Zelenski and any on his teet are the first to benefit, and are doing so. Ukranian everyman’s are the one’s who lose out. At least a third of that population are Russians. Which is amusing. Financially, the mid to lower income of the US/UK countries, are the households who lose out. If you went home by home for a vote, none would have wanted to get into this nonsense. Nonsense being the US (and intensely its non elected entrenched officials) government has absolutely no interest in mediation, just sending more arms to benefit the profit of the companies who provide arms, for whom they pander for votes and money, and thus re-elect them, and in the end, send more dollars to expand their lot. This has nothing to do with the majority of people worldwide, just government officials and the corporate sponsors who vote them in. Easy class discussion of why term limits is important, not for the obvious, but also on down the deep line of non-elected people.
That is total Putin propaganda. Zelenski is anti corruption and his protections for his country after the war will bear testament to that. You need to be more careful about the source of your info. The only people selling property and land in Ukraine are those former Oligarchs who realise they can never go back to bleeding Ukraine dry because Zelensky will not allow it.
That is total Putin propaganda. Zelenski is anti corruption and his protections for his country after the war will bear testament to that. You need to be more careful about the source of your info. The only people selling property and land in Ukraine are those former Oligarchs who realise they can never go back to bleeding Ukraine dry because Zelensky will not allow it.
0 0
10 months ago
Zelenski and any on his teet are the first to benefit, and are doing so. Ukranian everyman’s are the one’s who lose out. At least a third of that population are Russians. Which is amusing. Financially, the mid to lower income of the US/UK countries, are the households who lose out. If you went home by home for a vote, none would have wanted to get into this nonsense. Nonsense being the US (and intensely its non elected entrenched officials) government has absolutely no interest in mediation, just sending more arms to benefit the profit of the companies who provide arms, for whom they pander for votes and money, and thus re-elect them, and in the end, send more dollars to expand their lot. This has nothing to do with the majority of people worldwide, just government officials and the corporate sponsors who vote them in. Easy class discussion of why term limits is important, not for the obvious, but also on down the deep line of non-elected people.
Lisa I
10 months ago
I’m sure the investors are buying up agricultural land at cut price too. The Ukrainians are in a very difficult position. I’d imagine they are being strong armed in to a lot of things they wouldn’t otherwise do.
Oh my ! Have I accidentally joined a sixth form arm chair activists group ?
Is this the Jeremy Corbyn Foreign Policy ‘Ya Boo’ venting space for the Islington Popular Front ? Good God people ! It’s up to us to help stop Ukraine being exploited after the war. The creation of another kleptocracy is out of the question as is allowing the rump end of Ukraine’s discredited Oligarchs to invite the kind of US vultures who descended on Iraq and Afghanistan to make all Europeans unpopular throughout the country. Repeating Putin lies about Zelensky helps no one.
Oh my ! Have I accidentally joined a sixth form arm chair activists group ?
Is this the Jeremy Corbyn Foreign Policy ‘Ya Boo’ venting space for the Islington Popular Front ? Good God people ! It’s up to us to help stop Ukraine being exploited after the war. The creation of another kleptocracy is out of the question as is allowing the rump end of Ukraine’s discredited Oligarchs to invite the kind of US vultures who descended on Iraq and Afghanistan to make all Europeans unpopular throughout the country. Repeating Putin lies about Zelensky helps no one.
Noone throwing around Minsk Agreements here have ever read them or followed the development across those 8 years and yet so clever to make statements. Just look honestly at yourself and ask how much do you know of the situation?
Noone throwing around Minsk Agreements here have ever read them or followed the development across those 8 years and yet so clever to make statements. Just look honestly at yourself and ask how much do you know of the situation?
Sadly you are right. Implementing the Minsk Accords would have left Ukraine in a better position.
Lisa I
10 months ago
I’m sure the investors are buying up agricultural land at cut price too. The Ukrainians are in a very difficult position. I’d imagine they are being strong armed in to a lot of things they wouldn’t otherwise do.
Jason Smith
10 months ago
I suppose the alternative to rebuilding the country with horrible capitalism is just to let it rot in a glorious socialist nirvana. Well done Thomas, as usual your schoolboy politics offer no solutions, only agitprop slogans suitable for an “Eat the Rich” protest
I’m so glad you posted that. I’m new here and I was beginning to wonder if this was a branch of the ‘Stop The War Coalition’.
Jason Smith
10 months ago
I suppose the alternative to rebuilding the country with horrible capitalism is just to let it rot in a glorious socialist nirvana. Well done Thomas, as usual your schoolboy politics offer no solutions, only agitprop slogans suitable for an “Eat the Rich” protest
Ben Jones
10 months ago
I tried to imagine what he was going to write this time and, lo! It came to pass. Change the record.
Not really. We’ve heard the same nonsense from Thomas Fazi countless times.
If all he can do is repeat the same old tune (never apparently learning anything new; and even if it weren’t such obvious nonsense), then why’s he still here ?
Get someone new and original in.
Not really. We’ve heard the same nonsense from Thomas Fazi countless times.
If all he can do is repeat the same old tune (never apparently learning anything new; and even if it weren’t such obvious nonsense), then why’s he still here ?
Get someone new and original in.
I tried to imagine what he was going to write this time and, lo! It came to pass. Change the record.
Peter B
10 months ago
Point 1: Ukraine has always needed Western investment and adoption of Western management, business and legal practices in order to reach its potential. This is nothing new. It’s been true for well over 100 years.
Point 2: Western (and other) investors have already bought up lots of farmland in Eastern Europe over the past 25 years. Locals didn’t have the capital or expertise to run efficient, large scale agriculture. Again, this is nothing new.
Point 3: You can hardly blame companies for taking advantage of opportunities that arise from Putin’s stupidity in invading Ukraine.
Point 4: I don’t think that your average Ukrainian would view national survival, independence and economic revival and growth as quite the disaster that Thomas Fazi seems to think it would be.
What does Mr Fazi actually want here ? The West to stand back and do nothing to help Ukraine recover and rebuild so that he’ll have a clean conscience about not “exploiting” the poor Ukrainians ? Deny them their own agency and the opportunity to judge the tradeoffs for themselves.
Well over 100 years? A misprint perhaps. Before 1917 Ukraine agriculture was pretty prosperous, hence the drive against the kulaks.
Peter B
10 months ago
Point 1: Ukraine has always needed Western investment and adoption of Western management, business and legal practices in order to reach its potential. This is nothing new. It’s been true for well over 100 years.
Point 2: Western (and other) investors have already bought up lots of farmland in Eastern Europe over the past 25 years. Locals didn’t have the capital or expertise to run efficient, large scale agriculture. Again, this is nothing new.
Point 3: You can hardly blame companies for taking advantage of opportunities that arise from Putin’s stupidity in invading Ukraine.
Point 4: I don’t think that your average Ukrainian would view national survival, independence and economic revival and growth as quite the disaster that Thomas Fazi seems to think it would be.
What does Mr Fazi actually want here ? The West to stand back and do nothing to help Ukraine recover and rebuild so that he’ll have a clean conscience about not “exploiting” the poor Ukrainians ? Deny them their own agency and the opportunity to judge the tradeoffs for themselves.
Max Rottersman
10 months ago
Bankers are greedy and amoral? Thanks for the insight Mr. Fozi 😉 Where’s the Unherd question? For example, is the West purposely going slow in helping Ukraine achieve a military objective to favor its financial ones? Are there examples of other post-Soviet nations who have been taken advantage by Blackrock or JPMorgan, etc? Try again!
