The western liberals are too busy landing their sympathetic ears to more important matters like muslims complaining about their feelings being hurt by a British school teacher using Mohammad cartoons in his classroom where vulnerable muslim children are being educated. How dare British schools teach truth to such sensitive muslim children? Only muslims are allowed to brainwash their own sensitive children.
clem alford
3 years ago
I certainly won’t forget the war for the liberation and formation of the freed Bangladesh by let’s be honest, India. I was there in West Bengal at the time from 1968 to 1971 and saw millions flood over the Indian border to escape the West Pakistani butchery in 1971. Many never returned of the 2 million refugees.
West Pakistani language and culture and Bengali language and culture are very different. The environment and climates are also different from the predominately Punjab and Sindi culture and environment in Pakistan. There is even now a movement for the liberation of Baluchistan which is officially still part of Pakistan.
However what I find tragic is the ingratitude of the politics in Bangladesh towards India. Because of religion which is heavily Islamic in Bangladesh and mainly Hindu in West Bengal but with an increasing Muslim presence in West Bengal tensions have arisen greatly. When politics an religion get mixed like this there is bound to be a social disaster which is a real shame for a region that is scenically beautiful and culturally vibrant with a deep sense of history. No wonder the British made Calcutta the second capital of its empire for a while but were idiotic in Bengal’s partition in its game of geopolitics.
As a former vice chancellor of a Bengali University told me once. ‘You see we in West Bengal and those in Bangladesh are same people but divided by religion’.
No, Pakistan provoked India. Don’t forget they had been at war before. If India had not intervened it would have been genocide. See some of the reports by Indian officers. See Gita Mehta’s film, ‘Dateline Bangladesh’, it is a pretty accurate account of events leading up to and the war itself. (1) Gita Mehta’s documentary Dateline Bangladesh – YouTube
James Cameron was a very distinguished British reporter at the time and who was seriously injured there and agreed. West Pakistan was economically plundering the Bengalis and trying to enforce Urdu as the national language which was a step too far, in spite of them both being Islamic. In fact, the Pakistani army was killing the mullahs and imams in spite of their Islamic religion both professed to follow. I recently just saw a comment on social media by an Indian Bengali and he says at street level the average Bangladeshi is ungrateful for what India did. The government, of course, says differently When I was in Dhaka a few years ago I felt that also with an unjustified arrogance towards India which I can only put down to religion. Hinduism and Islam are very different. Hinduism is indigenous to the sub-continent and Islam was imposed on Bharat in a similar way Pakistan was doing to then East Pakistan, now Bangladesh.
Dougie Undersub
3 years ago
“That is, in large part, because it does not fit in with the western progressive framing of conflicts and geopolitical disputes through the prism of the ‘Non-Muslim on Muslim’ oppression, but is more reluctant to engage with historical cases in which the belligerent perpetrator is overwhelmingly Muslim.” Lets also note the same attitude that highlights the huge civilian death toll in Iraq following the 2003 invasion without mentioning that 90% of the victims were killed by other Muslims for the sole crime of being the wrong sort of Muslim.
In islam, how many muslims of the right kind are there? islam is a supremacist cult, and each of its warring factions want to be the ones who control the spoils of war (and peace).
Wars of religion are wars of conquest, just like all other wars.
clem alford
3 years ago
I would just like to add that there is a film that was made in 1971 by Geta Mehta called Dateline Bangladesh. It is available to see on YouTube. I assisted doing the music. The film is very accurate in its portrayal of what happened and the events that led up to that terrible war.
I believe James Cameron who was a reporter was seriously injured covering it.
I just looked it up on Youtube. You have to verify your age and google asks for credit card details. I’ve not known that before. Always reluctant to give out info so hesitating to watch.
When google asks for financial details to setup (complete) an account, there is a “camouflaged” button to skip.
It always works for me.
Susannah Baring Tait
3 years ago
I was driving Sheikh Mujib Rahman around when he first came to visit the UK shortly after . He went barefoot, as did his retinue, but all stayed at Claridge’s. He was charming and had me drive him around areas such as Notting Hill Gate – especially at lunch times – where he would stop unannounced at the homes of Bangladeshi immigrants who would delightedly welcome him in to share their lunches. The moment this invitation had been extended, he would turn and call me in to join them. I have never since enjoyed such delicious dahls, etc.. It was an interesting interlude. But in marked contrast to my next encounter with his new State’s diplomatic representative. Another story!
