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Do women need dating coaches? Feminists have forgotten how to play hard to get

ÂŁ10,000 can buy you domestic bliss. Credit: GraphicaArtis/Getty Images

ÂŁ10,000 can buy you domestic bliss. Credit: GraphicaArtis/Getty Images


October 6, 2021   7 mins

There’s a formula to successful self-help: it has to sound simple enough to be accessible, but complex enough that you need to buy the book or pay for the classes. And the 1990s dating bible The Rules was successful: it sold 2 million copies in its heyday, and was translated into 27 languages.

Its tone was that of a short, sharp, necessary telling off for lovelorn American women: you may have lost your way, it said, but we can get you back on track. And the reason women had fallen from the path to true romance? Feminism. Feminism, which was supposedly telling women they didn’t need a man, even though many women very much wanted to make a life with one. Feminism, which had separated women from the old wisdom of the chase.

Was feminism really so strong at this time? The proposed Equal Rights Amendment to the US constitution had been dead for more than a decade at this point, so possibly not, but facts never tended to trouble the narrative. You might need to be assertive at the office, but when it came to romance, the book was clear: only by playing the passive, feminine role could women make the right match.

Authors Ellen Fein and Sherrie Schneider were uncompromising in their instructions. Their method worked, they said, but only if you followed every detail. That included: “don’t talk to a man first”, “don’t rush into sex”, “let him take the lead” and “don’t expect a man to change”. In the worldview of The Rules, all feminism’s successes had left women lonely. “We didn’t want to give up our liberation,” wrote Fein and Schneider, “but neither did we want to come home to empty apartments. Why couldn’t we have it all?”

Of course, when I say The Rules was successful, I mean that in the commercial sense. A cynic might point out that if self-help was successful in bringing out all the personal improvements it promised, its vendors would rapidly go out of business. And yet, the market is still going strong, with new purveyors rising up to solve the same old problems.

Today, feminism isn’t just failing to progress — with Roe vs Wade in danger of imminent collapse in the US, and sexual equality law in the UK threatened by the dissolution of the very concept of sex, it seems to be in retreat. And yet, it’s still getting the blame from a new generation of relationship gurus who want women to reclaim their “feminine energy”.

If you’re a straight woman who feels like you’re caught in a romance dead-end, never able to get a man to actually commit, the problem might just be you. This is the argument of “femininity coaches” Persia Lawson and Sami Wunder, who were both recently profiled in the Daily Mail. Women, they argue, are bringing the macho values of the workplace to the bedroom, and they’re paying for it with loneliness.

The first “macho” mistake a woman might make is to jump into bed with a man. Playing it casual, says Lawson, just means you get treated casually. If women want to be valued, they have to play hard to get: “In days gone by, when we understood the importance of femininity, men wooed women and, if they were successful in their pursuit, considered these girlfriends a great prize,” she told the Mail.

The second mistake is that, even if a woman does manage to get a man to stick around after she’s flopped into bed with him, she’s still liable to sabotage herself by acting like the boss of the couple. Women who are used to being in control at work feel like they need to be in control at home as well, and men are happy to sit back and allow it. Wunder calls this impulse “mothering”, and according to Lawson, it creates “all kinds of tensions and resentments” which ultimately doom the relationship.

Fortunately, and by a stunning coincidence, these gurus can not only tell you where you’re going wrong — they can also sell you the solution. That is, assuming you have deep pockets (and assuming feminine energy is compatible with having pockets). Both Lawson and Wunder command up to £10,000 for one-to-one “femininity coaching”. In this, clients can learn vital womanly lore like “leave the man to do the running”, “resist the urge to plan” and “listen instead of talk, and smile”.

There are clearly women out there who are eager to pay for this advice, according to the testimonials on Lawson and Wunder’s websites. But it’s not obvious that they’re getting anything new: all this, pretty much, can be found in The Rules. Both are the perfect self-help formula: simple, yet complex. Catch a man with this one trick: all you have to do is change everything about yourself. Because for all that “feminine energy” is supposedly innate, it seems to take an awful lot of effort to harness it.

The relentless self-command and artifice these systems require must be exhausting. But then, the essence of femininity is pretence. In A Vindication of the Rights of Woman, Mary Wollstonecraft wrote of how young women were deformed into artifice by a middle-class education:

“while enervated by confinement and false notions of modesty, the body is prevented from attaining that grace and beauty which relaxed half-formed limbs never exhibit
 and having no serious scientific study, if they have natural sagacity it is turned too soon on life and manners.”

