractors whenever possible; dreadful handling of the pandemic; hostile rhetoric; petty grievances; a one-way street loyalty standard; being handsy and disrespectful with women (possible worse than Clinton). Oh yeah, he also encouraged a mob to storm the capital, costing lives and risking those of many others including his once sycophantic VP.
I get not loving an aged, never-great politician like Uncle Joe, but your notion of a simple, dark/light divide between your guys and the bad guys suggests that you are well-enclosed in a bubble yourself, sir.

Last edited 1 year ago by AJ Mac
Brett H
Brett H
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

It wasn’t insane Biden, it was “the insane Biden regime”. Of which there’s plenty that makes no sense. But it’s maybe possible to agree that Biden and Trump are no better than each other. Which is a sorry state for America to be in. It would be fair to say that Trump won the election fairly and spectacularly, which gives some idea of what people were feeling at the time, that enough voters wanted him to win, But can we maybe give up the idea that Trump encouraged a mob to storm the Capital and cost the lives of others?

Last edited 1 year ago by Brett H
AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Brett H

Ok that’s a fair clarification.
Do you mean give up in the sense of “move past” or for everyone stop pointing out that Trump’s encouragement of the Capitol attack happened? Would you more readily accept that Trump welcomed the attack then literally sat by and watched it instead or doing something, anything more to stop it sooner?
The unrest cooled down just about the instant he finally spoke up against it via presidential tweet.

Brett H
Brett H
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

“Would you more readily accept that Trump welcomed the attack â€œ
Yes, I could go along with that.

Hugh Bryant
Hugh Bryant
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Don’t you think the so-called January 6 ‘insurrection’ is a bit of a myth? Trump probably just didn’t take it very seriously and failed to anticipate the hysterical over-reaction of the establishment media.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Hugh Bryant

Maybe the i-word is slightly overblown, but the attack was real and so was the violent, disruptive intent of many involved. The reaction from the media as a whole may have been hysterical, but the hysteria and madness was more the fault and province of the rioters and their enablers in the far-right media.
When you see, for example, evidence of Trump’s hours-long inaction while staff and family pleaded with him to make a statement, the love he expressed for the rioters when he finally spoke out, and his documented “eff him let him die” attitude toward Mike Pence, I think you see a president who has only implausible deniability, not one who is disinterested or blameless.
That might earn me a few more down votes given the divisive nature of this topic in our divided world, but I don’t think I’ve overstated anything here.

Bill Bailey
Bill Bailey
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

and yet the only person ‘killed’ as opposed to dying, was a protestor who was shot, and no firearms were recovered from the protestors, even the ones in fancy dress.
https://www.spiked-online.com/2022/03/13/the-new-york-times-mask-has-slipped

Bruce Horton
Bruce Horton
1 year ago
Reply to  Bill Bailey

right, just a happy go lucky group of lads, oh and a few lasses, who broke into the capital, fun and games and all? I can’t imagine why a small group of capitol police might be a little antsy at a mob of hundreds (thousands?) smashing down doors. Those fascists!
Tell me how you would have reacted if if a gang from the SDS did the same thing, try not to be entirely hypocritical.

Bruce Horton
Bruce Horton
1 year ago
Reply to  Bill Bailey

right, just a happy go lucky group of lads, oh and a few lasses, who broke into the capital, fun and games and all? I can’t imagine why a small group of capitol police might be a little antsy at a mob of hundreds (thousands?) smashing down doors. Those fascists!
Tell me how you would have reacted if if a gang from the SDS did the same thing, try not to be entirely hypocritical.

Andrew F
Andrew F
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

What about Democratic Party and MSM defending and encouraging BLM riots?
How many people died, how many were injured and how much it cost economically?

Bill Bailey
Bill Bailey
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

and yet the only person ‘killed’ as opposed to dying, was a protestor who was shot, and no firearms were recovered from the protestors, even the ones in fancy dress.
https://www.spiked-online.com/2022/03/13/the-new-york-times-mask-has-slipped

Andrew F
Andrew F
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

What about Democratic Party and MSM defending and encouraging BLM riots?
How many people died, how many were injured and how much it cost economically?

CHARLES STANHOPE
CHARLES STANHOPE
1 year ago
Reply to  Hugh Bryant

Hear, hear! Sanity at last.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Hugh Bryant

Maybe the i-word is slightly overblown, but the attack was real and so was the violent, disruptive intent of many involved. The reaction from the media as a whole may have been hysterical, but the hysteria and madness was more the fault and province of the rioters and their enablers in the far-right media.
When you see, for example, evidence of Trump’s hours-long inaction while staff and family pleaded with him to make a statement, the love he expressed for the rioters when he finally spoke out, and his documented “eff him let him die” attitude toward Mike Pence, I think you see a president who has only implausible deniability, not one who is disinterested or blameless.
That might earn me a few more down votes given the divisive nature of this topic in our divided world, but I don’t think I’ve overstated anything here.

CHARLES STANHOPE
CHARLES STANHOPE
1 year ago
Reply to  Hugh Bryant

Hear, hear! Sanity at last.

Bill Bailey
Bill Bailey
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

‘Attack’? LOL – struck me more of a UK Monster Raving Looney party fancy dress day out. Take some selfies, nick some souvenirs then all go home. The irony is the NYT journo who painted it as a ‘Coup’ confessed it was no such thing to a woman, and was recorded doing so.
https://www.spiked-online.com/2022/03/13/the-new-york-times-mask-has-slipped

Brett H
Brett H
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

“Would you more readily accept that Trump welcomed the attack â€œ
Yes, I could go along with that.

Hugh Bryant
Hugh Bryant
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Don’t you think the so-called January 6 ‘insurrection’ is a bit of a myth? Trump probably just didn’t take it very seriously and failed to anticipate the hysterical over-reaction of the establishment media.

Bill Bailey
Bill Bailey
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

‘Attack’? LOL – struck me more of a UK Monster Raving Looney party fancy dress day out. Take some selfies, nick some souvenirs then all go home. The irony is the NYT journo who painted it as a ‘Coup’ confessed it was no such thing to a woman, and was recorded doing so.
https://www.spiked-online.com/2022/03/13/the-new-york-times-mask-has-slipped

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Brett H

Ok that’s a fair clarification.
Do you mean give up in the sense of “move past” or for everyone stop pointing out that Trump’s encouragement of the Capitol attack happened? Would you more readily accept that Trump welcomed the attack then literally sat by and watched it instead or doing something, anything more to stop it sooner?
The unrest cooled down just about the instant he finally spoke up against it via presidential tweet.

Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Just last night I saw Biden saying some pretty insane things about trans rights – inasmuch as he could get the words out in an orderly fashion. He was decked out in very dark aviators and hair was kind of ‘wedged’ at the back – insane theater in and of itself – presentation and content!
If you check on what Biden has claimed over time, there is no doubt he is a consummate and habitual liar – not to mention being corrupt as hell. He tells blatant untruths time and time again to the extent that even his slavish press e.g. NYT, has had to fact check him.
I follow him on Twitter to get a daily laugh out loud – the untruths are staggering. Granted, there is no way the man is able to tweet by himself, but still….

Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago

Unimpressive? Granted.
Corrupt? Yes – but then almost all US national politicians seem to be either corrupt or billionaires, it is the only way to find the massive sums to campaign.
In thrall to the woke trans lobby? Unmistakably.
But the blatant lying? Could you give some examples, because I genuinely do not know what you are talking about? I might actually believe you, if you could tell me.

Last edited 1 year ago by Rasmus Fogh
Brett H
Brett H
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

To state that the border is secure is quite bizarre. Is it a lie?

Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  Brett H

“The Inflation Reduction Act” would be another.

Bill Bailey
Bill Bailey
1 year ago
Reply to  Warren Trees

The EU loves that 😉

Bill Bailey
Bill Bailey
1 year ago
Reply to  Warren Trees

The EU loves that 😉

Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  Brett H

“The Inflation Reduction Act” would be another.

Pat Rowles
Pat Rowles
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

Biden has a history of at best exaggerating and at worst outright lying going back decades.
The ‘exaggerations’ include claims that he “had a house burn down with my wife in it — she got out safely, God willing.” It was a minor kitchen fire, with no damage even visible from the outside.
The outright lies include citing “ancestors who worked in the coal mines of northeast Pennsylvania” in his campaign speeches for the Democratic candidacy during the 1988 US presidential election. There were no such ancestors, because the speech was lifted verbatim from one by Neil Kinnock of the British Labour party, and being found out forced Biden to end his campaign.
You “might actually believe” these things if you’re told them, might you? As opposed to, say, checking for yourself that people’s claims he can’t be trusted to tell the truth have merit?
You’re welcome.

Last edited 1 year ago by Pat Rowles
Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago
Reply to  Pat Rowles

Thanks for the information. Now I know what you are talking about – slippery, unserious politicking. It reflects badly on him, but it is hardly serious. Like, for instance, claiming you had more spectators at your inauguration than previous presidents, but not like claiming you won when you actually lost. As for doing my own research, Lesley made the claim, and she and you already knew the facts. It took you a few minutes to tell me, whereas it would have taken me days to research US politics to form a considered opinion of my own.

Pat Rowles
Pat Rowles
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

It reflects badly on him, but it is hardly serious.

I suppose it depends what your expectations of politicians are. Biden’s a dishonest, careerist mediocrity. He ranked 76th in his law school class of 85, after failing a course due to an acknowledged “mistake” when he plagiarized a law review article for a paper he wrote in his first year.

It would have taken me days to research US politics to form a considered opinion of my own.

Only if you’re a very slow reader – I pulled this stuff together in ten minutes after Googling “Joe Biden lies”.

Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

Rasmus I follow US politics closely to take my mind off my own country’s sad politics. Mainly I would get my information from other than MSM, but now even left leaning media is putting the boot into Biden. He opens his mouth to lie and he lies with impunity. This is a link to NY Post (right leaning) with links into left and far left media.
https://nypost.com/2022/11/08/whats-behind-the-sudden-media-focus-on-bidens-big-lies/

Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago

Thanks. Reputable sources, from both right and left, and the message is clear. Consider me convinced. And, unlike what I said to Pat Rowles, yes, it is serious.

That is the nice thing about asking people. If you research it yourself you need to read both friends and enemies, evaluate and compare them, and make sure you get the more important arguments. That takes time. If you ask, people can guide you straight to the important points, and you can either trust or refute them on that basis.

Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh
Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago

Thanks. Reputable sources, from both right and left, and the message is clear. Consider me convinced. And, unlike what I said to Pat Rowles, yes, it is serious.

That is the nice thing about asking people. If you research it yourself you need to read both friends and enemies, evaluate and compare them, and make sure you get the more important arguments. That takes time. If you ask, people can guide you straight to the important points, and you can either trust or refute them on that basis.

Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh
Bill Bailey
Bill Bailey
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

Had we seen the contents of Biden Jnr’s laptop we might now be able to provide seriously bad examples. As it is we just have to wonder if the US weaponry flowing into Ukraine is payback for the backhanders Biden Jnr took home. Did he promise the Ukraine that his daddy had their back no matter how hard they poked The Bear?

Pat Rowles
Pat Rowles
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

It reflects badly on him, but it is hardly serious.

I suppose it depends what your expectations of politicians are. Biden’s a dishonest, careerist mediocrity. He ranked 76th in his law school class of 85, after failing a course due to an acknowledged “mistake” when he plagiarized a law review article for a paper he wrote in his first year.

It would have taken me days to research US politics to form a considered opinion of my own.

Only if you’re a very slow reader – I pulled this stuff together in ten minutes after Googling “Joe Biden lies”.

Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

Rasmus I follow US politics closely to take my mind off my own country’s sad politics. Mainly I would get my information from other than MSM, but now even left leaning media is putting the boot into Biden. He opens his mouth to lie and he lies with impunity. This is a link to NY Post (right leaning) with links into left and far left media.
https://nypost.com/2022/11/08/whats-behind-the-sudden-media-focus-on-bidens-big-lies/

Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh
Bill Bailey
Bill Bailey
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

Had we seen the contents of Biden Jnr’s laptop we might now be able to provide seriously bad examples. As it is we just have to wonder if the US weaponry flowing into Ukraine is payback for the backhanders Biden Jnr took home. Did he promise the Ukraine that his daddy had their back no matter how hard they poked The Bear?

Allison Barrows
Allison Barrows
1 year ago
Reply to  Pat Rowles

He still claims that his first wife was killed by a drunk driver – a blatant lie that has damaged the reputation of an innocent man. He said his son Beau died in Afghanistan (he died years later in at Walter Reed). He said repeatedly that he had no idea about son Hunter’s business dealings when he himself was engaged in political bribe schemes with this nation’s enemies, fronted by that son. The lies about his academic standing and his days as a Corn Pop fighter are trivial compared to his extraordinary corruption and epic stupidity, but they reveal his character, which is a shriveled, worm-like thing, if it exists at all.

Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago

I’ll take most of your claims on trust, but ‘political bribe schemes with this nation’s enemies’? Which enemies are those? Did he get, or solicit, the help of the FSB to smear his opponents? What are you referring to,exactly?
One wonders whether there could be anybody with an interest in trivialising the accusation of ‘working with this countries’ enemies’ who wanted to spread that story.

Last edited 1 year ago by Rasmus Fogh
Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

It’s ok to completely ignore reality. The world is moving in that direction further and further. You are just a little ahead of the rest of us.

Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago
Reply to  Warren Trees

I’ll certainly ignore your links – exactly because I am not sure they add much to reality. First because they are by Donald Trump Jr. – obviously not a reliable source on Joe Biden. Second because by their title an your presentation they do not seem to add much to what I have already learned from Lesley’s link. Third because they are video – if I want to learn something as opposed to get some nice feelings I prefer text.

Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago
Reply to  Warren Trees

I’ll certainly ignore your links – exactly because I am not sure they add much to reality. First because they are by Donald Trump Jr. – obviously not a reliable source on Joe Biden. Second because by their title an your presentation they do not seem to add much to what I have already learned from Lesley’s link. Third because they are video – if I want to learn something as opposed to get some nice feelings I prefer text.

Allison Barrows
Allison Barrows
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

Look up CEFC China Energy. Hunter Biden was paid millions – 10% of which went to his father. And why was the younger Biden on the board of a Ukrainian natural gas company? He is a drug addicted deviant with no experience in any kind of business. He was in those positions in order to funnel money to his father in exchange for political favors. That is about as far from trivial as it gets.

Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago

Yes, this is one of the most widely documented (and censored and suppressed) political issues in years.

Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago

Ukraine is not an enemy of the US. I had not heard of the China accusations before and, yes, they do sound rather bad. On the other hand, a quick check suggests that all information about that laptop and the reliability of data derived from it are partisan and suspect – from either side. I’d generally trust Wikipedia, but in this case their version is too one-sided to accept without confirmation. For certain the data came to the New York Post from the Trump campaign, timed for maximum effect ahead of the elections. Also there seems to be a lot of data around that claim to come from that laptop with no particular proof it was original. I’ll have to file this one together with who blew up Nord Stream and whether men and women have genetically determined personality differences – too hard to find *reliable* information.

Speaking of which: If you can show me convincing information that Chinese intelligence actively helped Biden to get elected, I’d admit that he was probably as bad as Trump.

Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago

Yes, this is one of the most widely documented (and censored and suppressed) political issues in years.

Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago

Ukraine is not an enemy of the US. I had not heard of the China accusations before and, yes, they do sound rather bad. On the other hand, a quick check suggests that all information about that laptop and the reliability of data derived from it are partisan and suspect – from either side. I’d generally trust Wikipedia, but in this case their version is too one-sided to accept without confirmation. For certain the data came to the New York Post from the Trump campaign, timed for maximum effect ahead of the elections. Also there seems to be a lot of data around that claim to come from that laptop with no particular proof it was original. I’ll have to file this one together with who blew up Nord Stream and whether men and women have genetically determined personality differences – too hard to find *reliable* information.

Speaking of which: If you can show me convincing information that Chinese intelligence actively helped Biden to get elected, I’d admit that he was probably as bad as Trump.

Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

It’s ok to completely ignore reality. The world is moving in that direction further and further. You are just a little ahead of the rest of us.

Allison Barrows
Allison Barrows
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

Look up CEFC China Energy. Hunter Biden was paid millions – 10% of which went to his father. And why was the younger Biden on the board of a Ukrainian natural gas company? He is a drug addicted deviant with no experience in any kind of business. He was in those positions in order to funnel money to his father in exchange for political favors. That is about as far from trivial as it gets.

Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago

I’ll take most of your claims on trust, but ‘political bribe schemes with this nation’s enemies’? Which enemies are those? Did he get, or solicit, the help of the FSB to smear his opponents? What are you referring to,exactly?
One wonders whether there could be anybody with an interest in trivialising the accusation of ‘working with this countries’ enemies’ who wanted to spread that story.

Last edited 1 year ago by Rasmus Fogh
James Hunter
James Hunter
1 year ago
Reply to  Pat Rowles

Biden’s great-grandfather Edward Blewitt and great-great grandfather, Patrick Blewitt did both work in the mines in northeast Pennsylvania. The former as an engineer and the latter as an inspector.
The words of the 1988 speech were indeed copied from Kinnock’s one.

Pat Rowles
Pat Rowles
1 year ago
Reply to  James Hunter

You have a point. It’s confusing, because Biden joked about the claim possibly costing him the presidency in 2004 to Jon Stewart.

Pat Rowles
Pat Rowles
1 year ago
Reply to  James Hunter

You have a point. It’s confusing, because Biden joked about the claim possibly costing him the presidency in 2004 to Jon Stewart.

Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago
Reply to  Pat Rowles

Thanks for the information. Now I know what you are talking about – slippery, unserious politicking. It reflects badly on him, but it is hardly serious. Like, for instance, claiming you had more spectators at your inauguration than previous presidents, but not like claiming you won when you actually lost. As for doing my own research, Lesley made the claim, and she and you already knew the facts. It took you a few minutes to tell me, whereas it would have taken me days to research US politics to form a considered opinion of my own.

Allison Barrows
Allison Barrows
1 year ago
Reply to  Pat Rowles

He still claims that his first wife was killed by a drunk driver – a blatant lie that has damaged the reputation of an innocent man. He said his son Beau died in Afghanistan (he died years later in at Walter Reed). He said repeatedly that he had no idea about son Hunter’s business dealings when he himself was engaged in political bribe schemes with this nation’s enemies, fronted by that son. The lies about his academic standing and his days as a Corn Pop fighter are trivial compared to his extraordinary corruption and epic stupidity, but they reveal his character, which is a shriveled, worm-like thing, if it exists at all.

James Hunter
James Hunter
1 year ago
Reply to  Pat Rowles

Biden’s great-grandfather Edward Blewitt and great-great grandfather, Patrick Blewitt did both work in the mines in northeast Pennsylvania. The former as an engineer and the latter as an inspector.
The words of the 1988 speech were indeed copied from Kinnock’s one.

Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

You can start with him claiming to have graduated near the top of his class in a college he did not attend. You can also look at various speeches, where he plagiarized great speeches of others. He was deemed by CBS news show as “done” as a politician over his lying.
Watch this one from the then MSM:
https://twitter.com/i/status/1257999939554234373

Brett H
Brett H
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

To state that the border is secure is quite bizarre. Is it a lie?

Pat Rowles
Pat Rowles
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

Biden has a history of at best exaggerating and at worst outright lying going back decades.
The ‘exaggerations’ include claims that he “had a house burn down with my wife in it — she got out safely, God willing.” It was a minor kitchen fire, with no damage even visible from the outside.
The outright lies include citing “ancestors who worked in the coal mines of northeast Pennsylvania” in his campaign speeches for the Democratic candidacy during the 1988 US presidential election. There were no such ancestors, because the speech was lifted verbatim from one by Neil Kinnock of the British Labour party, and being found out forced Biden to end his campaign.
You “might actually believe” these things if you’re told them, might you? As opposed to, say, checking for yourself that people’s claims he can’t be trusted to tell the truth have merit?
You’re welcome.

Last edited 1 year ago by Pat Rowles
Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

You can start with him claiming to have graduated near the top of his class in a college he did not attend. You can also look at various speeches, where he plagiarized great speeches of others. He was deemed by CBS news show as “done” as a politician over his lying.
Watch this one from the then MSM:
https://twitter.com/i/status/1257999939554234373

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago

I agree that Biden ignores the truth too often and is of middling charisma and intellect. Like George W. Bush (and unlike HW his father) he is not smart enough to be a great choice for president.
But I don’t agree that Biden is some “habitual or “consummate” liar–maybe a pretty good, part-time liar. I also think Biden is a decent, sane person compared to Trump. Even rudiments of good character, which Biden has, are important in a world leader. He is also surrounded by mostly sane and competent people. Show me the Biden-administration equivalents of Steve Bannon, Paul Manafort, Stephen Miller, and General Flynn
Even if you still like Trump, can you honestly deny that he is a mean-spirited, surprisingly selfish dude for whom loyalty is a one-way street?

Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Read link posted above. Biden is at last being called out by his own. Trump lies, but he is eclipsed spectacularly by Biden.
I don’t know what you mean by the comment ‘if you still like Trump’. I don’t like Trump, but given the choice I would take him over Biden any day.
Biden is not surrounded by competent people, he isn’t decent, he isn’t of sound mind and he is destroying the US.

Last edited 1 year ago by Lesley van Reenen
Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago

I still agree with AJ Mac, though I take your point about the lies.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago

That linked article has a flailing, hyperbolic tone, rather like your last sentence above. Though prompted by your reply, My “even if you still like Trump” appeal was in general response to several comments.
I can see we’re not gonna persuade one another at all or even have an exchange that’s worthwhile for either one of us, at least not today.

Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

I can see you didn’t open the link, because the link contains other links to NYT, CNN and Wapo. Nice try though.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago

You linked a single article, which I read, though not with much interest or intentness because it was in some kind of panic prose (!!!) though by the editorial board (of the infamous New York Post). It seems you expected me to read every possibly connecting thread that supports your view(s)–nice try.
I think I have a pretty hearty and varied media diet by nowadays standards: NYT, This place, Persuasion, Reason, BBC, Guardian, Spectator, National Review. It leans slightly left, but not all the time, and not by the standards of California, where I reside.
I would like to apologize for making the tone of our exchange more personal or contentious than was called for. I admit that Biden is no one’s favorite (excepting his wife?), and for good reason. We have different opinions on the least-bad choice, but that’s ok I think. Have a good weekend.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago

You linked a single article, which I read, though not with much interest or intentness because it was in some kind of panic prose (!!!) though by the editorial board (of the infamous New York Post). It seems you expected me to read every possibly connecting thread that supports your view(s)–nice try.
I think I have a pretty hearty and varied media diet by nowadays standards: NYT, This place, Persuasion, Reason, BBC, Guardian, Spectator, National Review. It leans slightly left, but not all the time, and not by the standards of California, where I reside.
I would like to apologize for making the tone of our exchange more personal or contentious than was called for. I admit that Biden is no one’s favorite (excepting his wife?), and for good reason. We have different opinions on the least-bad choice, but that’s ok I think. Have a good weekend.

Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Read the first comment on this page dude
. At least try.

Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

I can see you didn’t open the link, because the link contains other links to NYT, CNN and Wapo. Nice try though.

Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Read the first comment on this page dude
. At least try.

Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago

I still agree with AJ Mac, though I take your point about the lies.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago

That linked article has a flailing, hyperbolic tone, rather like your last sentence above. Though prompted by your reply, My “even if you still like Trump” appeal was in general response to several comments.
I can see we’re not gonna persuade one another at all or even have an exchange that’s worthwhile for either one of us, at least not today.

Allison Barrows
Allison Barrows
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Ask Tara Reade about his decency. Good God, the man showered naked with his own teen daughter.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago

What makes you think that’s factual, your hatred for Old Joe?
“We have so far been unable to find any evidence whatsoever that shows this is an actual quote from Biden’s daughter”– got that at the first result related to your -as-though-factual claim, which I’d never heard before.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/ashley-biden-diary-afraid/
Can’t we all just get along with the benefit of the doubt a little better?
Cheers gang.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago

What makes you think that’s factual, your hatred for Old Joe?
“We have so far been unable to find any evidence whatsoever that shows this is an actual quote from Biden’s daughter”– got that at the first result related to your -as-though-factual claim, which I’d never heard before.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/ashley-biden-diary-afraid/
Can’t we all just get along with the benefit of the doubt a little better?
Cheers gang.

Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac
Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Read link posted above. Biden is at last being called out by his own. Trump lies, but he is eclipsed spectacularly by Biden.
I don’t know what you mean by the comment ‘if you still like Trump’. I don’t like Trump, but given the choice I would take him over Biden any day.
Biden is not surrounded by competent people, he isn’t decent, he isn’t of sound mind and he is destroying the US.

Last edited 1 year ago by Lesley van Reenen
Allison Barrows
Allison Barrows
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Ask Tara Reade about his decency. Good God, the man showered naked with his own teen daughter.

Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac
Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago

Unimpressive? Granted.
Corrupt? Yes – but then almost all US national politicians seem to be either corrupt or billionaires, it is the only way to find the massive sums to campaign.
In thrall to the woke trans lobby? Unmistakably.
But the blatant lying? Could you give some examples, because I genuinely do not know what you are talking about? I might actually believe you, if you could tell me.

Last edited 1 year ago by Rasmus Fogh
AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago

I agree that Biden ignores the truth too often and is of middling charisma and intellect. Like George W. Bush (and unlike HW his father) he is not smart enough to be a great choice for president.
But I don’t agree that Biden is some “habitual or “consummate” liar–maybe a pretty good, part-time liar. I also think Biden is a decent, sane person compared to Trump. Even rudiments of good character, which Biden has, are important in a world leader. He is also surrounded by mostly sane and competent people. Show me the Biden-administration equivalents of Steve Bannon, Paul Manafort, Stephen Miller, and General Flynn
Even if you still like Trump, can you honestly deny that he is a mean-spirited, surprisingly selfish dude for whom loyalty is a one-way street?

Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

No examples? I suggest you merely watch an actual speech of his during the last couple of years vs. listening to what CNN says and edits. Perhaps also watch unedited videos from the 1980’s and 1990’s where he vehemently espoused policies that are 180 degrees from today. And let’s not talk of Trump’s “fraudulent” charity whilst ignoring the Clinton Foundation. I’ve never been a fan of Trump, but the misinformation and fake news about him is epic. And thinking Trump is the only man to ever abuse his power in order to woo a woman is grossly naive.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Warren Trees

The Clinton one was bad too. You’re grossly mischaracterizing my point of view. In fact, I compared Trump’s “pervyness” to Clinton’s. Don’t you think Trump is just about as morally bankrupt as Bill Clinton has proven to be, and if so: Is that ok in a president?

Last edited 1 year ago by AJ Mac
Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Just for fun: What was so terrible about Bill Clinton? From overseas all you can see is a habit of seducing willing, adult women, and some money from dodgy backers – which most US politicians would have. Unles you are his wife, or a #MeToo partisan trying to retrofit history, why get so upset?

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

I’m no longer actively upset with Bill Clinton and I don’t think he was “so terrible”. I voted for him when I was first eligible in 1992. Smart and charismatic but a bit greasy and empty under the suit. What really offended me at the time–but which I’m like totally over now–were things like his treacly “I…feel…your pain” performance and his classic “it depends on what your definition of is is:”
To be honest, I think Clinton was an okay president who has become a somewhat better man since his hornier days. And while I don’t think Trump is quite the force of sheer malevolence some pearl-clutching types imagine, I do think he was and–please, no–would be a uniquely bad president in many ways. But I was arguing the character issue with someone who seemed to be a Trump apologist, and in terms of moral integrity I think you’re looking at a similar emptiness in the two men.
I’ve definitely “overshared” on this board. Thanks for the virtual engagement everybody.

Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Thanks. And I won’t argue with your judgements.

Actually I rather liked his ‘depends on what your definition of ‘is’ is’. Since the entire impeachment process was a shameless partisan stunt, trying to get him on adult, consensual, extra-marital sex, some reciprocal shamelessness had its place.

Last edited 1 year ago by Rasmus Fogh
AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

Maybe so.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

Maybe so.

Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Thanks. And I won’t argue with your judgements.

Actually I rather liked his ‘depends on what your definition of ‘is’ is’. Since the entire impeachment process was a shameless partisan stunt, trying to get him on adult, consensual, extra-marital sex, some reciprocal shamelessness had its place.

Last edited 1 year ago by Rasmus Fogh
Andrew F
Andrew F
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

What about Lolita Express and his connections to Epstein?
Is it not the case that quite a few woman accused Clinton of rape?
Bigger problem were Clinton many foreign policy errors.
Like banking deregulation and enabling globalisation and rise of China.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

I’m no longer actively upset with Bill Clinton and I don’t think he was “so terrible”. I voted for him when I was first eligible in 1992. Smart and charismatic but a bit greasy and empty under the suit. What really offended me at the time–but which I’m like totally over now–were things like his treacly “I…feel…your pain” performance and his classic “it depends on what your definition of is is:”
To be honest, I think Clinton was an okay president who has become a somewhat better man since his hornier days. And while I don’t think Trump is quite the force of sheer malevolence some pearl-clutching types imagine, I do think he was and–please, no–would be a uniquely bad president in many ways. But I was arguing the character issue with someone who seemed to be a Trump apologist, and in terms of moral integrity I think you’re looking at a similar emptiness in the two men.
I’ve definitely “overshared” on this board. Thanks for the virtual engagement everybody.

Andrew F
Andrew F
1 year ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

What about Lolita Express and his connections to Epstein?
Is it not the case that quite a few woman accused Clinton of rape?
Bigger problem were Clinton many foreign policy errors.
Like banking deregulation and enabling globalisation and rise of China.

Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Just for fun: What was so terrible about Bill Clinton? From overseas all you can see is a habit of seducing willing, adult women, and some money from dodgy backers – which most US politicians would have. Unles you are his wife, or a #MeToo partisan trying to retrofit history, why get so upset?

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Warren Trees

The Clinton one was bad too. You’re grossly mischaracterizing my point of view. In fact, I compared Trump’s “pervyness” to Clinton’s. Don’t you think Trump is just about as morally bankrupt as Bill Clinton has proven to be, and if so: Is that ok in a president?

Last edited 1 year ago by AJ Mac
chris sullivan
chris sullivan
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Jonas is back as another pseudonym for ??? It is his job to be provocative and a conspiracy theorist ! Most of his stuff is somewhat OTT but he is a good rep for a certain viewpoint on Unherd – and has some good stuff to share from ‘on the ground’ – but dont feel you have to challenge all his posts – or you will be busy !! We are quite fond of him !!

Brett H
Brett H
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

It wasn’t insane Biden, it was “the insane Biden regime”. Of which there’s plenty that makes no sense. But it’s maybe possible to agree that Biden and Trump are no better than each other. Which is a sorry state for America to be in. It would be fair to say that Trump won the election fairly and spectacularly, which gives some idea of what people were feeling at the time, that enough voters wanted him to win, But can we maybe give up the idea that Trump encouraged a mob to storm the Capital and cost the lives of others?

