November 14, 2023 - 9:50pm
Recent developments in America’s conservative media landscape have illuminated deepening fissures over Israel, with implications that could ripple through the broader Republican Party. Boiling-over tensions between commentators Candace Owens and Ben Shapiro over their differing views on Israel’s actions in the conflict with Hamas exemplify this divide.
Shapiro, co-founder of The Daily Wire and an ardent supporter of Israel, publicly criticised Owens, a Right-wing activist and contributor to his company, for her stance on the conflict. Owens, taking what some may consider an isolationist or “America First” position, has condemned what she saw as “genocide” by Israel in Gaza. Shapiro argued that such comments were “disgraceful” and “disreputable”, highlighting her comparison of Israel to the pre-segregation South (interestingly, Owens, who is black, is much closer in alignment with the views of African Americans than Republicans on this issue).
Owens’s comments, which did not explicitly name Israel but condemned genocide in strong terms, sparked varied reactions. While she received backing from certain quarters, other figures, like former Donald Trump advisor Pastor Darrell Scott, suggested she was betraying her supporters. Owens has repeatedly defended her position, insisting on the universality of her anti-genocide stance and refusing to back down or apologise.
Inciting controversy within the Right is nothing new for Owens. She’s been embroiled in storms surrounding her defence of rapper Kanye West, alongside whom she wore a “White Lives Matter” shirt at a Paris fashion show, against accusations of antisemitism. She has also been previously criticised for comments about Adolf Hitler and opposing Covid-19 vaccines for children. These actions and statements have attracted significant backlash, but her ability to remain comfortably within the Rightwing ecosystem in spite of these contrarian remarks suggests she has at least some institutional support for her positions.
Indeed, her stance on Israel reveals a broader trend within the Republican Party and its fringes. Traditionally, the party has shown strong support for the Jewish state. However, the rise of the “America First” movement and figures such as Owens signals a shift. This rift is further complicated by the presence of antisemitic elements within what was once the alt-Right but has now fragmented into multiple successor groups — even reaching into the mainstream, as evidenced by the recent exposure of political influencer and Ron DeSantis supporter Pedro Gonzalez’s antisemitic messages by Breitbart News. These messages, dating from 2019 to 2020, highlighted the ongoing links between opposition to “international finance” and a willingness of some on the Right to trade in antisemitic, “Happy Merchant”-style stereotypes.
The Owens-Shapiro split and the Gonzalez controversy point to a party at a crossroads, grappling with its stance on Israel and broader questions of ideology and identity. While mainstream conservative Republicans like Shapiro continue to support Israel, a growing isolationist faction, combined with the extremely online Right’s antisemitic undercurrents, suggests an ideological battle that could redefine the party’s future direction — or at least influence some of its primaries and policymaking.
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SubscribeMuch opinion in the West is simply squeamish and not ready to contemplate the dirty business of fighting people like Hamas. People have been too comfortable for too long.
There is no violation of international law if your enemy has turned a hospital into a military headquarters and you attack him there.
If you have a problem with this then you just need to take a deep breath and try to get over it.
This article on Quillette perfectly encapsulates what you’re describing:
https://quillette.com/2023/11/14/the-radical-humanitarian-doctrine/
There are a lot of uncomfortable decisions that we have to make before they are made for us. When this happens, our options will be very limited and the price will be very high.
..and they will be based on what? Whim? Money? Hate? Give us a clue..
Survival.
The more interesting point is how an issue on another continent has come to dominate the discourse of a super power like the US and could even shape its political future.
The danger of fifth columnists?
Yes, two Middle Eastern countries at war and the patriots are on the side of one.
Only one is Middle Eastern.. the other is an occupying, colonial force.. When the British were fighting Japan it wasn’t two Far Eastern countries at war was it?
Wrong…. unbelievably wrong….
Israel has a – documented – history going back over 3,000 years.