Women, in other words, have always expended a great deal of energy on holding themselves back.

Almost two centuries later, we had the vote and the second wave was taking oppression to task at the social, sexual and economic levels; still, the definition of “woman” was something phoney and cultivated. In The Female Eunuch, Germaine Greer railed against all this:

“I’m sick of the masquerade. I’m sick of pretending eternal youth. I’m sick of belying my own intelligence, my own will, my own sex. I’m sick of peering at the world through false eyelashes, so everything I see is mixed with a shadow of bought hairs; I’m sick of weighting my head with a dead mane, unable to move my neck freely, terrified of rain, of wind, of dancing too vigorously in case I sweat into my lacquered curls. I’m sick of the Powder Room 
 I refuse to be a female impersonator. I am a woman, not a castrate.”

In 2021, the ways in which women are expected to impersonate femininity are as creative — and as punishing — as ever. The (horrifyingly dangerous) Brazilian butt lift, to craft outrageous curves of provocation. Lavish lip fillers, which turn female mouths into voluptuous doughnuts clearly meant for kissing and sucking rather than talking. And what can’t be changed on the body can be dealt with using photo editors. The epitome of femininity is a look that no unaltered female body could achieve.

The most depressing take on the modern crop of femininity coaches is that these are women simply doing what savvy members of their sex have done forever: finding a way to monetise sexism, rather than challenge it. From one perspective, it takes an almighty level of neck to make a business of telling other women to pretend to be something they’re not. You don’t need to resolve your conflicts with the man in your life if instead you can remake yourself as the perfect, passive girlfriend.

But, however much I squirm at the political set-dressing of femininity coaches, I cannot — hand on heart — say that all the advice is bad. Smuggled in under the feminism-blaming, you’ll find some stuff that would make even the most devoted second waver give a hearty cheer. Take Lawson’s command that women should eschew “faux casual indifference” towards men. She’s right that, if you’re looking for commitment, it is deranged to pretend that you aren’t, and then be disappointed that men aren’t looking to commit to you. Be clear about what you want, and you’ll attract men who want the same.

Or there’s the rule about not “mothering” a man. The imbalance of housework in heterosexual domesticity is an exhausting statistical truth. That’s not because women are misguidedly wearing the trousers at home, but because despite feminism’s cajoling, men have still not been inspired to pick up the pinny. If you want a relationship where you aren’t doing all the drudgework, don’t start out by doing it. The men you deter would only have been a drain on you anyway.

All this points to the idea that men can’t be reformed. All you can do is avoid the bad ones. Even the hoary old Rules has a chapter titled: “Don’t Expect a Man to Change or Try to Change Him”. This isn’t a supine injunction for women to fit themselves around a man. Instead, it’s an order for women to stop kidding themselves that their self-sacrifice can turn a deficient man into a decent one: if he sucks when you’re dating, he’s not going to un-suck just because he puts a ring on it. If anything, he’ll probably suck harder once the doors are bolted.

Look at this another way. The “femininity coaches” aren’t solving problems created by feminism. They’re solving problems created by femininity itself — the sex role that puts women in the role of universal caregiver. To reconstitute yourself around someone else’s needs, to never asking for more than the almighty man has signalled that he is willing to give — these are very, very feminine ways to behave, and all part of the mass transfer of labour (both the emotional and the physical kinds) from women, to men. A hefty chunk of the femininity coaches’ advice is actually telling women to be less feminine, while giving the appearance of selling a hyper traditional model of gender.

But no one ever lost money by pinning the blame on women. Think of the safety advice doled out to women after the murder of Sarah Everard: don’t put your hair in a ponytail; don’t go out after dark; even, astonishingly, don’t allow a police officer to arrest you. Not one of these things is practical defence against male violence, but they all came more easily to people’s minds than anything which would actually help. But ludicrous as this stuff is, women find reassurance in it. It gives a feeling of power and security, however illusory: if I can follow these rules, I can make it home safe.

There has always been a voracious female market for news of our own deficiencies. Some women sign up to be told they aren’t “leaning in” enough at work. Some pay through the nose to be berated for the sins of their race. And some simply want to hear that love is obtainable if they can get beyond their unappealing, masculine habits. Talk less, smile more. It might take all your powers to reinvent yourself as someone new and amenable, but it’s still less effort than trying to reinvent the world to be fair to women.


