December 11, 2020 - 3:19pm
Of course Ed West’s typically excellent piece on Brexit regret caused such a stir yesterday: the whole topic’s become so poisoned and rancorous, and the two opposing sides have radicalised so much, that any ambivalence or nuance has been more or less extinguished from the debate.
In truth, the arguments for and against Brexit were always finely balanced, so much so that the opinion of anyone who voted with absolute certainty for either side should probably be discounted. But I voted for Brexit myself, and the events of the intervening years have confirmed my opinion that this was the right decision, for us, and for the European Union.
We all know the Lexit arguments against the EU by now, and they remain true: the bloc’s political structure is built to be unresponsive to the demands of voters, and locks in neoliberal economic policies by design, forcing us to adhere to a failed ideological doctrine rightly hated by the majority of the country.
But I don’t hate the EU: generally speaking, it’s a good idea, and we should hope it prospers and finds a way to reform itself into a workable, stable institution. The stronger, more coherent EU now coming into being may be far from the starry-eyed ideals of Remainers, in which it’s nothing but a gigantic NGO with a flag, but it’s a natural partner and ally to Britain — we should want it to work.
Indeed, if Remainers feel the affection for the EU they claim, they should be pleased that Brexit has, paradoxically, helped the bloc assume a more coherent form. We should hope that our relationship with the EU from the outside, over decades, develops into a happier and more stable arrangement than it ever was with us on the inside, constantly grumbling and blocking its consolidation.
But in truth, the real target of Brexit wasn’t the EU itself but what it represented in this country, and that isn’t a bad thing. The Brexit vote was a powerful symbolic vote against the depoliticisation of the past few decades: a world of There Is No Alternative governance where the decisions that matter were no longer in the hands of voters. It was a vote against British elites, and not Brussels ones, which is precisely why they took it so badly.
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SubscribeAris seems to be one of the best and most knowledgeable writers on geo-politics in the media. In fact, right now I can’t think of anyone better or more thought provoking. I am therefore pleased to learn that he voted for Brexit.
He’s getting better too in my opinion
And in mine. I’ve been going off Unherd, but I’ve found all his pieces thoughtful.
I thought the article missed the entire point of Brexit. He makes it about what he thought of it, but it was about the last bit of Patriotic flame of being British being stomped out. All the side issues he brings up are fine, but it really was that in modern times Britishness is despised and being destroyed and just enough people reacted to that. It would not happen again, British will be gone in a generation either way.
I don’t think so. My own reasons for voting leave concurred with Aris’. I know people voted for many reasons and without the voters who voted for patriotic reasons, we’d be remaining. But there were essentially no union flags waved in the streets, no street parties and parades after the referendum, or before. This was definitely not a nationalistic expression. Unlike Scottish independence.
Well, that’s what you thought Brexit was about. I don’t think it was about any one thing.
Why?
He forgot Nigel Farage. Most huge political events were the cause one man began and pushed through to a world changing event Brexit was not just something building like a volcano ready to explode. It was created by Farage and through his leadership the movement built and built.
aris and bruno macaes are my two favourites definitely
I agree with this in the main; though I think Aris Roussinos is very sanguine about the prospects for the EU.
Even if it survives and develops, its essential character as an oligarchic tyranny is baked in.
An NGO is what it always will be, so long as it lasts: a dreamworld/Nirvana for professional politicians and bureaucrats who do not want to be answerable in any radical way to the populace they lord it over.
“Even if it survives and develops”
Ever since the Steel & Coal Days certain segments of British elite (people didn’t care much about it) have been banging on about “not going to go last”…..surely by now the time has come to face the truth?!
‘Politics is back, with a vengeance: this is an opportunity to be grasped with both hands, not squandered or lamented. Everything’s up for grabs, the future’s in our hands, if we want it: that’s exactly what Brexit voters wanted and it’s precisely why je ne Bregret rien.’
So now we just need a leader and a political party able to keep the Conservative Party accountable to the task. How is Nigel these days?
