Hopefully he “accidentally” falls out of a 5th story window as many other prominent Russians who upset Putin seem to do
Billy Bob
10 months ago
Hopefully he “accidentally” falls out of a 5th story window as many other prominent Russians who upset Putin seem to do
Simon Neale
10 months ago
A 60-something ranting warlord is a pretty tough act to carry off. He seemed to be modelling himself on Bruce Willis, whose retirement should give Prigozhin pause for thought.
Simon Neale
10 months ago
A 60-something ranting warlord is a pretty tough act to carry off. He seemed to be modelling himself on Bruce Willis, whose retirement should give Prigozhin pause for thought.
Reginald Duquesnoy
10 months ago
Valiant effort to Garner some support for flopping book.
Valiant effort to Garner some support for flopping book.
Paul Hemphill
10 months ago
Sometimes UnHerd commenters come up with some strange, rabbit hole stuff. They’re not alone. I have very knowledgeable and ostensibly wise friends who went down that hole during Covid are only just resurfacing. Many are still stuck in the time warp of the anti-Americanism they adopted in their ‘sixties and ‘seventies salad days. Some even suggested that Ukraine was bombing its own people to garner western support and sympathy. They’re convinced still that Russia is actually “winning” this wasteful, brutal war – whatever “winning” actually means. Subjugation? Denazification? Colonization? Russification? As Buffy Summers said, “those who fail history are doomed to repeat it in summer school”.
“Many are still stuck in the time warp of the anti-Americanism they adopted in their ‘sixties and ‘seventies salad days.” Actually, Paul, I think it might all be very different than you imagine. The people you think of as senior Baby Boomers are mostly under 40. For me, as a junior BB, I was all pro-American when so many not bright senior Marxist BB’s were reflexively anti-American. Yet as it turns out, my views have not remained intact. Still love all my American friends and family. Just don’t have much respect for the new (since 1990) American international relations class, not for Trumpist or Marxist reasons, but because American FP has managed to achieve such negative outcomes, and because it is no respecter – a real understatement – of the individual it pretends to champion.
“Many are still stuck in the time warp of the anti-Americanism they adopted in their ‘sixties and ‘seventies salad days.” Actually, Paul, I think it might all be very different than you imagine. The people you think of as senior Baby Boomers are mostly under 40. For me, as a junior BB, I was all pro-American when so many not bright senior Marxist BB’s were reflexively anti-American. Yet as it turns out, my views have not remained intact. Still love all my American friends and family. Just don’t have much respect for the new (since 1990) American international relations class, not for Trumpist or Marxist reasons, but because American FP has managed to achieve such negative outcomes, and because it is no respecter – a real understatement – of the individual it pretends to champion.
Paul Hemphill
10 months ago
Sometimes UnHerd commenters come up with some strange, rabbit hole stuff. They’re not alone. I have very knowledgeable and ostensibly wise friends who went down that hole during Covid are only just resurfacing. Many are still stuck in the time warp of the anti-Americanism they adopted in their ‘sixties and ‘seventies salad days. Some even suggested that Ukraine was bombing its own people to garner western support and sympathy. They’re convinced still that Russia is actually “winning” this wasteful, brutal war – whatever “winning” actually means. Subjugation? Denazification? Colonization? Russification? As Buffy Summers said, “those who fail history are doomed to repeat it in summer school”.
martin logan
10 months ago
Looks like Prigozhin has a bit more gas in the tank.
This is beginning to look like 1917 all over again, complete with General Kornilov’s march on St Petersburg.
(It failed, but set the stage for the revolution)
martin logan
10 months ago
Looks like Prigozhin has a bit more gas in the tank.
This is beginning to look like 1917 all over again, complete with General Kornilov’s march on St Petersburg.
(It failed, but set the stage for the revolution)
Andrew Boughton
10 months ago
“Many wonder whether Wagner’s leader might attempt to seize control of the military leadership or even launch a coup.” Well, that was rather prescient, wasn’t it?
Emmanuel MARTIN
10 months ago
Prigozhin is a part of Russian oligarchy. He brought Russia a moderately important (but not decisive) tactical victory, by using the clever tactic of recruiting convicts in order to have a fresh crop of motivated and expandable troops for high risk infantry combat.
Russian prisons are now empty (of acceptable recruits), and the trick was a one off. Prigozhin is back to being a high ranking Russia leader, but not in first circle anymore.
Emmanuel MARTIN
10 months ago
Prigozhin is a part of Russian oligarchy. He brought Russia a moderately important (but not decisive) tactical victory, by using the clever tactic of recruiting convicts in order to have a fresh crop of motivated and expandable troops for high risk infantry combat.
