X Close

Nick Cave’s doctrine of doubt His new album is triumphantly heterodox

Wild god (Credit:Jim Dyson/Getty)


August 30, 2024   7 mins

Strange are the thoughts that steal upon you, a thousand feet underground in a Polish salt mine. Under the glow of chandeliers, surrounded by samizdat saints and kings, entire chapels carved in rock salt by generations of miners, I found myself thinking not of the holy and exalted but an icon of disgrace.

According to apocrypha and Christian folklore, the Roman centurion Longinus pierced Christ in the side with his spear during the Crucifixion. There are several versions of this. In almost all, he’s punished for his crime. In one, he is sentenced to eternal life, fated to wander the earth, reborn over and over, stuck in a helical loop, a universal soldier condemned to die in successive wars. This reincarnation myth made its way subliminally into fiction (Barry Sadler’s Casca series), music (Jimmy Webb’s “Highwayman”) and cinema, in the form of Nick Cave’s script for his lamentably unfilmed sequel to Gladiator.

I first encountered Nick Cave through the medium of terror. At a young age my impressionable brain was inundated by orc metal, the sound of industrial accidents, and electronic plague dances. Most were too theatrical to be truly menacing but some got under the skin, to the extent I was compelled to hear them again.

Chief among them was “Tupelo” by Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds. I listened to it disturbed: a glorious moment of lightning-struck damnation. Describing the birth of Elvis Aaron Presley, alongside his still-born identical brother Jesse Garon Presley, it was an unholy chasm through which the night poured. I could barely piss straight with fear, and I’ve not stopped listening since.

“The mood is one of escape but to escape you first need to recognise you’re confined.”

Following the parting of Mick Harvey in 2009, the group changed their sound, embracing the absence. You can hear the space that had suddenly appeared and the unlikely influences that helped to fill it — electronic music, ambient drone.

“Well, if I were to use that threadbare metaphor of albums being like children,” Cave noted at the time, “then Push The Sky Away is the ghost-baby in the incubator and Warren’s loops are its tiny, trembling heart-beat.” And these claims were not hyperbole. It required a different kind of listening, and there were fans who were left behind, preferring, to continue the threadbare metaphor, the feral street urchins of their earlier work.

The four albums that followed feel like a sequence or an era; cinematic, measured, atmospheric. Yet as Cave and Ellis continued, and the cruelties of fate took the heaviest of tolls, they changed again. The boundaries of songs began to blur into one another, verse/chorus/verse dissolved. The music felt more and more like painting. The moonless nocturne of Skeleton Tree. Or the vast Turneresque swirls and washes of Ghosteen.

Now Wild God, the new album, marks a new phase. It’s lush, built from vast walls of sound and sudden explosive choral crescendos. An album of the most extraordinary joy, it’s not a complete abandonment of the new or the old. Traces of both can be found throughout (the horses, myths, meta lyricism, Jubilee Street, an eye for the debauched) but the synthesis has resulted in a different creature, an album that feels blissfully out of time. The choirs, bells, crashing of cymbals, the hard-earned euphoria, feel antithetical to these days of lamentation and the gnashing of teeth.

The imagery of the title track feels like something bursting out of one of William Blake’s illuminated manuscripts. ‘Final Rescue Attempt’ has an astonishingly wistful feel. At the other end of the spectrum, the finale of ‘Conversion’ is the band’s most intense climax since ‘There She Goes, My Beautiful World’. ‘O Wow O Wow (How Wonderful She Is)’ is a tribute to the late Anita Lane — once Cave’s partner in love and song — with lyrics free of piety but showing signs of the cloven-hooved Old Nick, proving the sacred and profane are never opposites but rather are wound around each other. ‘Frogs’ is open-hearted uplifting, filled with the sheer intoxication of life when faced with the smallest moments, a frog in a puddle “leaping to God, amazed of love, amazed of pain, amazed to be back in the water again.” A triumphant cloudburst of a song.

The production throughout feels like something beloved that’s been long-lost and recovered; Leonard Cohen Death of a Ladies’ Man with MDMA instead of barbiturates. The mood is one of escape but to escape you first need to recognise you’re confined.