Interesting. I have noticed a change in the Bangladeshis here in the UK.
Can’t quite put my finger on it. Of course, mostly they are from a farming background in the Sylette district. I don’t understand their Bengali very much. I used to have one music student who was brought up in both Bangladesh and here in England. He became very schizoid on a cultural level and more so after he had done the Haj and then came back to the UK. He also had a hard time in Bangladesh when he was older to study Bangla language and was put in a class with a bunch of 12 to 14-year-olds which affected him. He was married with kids!!
After he had done his haj which confirms his worship of allah who absolutely hates non-muslims.
Vijay Kant
3 years ago
It should also be remembered that the US was on the side of Pakistan during this war. In fact, Nixon warned Indira Gandhi not to send Indian troops into East Pakistan. The US actually placed an aircraft carrier in the Bay of Bengal to threaten India. Is there any wonder that this war is being whitewashed? It is in the interest of the US, Pakistan and the most of the Islamic world that this horror be whitewashed. For God’s sake, even Bangladeshi political establishment is ungrateful to India for liberating them. Sunni muslims must pretend to be unified in the face of truth.
Come on, that was a decade later, 1980. But you are right, India-Russia, USA- Pakistan, it was a mess. Still is, was through all the decades since. I do not think Pakistan makes a good ally.
But it was a complete SNAFU, the Russia/India/China/USA/Pakistan 5 party Cold War mess with Nixon at the Helm. I remember it vaguely, and the crazy Nixon/China times. Maybe the analogy of ‘The Great Game’ is a good one, which was to hold the status quo less the wrong powers faced each other across a border, always keep neutral lands between global powers.
But wasn’t India part of that ‘non allied’ group? Or was that in name only?
m pathy
3 years ago
What is yet missing from this account is the systematic targetting and eradication of Bangladesh’s hindu minority – widely represented in the “‘backbone’ of medical professionals, mechanical engineers, and leading educationalists.” the Mr Ehsan mentions. It was a hindu holocaust. Many of the war criminals live in the UK and openly help to organise jihadi groups in present day Bangladesh.
The tactic of hiding from an open discussion of these atrocities for fear of playing into hindu RW politics – how successful is it? 5 decades later, hindutva forces are ascendant in India and passing laws to curb muslim migration into the country because these memories simply cannot be simply eradicated by liberal fiat. https://indianexpress.com/article/world/world-others/not-bengalis-hindus-were-pakistani-targets-in-1971-bangladesh-war-claims-new-book/
Yes, you are correct. Hindus fled Bangladesh. My Indian Bengali teacher’s son-in-law’s Hindu family was originally from East Pakistan. They were Bengali Brahmans. Banerjee, and was a history professor.
Many of the top classical musicians left East Bengal to live in India.
Andrew Baldwin
3 years ago
If the West doesn’t want to talk about East and West Pakistan much anymore, it is because the Arab counterpart of East and West Pakistan, Gaza and the West Bank, also broke apart in a violent way going on 14 years ago in June. The idea of a single smallish Arab state with Israel in between always seemed like a dimwitted one, but people of goodwill were at least willing to give it a decent try. As it turned out, the so-called Palestinians themselves bailed on the idea. Nevertheless, it seems the consensus Western view is still to try to revive this corpse. It’s a view that should really be abandoned. The people of Gaza and the West Bank don’t have different languages like the people of East and West Pakistan, but non-contiguous countries never work very well. The only exceptions are countries like the United States, with Alaska and the contiguous 48 American states, where the smaller of the non-contiguous entities is so much smaller in population and output as to dwindle into insignificance. (Kaliningrad is not a problem in the Russian Federation for the same reason.) This is not the case with Gaza, which in 2017 had 1.8M people, as opposed to 2.7M people in the West Bank. So this is a similar kind of division to that between East and West Pakistan. The two regions, east and west are also much closer to each other in population than the rest of Germany with close to 63M people (as of 1933) and East Prussia, with 2.7M people. That also didn’t work out very well, although as with Gaza and the West Bank, there was no difference in religion. In 1939, East Prussia was made contiguous with the rest of Germany by obliterating Poland. The only people who should find the idea of Palestine as the Arab Pakistan attractive are those whose ultimate goal is to make the two parts contiguous by obliterating Israel. That’s why everyone else should drop the idea for good.