Russian prisons are now empty (of acceptable recruits), and the trick was a one off. Prigozhin is back to being a high ranking Russia leader, but not in first circle anymore.
Samir Iker
10 months ago
It’s interesting though, that so many Russian reporters and sources on Telegraph are happy to openly criticise Russian strategy.
Putin invited some of those bloggers to his office, apparently, for an open and frank discussion. None of them seem to have fallen out of a window so far.
Still, Russia is far more ideal in terms of press freedom, goes without saying. However, it is fairly bonkers, that the supposedly “free” western world is much more closed and aligned to the “official” view. Not just the media, which is now collectively a Pravda equivalent, but if you go to “Russia war” links on random blogs, websites etc, there is one and only one viewpoint.
Usually, one key theme is Russia evil and trying to invade Germany, but also Russia incompetent buffoons who have nothing left but shovels against a soon to be victorious Ukrainian army.
Ok Samir, a challenge: I’ll parade around Parliament Square, with a simple ‘Stop the War sign’ – you do the same in Red square, let’s see what happens.
Ok Samir, a challenge: I’ll parade around Parliament Square, with a simple ‘Stop the War sign’ – you do the same in Red square, let’s see what happens.
Samir Iker
10 months ago
It’s interesting though, that so many Russian reporters and sources on Telegraph are happy to openly criticise Russian strategy.
Putin invited some of those bloggers to his office, apparently, for an open and frank discussion. None of them seem to have fallen out of a window so far.
Still, Russia is far more ideal in terms of press freedom, goes without saying. However, it is fairly bonkers, that the supposedly “free” western world is much more closed and aligned to the “official” view. Not just the media, which is now collectively a Pravda equivalent, but if you go to “Russia war” links on random blogs, websites etc, there is one and only one viewpoint.
Usually, one key theme is Russia evil and trying to invade Germany, but also Russia incompetent buffoons who have nothing left but shovels against a soon to be victorious Ukrainian army.
Last edited 10 months ago by Samir Iker
Emil Castelli
10 months ago
I did not bother to finish the article – because the writer misses the whole point of everything….
Wagner is not needed now. Sure it will be handy for weird stuff – but this is a very, very, different world from a year ago, Wagner, and so Prigozhin, are obsolete.
Biden and Boris created a Brand New Professional Land Army, likely the best in the world. One armed with the most and best, one with training, discipline, spirit, and backed by the world’s leading military industry; out producing all the rest of the world in war material ….
Biden and Boris created this new Russian, Professional, Army. They called it into existence. They funded it by massively driving up the profit of Russian Resources with the Sanctions. They gave it a Nationalist Pride by showing the total Paper Tigers Biden and Boris are, and the hypocrisy of this endeavor, as the Neo-Cons worked and spent since 2008 to create this proxy war – and then lose it when they finally get it.
Biden, Boris, Prigozhin – all spent old warhorses who’s tine for the glue factory is approaching ….. The winners and losers of this engineered disaster are not those expected.
More rambling nonsense from yourself that uses lots of buzzwords but fails to actually make a point.
I’d argue that as signatories to the Budapest Memorandum the US and UK are morally doing the right thing by arming Ukraine and giving it the means to defend its territory, seeing as they agreed to respect its sovereignty and borders (along with Russia who have ignored it) in return for giving up its nuclear arsenal. Why do you believe those two countries especially should simply throw Ukraine to the wolves and let Russia turn it into a colony?
Surely the point is that Russia could not allow a hostile US colony on its border, particularly one in which a democratically elected friendly President was replaced in a CIA coup.
Think Cuba 1962 for an apt comparison. Regrettably the West had Neocons in charge, not real diplomats who had experienced WW2 and understood the very real risks.
If you believe that Ukraine would allow itself to become a “US colony” you really have no understanding of Ukrainian history. The country wishes merely to be free of foreign, i.e., Russian, domination. There is no comparison with the 1962 situation in the Caribbean. The US never denied Cuba’s right to exist as an independent nation; it merely objected to it’s foreign policy alignment.
Er, Cuba is still Communist, I believe, and aligned with Putin.They got their oil from him until recently.
So you’re really saying that it was OK for Ukraine to join the EU–originally their only goal until 24 Feb 2022.
And, since nuclaear weapons aren’t positioned in most NATO countries, you’re also saying Putin’s rationale for the invasion was bogus.
Thanks for proving Zelensky’s and Biden’s points!
Own goals don’t happen just in football…
If you believe that Ukraine would allow itself to become a “US colony” you really have no understanding of Ukrainian history. The country wishes merely to be free of foreign, i.e., Russian, domination. There is no comparison with the 1962 situation in the Caribbean. The US never denied Cuba’s right to exist as an independent nation; it merely objected to it’s foreign policy alignment.