There have been Arabs in the region since at least the time of Mohammed’s evil colonize-by-rape-and-particularly-child-rape program displaced and replaced the original inhabitants of countries like Egypt in the 7th century.
But the ‘Palestinians’ have only existed as an identified and identifiable group since the identity was first cooked up in the 1960s. Prior to that the few Arabs in Israel would have referred to themselves as Syrians, Jordanians and so on.
Israel belongs to the Jews and, personally, if it were up to me I would double the size of it.
It’s not accurate to say that the Palestinian identity was only created in the 1960s; rather, it developed over a longer period, influenced by various historical and geopolitical factors. The term “Palestine” has been used for centuries to describe the region between the Mediterranean Sea and the Jordan River. The inhabitants of this region, whether they identified as Arabs, Syrians, or by other local names, have a long history in the area. So, in your opinion the people who lived on the land that is now officially known as Israel, or what Israel claims as its own, should not complain if they are driven away from their homes. Does it really matter if the people call themselves Palestinians or does it matter that they used to live there and were driven away?
Palestine was a Roman province. The name was never used by the Arabs or Ottomans, and only very much later reused by westerners and the British. I agree it doesn’t matter what people call themselves.
However as so many other people do, you have a very selective memory of the events of 1948 when Israel was fighting for its very existence. Many Palestinians fled, mostly because the Arab armies told them to, some as a result of atrocities, which were carried out by both sides but mainly the Arab one. Whatever, they were not allowed back to their homes by Israel. However at exactly this time, the same number of Jews were subject to pogroms in numerous Arab countries and forced from their homes, which is conveniently ignored.
Millions of people were displaced in the 1945-8 period. However the Germans aren’t going back to the Sudetenland, or to western Poland, the Poles to Belarus, Sikhs and Hindus to Pakistan or Muslims to India. The great grandchildren of these refugees are not going back, this is totally politically unrealistic.
Your comment shows that you are on the side of Iran, Hezbollah and Hamas. Typical left liberal progressive, who wouldn’t comprehend the idea that such theocrats and fanatics hated him if they were stamping on his face.
Israel is a nation recognised by the UN in 1947. Zionists migrated (you love migration, yes?) peacefully to that region in addition to Jews who had already lived there. The Arabs tried to destroy that state and fortunately lost. This was generations ago. Palestinians lost their homes as did the same number of Jews subject to pogroms in numerous Arab states at the same time, and much larger numbers of Europeans and people on thesub continent.
“ There is no violation of international law if your enemy has turned a hospital into a military headquarters and you attack him there.”
Yes there is Paul. If Russia were attacking a Ukrainian hospital because of rebels then it would be described as a war crime. In fact they did attack hospitals in Syria, did claim there were rebels in those hospitals, and it was described as a war crime.
I don’t hold discussions in the subjunctive mood.
I’d a feeling there was something wrong with your mood! Heartless, soulless, facially incorrectly based and just filled with smug indifference.
More subhuman than subjunctive if you ask me.
The Russians were attacking the hospitals to force the civilians to flee and was nothing to do with whether or not there were rebels in them. They gave no warnings, provided no proof and ignored any humanitarian requests. Your comparison is absolute rubbish.
Nobody in Russia cares about war crimes. The only real crime in war is losing! For that you will surely be punished.
You are mistaken Article 19 of the Geneva Convention provides that hospitals lose their protection if they are” used to commit, outside their humanitarian duties, acts harmful to the enemy”
Using a hospital as a military base to store weapons, hide the enemy and plan attacks, would clearly fall within these provisions.
Conversely, using the hospital for such military purposes would be a war crime under the Convention.