Stephen Follows
3 years ago
Little girls at Ariana Grande concerts know all too well that Muslims are ‘belligerent perpetrators’.
Michael St John Croasdale
3 years ago
I would like to know much more about this. I do remember a Bangladeshi Restaurateur in Derby in the mid 70s, a retired Army Officer, talking about the immense courage displayed by his compatriots at home, in Bangladesh.
See Geeta Mehta’s ‘Dateline Bangladesh’ an hour long film made back in 1971 at the time of the war. It is an accurate account as to what happened as I was not only in Bengal at the time but involved in the films production.
I knew that Pakistan and Bangladesh used to be one nation, but I know nothing about what led to their separation.
Do tell us more.
Last edited 3 years ago by Andrea X
David McKee
3 years ago
I am a student at SOAS. I can categorically assure Dr. Ehsan that the birth of Bangladesh has not been forgotten, and is being taught in the Political Science classrooms. And it makes no difference if the academics are American, Indian or Pakistani: they all approached very contested issues with admirable fairness.
Be careful of SOAS. They have a vested interest in what they teach. It has a bit of a checkered colonial history.
Tami Misledus
3 years ago
It’s a pity that these two primitive sharia states didn’t fight their war until complete destruction of one or (preferably) both of them.
Pauline Baxter
3 years ago
Thank You. I did not know that detail of Bangladesh’s history. Though I did know that there are differences between different groups of Muslims.
Now I will add Bangladesh to my personal list, of Commonwealth Countries, that Brexit Britain should trade with.
The western liberals are too busy landing their sympathetic ears to more important matters like muslims complaining about their feelings being hurt by a British school teacher using Mohammad cartoons in his classroom where vulnerable muslim children are being educated. How dare British schools teach truth to such sensitive muslim children? Only muslims are allowed to brainwash their own sensitive children.
I certainly won’t forget the war for the liberation and formation of the freed Bangladesh by let’s be honest, India. I was there in West Bengal at the time from 1968 to 1971 and saw millions flood over the Indian border to escape the West Pakistani butchery in 1971. Many never returned of the 2 million refugees.
West Pakistani language and culture and Bengali language and culture are very different. The environment and climates are also different from the predominately Punjab and Sindi culture and environment in Pakistan. There is even now a movement for the liberation of Baluchistan which is officially still part of Pakistan.
However what I find tragic is the ingratitude of the politics in Bangladesh towards India. Because of religion which is heavily Islamic in Bangladesh and mainly Hindu in West Bengal but with an increasing Muslim presence in West Bengal tensions have arisen greatly. When politics an religion get mixed like this there is bound to be a social disaster which is a real shame for a region that is scenically beautiful and culturally vibrant with a deep sense of history. No wonder the British made Calcutta the second capital of its empire for a while but were idiotic in Bengal’s partition in its game of geopolitics.
As a former vice chancellor of a Bengali University told me once. ‘You see we in West Bengal and those in Bangladesh are same people but divided by religion’.
I believe Indera went to war with W Pakistan to stop the refugee flow from swamping India.
That is still a good enough reason.
No, Pakistan provoked India. Don’t forget they had been at war before. If India had not intervened it would have been genocide. See some of the reports by Indian officers. See Gita Mehta’s film, ‘Dateline Bangladesh’, it is a pretty accurate account of events leading up to and the war itself. (1) Gita Mehta’s documentary Dateline Bangladesh – YouTube
James Cameron was a very distinguished British reporter at the time and who was seriously injured there and agreed. West Pakistan was economically plundering the Bengalis and trying to enforce Urdu as the national language which was a step too far, in spite of them both being Islamic. In fact, the Pakistani army was killing the mullahs and imams in spite of their Islamic religion both professed to follow. I recently just saw a comment on social media by an Indian Bengali and he says at street level the average Bangladeshi is ungrateful for what India did. The government, of course, says differently When I was in Dhaka a few years ago I felt that also with an unjustified arrogance towards India which I can only put down to religion. Hinduism and Islam are very different. Hinduism is indigenous to the sub-continent and Islam was imposed on Bharat in a similar way Pakistan was doing to then East Pakistan, now Bangladesh.