Last edited 1 year ago by Brett H
Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Just last night I saw Biden saying some pretty insane things about trans rights – inasmuch as he could get the words out in an orderly fashion. He was decked out in very dark aviators and hair was kind of ‘wedged’ at the back – insane theater in and of itself – presentation and content!
If you check on what Biden has claimed over time, there is no doubt he is a consummate and habitual liar – not to mention being corrupt as hell. He tells blatant untruths time and time again to the extent that even his slavish press e.g. NYT, has had to fact check him.
I follow him on Twitter to get a daily laugh out loud – the untruths are staggering. Granted, there is no way the man is able to tweet by himself, but still….

Warren Trees
Warren Trees
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

No examples? I suggest you merely watch an actual speech of his during the last couple of years vs. listening to what CNN says and edits. Perhaps also watch unedited videos from the 1980’s and 1990’s where he vehemently espoused policies that are 180 degrees from today. And let’s not talk of Trump’s “fraudulent” charity whilst ignoring the Clinton Foundation. I’ve never been a fan of Trump, but the misinformation and fake news about him is epic. And thinking Trump is the only man to ever abuse his power in order to woo a woman is grossly naive.

chris sullivan
chris sullivan
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Jonas is back as another pseudonym for ??? It is his job to be provocative and a conspiracy theorist ! Most of his stuff is somewhat OTT but he is a good rep for a certain viewpoint on Unherd – and has some good stuff to share from ‘on the ground’ – but dont feel you have to challenge all his posts – or you will be busy !! We are quite fond of him !!

Bill Bailey
Bill Bailey
1 year ago
Reply to  Jonas Moze

As long as postal voting is encouraged, fraud will rule. In both the US and UK, it seems.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Jonas Moze

So you see Trump as honorable, not just someone you’d prefer to Biden?
You offered no examples of what makes Biden ‘insane’ with a capital I, but here are a few that make Trump a bad candidate for any position of public trust: his fake university; his fraudulent charity; stiffing contractors whenever possible; dreadful handling of the pandemic; hostile rhetoric; petty grievances; a one-way street loyalty standard; being handsy and disrespectful with women (possible worse than Clinton). Oh yeah, he also encouraged a mob to storm the capital, costing lives and risking those of many others including his once sycophantic VP.
I get not loving an aged, never-great politician like Uncle Joe, but your notion of a simple, dark/light divide between your guys and the bad guys suggests that you are well-enclosed in a bubble yourself, sir.

Last edited 1 year ago by AJ Mac
Bill Bailey
Bill Bailey
1 year ago
Reply to  Jonas Moze

As long as postal voting is encouraged, fraud will rule. In both the US and UK, it seems.

Jonas Moze
Jonas Moze
1 year ago

”Analysis of his political fortunes has always been somewhat distorted by the fact that he is universally loathed by the American media class — or at least those who exist outside the self-contained bubble of conservative media.”

I know lots of American Middle Class – they all vote for him. This writer must exist in the coastal Liberal Bubbles.

That the absolutely Insane Biden regime exists is totally a product of the completely captured and owned MSM, Social Media, Tech, and Finance oligarchs buying him the position.

They out spend the Republicans 10 to one, the cheat, they lie, buy votes, and they block all truth and promote all propaganda so shamefully lord Haw-Haw is the only media figure one can use as a comparison.

I think a lot was learned by this midterms. The conmen won again – but I do not see it happening in 2024 – lessons have been learned.

Brian Villanueva
Brian Villanueva
1 year ago

Trump is a like an abusive boyfriend. Until you get away from him for a little while and remember what you were like before, it’s hard to see how far you’ve fallen and how much you’ve compromised.
That said, if my choices in 2024 are Donald Trump or a pro-war, pro-infanticide, pro-euthanasia, pro-genital-mutilation Democrat… I guess it’s back to the abusive boyfriend.

Brian Villanueva
Brian Villanueva
1 year ago

Trump is a like an abusive boyfriend. Until you get away from him for a little while and remember what you were like before, it’s hard to see how far you’ve fallen and how much you’ve compromised.
That said, if my choices in 2024 are Donald Trump or a pro-war, pro-infanticide, pro-euthanasia, pro-genital-mutilation Democrat… I guess it’s back to the abusive boyfriend.

Steve Jolly
Steve Jolly
1 year ago

Trump is what he always was, a con-man and a buffoon. The Republican base would have rallied around ANYONE who championed limiting immigration, protecting American industry, eliminating corruption, fighting the corporate overlords, sticking it to the political establishment, etc. Trump never had any particular power or skill in politics or public speaking or anything else. It wasn’t skill or savvy that propelled him to prominence, it was simply a willingness to go beyond the guardrails established by the neoliberal globalist establishment that had ruled BOTH parties since the Clinton administration. There was enough resentment against those folks, let’s remember, that Sanders nearly did the same thing on the other side, TWICE. It took, as the author mentions, intervention from Democratic leadership, the DNC in 2016 and Obama himself in 2020, to stop the Democratic establishment from suffering exactly the same fate. Now, however, the guardrails have moved, permanently, and they can’t be unmoved no matter how much the neoliberals would like to do it. Four fifths of the Republican party now sound exactly like Trump in 2016, opposed to international interventions, against free trade agreements, in favor of tough immigration controls, anti-corporate, anti-PC, etc. The few who don’t, like Liz Cheney and Mitt Romney, have been rendered mostly irrelevant. I made a comment in an earlier article about how populist voters would shift as quickly as the wind if they saw a better path to achieve populist goals. Lo and behold, every poll conducted since the mid-terms shows DeSantis as the prohibitive favorite in 2024. The anti-globalist/populist momentum has reached critical mass in America.If the Democrats run Biden or another ho-hum establishment figure in 2024, they stand a good chance of suffering their biggest defeat since 1980.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Steve Jolly

I agree with most of your astute comment but I don’t think anyone but Trump, with his “buffoon genius”, could have won with such an anti-establishment message and rude tone–not for the first time. Now, we may see other wild candidates in the Trumpian mold or wake, perhaps even from the left.

Graeme McNeil
Graeme McNeil
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Genius?
Just stick with buffoon and you’ll be closer to the mark.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Graeme McNeil

There’s some method to his madness, and lack of IQ isn’t what’s wrong with him, though a lack of curiosity and an unwillingness to read are part of it.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Graeme McNeil

There’s some method to his madness, and lack of IQ isn’t what’s wrong with him, though a lack of curiosity and an unwillingness to read are part of it.

Graeme McNeil
Graeme McNeil
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Genius?
Just stick with buffoon and you’ll be closer to the mark.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Steve Jolly

I agree with most of your astute comment but I don’t think anyone but Trump, with his “buffoon genius”, could have won with such an anti-establishment message and rude tone–not for the first time. Now, we may see other wild candidates in the Trumpian mold or wake, perhaps even from the left.