The Bad Seeds have had their fair share of critical acclaim, yet in recent years an interesting development has taken place in the way Nick Cave is perceived and depicted. It centres around the idea that Cave has changed, become conservative, a God-botherer, betraying his earlier self. There’s a vague sense of disgrace in the air, quite different from the now-fashionable disgrace he cultivated as a young, shock-headed degenerate in Berlin in the early Eighties. The reasons can be guessed at — a typical sneering attitude towards success, a disdain for artists who are prolific or even just visible, a reaction against his role as agony uncle/psychopomp/semi-reluctant oracle of the internet in his stoical Red Hand Files. Yet there’s another deeper more reflective reason for the sense of casual disdain and it’s encapsulated in the album’s title.

Let’s consider that perhaps Nick Cave hasn’t changed at all, or at least not in the ways we’d like to think. A superficial reading of this would be to say that he has stayed still and the whole world has moved or slid. It’s a familiar claim, often voiced by tech bros claiming the Overton Window forced them to the Right when they’ve always been Liberal. The argument usually continues along the lines that all the pearl-clutching censorious Mary Whitehouse types on the Right, whom artists have had to battle for free expression are now to be found on the Left. The pendulum swings too far and if only we could get it to settle in the middle where the reasonable apolitical people are then everything would be hunky dory. Which of course is palpable bullshit.

Set aside the overly convenient dichotomy of Right and Left, and the comforting illusion of the Centre, and think instead in terms of orthodox and heterodox. The former always conforms, whatever the climate, however shameless. The latter didn’t fit then, doesn’t fit now and will never fit.

But the idea that Nick Cave’s religiosity is suddenly a problem or even a recent conversion is belied by most of his discography. In fact, it was those looming biblical shadows that first attracted me to his work and at times alienated me from it. Now a recovering Catholic, I was educated in schools run by nuns and priests and repeatedly locked horns with them. At the time, the church was infallible, hardly bothering to conceal its horrendous crimes against women and children in Ireland and beyond. It wasn’t just taboo to raise issues of abuse, homophobia, hypocrisy etc. It was forbidden to ask questions. I would ask the priests questions about the strange, puzzling details I’d chanced upon in the stories and language of the King James Bible and was completely unprepared for the hostility such enquiries would ignite. I realise now it was simply a case of orthodoxy. Questions, any sign of curiosity, were a threat to dogma. The Christian flock was not supposed to bleat, even if some had got wind of the slaughterhouse.

From the beginning, the Bad Seeds lyrics were steeped in that misty Jacobean version of the Bible. It was there in their album titles — Kicking Against the Pricks, The Good Son — and in countless songs. For every murder ballad, a spiritual. It’s even there in their name, with the Bad Seeds originating in the Good Book. This was a rich mine, and what was salvaged could be adapted in surprising subversive ways. When he used Jesus or God, at times he might just as well be singing about drugs, sex, pain, or love and its catastrophes. The themes allowed for the illumination of life at its most wretched and beautiful. It’s almost animist at heart but fed through Christian iconography – the thorns and the waves and the errant stars.

Witnessing the unfolding church scandals and how those who’d spoken out publicly like Sinéad O’Connor were made into scapegoats or sineaters, I gradually transformed into a righteous little bastard or to put it another way an evangelising atheist. Twenty years ago, I saw the Bad Seeds on their incendiary Abattoir Blues / The Lyre of Orpheus and left in a state of shock, such was their energy and charisma. Yet I felt a nagging reluctance in my heart. Cave’s brilliant, frenzied tent revivalist/snake handler/faith healer performance set off alarm bells. Having escaped one cult, albeit a very powerful 2,000-year-old one, I was overly cautious about signing up for another.

Eventually, I realised there was a reactionary mirroring quality to atheism, where you could become as self-righteous and rigid as your enemy, defined and controlled by a form of negation. Mainly, I was turned off by the joyless tiresomeness of some of its primary advocates. I also had not suffered quite enough to be relieved of certain egocentric illusions. I had not yet come to know the things you don’t want are the things that give your life real knowledge — grief, heartbreak, illness, estrangement and exile. But where do you go when you begin to doubt your own doubt?

It turns out Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds were already there. The religiosity in the songs was built from doubt, suffering, absurdity, closer to Dostoevsky or existentialism than tele-evangelism. We are in the eternal, the songs tell us, every little moment, and life and death are in here with us. Wild God feels like an opening and a radical one, given the constriction we’re increasingly subject to. How narrow, for instance, to think that writing about religious themes shackles you to the moribund, slowly sinking religious establishment, discarding the realms that Cave has tapped into.