The future is not in your hands. Britain is divided, is hardly British anymore. The BBC is the weather vein where the religious head is usually anything but Christian and Minorities are hired above their numbers in society and given extra inclusion and a Flag of St George is akin to a fascist symbol and Wokism = anti Western traditional values, and it the new charter of all MSM.
Politics is back with a vengeance, and it is against British values, and Brexit was a last gasp before the inevitable end.
weather vane…
I agree with your post. Englishness is particularly despised these days, it seems, Identity politics rules supreme,
I can only hope you are wrong
Spot on – the Brexit vote was mostly about rejection of the damage to the U.K. working class caused by globalisation – which th U.K. parliament conveniently blamed the EU for.
There will now be nowhere to hide.
OK, what are you gonna do about Blakcpool/Clacton/etc…?
Make vacations in Spain/Greece illegal?
It’s hard to imagine that Clacton’s difficulties will be easily overcome by anyone – but if you have any good suggestions to make to the UK government, I’m sure they will be gratefully recieved.
“It’s hard to imagine that Clacton’s difficulties will be easily overcome by anyone -” yes, go tell the truth to voters and see how they reward you!
That’s precisely what’s been done already !
Speaking as someone who has had the dubious pleasure of residing rather too near Blackpool for the last 20 years all I can say about that is God help them if they do!
Though I must add we voted 67.5% leave and all 14 districts of Lancashire voted leave too so I suppose its not really all that bad on reflection…. 😉
They will deploy gunboat diplomacy as the first resort not the last, to hide their political ineptitude and failure.
Sure, but it’s not a problem being solved by the EU, and it was even more difficult for the UK to solve without control of our country.
‘The stronger, more coherent EU now coming into being ‘ …
‘helped the bloc assume a more coherent form…’
Are you for real, Aris? Strong? Coherent? I voted Leave partly because I hoped it would jolt the EU into realising that carrying on as it is is unsustainable. But it seems literally incapable of changing direction and powers on to greater incoherence, greater injustice, greater poverty.
Good article. The world needs a different path than failed neo-liberalism. Communities need to come together again and plan their own futures. Centralized power has been a failure and has only led to corruption and an “elite” class divorced from reality.
Why do you describe it as “failed neo-liberalism”?
In what respect is neo liberalism a failure.
Duh, hello? Where have you been for the last few decades? I’ve been living in France, observing the inexorable slide of democracy into Blairite neo-liberalism.
The BBC and Sky News regularly wheel on Tony, Gordon and dear Peter to explain to us where we have gone so terribly wrong; thankfully that idiot Cameron made a fateful (wrong to him, he now claims) decision and we are now about to be FREEE!
Thanks Stanley, I live in New Zealand no BBC and I don’t subscribe to Sky; your “Duh, hello” response is not particularly helpful.
Neo-liberalism awakened the dragon, which probably isn’t the best news for Australasia long term
I wonder if David George is practicing his Kowtow? Or is planning to evacuate NZ?
Either way Mr Biden & Co are unlikely to defend him.
Enjoy France.
Coming back home then are we ?
If you can’t see that neo-liberalism has failed you really can’t see anything, And I write as one who would have been classed as a neo-liberal until perhaps 15 years ago.
Not very helpful Fraser.
I’m not blind to the problems inherent with free market economics. I just don’t get the idea that it is, overall, a failure. No one seems willing to elaborate on why that might be the case.
Because they don’t like it that is why is a failure!
Brilliant article. Love the bit about remainers seeing the EU as an NGO with a flag!!!
Thanks Aris. Bang on. You have eloquently expressed my reasoning waaay better than I could –
You think so? I’ve seldom seen a UK Government fettered in it’s choices by the idea that they divide into obviously necessary versus obviously stupid. Especially the current one.
Yes, already there and decades old. Endlessly pointed out and endlessly ignored. Why do you imagine our political class is going to change it’s spots now? Because of a thing called Brexit they can’t define let alone negotiate?
Exactly! The idea that politicians (and Treasury) had no idea about the country/economy is absurd. NuLab transferred hundreds of billions to the Left Behind areas between 1997-2007; it tried (and failed) to reproduce the “Bilbao effect”. Public money was used to build theaters, museums etc. to support creative industries for the regions. It also tried to hand over power to regional assemblies. It was a failure because many of these regions are geographically uncompetitive in the modern world.