“No violation of International Law” you say? I’m torn now whether to accept your findings based on complete ignorance or those of eminent International lawyers, the UN and a myriad of other eminent commentators. ‘Tough choice but I’m inclined to come down not on your side.. sorry. Even though you have 50 others equally ignorant on International law, I’m still more inclined to go with the experts, my ability to read law, decency, commonsense and human rights. Tough call though.. you do have blind hatred and collaboration with child murderers on you side, admittedly but still.. I’m more inclined to go with Christian teaching and compassion especially as murdering children in a concentracamp somehow doesn’t quite seem right to me.
If you check carefully, you will see that I’m right. Hospitals can be attacked if they are being used by forces seeking to harm the enemy. The proviso is that a warning must be given first. Israel is not in violation of any of this.
Israel’s actions in Gaza are not remotely genocidal. They do not intend to, and have not, killed a high proportion of the population of Gaza. They do not even intend to, and have not attempted, to expel the residents of Gaza to neighbouring countries such as Egypt, along the lines the Soviet expulsion of the German population of east Prussia and Sudetenland after WW2 (which although violent and frequently murderous was not genocidal). The use of the word genocidal is an attempt to equate Israel with the perpetrators of the Holocaust. It is tacky in the extreme. If conservatives attract support with this line, it will count for nothing, because they will have ceased to be conservatives.
Their plan is to send the people of Gaza to Europe and the US. I don’t know if they will get what they want but thats the plan, you can already see stories pushing the idea in the media
Diversity for thee but not for me
How lucky we are to have D. Walsh on this site, a gentleman (one presumes) who is privy to the internal discussions of the Israeli government!
Documents were leaked, saying the Israeli government would like to push the Pals into Egypt or on to Europe/US. In the last week, I have seen 2 or 3 articles in the media promoting the idea
If you’re not paying attention, that’s not my fault
Didn’t they mention sending the Palestinians to Ireland?
Ethnic cleansing is the unspoken objective and if the other Arab countries won’t take them where are they going to go
To a town near you
Diversity for Israel is suicide. Diversity for the West will result in collapse.
and then death
It already has.
I’m suggesting Wyoming but not for the Palestinians; for the Israelis! It’s truly a land without a people this time (pop 700,000 all living in Cheyanne) and they be next door to Utah, land of the Mormons.. more crazy religious nut jobs! And the US’s $6.4 million and free weapons can go to Wyoming instead, ie stay in the US! Its win win win.. whats not to like?
Nice and safe there, too. No further need to fear the neighbours. And just think of all the savings in arms spending.
When did support for Israel become a “conservative” position. It’s another country.
The movement of people out of their homelands is ethnic cleansing, which is generally seen as a form of genocide. The reason people go back to German expulsions is to lend credibility to actions the Israelis might take here, just in case they do.
Israel is NOT a country.. it is a people, a colonising people that occupies the land of Palestine, killing the natives just like in biblical times. Killing is what they did best and now do the same.. bit I suspect Hamas will give them a bloody nose despite the Gigantic David v diminutive Goliath struggle involved.
And when Hezbollah get going it’s bye bye Israel.. all the smart Zionists are hightailing it out of Zionland afa their little legs will carry them (including Netanyahu’s own draft dodging son).
The Israeli economy is in tatters and politically it is up sh¡t creek as well! It’s over for the Zionists.. they had it all, but greed and hatred were their undoing, as always with those type of people. They have just two countries supporting them, ie US+UK both of which are also doomed..
I think you’re getting a bit over-excited there. Canada, France and indeed the EU as a whole are also toeing the line. But Israel’s failure to negotiate a two-State solution, its territorial claim for ‘Judea & Samaria’ (i.e. the whole West Bank), cumulative settler annexations that now probably make a free West Bank state impossible, heavy-handed and never-ending military occupation, repeated resort to the ruthless and heavy-handed ‘Dahwa Doctine’, poor demographics vs Arab states and over-dependence for military aid and diplomatic cover on a fast-declining US have probably doomed it in the long-run. Will Israel as currently constituted reach 2048? We shall see. I don’t think the US will.