Certainty is a curse, damaging for activists, and fatal for artists. Cave gets it. There are wry lines, wrapped in enigmas in Wild God, “Who are these gods that you now defend? / And what purpose do they serve now at the end of time?” He replies not with apologetic laments or millenarian doom but with perfect inarguable euphoria. With the ecstatic doubt evident in the title track, whether the lead character is a soaring deity or just an old man in a retirement village propelling through his memory.

I still don’t believe in God, and I loathe the Church, and though I may be dumb, I am not dumb enough to deny I’m a Catholic writer. Whether the heavens are empty or not, I was permanently moulded by Jesuits. The hints were there, though it took me a while to recognise the compulsions. The countless pilgrimages. The need for rituals. The love for iconography and disdain for those who know only how to dismantle and not how to build. Listening to this cathartic album, it started to occur to me that maybe I’d got Longinus wrong. Maybe he shouldn’t have been a soldier after all. Maybe this cursed fallen figure should have been an artist. One who wanders, not smug and privileged in their certainty, not wielding belief or unbelief in order to judge or cudgel others, not resolving anything except for the small but significant consolation that some other poor wild bastard is out in the storm-beaten night with us all, bearing a lantern and somehow singing a song of joy.


Darran Anderson is the author of Imaginary Cities and Inventory.


Join the discussion


Join like minded readers that support our journalism by becoming a paid subscriber


To join the discussion in the comments, become a paid subscriber.

Join like minded readers that support our journalism, read unlimited articles and enjoy other subscriber-only benefits.

Subscribe
Subscribe
Notify of
guest

43 Comments
Most Voted
Newest Oldest
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Lancashire Lad
Lancashire Lad
2 months ago

Whilst i’ve no doubt that some readers (and perhaps Commenters) will be foaming with ecstasy at this type of article, i find it insufferably juvenile and overblown. It’s not the first Nick Cave eulogy by Unherd either (there’s an inter-paragraph link to the most recent one, a kind of self-eulogy) and that was more than enough; the guy just comes across as a complete pseud, using every possible trope he can lay his hands on to try to sound edgy and relevant.
Here, the writer at least makes plain how his own experiences have attracted him to Cave’s output. Instead of becoming a fan but then moving on, it’s as if his development has become arrested and therefore dependent upon Cave to ‘guide’ him, hence the use of fawning descriptions and detailed analysis of successive stages in Cave’s ‘work’. I hope, having divested himself of this article, he can start to live his own life, with his own thoughts, and find some degree of maturity away from the thrall of a figure whose significance appears to be as an attractor of vacant souls.

Jonathan Nash
Jonathan Nash
2 months ago
Reply to  Lancashire Lad

I’ve liked Nick Cave all the way back to The Birthday Party days. I agree that he is lionised by arty types and a lot of the criticism of his music and words is high falutin, but the man himself has always come across as authentic and likeable.

Brett H
Brett H
2 months ago
Reply to  Jonathan Nash

Yes, a rare authentic.

Jack Martin Leith
Jack Martin Leith
2 months ago
Reply to  Jonathan Nash

Nick Cave is one of the most self aware, compassionate and truly humble people I’ve ever encountered. His Red Hand Files responses are always a joy.

William Amos
William Amos
2 months ago
Reply to  Lancashire Lad

That seems a trifle unkind.
Almost all of us have used thinkers, artists and visionaries as props and conduits for our own life-of-the-mind at some stage in our pilgrimage here on earth.
I have yet to encounter anyone ostentatiously ‘living their own life’ and thinking ‘his own thoughts’ who wasn’t really a walking advertisement for a whole bag of more or less obvious latent intellectual influences.

Lancashire Lad
Lancashire Lad
2 months ago
Reply to  William Amos

“…pilgrimage here on earth.”
Where else do you think we’ll be “pilgrimaging”? My comment was an honest assessment, and i stated right at the outset i expected others to have a different view. I respect the comments of those others above, but your barbed reference to “a whole bag of more or less obvious intellectual influences” is pretty ironic given where your distinctly unintellectual influence is coming from.