The bar is so low it just does not matter how much the British politicos screw up and are anti British post Brexit. No one expects the Parliament and PM to do anything but make things worse, so they will not hold them to account, just be thankful they did not screw up even worse no matter how badly they do.
Well said Aris. It takes guts to challenge people to look beyond the mudslinging fest currently taking place. All challenges and setbacks also contain opportunities to move things forward, if we can only find them. The economic difficulties we will shortly be facing might just – perhaps out of necessity- provoke the overhaul this country’s economy and state structures have been needing for years. Whether that was part of the original Brexit prospectus or not.
Excellent article Aris. Echoes a lot of my own thoughts and reasons for (reluctantly) voting for Brexit.
Like you I hope the EU will come out of this better for it. Brexit might be the catalyst needed to make it reform and readjust.
Countries have more interdependencies now than perhaps at any other point in history – so we will not and cannot see a future without Europe being a major part of ours. But if it does not reform not then sadly it’s best for us that we are more insulated against the Eurozone than before.
Regarding this: “making our leaders play for higher stakes, directly subject to an electorate with an awakened sense of its own democratic power ” and newly radicalised against the sclerotic institutions blocking that power”, not if you are using Dominion voting machines.
I hope the UK learns from the USA’s mistakes: ensure a transparent and auditable process for counting the votes. Casting votes doesn’t matter in the US anymore…because dark forces now completely control the counting of votes.
The Left will never lose another US election that matters. We are lost. The UK and a few other places may now be the last beacons of hope for us all. Get this part right or nothing else matters.
“Casting votes doesn’t matter in the US anymore…because dark forces now completely control the counting of votes.”
Utterly a lie.
“The Left will never lose another US election that matters”
If that is the case why did Republicans win so many congressional seats and state elections?
Because the machine was focused on getting Biden in and the side issues were let slide as they failed to see how much Trumpism as a mood had entered the Nation’s voters. They stole the Prez, but missed the Congress due to not paying attention to the details. Also it looks like they may steal the Senate!
Absurd!
Republicans won in states that are heavily Democrat (NY and Cali). Are you suggesting that a Republican party in Georgia is handing the 2 senate seats over to Democrats …through corruption?
As of today Trump has won 1 out of 67 court cases. And even that case was about irregularities.
I fear your confidence in the UK is seriously misplaced
“Postal voting is open to fraud on an “industrial scale” and is “unviable” in its current form, a top judge has said.
Richard Mawrey QC, who tries cases of electoral fraud, told the BBC that people should not be able to apply for postal votes as a matter of course.”
BBC 11/3/20I4
“Now we have to deal with them, because we have no choice. “
There is a choice – PRETEND to deal with them. And that is exactly what is going to happen.
Unless you make Spanish/Greek vacations illegal what are you going to do about Blackpool/Clacton?
Take Central Bank Independence! Why does UK GOV (NuLab) goes for independence in 1997 (or depoliticized) ? Because people (the ones that cared) look around the world and said “let’s copy Bundesbank”. The track record of BofE controlled by treasure was not a happy one.
Would anyone (put patriotism aside) put his/her faith in a politically controlled BofE or an independent Bundesbank?
The thing about Brexit is that I discovered so many MPs (Diane Abbott, Mark Francois, etc.) that are utterly utterly useless. Full blown idiots.
Do you want those people to have more power?
And if you say “we can vote them out” the REAL answer is “no you will not”. They will get elected over and over again.
The new Tory Red Wall MPs are just as ignorant/useless as the previous Labor MPs. Because – brace yourself- the people want politicians that are “like us”
Your argument is self defeating.
If what you say is true, i.e. all politicians are useless, then the fact that you can vote them in or out should be irrelevant to you.
That you would rather useless politicians who you cannot vote in or out controlling how the Bank of England is run says enough.
You either haven’t fully considered the point or it merely exposes that your hatred of UK politicians (the one’s we can vote in and out) is so deep that you are blinded to the logic.
