Maybe the Vatican will re-locate to Rotherham. They’d be safe from prosecution there.
Ri Bradach
1 year ago
As a Catholic, I have not attended mass in over 20 years. This is why. My anger at being deprived of access to the teachers of my faith by their own moral ill means nothing to them. They will continue to abuse any and all trust that is given to them.
Frankly, I wish that the whole leadership of the Catholic Church would be imprisoned and asked to prove their innocence of trust and or child abuse – a different standard of care applies to priests. Burn the Vatican to the ground and start again.
Thank you Ri – it’s very refreshing for a Catholic to state that “priests should be held to a different standard”.
Anyone who can wield the threat of “eternal damnation” over others has to be judged far more harshly when they abuse their position of trust (and their flock)
Last edited 1 year ago by Ian Barton
si mclardy
1 year ago
This feels like old news. I remember cardinal Bernard Law covering up the wrong doings of priest like Geoghan, and when court ordered to appear in court he was given a position in the Vatican so he would not have to be cross examined. The Pope and the Vatican protected him until he died in 2017. Wikipedia leaves out the role of the Vatican for some reason, but I have always held them in contempt as long as they are willing to hide and protect pedophiles. The Boston sex scandal is old news because it was never about Boston but a sickness throughout the Roman catholic church that has been popping up all over the world with very little consequences.
It is old news – but needs to be aired continually – when “good people do nothing” i.e lose interest – then it’s “hell in a handcart” for all of us.
Just ask the children of Rotherham.
I blame the state-funded media e.g. the BBC for stopping reporting on ongoing issues – just because many people are losing interest.
If a state-funded broadcaster behaves like that – it needs to be shut down.
The church attracts abusers because the abusers know they’ll be protected.
Once you grasp that, the rest is easy.
Fred Paul
1 year ago
Am I reading this right? The First Nations wanted an apology from the pope (small p unless used with a name), and sure enough, they got it. Did the demand set conditions? No. Remember that, no conditions. The news media was the one organization that got away scot-free and bore the most responsibility outside of the government. Where were they when this was going on? Had they no idea what was going on? Hardly. Were they afraid to report the truth? Certainly. Who pressured them to keep it quiet? Does it matter? They kept it quiet to save their own skins, and now they are reporting and providing editorials as if they are the saviours of this mess.
IN TRUTH, THEY HELPED CREATE THIS MESS BECAUSE THEY WERE SCARED AND DIDN’T REPORT IT. THEY LET US DOWN.
Helen Moorhouse
1 year ago
This is a clear and useful report but I’m baffled that Damian Thompson has submitted it on Unherd instead of in his Holy Smoke section of The Spectator’s Coffee House. Was it to get to a wider/smaller audience? Or was The Spectator unwilling to publish it? I’m interested.
Ah, I hadn’t realised it was he. Thanks for pointing it out.
(It is the second time today that I write this comment. I wish we were given all the info in the articles themselves.)
Anyway, Damian does NOT like Francis, does he.
Last edited 1 year ago by Arkadian X
Andrew D
1 year ago
Expletive deleted
Last edited 1 year ago by Andrew D
Andrew Stoll
1 year ago
The pope might as well apologise for being human.
It shouldn’t be his role to attempt the impossible by appeasing the haters of the church.
It is a show trial of Soviet proportions that has been happening to the church.
Guilty as charged, always – any defence is further proof of guilt.
Every institution the size and age of the catholic church had it’s share of rotten apples.
No excuses for serious crimes but fair is fair and on balance with best intentions, none of us are so pure as to not have any faults!
No, I’m not a catholic, I’m not even religious but I respect the catholic church, her dedicated srevants, history – warts and all, more than many of their holier than thou modern day haters and accusers.
“It shouldn’t be his role to attempt the impossible by appeasing the haters of the church”
Ah, so those who think the head of an organisation who goes out of his way to protect paedophiles with complete and utter disregard for their victims are “haters”.
I see. In fact, i see the Holy See for what it is, aided and abetted by its apologists,.
Citing “they’re only human” is disgraceful. Aren’t we all? Aren’t their victims, who they dehumanised?
They’ve got away with it for so long through exercising a form of thought control. Once anyone believes that the bread and wine are the actual body and blood of someone who existed two millenia ago, they’re susceptible to any kind of manipulation.
I’m fully aware of what it is to be human, flaws and all. Nor do i seek to be ‘holier than thou’. I reject those points you make. Can you reject the suffering and lifelong humiliation of the church-protected victims?
Critizise anybody but do it for the right reasons and be careful about what you believe and what is prejudice or propaganda before passing judgement.
I’m thinking of the fiasko and miscarriage of justice regarding Cardinal George Pell. So obviously a case of false accusations of paedophelia, all the way through his secretive trial. Luckily it ended with an overturned verdict but the chances of a fair trial didn’t look good for him in Catholic hating Australia. That really made me think! And politics in Canada today are similarly skewed and untrustworthy!