Sarah Ditum is a columnist, critic and feature writer.

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Billy Bob
Billy Bob
2 years ago

I’ve not met a bloke yet who likes all the Botox, lip fillers and orange fake tan girls seem to believe they need. Most men just want an easy life in my opinion.
Women get with men hoping they’ll change and they don’t, men get with women hoping they won’t change and they do

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago
Reply to  Billy Bob

Women get with men hoping they’ll change and they don’t, men get with women hoping they won’t change and they do

ï»ż

That’s spot on. Is that yours or a quote?

Brendan O'Leary
Brendan O'Leary
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

It has many sources, usually expressed more succinctly as:

Women marry men hoping they will change, and men marry women hoping they will not. 

Jon Redman
Jon Redman
2 years ago

Reminds me of “When men get together they insult each other and don’t mean it. When women get together they compliment each other and don’t mean it.”

Dr Stephen Nightingale
Dr Stephen Nightingale
2 years ago

Or this one:

“Women spend half their lives looking for the perfect man, and the other half trying to ‘improve’ him”.

Dennis Boylon
Dennis Boylon
2 years ago

Oh.. that is good

Billy Bob
Billy Bob
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

Nah I stole it, can’t remember where from though

Dean Barwell
Dean Barwell
2 years ago
Reply to  Billy Bob

I worked with a young lad who complained that his girlfriend wore fake tan and he hated it. It made her look like Trump and smell like a wet dog. He didn’t say shit to her about it though. Easy life I guess!

Carol Moore
Carol Moore
2 years ago
Reply to  Billy Bob

Absolutely!

andrew harrison
andrew harrison
2 years ago
Reply to  Billy Bob

Or as the saying goes. Aisle, alter, hymn.

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago

Did the authors do any genuine research with actual men to find out what they really want? I honestly don’t think this 50s view of femininity is it, and it probably wasn’t in the 50s. What I suspect few of us do want is entitled, narcissistic, social media obsessed, hey look at me women who see the man’s role as footing the bill and delivering on their kitschy dreams! They are becoming a bit thick on the ground.
How about, kindness, understanding, intelligence, capability, emotional maturity, sense of humour, not disparaging men at every turn. Dare I say: someone you could rely on in a fix.

Jon Redman
Jon Redman
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

…kindness, understanding, intelligence, capability, emotional maturity, sense of humour, not disparaging men at every turn…someone you could rely on in a fix.

Such women are the new nymphomaniac brewery heiresses.

Dennis Boylon
Dennis Boylon
2 years ago
Reply to  Jon Redman

This is kind of funny. I married a widow with a brewery. I will say I never really worried about settling down until I was in my 30s. I had a lot of girlfriends. When I think back about it there were two I really should have been better too. I wasn’t bad to them necessarily just when it came time to settle down or move on… I just moved on because I wanted to “explore” life unimpeded. I missed out learning how to develop deeper relationships with women. When I did really try I was no good at it. I think I made the same mistakes most men do when they are younger. I focused on a woman who was a lot of fun in public and really pretty. She was a life of the party person and everyone loved her outside our home but behind closed door she was a completely different person. It was an emotional roller coaster. Every time it got so bad I was ready to leave she changed and was the fun person I thought her to be… and when I expressed doubts to people I was always told how great she was. It wound up being a train wreck of an ending. I actually spent some time in therapy and an online support group afterwards. I spent the next 8 years being single. Developed some very close relationships with women but wasn’t really interested in marriage. An older friend of mine was half owner of a tavern and they had plans to build a brewery/taproom next door to this tavern. I started to hang around that place. Just as I was getting to know his business partner he died unexpectedly. Everybody was crushed. I started to help out around the place because my friend was older and his partner who died was my age so he needed a younger body he could rely on and not worry about paying. LOL. His partner’s widow decided not to sell. She decided to build and startup the brewery. So we all built the brewery.. with all the crazy licensing, permitting, and inspections it wound up taking about 4 years before we opened. Some way along that line I became painfully aware of being deeply in love with this woman. She was devastated by her husband’s death but I saw her work through her grief and pain and become a part of our little community there. We spent a lot of time together mostly with other friends around but I was always invited to her house for parties and family gatherings. I got to a point I just couldn’t take it any more so I invited her to coffee one morning and professed my love. We have been blissfully together ever since. I think this came about because I wasn’t worried about love. I actually maybe quit believing in it for many years. After my divorce I had decided I wasn’t very good at developing deep meaningful relationships and just focused on improving my shortcomings. Really paying attention to the people closest to me and that I spent the most time with. My friendships improved and were a great source of strength for me and love came tumbling into my lap. I think there may be a good lesson in there for some people. Others seem to come by it naturally somehow. I had to get my head straight and work on relationship skills. It is definitely worth it. I can’t explain the joy and strength that comes from being in a truly great relationship.

