I am proud of much about the UK. But that feeling is about the country itself, its history and its people. I no longer have any pride in our institutions of governance and state, because they have decayed and corrupted to the point that they are a source of shame. And that includes the NHS.
I don’t think that our political parties, political individuals, or the “elites” (who are they?) to whom the author refers, have anything to tell any of us about being proud about this country. They are the problem rather than the solution.
Prashant Kotak
2 months ago
“…conservatives who want to win must also offer a nuanced and attractive alternative if they are to recapture any significant part of elite opinion…”
Whereas of course, progressives who want to win can offer up any old reality-denying tut like transgenderism as long as it’s kind, inclusive, diverse, and pro-Palastine, and that will be treated as the naked words of old God in a foggy white beard, or better still, the foggy old words of a naked white Marx or Lenin or Lennon in a beard, unless you ask Google Gemini in which case the Marx will be black and the beard a blood-splattered red, although the words will still be foggy and old.
But here’s a thought, how about conservatives, instead of offering ‘a nuanced and attractive alternative’ try and offer conservativism instead?
Actually the best alternative to the flatulent state when it comes to the provision of healthcare, education and social support is mutualism. The greatest tragedy of the Labour movement was the abandonment, prompted by middle class Fabians, of the co-op tradition in favour of big state Stalin worship. We’ve never recovered.
David Graham
2 months ago
It’s like the Woke elites’ Year Zero. I guess the biggest state institution would have the never ending devotion of big statists.
Peter B
2 months ago
We need to stop deluding ourselves that the NHS is some sort of world-class organisation. It so obviously is not. I’m sure it has parts which are and staff who are. But the organisation – no way. And lying to ourselves doesn’t make it so and only makes the task of improving it much harder.
We also need to stop lying about how awful the US medical system is. At the top end (and that may well be 50%), it’s much better than the NHS. It’s just less equal. But that’s the US for you (and they way they like it in many ways).
I take no pride in “elite opinion” that rejoices in poor performance and mediocrity.
Jeremy Hunt’s on the fast track to a well deserved P45. Good riddance.
2.6 million (22% of working age people) in the UK are economically inactive. Only a portion of these are mothers with young children. If this implies that something like 15% of the UK workforce cannot work because they are not well, then this also implies that the NHS is in fact doing an absolutely terrible job of keeping the UK populace well. I’m wondering, where’s the hole in my argument?
Many are suffering from “incurable” illnesses. That is, they do not wish them to be treated because that would mean they would no longer be eligible for benefits, and would have to go back to work. This whole system needs tightening up.
Right-Wing Hippie
2 months ago
This week Jeremy Hunt laid his sacrifice on the altar set up by Nye Bevan in 1948, claiming in his Budget speech that the “NHS is, rightly, the biggest reason most of us are proud to be British”.
Thus revealing that Mr. Hunt has a rather low opinion of what it means to be British.
The UK Tory Party is brimful of the Woking Class, Mr Hunt being an archetype.
Chris Milburn
2 months ago
This is odd to read, as it’s so full of assumptions and inconsistencies.
First, if the majority of people in a society vote for more free stuff, stuff that will be “free” because someone else is forced to provide it to them, does that make this “democratic”? If 51% of people vote that rape should be legal, does that make it right?
Second, there is an assumption that if someone criticizes socialized medicine, it’s up to them to come up with “an alternative” (…”conservatives who want to win must also offer a nuanced and attractive alternative”). Put another way: “If you want to take away our free stuff, you have to come up with a better way of giving us free stuff”.
The idea that “Yay, the government is going to give us all free stuff” was a wonderful historic moment in Britain (or any westernized country – as we are all on this road – I’m in Canada and it’s worse, as private provision of medicine is prohibited) is not only wrong, it’s 180-degrees from the truth. It was one of the first steps on the path that led us to Big Government, Big Taxes, and Big Managerialism.
At the very least conservatives have to win over a much bigger proportion of the voters than they do today. Of course some sort of alternative needs to be offered, if only to shift the Overton window of debate.
Instead, I detect an awful lot of off putting whining going on. No, it ain’t, and life ain’t – fair – a point I thought right wingers usually emphasised!
Great concentrations of wealth attract parasites – and the State is no exception. The British state is being destroyed by the rent-seeking behaviour of the middle class.
When Theresa May somewhat timidly suggested that some small part of the trillions in unearned property wealth that has been lavished on us by successive governments be used to pay for our social care the loudest howls of outrage came from the Guardian.
If that doesn’t tell you everything then you’re not listening.
Any chance you’ve got a link to the article (or few words from title). Bang on comment – but taxing that wealth probably would not be an election winner.
If 51% of people vote that rape should be legal, does that make it right?
There must be a name for this kind of fallacious reasoning. Anybody know what it is?
Silly post to be honest.
Chipoko
2 months ago
“British Right-wingers”
Pejorative, contemptuous tone established from the outset of the article. Mr Gooch’s sweeping pen alienates a broad demographic with immediate effect.