Steve Jolly
Steve Jolly
1 year ago

Trump is what he always was, a con-man and a buffoon. The Republican base would have rallied around ANYONE who championed limiting immigration, protecting American industry, eliminating corruption, fighting the corporate overlords, sticking it to the political establishment, etc. Trump never had any particular power or skill in politics or public speaking or anything else. It wasn’t skill or savvy that propelled him to prominence, it was simply a willingness to go beyond the guardrails established by the neoliberal globalist establishment that had ruled BOTH parties since the Clinton administration. There was enough resentment against those folks, let’s remember, that Sanders nearly did the same thing on the other side, TWICE. It took, as the author mentions, intervention from Democratic leadership, the DNC in 2016 and Obama himself in 2020, to stop the Democratic establishment from suffering exactly the same fate. Now, however, the guardrails have moved, permanently, and they can’t be unmoved no matter how much the neoliberals would like to do it. Four fifths of the Republican party now sound exactly like Trump in 2016, opposed to international interventions, against free trade agreements, in favor of tough immigration controls, anti-corporate, anti-PC, etc. The few who don’t, like Liz Cheney and Mitt Romney, have been rendered mostly irrelevant. I made a comment in an earlier article about how populist voters would shift as quickly as the wind if they saw a better path to achieve populist goals. Lo and behold, every poll conducted since the mid-terms shows DeSantis as the prohibitive favorite in 2024. The anti-globalist/populist momentum has reached critical mass in America.If the Democrats run Biden or another ho-hum establishment figure in 2024, they stand a good chance of suffering their biggest defeat since 1980.

Stoater D
Stoater D
1 year ago

Trump will be back.

Stoater D
Stoater D
1 year ago

Trump will be back.

polidori redux
polidori redux
1 year ago

I don’t understand why so may Americans are seemingly obsessed with Donald Trump. They seem to have made him the basis for an entire culture.
I’m with Vicki Pollard: “Wotever”.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  polidori redux

Remember that we don’t have a royal family here.

Dominic A
Dominic A
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

…and that’s the best advert for a Royal family; a safe, reliable container for peoples’ need to worship and/or despise figureheads. Generally frees up the real adults to get on with running things; although that’s not going so well in the UK right now.

Last edited 1 year ago by Dominic A
AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Dominic A

Well-expressed reply. How recently would you say that the real adults were running things well in Britain?

Dominic A
Dominic A
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Pre BoJo – NB: I’m not speaking to whether I liked them or how successful they were, just that they were not man, or woman childs.

Mr Bellisarius
Mr Bellisarius
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

I would say the UK is being run by the media. There is very little difference between Johnsons government and Sunaks, for example. But the press coverage is completely different.

Dominic A
Dominic A
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

Pre BoJo – NB: I’m not speaking to whether I liked them or how successful they were, just that they were not man, or woman childs.

Mr Bellisarius
Mr Bellisarius
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

I would say the UK is being run by the media. There is very little difference between Johnsons government and Sunaks, for example. But the press coverage is completely different.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  Dominic A

Well-expressed reply. How recently would you say that the real adults were running things well in Britain?

Dominic A
Dominic A
1 year ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

…and that’s the best advert for a Royal family; a safe, reliable container for peoples’ need to worship and/or despise figureheads. Generally frees up the real adults to get on with running things; although that’s not going so well in the UK right now.

Last edited 1 year ago by Dominic A
Mary Bruels
Mary Bruels
1 year ago
Reply to  polidori redux

It’s mainly the mainstream media that is obsessed with Trump. He lives in their heads. The majority of average Americans seem to care less.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
1 year ago
Reply to  polidori redux

Remember that we don’t have a royal family here.

Mary Bruels
Mary Bruels
1 year ago
Reply to  polidori redux

It’s mainly the mainstream media that is obsessed with Trump. He lives in their heads. The majority of average Americans seem to care less.

polidori redux
polidori redux
1 year ago

I don’t understand why so may Americans are seemingly obsessed with Donald Trump. They seem to have made him the basis for an entire culture.
I’m with Vicki Pollard: “Wotever”.

j watson
j watson
1 year ago

Isn’t there a sense Trump would say whatever he felt he needed to say to get elected and that the primary interest for Trump was what was in his own interest first and foremost? He was lucky too. Poor field of Republican Presidential candidates and then up against Hilary. The stars did align for him.
The dilemma now is he still has enough support to gain the nomination because of the way the GOP chooses its candidate. One suspects the GOP will coalesce behind DeSantis if forced to – the fear Trump is the Democrats best electoral asset will drive that. But one suspects they’d much prefer Jack Smith takes him down for them. They’ll hold off until they judge whether Eliot Ness Mk2 can do the job.

Dominic A
Dominic A
1 year ago
Reply to  j watson

Not sure he really wants or needs to be elected, or in power as such. I suspect that The Trump Problem could be largely solved – he would be satisifed with – some official title such as, “Brother of the sun and moon; grandson and viceroy of God; ruler of the Americas; emperor of emperors; sovereign of sovereigns; extraordinary knight, never defeated; steadfast guardian of the tomb of Jesus Christ; trustee chosen by God Himself; the scourge and discomfort of Muslims; confounder and great defender of Christians”. Biden should look into it.

j watson
j watson
1 year ago
Reply to  Dominic A

Yes that’d probably work!
I think the primary driver for his v early announcement of presidential candidacy was to i) try to forestall all his current legal jeopardy by making his eventual indictment(s) appear political ii) cream some more money off donors to help pay for his legal woes

Last edited 1 year ago by j watson
j watson
j watson
1 year ago
Reply to  Dominic A

Yes that’d probably work!
I think the primary driver for his v early announcement of presidential candidacy was to i) try to forestall all his current legal jeopardy by making his eventual indictment(s) appear political ii) cream some more money off donors to help pay for his legal woes

Last edited 1 year ago by j watson
Dominic A
Dominic A
1 year ago
Reply to  j watson

Not sure he really wants or needs to be elected, or in power as such. I suspect that The Trump Problem could be largely solved – he would be satisifed with – some official title such as, “Brother of the sun and moon; grandson and viceroy of God; ruler of the Americas; emperor of emperors; sovereign of sovereigns; extraordinary knight, never defeated; steadfast guardian of the tomb of Jesus Christ; trustee chosen by God Himself; the scourge and discomfort of Muslims; confounder and great defender of Christians”. Biden should look into it.

j watson
j watson
1 year ago

Isn’t there a sense Trump would say whatever he felt he needed to say to get elected and that the primary interest for Trump was what was in his own interest first and foremost? He was lucky too. Poor field of Republican Presidential candidates and then up against Hilary. The stars did align for him.
The dilemma now is he still has enough support to gain the nomination because of the way the GOP chooses its candidate. One suspects the GOP will coalesce behind DeSantis if forced to – the fear Trump is the Democrats best electoral asset will drive that. But one suspects they’d much prefer Jack Smith takes him down for them. They’ll hold off until they judge whether Eliot Ness Mk2 can do the job.