Last edited 2 years ago by Dennis Boylon
Norman Powers
Norman Powers
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

Yep, that’s how it’s been for all the men I know. Needs are not actually complex. Shared values, shared life, an inner resilience and clear-sightedness.
I have a married friend. His primary complaints about his wife are that she seems surprisingly uninterested in their children, whom he genuinely loves a lot, and that she doesn’t share his values about money/work/saving (he’s scottish, and she’s russian lol). Additionally she seems oblivious to these problems in their relationship even though he’s tried to talk to her about it several times.
I’m now engaged to a fantastic woman. Before that I had quite a few girlfriends, whom I always left, because it just wasn’t right. One criteria on which there could be no compromise: no feminists. The previous one before the future Mrs Norman turned out to be a feminist. This was quite upsetting because on our first date I had specifically told her in those exact words that I didn’t want to date a feminist and was looking for a woman who wasn’t one. She strongly implied – in hindsight without being as clear as I was – that she wasn’t of that mindset. It took a good 6-7 dates before the mask slipped and she started announcing her displeasure at e.g. how a technical conference I was involved with organizing (open to anyone) was attended primarily by men. Well, yes honey. Because it’s mostly men that work in that industry, as she knew perfectly well already.
This kind of attitude is grating, performative and depressing. Why couldn’t she be happy in the success of the event? To commit to someone long term you have to believe that you can know someone deeply, which at a certain level means understanding how they will perceive events and act. Feminists make bad mates because they look at a square object and announce it’s round. If anyone says it’s actually square then woe-betide them for not being morally pure enough. Arguing and fighting may follow. You cannot ever really know such a person. You cannot rely on them. You cannot trust them. You cannot be happy with them or respect them and without respect there can be no love. I saw it directly when I became friends with a guy who was married to a feminist. He pretty clearly wasn’t happy at home, saw her as not living in the real world, and didn’t respect her then-current line of “work” (some sort of PhD/higher-ed in which she was writing a report on the lack of women in <industry X>).
Women don’t really need to play ‘hard to get’ to get a good man, although a little bit of chase can be fun. But they do need to share the man’s worldview, which probably doesn’t include men being a part of an evil global conspiracy to keep women down.

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago
Reply to  Norman Powers

She may just have been envious of your success, so used a feminist ready-made to diminish it.
There are feminists, and feminists. But living with anyone who basically thinks you are the enemy just isn’t going to work.

Norman Powers
Norman Powers
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

I don’t think it was envy. She had a successful career by herself – in the a closely adjacent industry to the one she was criticizing! This stuff just seems to become reflexive with time. People are told the world is unfair to women and that a sort of generic fighting for better outcomes for women makes you a good person, so everything becomes viewed through that prism regardless of how many mental backflips are required.

Alison Wren
Alison Wren
2 years ago
Reply to  Norman Powers

The world IS unfair to women we are daily being erased “people with vaginas are women” should just shut up about the erasure of our name for ourselves!

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago
Reply to  Alison Wren

Maybe I just tired. I’ve read that 4 times and still don’t understand it.

Dennis Boylon
Dennis Boylon
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

Yeah… no idea

Julian Farrows
Julian Farrows
2 years ago
Reply to  Alison Wren

Feminists allowed that to happen when they declared gender to be nothing more than a social construct. It’s a bit of a knotty problem. Feminists wanted equality (fair enough), but still wanted to maintain the privileges of being a protected class. A lot of men are now realizing that there are perks to being a woman and so would like to share in that special privilege. I guess they’re thinking that if you can’t beat them, you might as well join them.
But yes, I do understand your concerns. As transgender men usurp female privilege, women are losing their status as a protected class. They’ll still have it for a while, but only for as long as it’s politically expedient.