Er, Cuba is still Communist, I believe, and aligned with Putin.They got their oil from him until recently.
So you’re really saying that it was OK for Ukraine to join the EU–originally their only goal until 24 Feb 2022.
And, since nuclaear weapons aren’t positioned in most NATO countries, you’re also saying Putin’s rationale for the invasion was bogus.
Thanks for proving Zelensky’s and Biden’s points!
Own goals don’t happen just in football…
Surely the point is that Russia could not allow a hostile US colony on its border, particularly one in which a democratically elected friendly President was replaced in a CIA coup.
Think Cuba 1962 for an apt comparison. Regrettably the West had Neocons in charge, not real diplomats who had experienced WW2 and understood the very real risks.
More rambling nonsense from yourself that uses lots of buzzwords but fails to actually make a point.
I’d argue that as signatories to the Budapest Memorandum the US and UK are morally doing the right thing by arming Ukraine and giving it the means to defend its territory, seeing as they agreed to respect its sovereignty and borders (along with Russia who have ignored it) in return for giving up its nuclear arsenal. Why do you believe those two countries especially should simply throw Ukraine to the wolves and let Russia turn it into a colony?
I did not bother to finish the article – because the writer misses the whole point of everything….
Wagner is not needed now. Sure it will be handy for weird stuff – but this is a very, very, different world from a year ago, Wagner, and so Prigozhin, are obsolete.
Biden and Boris created a Brand New Professional Land Army, likely the best in the world. One armed with the most and best, one with training, discipline, spirit, and backed by the world’s leading military industry; out producing all the rest of the world in war material ….
Biden and Boris created this new Russian, Professional, Army. They called it into existence. They funded it by massively driving up the profit of Russian Resources with the Sanctions. They gave it a Nationalist Pride by showing the total Paper Tigers Biden and Boris are, and the hypocrisy of this endeavor, as the Neo-Cons worked and spent since 2008 to create this proxy war – and then lose it when they finally get it.
Biden, Boris, Prigozhin – all spent old warhorses who’s tine for the glue factory is approaching ….. The winners and losers of this engineered disaster are not those expected.
Hopefully he “accidentally” falls out of a 5th story window as many other prominent Russians who upset Putin seem to do
Hopefully he “accidentally” falls out of a 5th story window as many other prominent Russians who upset Putin seem to do
A 60-something ranting warlord is a pretty tough act to carry off. He seemed to be modelling himself on Bruce Willis, whose retirement should give Prigozhin pause for thought.
A 60-something ranting warlord is a pretty tough act to carry off. He seemed to be modelling himself on Bruce Willis, whose retirement should give Prigozhin pause for thought.
Valiant effort to Garner some support for flopping book.
Too true. Terrible article
Too true. Terrible article
Valiant effort to Garner some support for flopping book.
Sometimes UnHerd commenters come up with some strange, rabbit hole stuff. They’re not alone. I have very knowledgeable and ostensibly wise friends who went down that hole during Covid are only just resurfacing. Many are still stuck in the time warp of the anti-Americanism they adopted in their ‘sixties and ‘seventies salad days. Some even suggested that Ukraine was bombing its own people to garner western support and sympathy. They’re convinced still that Russia is actually “winning” this wasteful, brutal war – whatever “winning” actually means. Subjugation? Denazification? Colonization? Russification? As Buffy Summers said, “those who fail history are doomed to repeat it in summer school”.
“Many are still stuck in the time warp of the anti-Americanism they adopted in their ‘sixties and ‘seventies salad days.” Actually, Paul, I think it might all be very different than you imagine. The people you think of as senior Baby Boomers are mostly under 40. For me, as a junior BB, I was all pro-American when so many not bright senior Marxist BB’s were reflexively anti-American. Yet as it turns out, my views have not remained intact. Still love all my American friends and family. Just don’t have much respect for the new (since 1990) American international relations class, not for Trumpist or Marxist reasons, but because American FP has managed to achieve such negative outcomes, and because it is no respecter – a real understatement – of the individual it pretends to champion.
“Many are still stuck in the time warp of the anti-Americanism they adopted in their ‘sixties and ‘seventies salad days.” Actually, Paul, I think it might all be very different than you imagine. The people you think of as senior Baby Boomers are mostly under 40. For me, as a junior BB, I was all pro-American when so many not bright senior Marxist BB’s were reflexively anti-American. Yet as it turns out, my views have not remained intact. Still love all my American friends and family. Just don’t have much respect for the new (since 1990) American international relations class, not for Trumpist or Marxist reasons, but because American FP has managed to achieve such negative outcomes, and because it is no respecter – a real understatement – of the individual it pretends to champion.