Max Rottersman
10 months ago
Bankers are greedy and amoral? Thanks for the insight Mr. Fozi 😉 Where’s the Unherd question? For example, is the West purposely going slow in helping Ukraine achieve a military objective to favor its financial ones? Are there examples of other post-Soviet nations who have been taken advantage by Blackrock or JPMorgan, etc? Try again!
Anna Bramwell
10 months ago
The 2014 Trade and Association Agreement devotes about half of its length to measures to protect the EU against cheaper Ukrainian agricultural / food exports.
Anna Bramwell
10 months ago
The 2014 Trade and Association Agreement devotes about half of its length to measures to protect the EU against cheaper Ukrainian agricultural / food exports.
Edward De Beukelaer
10 months ago
The criticisms in the comments of this article are quite interesting. There are of course many ‘realities’ . Maybe the writer should have linked his worry to what big farming has done to land elsewhere. If one is concerned about health, one needs to be concerned about farming in the wide sense of the word = including the people involved in the farming, and the food that is produced. This then becomes a much more complex discusion.
I suspect it is not unsafe to assume that the large entities who own or are interested in owning the farming land in Ukraine will just apply the model that is exhausting farming land elsewhere and producing low quality food that yes delivers calories but often not necessary much nutrition.
interesting film: https://grow.foodrevolution.org/?uid=10&oid=3&affid=171
Edward De Beukelaer
10 months ago
The criticisms in the comments of this article are quite interesting. There are of course many ‘realities’ . Maybe the writer should have linked his worry to what big farming has done to land elsewhere. If one is concerned about health, one needs to be concerned about farming in the wide sense of the word = including the people involved in the farming, and the food that is produced. This then becomes a much more complex discusion.
I suspect it is not unsafe to assume that the large entities who own or are interested in owning the farming land in Ukraine will just apply the model that is exhausting farming land elsewhere and producing low quality food that yes delivers calories but often not necessary much nutrition.
interesting film: https://grow.foodrevolution.org/?uid=10&oid=3&affid=171
Andrew Holmes
10 months ago
The same essay was written about Poland when it left the Soviet sphere and chose capitalism over continued leftist interventions in their economy. Look at Poland today.
Very much agree, been working there since 2008 in our Swedish company. But there’s too many differences in comparing Poland to Ukraine or, God forbid, Russia. Poland are 1500 years (except the in/famous partitions) ahead of the vast lands to the east. Except for western Ukraine.
Their character is not near their so called slavic brethren, actually it’s only the language that would somehow “unite” them, but that’s also a stretch. Poland has slowly and methodically put it’s inhabitants through a de-communisation, they still do. They have invested in education heavily and are world leaders (with some other nations) producing a well educated mass. Look at the latest Pisa results, Finland, Estonia and Poland are top nations in Europe. They have also been clever in not only bring Investments from EU but also from Asia, primarily Korea.
US companies are also investing largely, and not least they are not in any way dependant on Russia, which most Central and East European countries are. Hungry is a good example. Give it another 10 years and they will also have their energy made by their own reactors. I’m really looking forward to the next 15 years, as long as they keep it homogeneous and don’t make the mistakes we have done. And keep Russia at an arms length.
Very much agree, been working there since 2008 in our Swedish company. But there’s too many differences in comparing Poland to Ukraine or, God forbid, Russia. Poland are 1500 years (except the in/famous partitions) ahead of the vast lands to the east. Except for western Ukraine.
Their character is not near their so called slavic brethren, actually it’s only the language that would somehow “unite” them, but that’s also a stretch. Poland has slowly and methodically put it’s inhabitants through a de-communisation, they still do. They have invested in education heavily and are world leaders (with some other nations) producing a well educated mass. Look at the latest Pisa results, Finland, Estonia and Poland are top nations in Europe. They have also been clever in not only bring Investments from EU but also from Asia, primarily Korea.
US companies are also investing largely, and not least they are not in any way dependant on Russia, which most Central and East European countries are. Hungry is a good example. Give it another 10 years and they will also have their energy made by their own reactors. I’m really looking forward to the next 15 years, as long as they keep it homogeneous and don’t make the mistakes we have done. And keep Russia at an arms length.
Cheers
Andrew Holmes
10 months ago
The same essay was written about Poland when it left the Soviet sphere and chose capitalism over continued leftist interventions in their economy. Look at Poland today.
Simon Blanchard
10 months ago
I’d go a step further and speculate that the main prize is Russia and that longer term this drives Biden’s humanitarian intervention. Capital’s fingers will be twitching in anticipation at picking over the remains of Putin’s fallen fiefdom.
Eh? I’m just pointing out that the capitalists had already found their way into Putin’s fiefdom, to the point of defining it – capitalists I would argue who are far more ‘red in tooth and claw; than our own. Russia has had the worst form of monarchy, under the Tsars, followed by the worst form of communism, followed by the worst form of capitalism.
Eh? I’m just pointing out that the capitalists had already found their way into Putin’s fiefdom, to the point of defining it – capitalists I would argue who are far more ‘red in tooth and claw; than our own. Russia has had the worst form of monarchy, under the Tsars, followed by the worst form of communism, followed by the worst form of capitalism.
Exactly right. Putin never imagined that he was putting Russia into play, but that’s what he did when he invaded Ukraine. The stakes are simply massive and the outcome will determine global dominance for years to come. Luckily, China is almost certainly odds-on to lose, although as strategists, the Chinese are first-class. Their control of most of the water resources in Asia gives them enormous leverage.
Ukraine was always the US’ ‘baby’. As Madeline Albright remarked, it was hard to resist the temptation to make shedloads of money out of it. Hunter was just the tip of the iceverg. And people forget: in the book McMafia you wont find any mention of Russia, only Ukraine. The prison sentences handed out to some members of the HarvardIID in the early 1990s in Russia were outliers.
If only the collective west had just done capitalism in Ukraine… but they didn’t. Hence all the strange F2F visits by foreign “leaders”… and endless donations of unaccounted for cash and weaponry.
Exactly right. Putin never imagined that he was putting Russia into play, but that’s what he did when he invaded Ukraine. The stakes are simply massive and the outcome will determine global dominance for years to come. Luckily, China is almost certainly odds-on to lose, although as strategists, the Chinese are first-class. Their control of most of the water resources in Asia gives them enormous leverage.
Ukraine was always the US’ ‘baby’. As Madeline Albright remarked, it was hard to resist the temptation to make shedloads of money out of it. Hunter was just the tip of the iceverg. And people forget: in the book McMafia you wont find any mention of Russia, only Ukraine. The prison sentences handed out to some members of the HarvardIID in the early 1990s in Russia were outliers.
If only the collective west had just done capitalism in Ukraine… but they didn’t. Hence all the strange F2F visits by foreign “leaders”… and endless donations of unaccounted for cash and weaponry.
Simon Blanchard
10 months ago
I’d go a step further and speculate that the main prize is Russia and that longer term this drives Biden’s humanitarian intervention. Capital’s fingers will be twitching in anticipation at picking over the remains of Putin’s fallen fiefdom.
He’s evidently a good journalist, but he is not a leader or politician; he does not even attempt to interpret why the US supports Ukraine, or engage with the possibility that it might be in the US’s interests. Reminds me of the adage about accountants knowing the price of everything and the value of nothing.