I think you’re getting a bit over-excited there. Canada, France and indeed the EU as a whole are also toeing the line. But Israel’s failure to negotiate a two-State solution, its territorial claim for ‘Judea & Samaria’ (i.e. the whole West Bank), cumulative settler annexations that now probably make a free West Bank state impossible, heavy-handed and never-ending military occupation, repeated resort to the ‘Dahwa Doctine’, poor demographics vs Arab states and over-dependence for military aid and diplomatic cover on a fast-declining US have probably doomed it in the long-run. Will Israel as currently constituted reach 2048? We shall see. I don’t think the US will.
I think you don’t quite understand the term genocidAL not to be confused with genocide. the first is about the motivation, the second about accomplishment. Since Israeli government spokesmen have stated in effect “all Palestinians are terrorists and so must be eradicated” potentially using a nuclear bomb the term genocidal is absolutely correct. If they do so or continue the bombardment (more TNT equivalent on Gaza than on Hiroshima, though it is only ¼ the size) is certainly getting on for genocide and is already genocidAL..
I think it’s fair for people to disagree about the approach Israel is taking. Ultimately though, Hamas is a lethal threat to Israel and its own people. It has deliberately impoverished its own people and has done nothing to protect its people – building bomb shelters for instance – while instigating a war against a much more lethal armed forces. Hamas has refused ex to release its hostages, which would be the bare minimum step towards deescalation.
If you measure (a) the death rates and (b) the military capability you’ll immediately see who us a threat to whom.. and it’s the opposite of what you say.
Your logic is faulty. It’s not a football match where one side is doping in order to win. The only thing Israel can be faulted for is that they are not killing the enemy quickly enough.
You think this would be more fair if more Jews were being killed?
On the question of ethnic cleansing Israel would be quite entitled to push the entire population of Gaza into Egypt or any other Arab country stupid enough to take them in.
The truth is that the Arab people of the region have been entirely corrupted by the UN and international anti-Western actors plus the whiney left in the West itself who have turned them into hereditary refugees whose entire interaction with the world is an ongoing masterclass in moronic self-pity and passive aggression.
They should have turned their lands into a Riviera on the Mediterranean. Israel would have been more than happy to trade with a peaceful law abiding Arab population.
Instead they have become performing “angry” noble savages for polite international opinion with a self governance, spectacular in its degradation and self abuse of their own basic humanity.
I presume you know no Muslims whatsoever and have never lived in an Islamic country.. indeed you sound like someone who has surrounded himself with white faces and never ventured very far from your your BNP club!
It’s a bit hard to turn your land into a Riviera with a total blockade in force, no airport, no sea port, water, food and power rationed.. I can’t see it making the top ofthe holiday list can you? ..oh yes, and frequent, indiscriminate bombings by the IDF.. Benidorm? ..not so much!
I do appreciate that you don’t even pretend to understand the sequence of events in the history of the region.
“her comments praising Adolf Hitler”.
Candace Owens’s comments at that link did not praise Adolf Hitler. Quite the contrary.
That’s a misquote. Mr Bateman mentioned ‘her comments about Adolf Hitler’, and didn’t imply that those comments praised him. As you point out, of course, her comments – when she was allowed to make them – weren’t positive at all about Hitler, though the clip played by the Congressman was carefully edited to imply that they were.
That quote I put in my comment was copied from the article. It may have been updated but that is what it said originally.
It sounded unlikely so I checked the link and saw CO said nothing praising Hitler.
That’s why you have to see the original source.
“She has also been previously criticised for comments about Adolf Hitler …”
A criticism which was unfounded. Seems like you didn’t even listen to that clip that you linked to. :-/
Another example of Batemanese, whose song is mostly about the imagined “Right”. Unlike the lock-step, fall-in-with-the-narrative-or-else Left, as Stalin and Pol Pot and Mao and others required, “the Right” is not fractured or hysterical when argument and disagreements occur – that is what real democracy requires, not so?