Of course bad things really did happen as well and some clergy protected each other. But.. that’s part of life
I don’t give downvotes easily – thank you for your thoughts!
I don’t easily “believe” anything, and i certainly don’t need a reminder of how to go about forming a balanced view.
You’ve signally failed to address the issue that this article is about – the hypocrisy of Pope Francis in protecting someone at the expense of the victims of their criminal activity. Instead, you’re trying to use deflection by pointing to a different outcome concerning “Catholic hating Australia” (that “hating” trope again, it’s a dead giveaway for a particular mindset).
You’re very welcome to my thoughts. I’m prepared to challenge anyone who seeks to excuse authoritarian criminals against young victims through manipulation of the religious beliefs of their families, or of state orphanages, which places the victims in danger and allows those with certain proclivities to take advantage. I’ve equally no doubt that many of the priests involved took the cloth precisely because it allowed them such access. Make of that what you will, but i call it the epitome of evil.
Steve Murray
1 year ago
A more appropriate headline for this article would be “The hypocrisy of the entire Catholic Church”. That such an evil person should be elected as its head tells you all you need to know. Corrupt from top to bottom, and unsurprisingly so, given the ludicrous nature of the doctrine they peddle. I still find it difficult to get my head around why so many otherwise intelligent people fall for it.
CHARLES STANHOPE
1 year ago
Considering that the Vatican was an ‘invention’ of that renowned Fascist Benito Mussolini,(1929) perhaps it is time for it to be ‘Dissolved’ or at least stripped of its ludicrous Sovereign status?
It is an anachronism unworthy of the twenty first century.
Rather inaccurate history. The Papal States was an independent principality on the Italian peninsula until it was invaded by the newly created Kingdom of Italy in 1870, although they stopped short of invading the area within the Leonine Walls. A proposal was put forward at that point to create an independent principality for the Pope roughly twice the size of the present Vatican state encompassing the area within the Leonine Walls. This was rejected by successive Pope’s until the standoff was ended by the Lateran Pacts in 1929. Nothing to do with Mussolini creating the Vatican. The Popes had had possessed large chunks of Italy as Princes for many centuries before.
Mussolini was the Prime Minister of Italy in 1929, when this ludicrous comprises was agreed on.
Prior to that various Popes had been bleating since 1870 that they were “prisoners of the Vatican”, a precedent set by the male hysteric otherwise known as Pius IX.
The fact that the Papal States had existed in one form or another since the 8th century is irrelevant.
Is the Pope Catholic used to be a rhetorical question, now it’s an actual question.
Is anyone in the Vatican or is it the centre of evil?
Yes, he is a Catholic, a fully consistent one, hence his actions.
Do bears still……?
Maybe the Vatican will re-locate to Rotherham. They’d be safe from prosecution there.
As a Catholic, I have not attended mass in over 20 years. This is why. My anger at being deprived of access to the teachers of my faith by their own moral ill means nothing to them. They will continue to abuse any and all trust that is given to them.
Frankly, I wish that the whole leadership of the Catholic Church would be imprisoned and asked to prove their innocence of trust and or child abuse – a different standard of care applies to priests. Burn the Vatican to the ground and start again.
Thank you Ri – it’s very refreshing for a Catholic to state that “priests should be held to a different standard”.
Anyone who can wield the threat of “eternal damnation” over others has to be judged far more harshly when they abuse their position of trust (and their flock)
This feels like old news. I remember cardinal Bernard Law covering up the wrong doings of priest like Geoghan, and when court ordered to appear in court he was given a position in the Vatican so he would not have to be cross examined. The Pope and the Vatican protected him until he died in 2017. Wikipedia leaves out the role of the Vatican for some reason, but I have always held them in contempt as long as they are willing to hide and protect pedophiles. The Boston sex scandal is old news because it was never about Boston but a sickness throughout the Roman catholic church that has been popping up all over the world with very little consequences.
It is old news – but needs to be aired continually – when “good people do nothing” i.e lose interest – then it’s “hell in a handcart” for all of us.
Just ask the children of Rotherham.
I blame the state-funded media e.g. the BBC for stopping reporting on ongoing issues – just because many people are losing interest.
If a state-funded broadcaster behaves like that – it needs to be shut down.
The church attracts abusers because the abusers know they’ll be protected.
Once you grasp that, the rest is easy.
Am I reading this right? The First Nations wanted an apology from the pope (small p unless used with a name), and sure enough, they got it. Did the demand set conditions? No. Remember that, no conditions. The news media was the one organization that got away scot-free and bore the most responsibility outside of the government. Where were they when this was going on? Had they no idea what was going on? Hardly. Were they afraid to report the truth? Certainly. Who pressured them to keep it quiet? Does it matter? They kept it quiet to save their own skins, and now they are reporting and providing editorials as if they are the saviours of this mess.