“That is, in large part, because it does not fit in with the western progressive framing of conflicts and geopolitical disputes through the prism of the ‘Non-Muslim on Muslim’ oppression, but is more reluctant to engage with historical cases in which the belligerent perpetrator is overwhelmingly Muslim.”
Lets also note the same attitude that highlights the huge civilian death toll in Iraq following the 2003 invasion without mentioning that 90% of the victims were killed by other Muslims for the sole crime of being the wrong sort of Muslim.
In islam, how many muslims of the right kind are there? islam is a supremacist cult, and each of its warring factions want to be the ones who control the spoils of war (and peace).
Wars of religion are wars of conquest, just like all other wars.
I would just like to add that there is a film that was made in 1971 by Geta Mehta called Dateline Bangladesh. It is available to see on YouTube. I assisted doing the music. The film is very accurate in its portrayal of what happened and the events that led up to that terrible war.
I believe James Cameron who was a reporter was seriously injured covering it.
I will look it up. Thanks for the tip and for your observations.
I just looked it up on Youtube. You have to verify your age and google asks for credit card details. I’ve not known that before. Always reluctant to give out info so hesitating to watch.
That’s very strange. I just opened Youtube and entered the title and it came up with no problem!! Maybe info control!!!
When google asks for financial details to setup (complete) an account, there is a “camouflaged” button to skip.
It always works for me.
I was driving Sheikh Mujib Rahman around when he first came to visit the UK shortly after . He went barefoot, as did his retinue, but all stayed at Claridge’s. He was charming and had me drive him around areas such as Notting Hill Gate – especially at lunch times – where he would stop unannounced at the homes of Bangladeshi immigrants who would delightedly welcome him in to share their lunches. The moment this invitation had been extended, he would turn and call me in to join them. I have never since enjoyed such delicious dahls, etc.. It was an interesting interlude. But in marked contrast to my next encounter with his new State’s diplomatic representative. Another story!
Interesting. I have noticed a change in the Bangladeshis here in the UK.
Can’t quite put my finger on it. Of course, mostly they are from a farming background in the Sylette district. I don’t understand their Bengali very much. I used to have one music student who was brought up in both Bangladesh and here in England. He became very schizoid on a cultural level and more so after he had done the Haj and then came back to the UK. He also had a hard time in Bangladesh when he was older to study Bangla language and was put in a class with a bunch of 12 to 14-year-olds which affected him. He was married with kids!!
After he had done his haj which confirms his worship of allah who absolutely hates non-muslims.
It should also be remembered that the US was on the side of Pakistan during this war. In fact, Nixon warned Indira Gandhi not to send Indian troops into East Pakistan. The US actually placed an aircraft carrier in the Bay of Bengal to threaten India. Is there any wonder that this war is being whitewashed? It is in the interest of the US, Pakistan and the most of the Islamic world that this horror be whitewashed. For God’s sake, even Bangladeshi political establishment is ungrateful to India for liberating them. Sunni muslims must pretend to be unified in the face of truth.
Puzzling. Would you have some ideas about how US interests would have been perceived to be served by frustrating the independence of West Pakistan?
Well, the US was helped by Pakistan in containing the USSR in Afghanistan. And to be honest, India was after all an ally of the USSR!
Come on, that was a decade later, 1980. But you are right, India-Russia, USA- Pakistan, it was a mess. Still is, was through all the decades since. I do not think Pakistan makes a good ally.
But it was a complete SNAFU, the Russia/India/China/USA/Pakistan 5 party Cold War mess with Nixon at the Helm. I remember it vaguely, and the crazy Nixon/China times. Maybe the analogy of ‘The Great Game’ is a good one, which was to hold the status quo less the wrong powers faced each other across a border, always keep neutral lands between global powers.