I am proud of much about the UK. But that feeling is about the country itself, its history and its people. I no longer have any pride in our institutions of governance and state, because they have decayed and corrupted to the point that they are a source of shame. And that includes the NHS.
I don’t think that our political parties, political individuals, or the “elites” (who are they?) to whom the author refers, have anything to tell any of us about being proud about this country. They are the problem rather than the solution.
“…conservatives who want to win must also offer a nuanced and attractive alternative if they are to recapture any significant part of elite opinion…”
Whereas of course, progressives who want to win can offer up any old reality-denying tut like transgenderism as long as it’s kind, inclusive, diverse, and pro-Palastine, and that will be treated as the naked words of old God in a foggy white beard, or better still, the foggy old words of a naked white Marx or Lenin or Lennon in a beard, unless you ask Google Gemini in which case the Marx will be black and the beard a blood-splattered red, although the words will still be foggy and old.
But here’s a thought, how about conservatives, instead of offering ‘a nuanced and attractive alternative’ try and offer conservativism instead?
Actually the best alternative to the flatulent state when it comes to the provision of healthcare, education and social support is mutualism. The greatest tragedy of the Labour movement was the abandonment, prompted by middle class Fabians, of the co-op tradition in favour of big state Stalin worship. We’ve never recovered.
It’s like the Woke elites’ Year Zero. I guess the biggest state institution would have the never ending devotion of big statists.
We need to stop deluding ourselves that the NHS is some sort of world-class organisation. It so obviously is not. I’m sure it has parts which are and staff who are. But the organisation – no way. And lying to ourselves doesn’t make it so and only makes the task of improving it much harder.
We also need to stop lying about how awful the US medical system is. At the top end (and that may well be 50%), it’s much better than the NHS. It’s just less equal. But that’s the US for you (and they way they like it in many ways).
I take no pride in “elite opinion” that rejoices in poor performance and mediocrity.
Jeremy Hunt’s on the fast track to a well deserved P45. Good riddance.
2.6 million (22% of working age people) in the UK are economically inactive. Only a portion of these are mothers with young children. If this implies that something like 15% of the UK workforce cannot work because they are not well, then this also implies that the NHS is in fact doing an absolutely terrible job of keeping the UK populace well. I’m wondering, where’s the hole in my argument?
Many are suffering from “incurable” illnesses. That is, they do not wish them to be treated because that would mean they would no longer be eligible for benefits, and would have to go back to work. This whole system needs tightening up.
This week Jeremy Hunt laid his sacrifice on the altar set up by Nye Bevan in 1948, claiming in his Budget speech that the “NHS is, rightly, the biggest reason most of us are proud to be British”.
Thus revealing that Mr. Hunt has a rather low opinion of what it means to be British.
His opening statement about a certain memorial set the tone. Tone deaf Tories. Oh that applies to the opposition too.
The UK Tory Party is brimful of the Woking Class, Mr Hunt being an archetype.
This is odd to read, as it’s so full of assumptions and inconsistencies.
First, if the majority of people in a society vote for more free stuff, stuff that will be “free” because someone else is forced to provide it to them, does that make this “democratic”? If 51% of people vote that rape should be legal, does that make it right?
Second, there is an assumption that if someone criticizes socialized medicine, it’s up to them to come up with “an alternative” (…”conservatives who want to win must also offer a nuanced and attractive alternative”). Put another way: “If you want to take away our free stuff, you have to come up with a better way of giving us free stuff”.
The idea that “Yay, the government is going to give us all free stuff” was a wonderful historic moment in Britain (or any westernized country – as we are all on this road – I’m in Canada and it’s worse, as private provision of medicine is prohibited) is not only wrong, it’s 180-degrees from the truth. It was one of the first steps on the path that led us to Big Government, Big Taxes, and Big Managerialism.
At the very least conservatives have to win over a much bigger proportion of the voters than they do today. Of course some sort of alternative needs to be offered, if only to shift the Overton window of debate.
Instead, I detect an awful lot of off putting whining going on. No, it ain’t, and life ain’t – fair – a point I thought right wingers usually emphasised!
Great concentrations of wealth attract parasites – and the State is no exception. The British state is being destroyed by the rent-seeking behaviour of the middle class.
When Theresa May somewhat timidly suggested that some small part of the trillions in unearned property wealth that has been lavished on us by successive governments be used to pay for our social care the loudest howls of outrage came from the Guardian.
If that doesn’t tell you everything then you’re not listening.
Any chance you’ve got a link to the article (or few words from title). Bang on comment – but taxing that wealth probably would not be an election winner.
As an abstract point, this is clearly true.
Nonetheless, if it’s the haves telling the have nots that “life just ain’t fair” only a dunce wouldn’t be suspicious.
There must be a name for this kind of fallacious reasoning. Anybody know what it is?
Silly post to be honest.
“British Right-wingers”
Pejorative, contemptuous tone established from the outset of the article. Mr Gooch’s sweeping pen alienates a broad demographic with immediate effect.