William Amos
William Amos
2 months ago
Reply to  Lancashire Lad

You may take the pilgrimage metaphor as you choose. Even the Epicurean “Non fui, fui, non sum, non curo” still involves a preregrination to “that undiscovered country from whose bourn no traveler returns”
But I am sorry that you felt my last remark was aimed at you personally. I know almost nothing about you and so I couldn’t presume to pass judgement on you in that way. Please forgive my carelessness in causing offence.
I’m not sure I understand your own closing remark but I will be the first to say, quite cheerfully. that I am a bag of borrowed feathers, (un)intellectually speaking. My point is that we all are.

Lancashire Lad
Lancashire Lad
2 months ago
Reply to  William Amos

It’s your own interpretation of my response that leads you to think i took it personally. My response was based upon previous comments you’ve made around religious faith.
Of course, we all take our influences from somewhere initially; my point is that the obsequiousness in the article suggests to me an inability to move on from there in a more independent fashion, which should at least be an aim, if not always achieved.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
2 months ago
Reply to  Lancashire Lad

I agree that it’s a gushing appreciation. It’s not an objective review and doesn’t purport to be. I think there’s a place for “celebratory criticism”, and I’m glad that it sometimes finds a home here—though we all reserve our right to object to an author’s tone or adored subject. There’s certainly plenty of subjective hit-piece and ulterior-motive criticism out there already.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
2 months ago
Reply to  William Amos

I once read that even the line attributed to Sir Isaac Newton: “If have seen so far, it is only because I stood on the shoulders of giants” has many similar antecedents, from well before his time.

The near-simultaneous invention of calculus by Newton and Leibniz, and of evolutionary theory by Darwin and Wallace (with no evidence of any exchanged or “stolen” knowledge of the other man’s work) points to a kind of creative zeitgeist. Someone would probably have concocted the printing press or steam engine without Gutenberg or Watt, at around the same time. That’s my speculation, informed by the research and reasoning of others.

Even works of great originality and power, like Paradise Lost or Brave New World or Bach’s Keyboard Suites, do not emerge from a single, unaided hand. That’s all the more true when we acknowledge a mysterious author or Divine Hand. I believe there’s real truth in this lyric by the Liverpudlian Lads (wonder if Harrison or Lennon “invented” it): “There’s nothin’ you can see that isn’t shown / Nothin’ you can know that isn’t known“.

William Amos
William Amos
2 months ago
Reply to  AJ Mac

That last aphorism is a fairly neat summary of Platonic Epistemology or Anamnesis.
Or perhaps, as Harold Bloom might suggest, that is my own ‘creative misreading’?
And how does all that leave room, after all, for the individual genius?
At least this article has us talking and thinking!

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
2 months ago
Reply to  William Amos

Agreed. And even, or at times especially when I disagree, I appreciate your erudite contributions.

Dumetrius
Dumetrius
2 months ago
Reply to  Lancashire Lad

I got the feeling a teenager with a thesaurus had been let loose at Unherd offices.
I once went to a music pub in Prahran (Melbourne) where my much older friend went over the road, retrieved a box of over-ripe tomatoes turfed outside a greengrocer, and proceeded to pelt Mr Cave with them as he sang.

At points of particularly histrionic gyration, two or three would find their mark.

The bouncers didn’t stop him. The band seemed to think it funny.

Dermot O'Sullivan
Dermot O'Sullivan
2 months ago
Reply to  Lancashire Lad

I agree with you. I’ll buy the Wild God album despite the review.

As a general comment let me point out that Sinead O’Connor and other ‘celebrity rightoners’ are lionised by the media, especially by RTE, the national broadcaster, who appears to have a fetish about Catholic Church misdeeds but rarely look in the mirror.

Benedict Waterson
Benedict Waterson
2 months ago
Reply to  Lancashire Lad

Listen to Lazarus Dig Yourself, Lancashire Lad. It’s a lot of fun, and not as po-faced/ pompous as some of Cave’s other work.
Anyway I thought it was a nice article and Nick Cave is an interesting, sporadically great artist.

Lancashire Lad
Lancashire Lad
2 months ago

I’ll give it a go, in the spirit of finding something i’ve not found previously in Cave’s work

Simon Blanchard
Simon Blanchard
2 months ago
Reply to  Lancashire Lad

I hate to say it but I agree. My gut tells me that Cave is a charlatan. Extremely clever but ultimately fake. A master of the art of fooling music journalists. Just like Brian Eno.