I didn’t say ALL politicians are useless – you did. I said many politicians are useless.
BofE-( e.g. read it again) is that technocracy rose because politicians were seen by the public as useless. The point I am trying to address (assuming you read the author’s post) is about bringing back the politics and rolling back technocracy.
The author and you are wrong because you both assume that things will be fixed now because “we have no choice”. It was never about choice it was and is about (geographic) reality – the places that voted Leave (up north) can not compete. And no choice exist to make Blackpool compete with Corfu.
Sometimes there is no choice.
As Aerosmith says “Dream until the dream comes true”
The only difference between the EU and an Empire is that the EU does not yet have its own armed forces. Thank God we are getting out before they do. Anyone who doubts what would have happened, had Britain been occupied by an EU army, should look at Macron’s law that bans people from filming the French police beating up demonstrators and remember how the Guardia Civil beat up Catalan pensioners who were exercising their right to freedom of expression and yet received no censure from the EU.
BREXIT is an existential threat to the EU and the EU will try to destroy Britain. It’s time our politicians understood this.
Well said! Re-politicisation was exactly what I voted for in 2016.
Yes, re-politicization is going to make Blackpool a rival to Barcelona and St. Tropez.
Writer of the year, Aris Roussinos.
Very good article. A vote against the civil service, quangos, ngo’s, bbc and politicians of the U.K. for being anti-democratic and useless.
I look forward to your articles Aris and very often agree with every word you print. I take my hat off to you Sir. Us British, I think, can take a tremendous amount of pushing before we snap but when we do finally snap everyone and his dog has to jump. Maybe the odd one or two more snaps brewing in the background too I reckon; time as always will tell
Just to clarify, by claiming that Brexit was a ‘vote against British elites’, what you really mean is that ‘Brexit was sold to the general population as a vote against British elites’, right? At best, Brexit is little more than a power-grab from one group of elites to another. No comment from me on the morality or cost/benefits of this power grab, but let’s be honest about it.
As I said before Brexit is a time-machine that has taken us all back to the last point of the inconclusive civil strife of the nineteen eighties. A false patriotism of taking back control was served as a rabble-rouser for a neo-liberal post Brexit power-grab. How long before the working class rabble of the leave vote realise their vote was a neo-liberal poisoned chalice?
How long before the working class rabble of the leave vote realise their vote was a neo-liberal poisoned chalice?
Not sure the “working class” are bothered about “neo liberal poisoned chalices”…makes you sound rather pompous and arrogant though-keep taking the advanced sociology course-you can aspire to sounding even more like a polysyllabic prck
“Now we have to deal with them, because we have no choice.”
We are far, far weaker now than we were in 1972. Even in 1980 before Thatcher’s bankster medicine wiped out huge swathes of British industry I recall an industrialist – yes we used to have those then – commenting that “we could turn out anything, in any quantity”. True a lot of it was uncompetitive but the North Sea oil money could have revolutionised British manufacture – whose age old bugbear was the lack of secure long term finance. This was down to the City of London and their parasitical political toadies in Parliament. Keynes said that when the capital development of a country is left to a gambling then the job is likely to be very ill done – and so to our massive detriment has it proved.
What can we make now? – the square root of sweet fa. Where ate the British manufacturing concerns – long gone or flogged off to foreign owners. This has amounted to eating the seed corn and has sustained the dream world we have lived in for many a long year.
If you can see how this can be dealt with then you are a better man than I.
This is frankly bonkers. The idea that problems that he quite rightly admits had nothing to do with the EU will now be resolved is nonsense. This is magical thinking. They are all almost certain to be made much worse. Increasingly what we hear from Brexiteers at present to justify themselves is indistinguishable from satire.
Where does he say that the problems he identifies “will now be resolved”? And why are they “almost certain to be made much worse”? It seems that you agree with Aris Roussinos that the problems have been getting worse–so, yes, it is likely (if you’re right, of course) that they will continue to worsen, but that would have been true had we voted to Remain.
I’m going to quote a passage, just so we know that we’re talking about the same problems.