Sometimes UnHerd commenters come up with some strange, rabbit hole stuff. They’re not alone. I have very knowledgeable and ostensibly wise friends who went down that hole during Covid are only just resurfacing. Many are still stuck in the time warp of the anti-Americanism they adopted in their ‘sixties and ‘seventies salad days. Some even suggested that Ukraine was bombing its own people to garner western support and sympathy. They’re convinced still that Russia is actually “winning” this wasteful, brutal war – whatever “winning” actually means. Subjugation? Denazification? Colonization? Russification? As Buffy Summers said, “those who fail history are doomed to repeat it in summer school”.
Looks like Prigozhin has a bit more gas in the tank.
This is beginning to look like 1917 all over again, complete with General Kornilov’s march on St Petersburg.
(It failed, but set the stage for the revolution)
Looks like Prigozhin has a bit more gas in the tank.
This is beginning to look like 1917 all over again, complete with General Kornilov’s march on St Petersburg.
(It failed, but set the stage for the revolution)
“Many wonder whether Wagner’s leader might attempt to seize control of the military leadership or even launch a coup.” Well, that was rather prescient, wasn’t it?
Prigozhin is a part of Russian oligarchy. He brought Russia a moderately important (but not decisive) tactical victory, by using the clever tactic of recruiting convicts in order to have a fresh crop of motivated and expandable troops for high risk infantry combat.
Russian prisons are now empty (of acceptable recruits), and the trick was a one off. Prigozhin is back to being a high ranking Russia leader, but not in first circle anymore.
Prigozhin is a part of Russian oligarchy. He brought Russia a moderately important (but not decisive) tactical victory, by using the clever tactic of recruiting convicts in order to have a fresh crop of motivated and expandable troops for high risk infantry combat.
Russian prisons are now empty (of acceptable recruits), and the trick was a one off. Prigozhin is back to being a high ranking Russia leader, but not in first circle anymore.
It’s interesting though, that so many Russian reporters and sources on Telegraph are happy to openly criticise Russian strategy.
Putin invited some of those bloggers to his office, apparently, for an open and frank discussion. None of them seem to have fallen out of a window so far.
Still, Russia is far more ideal in terms of press freedom, goes without saying. However, it is fairly bonkers, that the supposedly “free” western world is much more closed and aligned to the “official” view. Not just the media, which is now collectively a Pravda equivalent, but if you go to “Russia war” links on random blogs, websites etc, there is one and only one viewpoint.
Usually, one key theme is Russia evil and trying to invade Germany, but also Russia incompetent buffoons who have nothing left but shovels against a soon to be victorious Ukrainian army.
Ok Samir, a challenge: I’ll parade around Parliament Square, with a simple ‘Stop the War sign’ – you do the same in Red square, let’s see what happens.
Easy.
Those in power in Russia fear someone waving a sign could be a threat.
Those in power in the West have nothing to fear from you waving a sign.
Easy. but you didn’t answer the question. What actually happens to you, and to me, in the hours, days, months after the sign holding?
Easy. but you didn’t answer the question. What actually happens to you, and to me, in the hours, days, months after the sign holding?
Easy.
Those in power in Russia fear someone waving a sign could be a threat.
Those in power in the West have nothing to fear from you waving a sign.
Ok Samir, a challenge: I’ll parade around Parliament Square, with a simple ‘Stop the War sign’ – you do the same in Red square, let’s see what happens.
It’s interesting though, that so many Russian reporters and sources on Telegraph are happy to openly criticise Russian strategy.
Putin invited some of those bloggers to his office, apparently, for an open and frank discussion. None of them seem to have fallen out of a window so far.
Still, Russia is far more ideal in terms of press freedom, goes without saying. However, it is fairly bonkers, that the supposedly “free” western world is much more closed and aligned to the “official” view. Not just the media, which is now collectively a Pravda equivalent, but if you go to “Russia war” links on random blogs, websites etc, there is one and only one viewpoint.
Usually, one key theme is Russia evil and trying to invade Germany, but also Russia incompetent buffoons who have nothing left but shovels against a soon to be victorious Ukrainian army.
I did not bother to finish the article – because the writer misses the whole point of everything….
Wagner is not needed now. Sure it will be handy for weird stuff – but this is a very, very, different world from a year ago, Wagner, and so Prigozhin, are obsolete.
Biden and Boris created a Brand New Professional Land Army, likely the best in the world. One armed with the most and best, one with training, discipline, spirit, and backed by the world’s leading military industry; out producing all the rest of the world in war material ….