Daniel Lee
Daniel Lee
1 year ago

“The End of Trump” part 37,467. Can’t wait for the sequel to come out next week.

Daniel Lee
Daniel Lee
1 year ago

“The End of Trump” part 37,467. Can’t wait for the sequel to come out next week.

Bruce Horton
Bruce Horton
1 year ago

Unfortunately there is only the choice between red and blue in the U.S. Hating the blue less/more than the red seems to have been the proposition to voters in both 2016 (the corrupt elite versus the great disrupter) and 2020 (the sleepy compromiser versus the erratic maniac). The people chose the sleepy compromiser regardless of their motivation. I truly hope better options are available in 2024. America is a great country (not mine) and deserves better leadership.

Last edited 1 year ago by Bruce Horton
Bruce Horton
Bruce Horton
1 year ago

Unfortunately there is only the choice between red and blue in the U.S. Hating the blue less/more than the red seems to have been the proposition to voters in both 2016 (the corrupt elite versus the great disrupter) and 2020 (the sleepy compromiser versus the erratic maniac). The people chose the sleepy compromiser regardless of their motivation. I truly hope better options are available in 2024. America is a great country (not mine) and deserves better leadership.

Last edited 1 year ago by Bruce Horton
Graeme McNeil
Graeme McNeil
1 year ago

Is this the final humiliation for Trump supporters?
I doubt it…

Graeme McNeil
Graeme McNeil
1 year ago

Is this the final humiliation for Trump supporters?
I doubt it…

Paul Hendricks
Paul Hendricks
1 year ago

An honest assessment of MAGA is hard to come by, not only because of biased media but biased social media, search engines and “news home pages” on everyone’s devices pumping superficial nonsense. Overall his bold administration was a rousing success.

Operation Warp Speed. Betsy DeVos rolling back title ix and halting massive aid for incompetent public schools. Scott Atlas a reasonable response to the China virus, as Trump called it. Amy Coney Barret to the supreme court. A great economy. Winning over minority voters to the GOP. Too much sorely needed deregulation to mention here. Too much else really.

His greatest fault, not getting rid of Fauci. His off-putting performance in the first debate with Biden was a bad miscalculation at a crucial moment. And the Wuhan Flu stimulus checks were far too much.

Graeme McNeil
Graeme McNeil
1 year ago
Reply to  Paul Hendricks

Let me summarize – Trump was a one term failure who will be remembered as one of history’s bad jokes. For “rousing success” read chaotic muddle of half-baked stupidity and picking the supreme court justices that he was told to when he fluked into getting the picks.

Samuel Ross
Samuel Ross
1 year ago
Reply to  Graeme McNeil

One of the cleverer and more incisive comments I’ve read here today. Not.

Samuel Ross
Samuel Ross
1 year ago
Reply to  Graeme McNeil

One of the cleverer and more incisive comments I’ve read here today. Not.

Graeme McNeil
Graeme McNeil
1 year ago
Reply to  Paul Hendricks

Let me summarize – Trump was a one term failure who will be remembered as one of history’s bad jokes. For “rousing success” read chaotic muddle of half-baked stupidity and picking the supreme court justices that he was told to when he fluked into getting the picks.

Paul Hendricks
Paul Hendricks
1 year ago

An honest assessment of MAGA is hard to come by, not only because of biased media but biased social media, search engines and “news home pages” on everyone’s devices pumping superficial nonsense. Overall his bold administration was a rousing success.

Operation Warp Speed. Betsy DeVos rolling back title ix and halting massive aid for incompetent public schools. Scott Atlas a reasonable response to the China virus, as Trump called it. Amy Coney Barret to the supreme court. A great economy. Winning over minority voters to the GOP. Too much sorely needed deregulation to mention here. Too much else really.

His greatest fault, not getting rid of Fauci. His off-putting performance in the first debate with Biden was a bad miscalculation at a crucial moment. And the Wuhan Flu stimulus checks were far too much.

Jerry Carroll
Jerry Carroll
1 year ago

No one was more surprised than Trump when he won the Republican nomination and then kicked Hillary’s lard ass. That was why he was so unprepared for the job, surrounding himself with yes men, drunks and incompetents, hiring and firing like the angry head of a family firm, which was all of his previous history, when things went wrong. DeSantis will wipe the floor with him if he is dumb enough to run again. That critical element of surprise is long gone.

Jerry Carroll
Jerry Carroll
1 year ago

No one was more surprised than Trump when he won the Republican nomination and then kicked Hillary’s lard ass. That was why he was so unprepared for the job, surrounding himself with yes men, drunks and incompetents, hiring and firing like the angry head of a family firm, which was all of his previous history, when things went wrong. DeSantis will wipe the floor with him if he is dumb enough to run again. That critical element of surprise is long gone.

Johnathan Galt
Johnathan Galt
1 year ago

More leftist wishful thinking. Yawn.

Graeme McNeil
Graeme McNeil
1 year ago
Reply to  Johnathan Galt

Which NFT did you go for? The cowboy? The astronaut? Christmas sure came early for you, didn’t it?!?!

Graeme McNeil
Graeme McNeil
1 year ago
Reply to  Johnathan Galt

Which NFT did you go for? The cowboy? The astronaut? Christmas sure came early for you, didn’t it?!?!

Johnathan Galt
Johnathan Galt
1 year ago

More leftist wishful thinking. Yawn.

Mr Bellisarius
Mr Bellisarius
1 year ago

I’m surprised he didn’t include a signed copy of his tax returns in the auction.

Mr Bellisarius
Mr Bellisarius
1 year ago

I’m surprised he didn’t include a signed copy of his tax returns in the auction.

Vince B
Vince B
1 year ago

Trump is intentionally shooting himself in the foot. He