How would a 52% vote for Remain have addressed any of this? Similar problems exist in some EU states: France and Italy certainly have regional imbalances. The EU may offer greater stability than any one nation could expect (and this was a reason I was initially for Remain), but that stability means problems which would have been addressed by competent government can instead be overlooked until they become chronic (as may be happening in France and Italy).
He clearly thinks they are more likely to be resolved as a consequence of Brexit. The reality is that the post-Brexit economic pressures are going to be used as an excuse for more running down of public services, pandering to the wealthy, and the reduction of labour and environmental protections.
This is hardly surprising when the same party that has vigorously promoted financial engineering, inequality and running down the public sphere has brought us Brexit.
As for the ‘the centrifugal pressures threatening to break the union’ – a 55-45 No vote in the 2014 Scottish independence referendum has now become 55-45 Yes in polls.
He doesn’t say that at all. He is saying that Brexit has left the politicians with nowhere to hide, whatever the outcome.
Many people taunt Brexiteers about the need of “taking back control” as something somehow fanciful or non existent.
But this is precisely what it means. Politicians will have fewer excuses, and voters therefore have more power to elect people who will do what they want.
If the people bought the excuse that EU Is to blame for X they will happily buy that someone else is to blame for X in 2023.
“He clearly thinks they are more likely to be resolved as a consequence of Brexit.”
Like most Remainers, you seem not to understand the difference between:-
(1) X is necessary for Y, as in “Brexit is needed in to address the problems posed by EU membership”
and
(2) X is sufficient for Y, as in “Brexit will resolve the problems posed by EU membership”.
No it will not because the REAL problems of UK have nothing to do with EU membership.
You have proved Drahcir’s point there.
Put plainly; EU Membership may not have caused a lot of the UK’s problems, but in order to address them properly, leaving the EU is beneficial.
“EU Membership may not have caused a lot of the UK’s problems, but in order to address them properly, leaving the EU is beneficial.”
EU Membership HAS NOT caused the MOST SERIOUS UK problems. Every human organization (including UK state) looks at the issues and decides which one is important and which one is not.
EU Migration to UK (assuming they stay) is simply not a problem for UK. They are only 33% of all migrants since 1997 and on average are young and net contributors to the society. They also integrate very well – unless you believe that Poles are a secret papist army.
Non EU Migration to UK (c.66% of all since 1997) is a major problem because they
– most likely will stay
– hard to integrate
– net receivers
True.
I’m not sure of your point. Clearly leaving the EU is neither necessary nor sufficient for resolving problems that have nothing to do with our membership of the EU!
The free movement provision set out in the Treaty of Lisbon has been a major contributant to the exponential population growth besetting the UK for the last 15 years, and the resultant housing and public service crises, not to mention the pressure on C2DE wages.
Leaving the EU is necessary to address these issues. Almost nobody says it’s sufficient, and the continuous Remainer straw manning in relation to this latter point is tiresome.
That argument, specious as it is, is a completely different one to that being made in this article.
I was addressing YOUR straw-man comment to the effect that leaving the EU would not SUFFICE to limit population growth. Can you please at least TRY to follow your own dialectic.
I wasn’t addressing that statement at all. I was addressing the point of this article which is that ‘the real target of Brexit wasn’t the EU itself’.
Since 1997 (Facts not fiction) c.66% of all migrants to UK are non EU Migrants – that part of migration is a UK GOV Policy.
UK GOV (not EU) made the decision to open its border to EU migrants.
Your comment makes no sense unless you are understood as arguing against my claim that the UK needs to leave the EU in order to limit its population growth. Accordingly, your argument can only be construed as follows:-
1. The UK has historically not limited immigration from non-EU
ergo
2. The UK does not need to leave the EU in order to limit its population growth.
Your argument is invalid. The conclusion does not follow from the premise.
In fact, I would go a bit further. You are manifestly incapable of engaging in basic reasoning.
We can’t solve the problem of immigration levels outrunning the capacity of our infrastructure from within the EU because we had no control of out borders. There are other analogous problems.
Have you read this article?
He doesn’t say that. Your inability to read is motivated reasoning