Biden and Boris created this new Russian, Professional, Army. They called it into existence. They funded it by massively driving up the profit of Russian Resources with the Sanctions. They gave it a Nationalist Pride by showing the total Paper Tigers Biden and Boris are, and the hypocrisy of this endeavor, as the Neo-Cons worked and spent since 2008 to create this proxy war – and then lose it when they finally get it.
Biden, Boris, Prigozhin – all spent old warhorses who’s tine for the glue factory is approaching ….. The winners and losers of this engineered disaster are not those expected.
More rambling nonsense from yourself that uses lots of buzzwords but fails to actually make a point.
I’d argue that as signatories to the Budapest Memorandum the US and UK are morally doing the right thing by arming Ukraine and giving it the means to defend its territory, seeing as they agreed to respect its sovereignty and borders (along with Russia who have ignored it) in return for giving up its nuclear arsenal. Why do you believe those two countries especially should simply throw Ukraine to the wolves and let Russia turn it into a colony?
Surely the point is that Russia could not allow a hostile US colony on its border, particularly one in which a democratically elected friendly President was replaced in a CIA coup.
Think Cuba 1962 for an apt comparison. Regrettably the West had Neocons in charge, not real diplomats who had experienced WW2 and understood the very real risks.
If you believe that Ukraine would allow itself to become a “US colony” you really have no understanding of Ukrainian history. The country wishes merely to be free of foreign, i.e., Russian, domination. There is no comparison with the 1962 situation in the Caribbean. The US never denied Cuba’s right to exist as an independent nation; it merely objected to it’s foreign policy alignment.
Er, Cuba is still Communist, I believe, and aligned with Putin.They got their oil from him until recently.
So you’re really saying that it was OK for Ukraine to join the EU–originally their only goal until 24 Feb 2022.
And, since nuclaear weapons aren’t positioned in most NATO countries, you’re also saying Putin’s rationale for the invasion was bogus.
Thanks for proving Zelensky’s and Biden’s points!
Own goals don’t happen just in football…
If you believe that Ukraine would allow itself to become a “US colony” you really have no understanding of Ukrainian history. The country wishes merely to be free of foreign, i.e., Russian, domination. There is no comparison with the 1962 situation in the Caribbean. The US never denied Cuba’s right to exist as an independent nation; it merely objected to it’s foreign policy alignment.
Er, Cuba is still Communist, I believe, and aligned with Putin.They got their oil from him until recently.
So you’re really saying that it was OK for Ukraine to join the EU–originally their only goal until 24 Feb 2022.
And, since nuclaear weapons aren’t positioned in most NATO countries, you’re also saying Putin’s rationale for the invasion was bogus.
Thanks for proving Zelensky’s and Biden’s points!
Own goals don’t happen just in football…
Surely the point is that Russia could not allow a hostile US colony on its border, particularly one in which a democratically elected friendly President was replaced in a CIA coup.
Think Cuba 1962 for an apt comparison. Regrettably the West had Neocons in charge, not real diplomats who had experienced WW2 and understood the very real risks.
really weird
Best in the world? That’s a quick turnaround.
More rambling nonsense from yourself that uses lots of buzzwords but fails to actually make a point.
I’d argue that as signatories to the Budapest Memorandum the US and UK are morally doing the right thing by arming Ukraine and giving it the means to defend its territory, seeing as they agreed to respect its sovereignty and borders (along with Russia who have ignored it) in return for giving up its nuclear arsenal. Why do you believe those two countries especially should simply throw Ukraine to the wolves and let Russia turn it into a colony?
really weird
Best in the world? That’s a quick turnaround.
I did not bother to finish the article – because the writer misses the whole point of everything….
Wagner is not needed now. Sure it will be handy for weird stuff – but this is a very, very, different world from a year ago, Wagner, and so Prigozhin, are obsolete.
Biden and Boris created a Brand New Professional Land Army, likely the best in the world. One armed with the most and best, one with training, discipline, spirit, and backed by the world’s leading military industry; out producing all the rest of the world in war material ….
Biden and Boris created this new Russian, Professional, Army. They called it into existence. They funded it by massively driving up the profit of Russian Resources with the Sanctions. They gave it a Nationalist Pride by showing the total Paper Tigers Biden and Boris are, and the hypocrisy of this endeavor, as the Neo-Cons worked and spent since 2008 to create this proxy war – and then lose it when they finally get it.
Biden, Boris, Prigozhin – all spent old warhorses who’s tine for the glue factory is approaching ….. The winners and losers of this engineered disaster are not those expected.