He’s evidently a good journalist, but he is not a leader or politician; he does not even attempt to interpret why the US supports Ukraine, or engage with the possibility that it might be in the US’s interests. Reminds me of the adage about accountants knowing the price of everything and the value of nothing.
Because the pre-Maidan oligarchs before the war were so much better at running things and corruption was nonexistent. The quote from Ms Borodina is almost Putinesque – opening up land sales to foreigners helps the oligarchs. Difficult circle to square. At least the author gets his last paragraph right.
Milton Gibbon
10 months ago
Because the pre-Maidan oligarchs before the war were so much better at running things and corruption was nonexistent. The quote from Ms Borodina is almost Putinesque – opening up land sales to foreigners helps the oligarchs. Difficult circle to square. At least the author gets his last paragraph right.
john d rockemella
10 months ago
More concentrated wealth and ownership in private hands, leads to one world governance run by private entities. The plan by 2030 will be fully in place, then say goodbye to democracy, welcome to authoritarian governments, and if conspiracy of UN agenda 21 is true, such as all the other conspiracies, say goodbye life! You will no longer be needed, as the global number wanted is less than 1bn.
john d rockemella
10 months ago
More concentrated wealth and ownership in private hands, leads to one world governance run by private entities. The plan by 2030 will be fully in place, then say goodbye to democracy, welcome to authoritarian governments, and if conspiracy of UN agenda 21 is true, such as all the other conspiracies, say goodbye life! You will no longer be needed, as the global number wanted is less than 1bn.
Perry de Havilland
10 months ago
“The capitalists are circling over Ukraine. The war is creating massive profit opportunities.”
And that is an unmitigated good thing. For Ukraine to be rebuilt, it needs to become a beacon for economic opportunity, not bvllshit regulatory statism. It needs rule of law, incorruptible courts (progress on that score is remarkable but more is needed), and aggressively pro-growth light touch policies. In short, it needs to become a magnet for private capital.
It is a measure of the disconnection from reality so pervasive amongst the chattering classes in the West that is not screamingly obvious to everyone.
Is there really no other way? Either an easy mark for Davos Man or a cave-dwelling troglodite? What if there was no war, no extreme duress? What would the Ukrainians want? I imagine that there might be aspects of their lives that they would rather not sell out to some low-ball bidder.
“What if there was no war, no extreme duress? What would the Ukrainians want?”
Well the ones I know (quite a few) want to be part of a market driven west (which is sadly less market driven than they imagine) as the alternative is a return to a reality dominated by local oligarchs.
As a Ukrainian once said to me: Western investors have a much lower tolerance for paying backhanders & make more noise when pressured to do so.
There are reasons why free-market capitalists are constantly being compared to vultures, wolves and vampires. I hope your Ukraikian friends know what they’re getting themselves into. I suspect they don’t.
There are reasons why free-market capitalists are constantly being compared to vultures, wolves and vampires. I hope your Ukraikian friends know what they’re getting themselves into. I suspect they don’t.
“What if there was no war, no extreme duress? What would the Ukrainians want?”
Well the ones I know (quite a few) want to be part of a market driven west (which is sadly less market driven than they imagine) as the alternative is a return to a reality dominated by local oligarchs.
As a Ukrainian once said to me: Western investors have a much lower tolerance for paying backhanders & make more noise when pressured to do so.
Is there really no other way? Either an easy mark for Davos Man or a cave-dwelling troglodite? What if there was no war, no extreme duress? What would the Ukrainians want? I imagine that there might be aspects of their lives that they would rather not sell out to some low-ball bidder.
Perry de Havilland
10 months ago
“The capitalists are circling over Ukraine. The war is creating massive profit opportunities.”
And that is an unmitigated good thing. For Ukraine to be rebuilt, it needs to become a beacon for economic opportunity, not bvllshit regulatory statism. It needs rule of law, incorruptible courts (progress on that score is remarkable but more is needed), and aggressively pro-growth light touch policies. In short, it needs to become a magnet for private capital.
It is a measure of the disconnection from reality so pervasive amongst the chattering classes in the West that is not screamingly obvious to everyone.
james elliott
10 months ago
Painfully, painfully naive.
james elliott
10 months ago
Painfully, painfully naive.
Arthur G
10 months ago
Do people not realize where the capital came from to build the RRs and fund US industrialization in the 1900s? Hint, it started with United, but ended in Kingdom, not States. Do people think we would have been better off to stay an agrarian nation in order to avoid the “evil capitalists”?
Do people not realize where the capital came from to build the RRs and fund US industrialization in the 1900s? Hint, it started with United, but ended in Kingdom, not States. Do people think we would have been better off to stay an agrarian nation in order to avoid the “evil capitalists”?
Last edited 10 months ago by Arthur G
Richard Craven
10 months ago
And your proposals for rebuilding Ukraine without capital investment are … ?
Richard Craven
10 months ago
And your proposals for rebuilding Ukraine without capital investment are … ?
Steve White
10 months ago
Neoliberal serfdom and narrative controlled democracy doesn’t functionally work out much different for the average person than something like people have in China. China is very capitalistic, apparently doesn’t care for some of its citizens. Like them, we sometmies have elections, but everyone in the West now is sort of at the mercy of the supposed benevolence of their supposedly fairly elected benefactors. With all the money floating around, are we to believe that things aren’t rigged to benefit a few, and use the many?
I am surprised that the narrative control allows at least the money behind everything in this Ukraine / Donbass issue to still be talked about. They are still leaving us this window to discuss for now. That mankind could in fact, be corrupt, even evil, even those in control over information and governments that we sit under.
Just because we live in a place, like we support the football teams in the area we live, we’re supposed to clannishly support whatever people claim to represent our side of everything for the good of all.
After all, all the tech we use has us under surveillance, and our bank accounts, the companies we work for, the laws we live under can be turned against us at any moment if we don’t buy the narratives that they say is all there to keep us safe. At some point, are we supposed to say it’s better to eat the bugs and live in the pod than face the evil [insert the latest foil] tanks?
At some point what I think was lost was humanity. Oh yes it’s used in images to move us, to nudge us who are not narcissists and psychopaths, but are things in our nations about blessing us, our families, our communities? They have us all looking out at foreign events, and policy, but what about domestically. Are our schools good? Are our borders safe? Do our children have a good future? They use fake virtue. They are have compassion for those who are not in front of them. Everyone but us who live under them. You see how that works?
Pragmatism took over for first-principles, and they make us look at everything except them. They make us feel like we have control over some things, but never them, somehow, none of the ones who do all the bad policy, or who are corrupt face the consequences.
Joe Biden and Zelenskyy are arguably two of the most corrupt men in political office today, and yet, no one can or will hold them accountable. No, there are apparently pragmatic reasons not to…. Really? Is there no real justice in the world, or are there more important things. Things that are too big to fail that mean these chess pieces need to stay put for now.
I would personally say that this is true if there is no God. If there is no God, or if he is not righteous, then yes, no problem. Pragmatism works just fine.
Zelenskyy is corrupt how, by doing everything he can to protect his country — and fulfilling the will of electorate, who clearly don’t want to give up? Before the war he was all for a settlement, in fact he was considered a Russophile by many. I have noticed by now that all of the political realities doesn’t concern you because you just love to push your nurtured narrative.. Maybe you should be a fiction writer?
Zelenskyy is corrupt how, by doing everything he can to protect his country — and fulfilling the will of electorate, who clearly don’t want to give up? Before the war he was all for a settlement, in fact he was considered a Russophile by many. I have noticed by now that all of the political realities doesn’t concern you because you just love to push your nurtured narrative.. Maybe you should be a fiction writer?