In those days, it is said that Karachi was crawling with CIA agents and New Delhi was crawling with KGB.
Well didn’t Nehru go to USSR and said he had seen socialism?
But wasn’t India part of that ‘non allied’ group? Or was that in name only?
What is yet missing from this account is the systematic targetting and eradication of Bangladesh’s hindu minority – widely represented in the “‘backbone’ of medical professionals, mechanical engineers, and leading educationalists.” the Mr Ehsan mentions. It was a hindu holocaust. Many of the war criminals live in the UK and openly help to organise jihadi groups in present day Bangladesh.
The tactic of hiding from an open discussion of these atrocities for fear of playing into hindu RW politics – how successful is it? 5 decades later, hindutva forces are ascendant in India and passing laws to curb muslim migration into the country because these memories simply cannot be simply eradicated by liberal fiat.
https://indianexpress.com/article/world/world-others/not-bengalis-hindus-were-pakistani-targets-in-1971-bangladesh-war-claims-new-book/
Yes, you are correct. Hindus fled Bangladesh. My Indian Bengali teacher’s son-in-law’s Hindu family was originally from East Pakistan. They were Bengali Brahmans. Banerjee, and was a history professor.
Many of the top classical musicians left East Bengal to live in India.
If the West doesn’t want to talk about East and West Pakistan much anymore, it is because the Arab counterpart of East and West Pakistan, Gaza and the West Bank, also broke apart in a violent way going on 14 years ago in June. The idea of a single smallish Arab state with Israel in between always seemed like a dimwitted one, but people of goodwill were at least willing to give it a decent try. As it turned out, the so-called Palestinians themselves bailed on the idea. Nevertheless, it seems the consensus Western view is still to try to revive this corpse. It’s a view that should really be abandoned. The people of Gaza and the West Bank don’t have different languages like the people of East and West Pakistan, but non-contiguous countries never work very well. The only exceptions are countries like the United States, with Alaska and the contiguous 48 American states, where the smaller of the non-contiguous entities is so much smaller in population and output as to dwindle into insignificance. (Kaliningrad is not a problem in the Russian Federation for the same reason.) This is not the case with Gaza, which in 2017 had 1.8M people, as opposed to 2.7M people in the West Bank. So this is a similar kind of division to that between East and West Pakistan. The two regions, east and west are also much closer to each other in population than the rest of Germany with close to 63M people (as of 1933) and East Prussia, with 2.7M people. That also didn’t work out very well, although as with Gaza and the West Bank, there was no difference in religion. In 1939, East Prussia was made contiguous with the rest of Germany by obliterating Poland. The only people who should find the idea of Palestine as the Arab Pakistan attractive are those whose ultimate goal is to make the two parts contiguous by obliterating Israel. That’s why everyone else should drop the idea for good.
Little girls at Ariana Grande concerts know all too well that Muslims are ‘belligerent perpetrators’.
I would like to know much more about this. I do remember a Bangladeshi Restaurateur in Derby in the mid 70s, a retired Army Officer, talking about the immense courage displayed by his compatriots at home, in Bangladesh.
See Geeta Mehta’s ‘Dateline Bangladesh’ an hour long film made back in 1971 at the time of the war. It is an accurate account as to what happened as I was not only in Bengal at the time but involved in the films production.
Well he would, wouldn’t he?
I knew that Pakistan and Bangladesh used to be one nation, but I know nothing about what led to their separation.
Do tell us more.
I am a student at SOAS. I can categorically assure Dr. Ehsan that the birth of Bangladesh has not been forgotten, and is being taught in the Political Science classrooms. And it makes no difference if the academics are American, Indian or Pakistani: they all approached very contested issues with admirable fairness.
Be careful of SOAS. They have a vested interest in what they teach. It has a bit of a checkered colonial history.
It’s a pity that these two primitive sharia states didn’t fight their war until complete destruction of one or (preferably) both of them.
Thank You. I did not know that detail of Bangladesh’s history. Though I did know that there are differences between different groups of Muslims.
Now I will add Bangladesh to my personal list, of Commonwealth Countries, that Brexit Britain should trade with.