Notwithstanding its underperformance on 7 Oct, the IDF is a highly efficient, well-equipped force. If Israeli policy towards Gaza was indeed one of genocide, they would all have been eradicated years ago.
And yet so far they have killed more women and children than Hamas fighters
Hamas have put the women and children in harms way. As long as human shields work, governments like Hamas (and I consider them a government as they have been running the show on the Gaza strip) will continue to do so.
If you are going to play the body count game, and please do. Israel gave warning, Israel waited, and Israel responded in a measured way because Israel could have just leveled the whole Gaza strip and killed everyone there on the 8th of October, but choose not to. So every civilian (Man, Woman, or Child! Because lets face it, actual civilian men count as well), every civilian is on the body count list of Hamas.
That’s Hamas’ point or don’t you understand how their strategy works?
10 times as many, excluding all previous murders which is 27:1, and the numbers of Israeli civilians killed by Hamas is dropping like a stone.. ref Ha’aretz ISRAELI reports. Also 48% minimum were armed militants. The no. of babies now atands at one or two! No beheadings! Atrocities faked in some if not all cases! Get up to date!
Also many of the civilians killed on Oct 7 were killed by the IDFapplying the Hannibal directive.. Why not check the facts? Of course the IDF knew all about the attack and, like 911 in the US, used it to carry out a genocidal attack on wholly innocent civilians! ..just like 911 was used to invade not Egypt and Saudi Arabia where the attackers were from ..no, Iraq that had no connection whatsoever to 911.
Is your source for this perhaps the Hamas’ Health ministry?
I watched Ben take Candace to pieces on YouTube. She was very short on facts.
You can find plenty of videos like that on YouTube, Ben Sapiro destroyes liberal ect, it’s all BS, he loves to debate low IQ fools, if he ever runs into someone of normal intelligence, he loses badly. Andrew Neil made him look like a clown
Ben’s main goal is to keep foolish boomers supporting Israel, open borders, war with Syria/Iran. I will give him some credit. Its working for now, but long-term Its not going to work
Stick with what I said first of all. He took Candace to pieces.
And he is certainly no fool – rather the opposite…and neither am I. Been the liberal route, got the T-shirt and took it off.
Looks like foolish Gen Z identity politics is getting the better of you Irishmen.
I never said he didn’t
I said it’s all rigged, it’s fake. Candance is a fool
Not the only one practicing foolish identity politics around here, I see.
Ah yes, how many steps was that to your ad hominem, racist comment? I guess the old Nåz¡ comment is due shortly?
Funny, I saw it the other way.. Shapiro’s ‘facts’ are blatant lies and twisted distortions.. the guy is so full of hate he’s toxic.. I don’t know how anyone can bear to be in the same room as the smig creep.. he exudes evil!
How would folk have coped in WW2 if social media/the Internet existed? I fear we would have let the Nazi’s just win or risk harming the lives of Germans living in Nazi strongholds.
People on the Right have long predicted the breakdown of the unanimity of support for Israel in conservative politics. Antisemitism isn’t the cause. It was simply a terribly one-sided alliance.
What does the Right in America gain from aligning itself to Israel, other than curated vacation excursions for church groups to Galilee and Bethlehem?
For years I’ve been pointing out the double-game Israeli diplomats play with conservatives. Folks like Dan Senor and Ron Derman make dozens of appearances on Fox News and talk radio, where they talk about our common Judeo-Christian heritage and traditionalist beliefs.
Then later in the same day those gentlemen appear before black-tie audiences at ritzy venues in NY and LA to pitch Israel as a progressive outpost and sing the praises Israel’s gay, transgender and abortion-friendly liberal society.
The game was to garner votes from the least sophisticated folks on the Right and political support from the arts and business communities on the Left. It worked for decades.