Steve White
10 months ago
Neoliberal serfdom and narrative controlled democracy doesn’t functionally work out much different for the average person than something like people have in China. China is very capitalistic, apparently doesn’t care for some of its citizens. Like them, we sometmies have elections, but everyone in the West now is sort of at the mercy of the supposed benevolence of their supposedly fairly elected benefactors. With all the money floating around, are we to believe that things aren’t rigged to benefit a few, and use the many?
I am surprised that the narrative control allows at least the money behind everything in this Ukraine / Donbass issue to still be talked about. They are still leaving us this window to discuss for now. That mankind could in fact, be corrupt, even evil, even those in control over information and governments that we sit under.
Just because we live in a place, like we support the football teams in the area we live, we’re supposed to clannishly support whatever people claim to represent our side of everything for the good of all.
After all, all the tech we use has us under surveillance, and our bank accounts, the companies we work for, the laws we live under can be turned against us at any moment if we don’t buy the narratives that they say is all there to keep us safe. At some point, are we supposed to say it’s better to eat the bugs and live in the pod than face the evil [insert the latest foil] tanks?
At some point what I think was lost was humanity. Oh yes it’s used in images to move us, to nudge us who are not narcissists and psychopaths, but are things in our nations about blessing us, our families, our communities? They have us all looking out at foreign events, and policy, but what about domestically. Are our schools good? Are our borders safe? Do our children have a good future? They use fake virtue. They are have compassion for those who are not in front of them. Everyone but us who live under them. You see how that works?
Pragmatism took over for first-principles, and they make us look at everything except them. They make us feel like we have control over some things, but never them, somehow, none of the ones who do all the bad policy, or who are corrupt face the consequences.
Joe Biden and Zelenskyy are arguably two of the most corrupt men in political office today, and yet, no one can or will hold them accountable. No, there are apparently pragmatic reasons not to…. Really? Is there no real justice in the world, or are there more important things. Things that are too big to fail that mean these chess pieces need to stay put for now.
I would personally say that this is true if there is no God. If there is no God, or if he is not righteous, then yes, no problem. Pragmatism works just fine.
Last edited 10 months ago by Steve White
Gordon Arta
10 months ago
Was there ever a more predictable opinion from a more predictable writer?
Was there ever a more predictable opinion from a more predictable writer?
martin logan
10 months ago
The Hidden Hand of World Capital!
Hunter Biden–unmasked!
Can’t people like Fazi come up with anything new? This supposedly predatory system has been around for some 200 years, and everything else seems to work far worse, as in Yanukovich’s Ukraine.
So, Thomas, just take a seat beside Noam, and wait for Godot.
martin logan
10 months ago
The Hidden Hand of World Capital!
Hunter Biden–unmasked!
Can’t people like Fazi come up with anything new? This supposedly predatory system has been around for some 200 years, and everything else seems to work far worse, as in Yanukovich’s Ukraine.
So, Thomas, just take a seat beside Noam, and wait for Godot.
Frank McCusker
10 months ago
If all that helps keep Putin out, what’s the problem?
If all that helps keep Putin out, what’s the problem?
TheElephant InTheRoom
10 months ago
Best wishes to those wishing to do business in country 404. Your pockets may actually just disappear.
TheElephant InTheRoom
10 months ago
Best wishes to those wishing to do business in country 404. Your pockets may actually just disappear.
Rupert Carnegie
10 months ago
I seem to have found this essay less objectionable than some other readers.
In the grand scheme of things then – assuming the war ends with a deal between Ukraine and Russia – Ukraine will become most important as an alternative model for Russia. It may have a comparable effect to that of West Germany on East Germany during the Cold War. This suggests that it makes some sense to moderate the more ruthless and alienating aspects of Capitalism in favour of a more emollient and user friendly approach – just as during the early stages of the Cold War American capitalists thought it prudent to support Social Democrats in Western Europe.
It is also worth remembering that the shock therapy of the 1990s had a disastrous effect on some ex communist economies and, in particular, on that of Russia. This may encourage a little humility for those pushing neo-liberal reform today,
Containing Russian military aggression will be an important victory in this new Cold War but the ultimate prize will be the “conversion” of Russia and, eventually, China. Amiable pragmatism not ideological dogmatism will improve the odds.
“the shock therapy of the 1990s had a disastrous effect on some ex communist economies”
Perhaps, but it’s clear that their economic catastrophe was decades in the making. What we witnessed in the 1990s was the inevitable collapse. It’ll be the same whenever North Korea collapses.
“the shock therapy of the 1990s had a disastrous effect on some ex communist economies”
Perhaps, but it’s clear that their economic catastrophe was decades in the making. What we witnessed in the 1990s was the inevitable collapse. It’ll be the same whenever North Korea collapses.
Rupert Carnegie
10 months ago
I seem to have found this essay less objectionable than some other readers.
In the grand scheme of things then – assuming the war ends with a deal between Ukraine and Russia – Ukraine will become most important as an alternative model for Russia. It may have a comparable effect to that of West Germany on East Germany during the Cold War. This suggests that it makes some sense to moderate the more ruthless and alienating aspects of Capitalism in favour of a more emollient and user friendly approach – just as during the early stages of the Cold War American capitalists thought it prudent to support Social Democrats in Western Europe.
It is also worth remembering that the shock therapy of the 1990s had a disastrous effect on some ex communist economies and, in particular, on that of Russia. This may encourage a little humility for those pushing neo-liberal reform today,
Containing Russian military aggression will be an important victory in this new Cold War but the ultimate prize will be the “conversion” of Russia and, eventually, China. Amiable pragmatism not ideological dogmatism will improve the odds.
Marcus Leach
10 months ago
By the time Ukraine’s natural resourses have been appropriated by China, the US and others, the country is in hock for hundreds of billions in loans, with foreign financiers dictating economic policy, and the EU displaces national sovereignty and democratic representation and controls vast swathes of policy areas, Ukrainians may well wish they had just thrown their lot in with Russia,
They tried enough with Russia.. Where did it get them? Maybe have a look at how Yanukovich ran the country, at his golden toilet bowl estate? Or how Donbass has been looted by Russian elites during these 8 years? Jesus wept at the Westerner naivety towards Russia.. There is a reason Eastern Europeans view the exploitation of the West as a much smaller evil — at the very least they are not trying to kill the local culture and identity.
They tried enough with Russia.. Where did it get them? Maybe have a look at how Yanukovich ran the country, at his golden toilet bowl estate? Or how Donbass has been looted by Russian elites during these 8 years? Jesus wept at the Westerner naivety towards Russia.. There is a reason Eastern Europeans view the exploitation of the West as a much smaller evil — at the very least they are not trying to kill the local culture and identity.
Will the banks do to Ukraine what they did, and are still doing to Greece?
Marcus Leach
10 months ago
By the time Ukraine’s natural resourses have been appropriated by China, the US and others, the country is in hock for hundreds of billions in loans, with foreign financiers dictating economic policy, and the EU displaces national sovereignty and democratic representation and controls vast swathes of policy areas, Ukrainians may well wish they had just thrown their lot in with Russia,
Zelenski and any on his teet are the first to benefit, and are doing so. Ukranian everyman’s are the one’s who lose out. At least a third of that population are Russians. Which is amusing. Financially, the mid to lower income of the US/UK countries, are the households who lose out. If you went home by home for a vote, none would have wanted to get into this nonsense. Nonsense being the US (and intensely its non elected entrenched officials) government has absolutely no interest in mediation, just sending more arms to benefit the profit of the companies who provide arms, for whom they pander for votes and money, and thus re-elect them, and in the end, send more dollars to expand their lot. This has nothing to do with the majority of people worldwide, just government officials and the corporate sponsors who vote them in. Easy class discussion of why term limits is important, not for the obvious, but also on down the deep line of non-elected people.