Brett H
Brett H
2 months ago

Well I was just about to make a comment then I saw that made by LL. And it always amazes me how different we perceive things. I liked this review and I’ll probably go through it again. It also occurred to me how much i’d like to see so many of the political pieces written with a similar fresh perspective instead of the tired cross referencing and cobbling together of tired opinions. Nice work Darran.

Jack Martin Leith
Jack Martin Leith
2 months ago
Reply to  Brett H

Brett, if you’re not already a subscriber to Nick Cave’s Red Hand Files Q&A platform, I think you might enjoy reading his response to the question “What is joy? Where is it? Where is love in this world that is such an evil mess.”
https://www.theredhandfiles.com/what-is-joy-where-is-it/

Brett H
Brett H
2 months ago

I had a look at that. Thanks.

Citizen Diversity
Citizen Diversity
2 months ago

As C S Lewis has Aslan, paraphrasing Jesus of Nazareth, declare: All find what they truly seek.
Beware, then, what it is you seek.

Chris Whybrow
Chris Whybrow
2 months ago

Why were the Jesuits using a King James Bible?

William Amos
William Amos
2 months ago
Reply to  Chris Whybrow

The Douay-Rheims Bible, as revised by Richard Challoner in 1749, was the standard Roman Catholic translation of the Bible until the late 20th Century and is and still widely used by traditionalist Roman Catholics.
It draws heavily on the King James Bible for its translation, particularly in Challoners revised version.

Francis Turner
Francis Turner
2 months ago
Reply to  William Amos

especially for those of us to went to Douai!

William Amos
William Amos
2 months ago

The writer mentions Blake but perhaps the artistic and existential arc he sketches around the life and work of the artist may be closer to that of John Milton than Blake.
Milton, far more than Blake, lived to see his own early promise, his hopes for religious and intellectual freedom and the earnest expecations of his whole generation baffled and perplexed by the turn of events and the ‘inhuman dearth of noble natures’ – as a later ‘New Romantic’ would put it. The man who wrote Areopagitica and The Tenure of Kings and Magistrates (supporting a free press and a republic) lived to see his idealised revolution turn into Cromwell’s police-state.
Similarly, Milton has not been short of accusers who suggest he used the imagery of Jerusalem to mask the yearnings of Athens – or worse.
I doubt Mr Cave can have been unaware of this life mirroring if he chose Milton’s ‘Red Right Hand’, the vengeful hand of God, as his emblem and totem.
Milton, perhaps like Mr Cave and the writer of this piece, had no time for the pretensions of the ‘Church’, for priestcraft, for Holy Orders or for schemes of law and piety. But he always considered himself a Christian and his life’s work was to know God rightly.
“The end then of learning is to repair the ruins of our first parents by regaining to know God aright, and out of that knowledge to love him, to imitate him, to be like him, as we may the nearest by possessing our souls of true virtue, which being united to the heavenly grace of faith makes up the highest perfection.”
John Milton, On Education.
A.N. Wilson’s short biography of Milton would be of interest to this writer and anyone else persuaded or intrigued by what he has written.

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
2 months ago
Reply to  William Amos

Nevertheless he was drawn to Cromwell the false prophet-ruler, as you note. When Milton’s friend Andrew Marvell asked in verse: “Where couldst thou words of such compass find / Whence furnish such a vast expanse of mind?”, the answer speaks for itself. But it is still a Source beyond our understanding. And it is not expressed in one faith tradition alone, not to my eyes and ears. Along with many readers, I detect in the Dhammapada and Bhagavad Gita the same mysterious guiding hand that is present in the Teachings of Jesus, and works like Faust and Paradise Lost. That is not an assertion of equivalence or interchangeability, but of the same ineffable Source.
You and I had an earlier exchange concerning the paradox of Milton, at once arch-traditionalist and revolting-radical. We might also do well to separate the life of Milton—perhaps a rather bad husband and father, on the humorless side, but with redeeming virtues—from his work. Nor should we assume that less “churchy” vision-seekers like Blake and Cave do not also seek to know God rightly.

Peter Kettle
Peter Kettle
2 months ago

Wonderful piece, and dare one say iy: Beautiful prose and elegant thoughts.