Unfortunately, though, sooner or later the butcher’s bill for the American Right was bound to cause an “ agonizing reappraisal.” Candace Owens’ position is a natural consequence of the hypocrisy of Ben Shapiro’s insistence that we keep getting fleeced.
Even evangelicals are getting wise. After all, how long can American evangelicals say we must resist Christian nationalism in this country, while at the same time declaring at the top of their voices that we must defend the Jewish state?
Excellent post, and perfectly summarises my thoughts. You’d have thought evangelical Christians living in the boondocks might have been a bit more suspicious of powerful groups like AIPAC when they hold talks from Clinton, Biden and Harris and basically view them like pond scum.
I support Israel. Israel does not want or need U.S. intervention. I would even go so far as to say that U.S. intervention would be a liability to Israel.
You clearly have no idea that the US arms Israel free of charge and still send $6.4 bn in aid to Israel! If the US turned off the tap Israel would last about 10 minutes!
Most of U.S. foreign aid is really money laundering for crony contracts. I would not be shocked to discover that actors within Israel’s deep state get kickbacks for facilitating the process.
That said, Israel has its own thriving arms industry.
Guelfs and Ghibbelines…
They’re both cringey as hell, Shapiro for his shabbos goy grandstanding and Owens for essentially calling for Hamas to essentially get away with murder. It isn’t the responsibility of Americans or Britons to deal with foreign wars.
A more cynical explanation, but perhaps one closer to the truth, is that, for the first (and only) time since the 1980 election, due to the genuinely disturbing reaction to the recent escalation of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict in the American far-left (and even the moderate left), the Republican Party has a chance to obtain more than its usual ~20% share of the Jewish-American vote (one of the most solidly Democratic constituencie) in the 2024 election by using Israel as a “wedge issue”, as they have been trying to do precisely since Reagan’s until-then unprecedented and so far never again repeated ~50% against Democrat (and one-term President), James Earl Carter, Jr.
Unlike most other countries in the world (certainly unlike any European country including Britain), people of Jewish confession or cultural identity are numerous enough actually to matter in elections. This combined with the fact that the United States is one of the few countries in the world with enough hard and soft power in the Middle East, so that what stance the United States takes on this matter and what course it follows actually matters. (Again, this is a stark contrast to most other countries in the world, including most if not all the European countries, whether in NATO or not, or whether in the EU or not).
Ms. Owens’ stupid remarks on this issue may put but the actual policy and the ekectoral campaign at risk, as it did in fact happen when Pat Buchanan opposed then-president George HW Bush on the First Gulf War, and did so with anti-Semitic insinuations, such as this: “There are only two groups that are beating the drums for war in The Middle East – the Israeli Defense Ministry and its amen corner in the United States.” But, then again, since most American Jews have voted and indeed do tend to vote for the Democratic Party, regardless of what policy on Israel and the Middle East either party follows, the dispute between Shapiro and Owens is likely not to have any importance beyond the extremely narrow circles of persons aware of any “recent developments in America’s conservative media landscspe.”
Shapiro is the guy who sneered at the Notre Dame fire, right?
“Absolutely heartbreaking. A magnificent monument to Western civilization collapsing.” Does that sound like sneering?
I do think that a kind of ethnic cleansing is taking place with this bombing, ultimately aimed at the dislocation from their territory of a million people.
Unfortunately, I can’t see any other solution to the problem of a set of people who vehemently want to kill another set of people living next door to them.
And I’m not surprised that Ms Owens and a lot of people reach the same conclusion about the Israelis
Ms Owens is short on facts.
Yes, Mr Durden is quite correct: there is indeed a set of people who vehemently want to kill another set of people living next door to them, as they showed only too clearly on October 7th.
Oh, sorry – wasn’t that what you meant?
I think you may well have misread him!
After Epstein’s blackmail scheme was uncovered, all other Mossad operatives should have been sent back to Israel. If that means the US loses the Worlds smallest neocon, Chickenhawk, well, so be it
Wha?