“At least a third of that population are Russians.”
Russian speaking does not mean they are Russian.
That is total Putin propaganda. Zelenski is anti corruption and his protections for his country after the war will bear testament to that. You need to be more careful about the source of your info. The only people selling property and land in Ukraine are those former Oligarchs who realise they can never go back to bleeding Ukraine dry because Zelensky will not allow it.
“At least a third of that population are Russians.”
Russian speaking does not mean they are Russian.
That is total Putin propaganda. Zelenski is anti corruption and his protections for his country after the war will bear testament to that. You need to be more careful about the source of your info. The only people selling property and land in Ukraine are those former Oligarchs who realise they can never go back to bleeding Ukraine dry because Zelensky will not allow it.
Zelenski and any on his teet are the first to benefit, and are doing so. Ukranian everyman’s are the one’s who lose out. At least a third of that population are Russians. Which is amusing. Financially, the mid to lower income of the US/UK countries, are the households who lose out. If you went home by home for a vote, none would have wanted to get into this nonsense. Nonsense being the US (and intensely its non elected entrenched officials) government has absolutely no interest in mediation, just sending more arms to benefit the profit of the companies who provide arms, for whom they pander for votes and money, and thus re-elect them, and in the end, send more dollars to expand their lot. This has nothing to do with the majority of people worldwide, just government officials and the corporate sponsors who vote them in. Easy class discussion of why term limits is important, not for the obvious, but also on down the deep line of non-elected people.
I’m sure the investors are buying up agricultural land at cut price too. The Ukrainians are in a very difficult position. I’d imagine they are being strong armed in to a lot of things they wouldn’t otherwise do.
The Chinese are the biggest buyers of land in Ukraine.
Sadly you are right. Implementing the Minsk Accords would have left Ukraine in a better position.
The Russians will take one half and Blackrock will own the rest, a massive % of Ukrainian men will be dead
And Ukrainian nationalists think that they’re winning
Oh my ! Have I accidentally joined a sixth form arm chair activists group ?
Is this the Jeremy Corbyn Foreign Policy ‘Ya Boo’ venting space for the Islington Popular Front ? Good God people ! It’s up to us to help stop Ukraine being exploited after the war. The creation of another kleptocracy is out of the question as is allowing the rump end of Ukraine’s discredited Oligarchs to invite the kind of US vultures who descended on Iraq and Afghanistan to make all Europeans unpopular throughout the country. Repeating Putin lies about Zelensky helps no one.
Oh my ! Have I accidentally joined a sixth form arm chair activists group ?
Is this the Jeremy Corbyn Foreign Policy ‘Ya Boo’ venting space for the Islington Popular Front ? Good God people ! It’s up to us to help stop Ukraine being exploited after the war. The creation of another kleptocracy is out of the question as is allowing the rump end of Ukraine’s discredited Oligarchs to invite the kind of US vultures who descended on Iraq and Afghanistan to make all Europeans unpopular throughout the country. Repeating Putin lies about Zelensky helps no one.
Noone throwing around Minsk Agreements here have ever read them or followed the development across those 8 years and yet so clever to make statements. Just look honestly at yourself and ask how much do you know of the situation?
The Russians will take one half and Blackrock will own the rest, a massive % of Ukrainian men will be dead
And Ukrainian nationalists think that they’re winning
Noone throwing around Minsk Agreements here have ever read them or followed the development across those 8 years and yet so clever to make statements. Just look honestly at yourself and ask how much do you know of the situation?
The Chinese are the biggest buyers of land in Ukraine.
Sadly you are right. Implementing the Minsk Accords would have left Ukraine in a better position.
I’m sure the investors are buying up agricultural land at cut price too. The Ukrainians are in a very difficult position. I’d imagine they are being strong armed in to a lot of things they wouldn’t otherwise do.
I suppose the alternative to rebuilding the country with horrible capitalism is just to let it rot in a glorious socialist nirvana. Well done Thomas, as usual your schoolboy politics offer no solutions, only agitprop slogans suitable for an “Eat the Rich” protest
I’m so glad you posted that. I’m new here and I was beginning to wonder if this was a branch of the ‘Stop The War Coalition’.
I’m so glad you posted that. I’m new here and I was beginning to wonder if this was a branch of the ‘Stop The War Coalition’.
I suppose the alternative to rebuilding the country with horrible capitalism is just to let it rot in a glorious socialist nirvana. Well done Thomas, as usual your schoolboy politics offer no solutions, only agitprop slogans suitable for an “Eat the Rich” protest
I tried to imagine what he was going to write this time and, lo! It came to pass. Change the record.
It bears repeating
Not really. We’ve heard the same nonsense from Thomas Fazi countless times.
If all he can do is repeat the same old tune (never apparently learning anything new; and even if it weren’t such obvious nonsense), then why’s he still here ?
Get someone new and original in.
Not really. We’ve heard the same nonsense from Thomas Fazi countless times.
If all he can do is repeat the same old tune (never apparently learning anything new; and even if it weren’t such obvious nonsense), then why’s he still here ?
Get someone new and original in.
It bears repeating
I tried to imagine what he was going to write this time and, lo! It came to pass. Change the record.
Point 1: Ukraine has always needed Western investment and adoption of Western management, business and legal practices in order to reach its potential. This is nothing new. It’s been true for well over 100 years.
Point 2: Western (and other) investors have already bought up lots of farmland in Eastern Europe over the past 25 years. Locals didn’t have the capital or expertise to run efficient, large scale agriculture. Again, this is nothing new.
Point 3: You can hardly blame companies for taking advantage of opportunities that arise from Putin’s stupidity in invading Ukraine.
Point 4: I don’t think that your average Ukrainian would view national survival, independence and economic revival and growth as quite the disaster that Thomas Fazi seems to think it would be.
What does Mr Fazi actually want here ? The West to stand back and do nothing to help Ukraine recover and rebuild so that he’ll have a clean conscience about not “exploiting” the poor Ukrainians ? Deny them their own agency and the opportunity to judge the tradeoffs for themselves.
Well over 100 years? A misprint perhaps. Before 1917 Ukraine agriculture was pretty prosperous, hence the drive against the kulaks.
Well over 100 years? A misprint perhaps. Before 1917 Ukraine agriculture was pretty prosperous, hence the drive against the kulaks.
Point 1: Ukraine has always needed Western investment and adoption of Western management, business and legal practices in order to reach its potential. This is nothing new. It’s been true for well over 100 years.
Point 2: Western (and other) investors have already bought up lots of farmland in Eastern Europe over the past 25 years. Locals didn’t have the capital or expertise to run efficient, large scale agriculture. Again, this is nothing new.
Point 3: You can hardly blame companies for taking advantage of opportunities that arise from Putin’s stupidity in invading Ukraine.
Point 4: I don’t think that your average Ukrainian would view national survival, independence and economic revival and growth as quite the disaster that Thomas Fazi seems to think it would be.
What does Mr Fazi actually want here ? The West to stand back and do nothing to help Ukraine recover and rebuild so that he’ll have a clean conscience about not “exploiting” the poor Ukrainians ? Deny them their own agency and the opportunity to judge the tradeoffs for themselves.