IN TRUTH, THEY HELPED CREATE THIS MESS BECAUSE THEY WERE SCARED AND DIDN’T REPORT IT. THEY LET US DOWN.
This is a clear and useful report but I’m baffled that Damian Thompson has submitted it on Unherd instead of in his Holy Smoke section of The Spectator’s Coffee House. Was it to get to a wider/smaller audience? Or was The Spectator unwilling to publish it? I’m interested.
Ah, I hadn’t realised it was he. Thanks for pointing it out.
(It is the second time today that I write this comment. I wish we were given all the info in the articles themselves.)
Anyway, Damian does NOT like Francis, does he.
Expletive deleted
The pope might as well apologise for being human.
It shouldn’t be his role to attempt the impossible by appeasing the haters of the church.
It is a show trial of Soviet proportions that has been happening to the church.
Guilty as charged, always – any defence is further proof of guilt.
Every institution the size and age of the catholic church had it’s share of rotten apples.
No excuses for serious crimes but fair is fair and on balance with best intentions, none of us are so pure as to not have any faults!
No, I’m not a catholic, I’m not even religious but I respect the catholic church, her dedicated srevants, history – warts and all, more than many of their holier than thou modern day haters and accusers.
“It shouldn’t be his role to attempt the impossible by appeasing the haters of the church”
Ah, so those who think the head of an organisation who goes out of his way to protect paedophiles with complete and utter disregard for their victims are “haters”.
I see. In fact, i see the Holy See for what it is, aided and abetted by its apologists,.
Citing “they’re only human” is disgraceful. Aren’t we all? Aren’t their victims, who they dehumanised?
They’ve got away with it for so long through exercising a form of thought control. Once anyone believes that the bread and wine are the actual body and blood of someone who existed two millenia ago, they’re susceptible to any kind of manipulation.
I’m fully aware of what it is to be human, flaws and all. Nor do i seek to be ‘holier than thou’. I reject those points you make. Can you reject the suffering and lifelong humiliation of the church-protected victims?
If so, go ahead and downvote.
Critizise anybody but do it for the right reasons and be careful about what you believe and what is prejudice or propaganda before passing judgement.
I’m thinking of the fiasko and miscarriage of justice regarding Cardinal George Pell. So obviously a case of false accusations of paedophelia, all the way through his secretive trial. Luckily it ended with an overturned verdict but the chances of a fair trial didn’t look good for him in Catholic hating Australia. That really made me think! And politics in Canada today are similarly skewed and untrustworthy!
Of course bad things really did happen as well and some clergy protected each other. But.. that’s part of life
I don’t give downvotes easily – thank you for your thoughts!
I don’t easily “believe” anything, and i certainly don’t need a reminder of how to go about forming a balanced view.
You’ve signally failed to address the issue that this article is about – the hypocrisy of Pope Francis in protecting someone at the expense of the victims of their criminal activity. Instead, you’re trying to use deflection by pointing to a different outcome concerning “Catholic hating Australia” (that “hating” trope again, it’s a dead giveaway for a particular mindset).
You’re very welcome to my thoughts. I’m prepared to challenge anyone who seeks to excuse authoritarian criminals against young victims through manipulation of the religious beliefs of their families, or of state orphanages, which places the victims in danger and allows those with certain proclivities to take advantage. I’ve equally no doubt that many of the priests involved took the cloth precisely because it allowed them such access. Make of that what you will, but i call it the epitome of evil.
A more appropriate headline for this article would be “The hypocrisy of the entire Catholic Church”. That such an evil person should be elected as its head tells you all you need to know. Corrupt from top to bottom, and unsurprisingly so, given the ludicrous nature of the doctrine they peddle. I still find it difficult to get my head around why so many otherwise intelligent people fall for it.
Considering that the Vatican was an ‘invention’ of that renowned Fascist Benito Mussolini,(1929) perhaps it is time for it to be ‘Dissolved’ or at least stripped of its ludicrous Sovereign status?
It is an anachronism unworthy of the twenty first century.
Rather inaccurate history. The Papal States was an independent principality on the Italian peninsula until it was invaded by the newly created Kingdom of Italy in 1870, although they stopped short of invading the area within the Leonine Walls. A proposal was put forward at that point to create an independent principality for the Pope roughly twice the size of the present Vatican state encompassing the area within the Leonine Walls. This was rejected by successive Pope’s until the standoff was ended by the Lateran Pacts in 1929. Nothing to do with Mussolini creating the Vatican. The Popes had had possessed large chunks of Italy as Princes for many centuries before.
Mussolini was the Prime Minister of Italy in 1929, when this ludicrous comprises was agreed on.
Prior to that various Popes had been bleating since 1870 that they were “prisoners of the Vatican”, a precedent set by the male hysteric otherwise known as Pius IX.
The fact that the Papal States had existed in one form or another since the 8th century is irrelevant.
Is the twenty-first century worth being worthy of?
Not yet.
Good one!
Here, here!