Francis Turner
Francis Turner
2 months ago

Who is this Nick Cave? Never heard of him…

Brett H
Brett H
2 months ago
Reply to  Francis Turner

Well now you have and you can find out more about him. One of the benefits of being an Unherd subscriber.

Peter A
Peter A
2 months ago
Reply to  Francis Turner

A popular chanteur, m’lud

Dumetrius
Dumetrius
2 months ago
Reply to  Francis Turner

A gothic stick of limp asparagus from the colonies, m’lud.

Tina D
Tina D
2 months ago
Reply to  Dumetrius

Well, you could, at the very least, name the colony.

Geoff W
Geoff W
2 months ago
Reply to  Tina D

He was born in rural Victoria, ma’am, and began his career in Orstraylia.

Jack Martin Leith
Jack Martin Leith
2 months ago
Reply to  Francis Turner
Matthew Jones
Matthew Jones
2 months ago

As a recovered atheist, I am slightly disappointed with my self for investing several minutes reading this long, meandering, pompous ode to pseudo-intellectualism.

On a seperate note, I pray that Nick Cave is blessed by God, and that his boys are one with him.

Brett H
Brett H
2 months ago
Reply to  Matthew Jones

And then spending more time making pointless comments. How disappointed you must be in yourself.

Matthew Jones
Matthew Jones
2 months ago
Reply to  Brett H

My comment had a point. I am pleased with it, and also with this one (which also has a point).

AJ Mac
AJ Mac
2 months ago

A Catholic atheist-agnostic? I’m drawn to the stubborn, hard-boiled, highly unorthodox faith of artists like Dostoevsky and Cave. And this rave review makes me keener to receive my CD of Wild God, which was released today and should be on its way to me from Bezos Inc.

Robert White
Robert White
2 months ago

Cave is absolutely A Good Thing. But I hope everyone here will excuse me for remembering the true presiding spirit, in my off-topic opinion, of the Birthday Party: Rowland S Howard, that most unsungest of guitar anti-heroes. Spectral, eldritch, downright weird, and with chops straight out of a crossroads jam with the devil himself.
I hope old Nick would agree.

UnHerd Reader
UnHerd Reader
2 months ago

Speaking of Overton’s window – “Atheist who loathes the church…”
I found I better understood literature and specifically Nick’s journey from violence-obsessed youth to thoughtful lyricist, preacher, and grief counselor all by better understanding the Bible.  
I too was Jesuit educated and only after graduating and experiencing the real world did I appreciate their POV, sacrifices, and drawing me out from the cave of darkness.
I highly recommend listening to the thoughtful and inspiring biblical series by Jordan Peterson – https://open.spotify.com/episode/0iXuxsSURdRkyzKOoyf2dg?si=bc38317ceb894a47
Jordan goes deep into the Old Testament and tries to understand the implications and meanings – which are 100% relevant today as they were thousands of years ago. Plus the quality of writing and ideas is unparalleled.
It is a perfect pairing with Nick and a step in the right direction of kicking against the pricks.

Rachel Cohen
Rachel Cohen
2 months ago

Speaking of Overton’s window – “Atheist who loathes the church…”
I found I better understood literature and specifically Nick’s journey from violence-obsessed youth to thoughtful lyricist, preacher, and grief counselor to all by better understanding the Bible. 
I too was Jesuit educated and only after graduating and experiencing the real world did I appreciate their POV, sacrifices, and drawing me out from the cave of darkness.
I highly recommend listening to the thoughtful and inspiring biblical series by Jordan Peterson – https://open.spotify.com/episode/0iXuxsSURdRkyzKOoyf2dg?si=bc38317ceb894a47
It is a perfect pairing with Nick and a step in the right direction of kicking against the pricks.

Kelly Madden
Kelly Madden
2 months ago

This piece tells us more about its author than its subject.
Imagine being trapped at a table with him for dinner or drinks.

Tyler Durden
Tyler Durden
2 months ago

I’d put Push The Sky Away amongst NC’s top 5 records. But in honesty I lost interest during The Boatman’s Call and its successors because the Bargeld element had been lost (so triumphant in Let Love In, for instance).
Mick Harvey eventually abandoned the project too which is where I think he refound some musical inspiration in the electronic furnishings of the Sky record. Then the tragedy in his life, multiple times, and I didn’t really feel like commenting on the rest mostly from no longer being a committed listener.