Bankers are greedy and amoral? Thanks for the insight Mr. Fozi 😉 Where’s the Unherd question? For example, is the West purposely going slow in helping Ukraine achieve a military objective to favor its financial ones? Are there examples of other post-Soviet nations who have been taken advantage by Blackrock or JPMorgan, etc? Try again!
Bankers are greedy and amoral? Thanks for the insight Mr. Fozi 😉 Where’s the Unherd question? For example, is the West purposely going slow in helping Ukraine achieve a military objective to favor its financial ones? Are there examples of other post-Soviet nations who have been taken advantage by Blackrock or JPMorgan, etc? Try again!
The 2014 Trade and Association Agreement devotes about half of its length to measures to protect the EU against cheaper Ukrainian agricultural / food exports.
The 2014 Trade and Association Agreement devotes about half of its length to measures to protect the EU against cheaper Ukrainian agricultural / food exports.
The criticisms in the comments of this article are quite interesting. There are of course many ‘realities’ . Maybe the writer should have linked his worry to what big farming has done to land elsewhere. If one is concerned about health, one needs to be concerned about farming in the wide sense of the word = including the people involved in the farming, and the food that is produced. This then becomes a much more complex discusion.
I suspect it is not unsafe to assume that the large entities who own or are interested in owning the farming land in Ukraine will just apply the model that is exhausting farming land elsewhere and producing low quality food that yes delivers calories but often not necessary much nutrition.
interesting film: https://grow.foodrevolution.org/?uid=10&oid=3&affid=171
The criticisms in the comments of this article are quite interesting. There are of course many ‘realities’ . Maybe the writer should have linked his worry to what big farming has done to land elsewhere. If one is concerned about health, one needs to be concerned about farming in the wide sense of the word = including the people involved in the farming, and the food that is produced. This then becomes a much more complex discusion.
I suspect it is not unsafe to assume that the large entities who own or are interested in owning the farming land in Ukraine will just apply the model that is exhausting farming land elsewhere and producing low quality food that yes delivers calories but often not necessary much nutrition.
interesting film: https://grow.foodrevolution.org/?uid=10&oid=3&affid=171
The same essay was written about Poland when it left the Soviet sphere and chose capitalism over continued leftist interventions in their economy. Look at Poland today.
Very much agree, been working there since 2008 in our Swedish company. But there’s too many differences in comparing Poland to Ukraine or, God forbid, Russia. Poland are 1500 years (except the in/famous partitions) ahead of the vast lands to the east. Except for western Ukraine.
Their character is not near their so called slavic brethren, actually it’s only the language that would somehow “unite” them, but that’s also a stretch. Poland has slowly and methodically put it’s inhabitants through a de-communisation, they still do. They have invested in education heavily and are world leaders (with some other nations) producing a well educated mass. Look at the latest Pisa results, Finland, Estonia and Poland are top nations in Europe. They have also been clever in not only bring Investments from EU but also from Asia, primarily Korea.
US companies are also investing largely, and not least they are not in any way dependant on Russia, which most Central and East European countries are. Hungry is a good example. Give it another 10 years and they will also have their energy made by their own reactors. I’m really looking forward to the next 15 years, as long as they keep it homogeneous and don’t make the mistakes we have done. And keep Russia at an arms length.
Cheers
Very much agree, been working there since 2008 in our Swedish company. But there’s too many differences in comparing Poland to Ukraine or, God forbid, Russia. Poland are 1500 years (except the in/famous partitions) ahead of the vast lands to the east. Except for western Ukraine.
Their character is not near their so called slavic brethren, actually it’s only the language that would somehow “unite” them, but that’s also a stretch. Poland has slowly and methodically put it’s inhabitants through a de-communisation, they still do. They have invested in education heavily and are world leaders (with some other nations) producing a well educated mass. Look at the latest Pisa results, Finland, Estonia and Poland are top nations in Europe. They have also been clever in not only bring Investments from EU but also from Asia, primarily Korea.
US companies are also investing largely, and not least they are not in any way dependant on Russia, which most Central and East European countries are. Hungry is a good example. Give it another 10 years and they will also have their energy made by their own reactors. I’m really looking forward to the next 15 years, as long as they keep it homogeneous and don’t make the mistakes we have done. And keep Russia at an arms length.
Cheers
The same essay was written about Poland when it left the Soviet sphere and chose capitalism over continued leftist interventions in their economy. Look at Poland today.
I’d go a step further and speculate that the main prize is Russia and that longer term this drives Biden’s humanitarian intervention. Capital’s fingers will be twitching in anticipation at picking over the remains of Putin’s fallen fiefdom.
Because there was nothing capitalistic about Putin’s Russia; the Western capitalist running dogs aim to fill this void.
What would you do – send in the Sally Army?
Eh? I’m just pointing out that the capitalists had already found their way into Putin’s fiefdom, to the point of defining it – capitalists I would argue who are far more ‘red in tooth and claw; than our own. Russia has had the worst form of monarchy, under the Tsars, followed by the worst form of communism, followed by the worst form of capitalism.
Eh? I’m just pointing out that the capitalists had already found their way into Putin’s fiefdom, to the point of defining it – capitalists I would argue who are far more ‘red in tooth and claw; than our own. Russia has had the worst form of monarchy, under the Tsars, followed by the worst form of communism, followed by the worst form of capitalism.
What would you do – send in the Sally Army?
Exactly right. Putin never imagined that he was putting Russia into play, but that’s what he did when he invaded Ukraine. The stakes are simply massive and the outcome will determine global dominance for years to come. Luckily, China is almost certainly odds-on to lose, although as strategists, the Chinese are first-class. Their control of most of the water resources in Asia gives them enormous leverage.
Why is China odds-on to lose? Because of their shrinking population? Or some other reason?
Why is China odds-on to lose? Because of their shrinking population? Or some other reason?
Ukraine was always the US’ ‘baby’. As Madeline Albright remarked, it was hard to resist the temptation to make shedloads of money out of it. Hunter was just the tip of the iceverg. And people forget: in the book McMafia you wont find any mention of Russia, only Ukraine. The prison sentences handed out to some members of the HarvardIID in the early 1990s in Russia were outliers.
I was thinking much the same
If only the collective west had just done capitalism in Ukraine… but they didn’t. Hence all the strange F2F visits by foreign “leaders”… and endless donations of unaccounted for cash and weaponry.
Because there was nothing capitalistic about Putin’s Russia; the Western capitalist running dogs aim to fill this void.
Exactly right. Putin never imagined that he was putting Russia into play, but that’s what he did when he invaded Ukraine. The stakes are simply massive and the outcome will determine global dominance for years to come. Luckily, China is almost certainly odds-on to lose, although as strategists, the Chinese are first-class. Their control of most of the water resources in Asia gives them enormous leverage.
Ukraine was always the US’ ‘baby’. As Madeline Albright remarked, it was hard to resist the temptation to make shedloads of money out of it. Hunter was just the tip of the iceverg. And people forget: in the book McMafia you wont find any mention of Russia, only Ukraine. The prison sentences handed out to some members of the HarvardIID in the early 1990s in Russia were outliers.
I was thinking much the same
If only the collective west had just done capitalism in Ukraine… but they didn’t. Hence all the strange F2F visits by foreign “leaders”… and endless donations of unaccounted for cash and weaponry.
I’d go a step further and speculate that the main prize is Russia and that longer term this drives Biden’s humanitarian intervention. Capital’s fingers will be twitching in anticipation at picking over the remains of Putin’s fallen fiefdom.
check out what Max Blumenthal has to say:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Eq4643bsH8w
Thank you!
He’s evidently a good journalist, but he is not a leader or politician; he does not even attempt to interpret why the US supports Ukraine, or engage with the possibility that it might be in the US’s interests. Reminds me of the adage about accountants knowing the price of everything and the value of nothing.
Thank you!
He’s evidently a good journalist, but he is not a leader or politician; he does not even attempt to interpret why the US supports Ukraine, or engage with the possibility that it might be in the US’s interests. Reminds me of the adage about accountants knowing the price of everything and the value of nothing.
check out what Max Blumenthal has to say:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Eq4643bsH8w
The vultures are circling.
The vultures are circling.
Because the pre-Maidan oligarchs before the war were so much better at running things and corruption was nonexistent. The quote from Ms Borodina is almost Putinesque – opening up land sales to foreigners helps the oligarchs. Difficult circle to square. At least the author gets his last paragraph right.
Because the pre-Maidan oligarchs before the war were so much better at running things and corruption was nonexistent. The quote from Ms Borodina is almost Putinesque – opening up land sales to foreigners helps the oligarchs. Difficult circle to square. At least the author gets his last paragraph right.
More concentrated wealth and ownership in private hands, leads to one world governance run by private entities. The plan by 2030 will be fully in place, then say goodbye to democracy, welcome to authoritarian governments, and if conspiracy of UN agenda 21 is true, such as all the other conspiracies, say goodbye life! You will no longer be needed, as the global number wanted is less than 1bn.
More concentrated wealth and ownership in private hands, leads to one world governance run by private entities. The plan by 2030 will be fully in place, then say goodbye to democracy, welcome to authoritarian governments, and if conspiracy of UN agenda 21 is true, such as all the other conspiracies, say goodbye life! You will no longer be needed, as the global number wanted is less than 1bn.
“The capitalists are circling over Ukraine. The war is creating massive profit opportunities.”
And that is an unmitigated good thing. For Ukraine to be rebuilt, it needs to become a beacon for economic opportunity, not bvllshit regulatory statism. It needs rule of law, incorruptible courts (progress on that score is remarkable but more is needed), and aggressively pro-growth light touch policies. In short, it needs to become a magnet for private capital.
It is a measure of the disconnection from reality so pervasive amongst the chattering classes in the West that is not screamingly obvious to everyone.
Is there really no other way? Either an easy mark for Davos Man or a cave-dwelling troglodite? What if there was no war, no extreme duress? What would the Ukrainians want? I imagine that there might be aspects of their lives that they would rather not sell out to some low-ball bidder.
“What if there was no war, no extreme duress? What would the Ukrainians want?”
Well the ones I know (quite a few) want to be part of a market driven west (which is sadly less market driven than they imagine) as the alternative is a return to a reality dominated by local oligarchs.
As a Ukrainian once said to me: Western investors have a much lower tolerance for paying backhanders & make more noise when pressured to do so.
There are reasons why free-market capitalists are constantly being compared to vultures, wolves and vampires. I hope your Ukraikian friends know what they’re getting themselves into. I suspect they don’t.
There are reasons why free-market capitalists are constantly being compared to vultures, wolves and vampires. I hope your Ukraikian friends know what they’re getting themselves into. I suspect they don’t.
“What if there was no war, no extreme duress? What would the Ukrainians want?”
Well the ones I know (quite a few) want to be part of a market driven west (which is sadly less market driven than they imagine) as the alternative is a return to a reality dominated by local oligarchs.
As a Ukrainian once said to me: Western investors have a much lower tolerance for paying backhanders & make more noise when pressured to do so.
Is there really no other way? Either an easy mark for Davos Man or a cave-dwelling troglodite? What if there was no war, no extreme duress? What would the Ukrainians want? I imagine that there might be aspects of their lives that they would rather not sell out to some low-ball bidder.
“The capitalists are circling over Ukraine. The war is creating massive profit opportunities.”
And that is an unmitigated good thing. For Ukraine to be rebuilt, it needs to become a beacon for economic opportunity, not bvllshit regulatory statism. It needs rule of law, incorruptible courts (progress on that score is remarkable but more is needed), and aggressively pro-growth light touch policies. In short, it needs to become a magnet for private capital.
It is a measure of the disconnection from reality so pervasive amongst the chattering classes in the West that is not screamingly obvious to everyone.
Painfully, painfully naive.
Painfully, painfully naive.
Do people not realize where the capital came from to build the RRs and fund US industrialization in the 1900s? Hint, it started with United, but ended in Kingdom, not States. Do people think we would have been better off to stay an agrarian nation in order to avoid the “evil capitalists”?
Give me a minute. I’m thinking.
Give me a minute. I’m thinking.
Do people not realize where the capital came from to build the RRs and fund US industrialization in the 1900s? Hint, it started with United, but ended in Kingdom, not States. Do people think we would have been better off to stay an agrarian nation in order to avoid the “evil capitalists”?
And your proposals for rebuilding Ukraine without capital investment are … ?
And your proposals for rebuilding Ukraine without capital investment are … ?
Neoliberal serfdom and narrative controlled democracy doesn’t functionally work out much different for the average person than something like people have in China. China is very capitalistic, apparently doesn’t care for some of its citizens. Like them, we sometmies have elections, but everyone in the West now is sort of at the mercy of the supposed benevolence of their supposedly fairly elected benefactors. With all the money floating around, are we to believe that things aren’t rigged to benefit a few, and use the many?
I am surprised that the narrative control allows at least the money behind everything in this Ukraine / Donbass issue to still be talked about. They are still leaving us this window to discuss for now. That mankind could in fact, be corrupt, even evil, even those in control over information and governments that we sit under.
Just because we live in a place, like we support the football teams in the area we live, we’re supposed to clannishly support whatever people claim to represent our side of everything for the good of all.
After all, all the tech we use has us under surveillance, and our bank accounts, the companies we work for, the laws we live under can be turned against us at any moment if we don’t buy the narratives that they say is all there to keep us safe. At some point, are we supposed to say it’s better to eat the bugs and live in the pod than face the evil [insert the latest foil] tanks?
At some point what I think was lost was humanity. Oh yes it’s used in images to move us, to nudge us who are not narcissists and psychopaths, but are things in our nations about blessing us, our families, our communities? They have us all looking out at foreign events, and policy, but what about domestically. Are our schools good? Are our borders safe? Do our children have a good future? They use fake virtue. They are have compassion for those who are not in front of them. Everyone but us who live under them. You see how that works?
Pragmatism took over for first-principles, and they make us look at everything except them. They make us feel like we have control over some things, but never them, somehow, none of the ones who do all the bad policy, or who are corrupt face the consequences.
Joe Biden and Zelenskyy are arguably two of the most corrupt men in political office today, and yet, no one can or will hold them accountable. No, there are apparently pragmatic reasons not to…. Really? Is there no real justice in the world, or are there more important things. Things that are too big to fail that mean these chess pieces need to stay put for now.
I would personally say that this is true if there is no God. If there is no God, or if he is not righteous, then yes, no problem. Pragmatism works just fine.
Zelenskyy is corrupt how, by doing everything he can to protect his country — and fulfilling the will of electorate, who clearly don’t want to give up? Before the war he was all for a settlement, in fact he was considered a Russophile by many. I have noticed by now that all of the political realities doesn’t concern you because you just love to push your nurtured narrative.. Maybe you should be a fiction writer?
Well said.
Well said.
Zelenskyy is corrupt how, by doing everything he can to protect his country — and fulfilling the will of electorate, who clearly don’t want to give up? Before the war he was all for a settlement, in fact he was considered a Russophile by many. I have noticed by now that all of the political realities doesn’t concern you because you just love to push your nurtured narrative.. Maybe you should be a fiction writer?
Neoliberal serfdom and narrative controlled democracy doesn’t functionally work out much different for the average person than something like people have in China. China is very capitalistic, apparently doesn’t care for some of its citizens. Like them, we sometmies have elections, but everyone in the West now is sort of at the mercy of the supposed benevolence of their supposedly fairly elected benefactors. With all the money floating around, are we to believe that things aren’t rigged to benefit a few, and use the many?
I am surprised that the narrative control allows at least the money behind everything in this Ukraine / Donbass issue to still be talked about. They are still leaving us this window to discuss for now. That mankind could in fact, be corrupt, even evil, even those in control over information and governments that we sit under.
Just because we live in a place, like we support the football teams in the area we live, we’re supposed to clannishly support whatever people claim to represent our side of everything for the good of all.
After all, all the tech we use has us under surveillance, and our bank accounts, the companies we work for, the laws we live under can be turned against us at any moment if we don’t buy the narratives that they say is all there to keep us safe. At some point, are we supposed to say it’s better to eat the bugs and live in the pod than face the evil [insert the latest foil] tanks?
At some point what I think was lost was humanity. Oh yes it’s used in images to move us, to nudge us who are not narcissists and psychopaths, but are things in our nations about blessing us, our families, our communities? They have us all looking out at foreign events, and policy, but what about domestically. Are our schools good? Are our borders safe? Do our children have a good future? They use fake virtue. They are have compassion for those who are not in front of them. Everyone but us who live under them. You see how that works?
Pragmatism took over for first-principles, and they make us look at everything except them. They make us feel like we have control over some things, but never them, somehow, none of the ones who do all the bad policy, or who are corrupt face the consequences.
Joe Biden and Zelenskyy are arguably two of the most corrupt men in political office today, and yet, no one can or will hold them accountable. No, there are apparently pragmatic reasons not to…. Really? Is there no real justice in the world, or are there more important things. Things that are too big to fail that mean these chess pieces need to stay put for now.
I would personally say that this is true if there is no God. If there is no God, or if he is not righteous, then yes, no problem. Pragmatism works just fine.
Was there ever a more predictable opinion from a more predictable writer?
I knew you were going to say that
I knew you were going to say that
Was there ever a more predictable opinion from a more predictable writer?
The Hidden Hand of World Capital!
Hunter Biden–unmasked!
Can’t people like Fazi come up with anything new? This supposedly predatory system has been around for some 200 years, and everything else seems to work far worse, as in Yanukovich’s Ukraine.
So, Thomas, just take a seat beside Noam, and wait for Godot.
The Hidden Hand of World Capital!
Hunter Biden–unmasked!
Can’t people like Fazi come up with anything new? This supposedly predatory system has been around for some 200 years, and everything else seems to work far worse, as in Yanukovich’s Ukraine.
So, Thomas, just take a seat beside Noam, and wait for Godot.
If all that helps keep Putin out, what’s the problem?
FY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
FY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If all that helps keep Putin out, what’s the problem?
Best wishes to those wishing to do business in country 404. Your pockets may actually just disappear.
Best wishes to those wishing to do business in country 404. Your pockets may actually just disappear.
I seem to have found this essay less objectionable than some other readers.
In the grand scheme of things then – assuming the war ends with a deal between Ukraine and Russia – Ukraine will become most important as an alternative model for Russia. It may have a comparable effect to that of West Germany on East Germany during the Cold War. This suggests that it makes some sense to moderate the more ruthless and alienating aspects of Capitalism in favour of a more emollient and user friendly approach – just as during the early stages of the Cold War American capitalists thought it prudent to support Social Democrats in Western Europe.
It is also worth remembering that the shock therapy of the 1990s had a disastrous effect on some ex communist economies and, in particular, on that of Russia. This may encourage a little humility for those pushing neo-liberal reform today,
Containing Russian military aggression will be an important victory in this new Cold War but the ultimate prize will be the “conversion” of Russia and, eventually, China. Amiable pragmatism not ideological dogmatism will improve the odds.
“the shock therapy of the 1990s had a disastrous effect on some ex communist economies”
Perhaps, but it’s clear that their economic catastrophe was decades in the making. What we witnessed in the 1990s was the inevitable collapse. It’ll be the same whenever North Korea collapses.
“the shock therapy of the 1990s had a disastrous effect on some ex communist economies”
Perhaps, but it’s clear that their economic catastrophe was decades in the making. What we witnessed in the 1990s was the inevitable collapse. It’ll be the same whenever North Korea collapses.
I seem to have found this essay less objectionable than some other readers.
In the grand scheme of things then – assuming the war ends with a deal between Ukraine and Russia – Ukraine will become most important as an alternative model for Russia. It may have a comparable effect to that of West Germany on East Germany during the Cold War. This suggests that it makes some sense to moderate the more ruthless and alienating aspects of Capitalism in favour of a more emollient and user friendly approach – just as during the early stages of the Cold War American capitalists thought it prudent to support Social Democrats in Western Europe.
It is also worth remembering that the shock therapy of the 1990s had a disastrous effect on some ex communist economies and, in particular, on that of Russia. This may encourage a little humility for those pushing neo-liberal reform today,
Containing Russian military aggression will be an important victory in this new Cold War but the ultimate prize will be the “conversion” of Russia and, eventually, China. Amiable pragmatism not ideological dogmatism will improve the odds.
By the time Ukraine’s natural resourses have been appropriated by China, the US and others, the country is in hock for hundreds of billions in loans, with foreign financiers dictating economic policy, and the EU displaces national sovereignty and democratic representation and controls vast swathes of policy areas, Ukrainians may well wish they had just thrown their lot in with Russia,
They didn’t have to join Russia, the other option was to be neutral, they could have been like Switzerland, would that have been so bad
They tried enough with Russia.. Where did it get them? Maybe have a look at how Yanukovich ran the country, at his golden toilet bowl estate? Or how Donbass has been looted by Russian elites during these 8 years? Jesus wept at the Westerner naivety towards Russia.. There is a reason Eastern Europeans view the exploitation of the West as a much smaller evil — at the very least they are not trying to kill the local culture and identity.
Will the banks do to Ukraine what they did, and are still doing to Greece?
They didn’t have to join Russia, the other option was to be neutral, they could have been like Switzerland, would that have been so bad
They tried enough with Russia.. Where did it get them? Maybe have a look at how Yanukovich ran the country, at his golden toilet bowl estate? Or how Donbass has been looted by Russian elites during these 8 years? Jesus wept at the Westerner naivety towards Russia.. There is a reason Eastern Europeans view the exploitation of the West as a much smaller evil — at the very least they are not trying to kill the local culture and identity.
Will the banks do to Ukraine what they did, and are still doing to Greece?
By the time Ukraine’s natural resourses have been appropriated by China, the US and others, the country is in hock for hundreds of billions in loans, with foreign financiers dictating economic policy, and the EU displaces national sovereignty and democratic representation and controls vast swathes of policy areas, Ukrainians may well wish they had just thrown their lot in with Russia,