Last edited 2 years ago by Julian Farrows
Jerry Jay Carroll
Jerry Jay Carroll
2 years ago
Reply to  Julian Farrows

I don’t understand why women are being doormats for this deviant class. Are they waiting for men to stand up for them?

Drahcir Nevarc
Drahcir Nevarc
2 years ago
Reply to  Norman Powers

To my mind, there are two types of feminists: the ones who want to improve women’s lives, and the ones who just hate men. The first sort are fine. My feelings towards the second sort basically match what you say in your comment.

Jerry Jay Carroll
Jerry Jay Carroll
2 years ago
Reply to  Norman Powers

The woman you describe and her sisterhood are great markets for cats in later life.

Cathy Carron
Cathy Carron
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

It’s not 50’s femininity that she’s referring to but rather good ‘ol ‘human nature’. The Left would like to abolish it so they can reengineer the populace. But it’s been formed over thousands of years and is hard to alter.

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago
Reply to  Cathy Carron

I half agree. Clearly there is a human nature and the idea that our behaviours are produced entirely by the environment is outdated tosh.
That said, human behaviour clearly does change over time. Men and women today do not behave entirely the same as they did 50 or a 100 years ago and the changes are not all dysfunctional. Some things are an improvement.
But I think there are limits.

Drahcir Nevarc
Drahcir Nevarc
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

Good sense.

Niobe Hunter
Niobe Hunter
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

So, a human being, just like you. that was what we ancient ‘feminists’ thought we were aiming for, too.

Drahcir Nevarc
Drahcir Nevarc
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

If the rest of mankind is anything like me, they just want women to laugh at their jokes.

Lindsay S
Lindsay S
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

Why we (society) keep assuming that all men are the same and all women are the same is beyond me. In my experience, there are personality aspects that dominate people’s choices for a partner and in many it comes down to whether they are a dominant or submissive personality. I know submissive men that look for dominant women and dominant men who look for submissive women and there are those that are somewhere in between. There are some men that like a trophy wife too just as there are women who like a rich husband but these tend to be minority. In my experience, most men are not as shallow as everyone likes to assume.

Last edited 2 years ago by Lindsay S
Jon Redman
Jon Redman
2 years ago

…the ways in which women are expected to impersonate femininity are as creative — and as punishing — as ever

I’ve read bland and sweeping statements like this one so often that as soon as you realise what the article purports to be about, you know with a sigh that a variant of it will be right along. And sure enough, up it pops, always about the fourth paragraph in. The reuse of tired old clichĂ©s like this is a surefire sign that the writer isn’t thinking about what she’s writing.
The fact is that female grooming of this kind is always and only aimed at other women. Men do not notice this stuff, any more than women notice whether the bloke turned up for a date in the 2-litre or the 2.5. It is done to intimidate other women into conceding that someone else is the alpha female. The alpha female’s idea is that she then gets a clear run at the alpha male regardless of what his taste happens to be.
The equivalent male behaviour is steroid-abusive bodybuilding. By being the biggest lump of beef, Wayne expects everyone else to back off so he is acknowledged as the alpha. This strategy is as successful as the female version.
This strategy of self-mutilation is only ever adopted by the terminally dense. You will never meet a female with both Botoxed lips and an IQ of 125. Most bodybuilders’ chest measurement exceeds their IQ.
If it is somehow men’s fault that women undergo elective ar5e surgery, then it is also women’s that steroid-abusing men have liver and heart problems. How stupid does that sound? Exactly.

Sam
Sam
2 years ago

As I guy, I’m not quite sure how I would respond to the aforementioned advice to women. The women who I’ve committed to in my life, I’ve had several girlfriends, tend to be nice, rather introverted (as I’m introverted and a relationship with an extrovert would probably not work), healthy, like to travel and are generally capable of facing difficult situations without breaking down emotionally.
But if you look at these characteristics, they could just as easily describe a guy! They are in fact simply human characteristics. I had a girlfriend who was quite dominant and strong willed, and another who is much more passive. And both situations were fine, because both women were good human beings.
I wonder if this femininity advice isn’t almost trying to be a magic solution? Rather than working on developing yourself into your full potential as a human, just become meek and submissive and guys will fawn over and commit to you!
I’m not sure if I’m right or wrong about that, but it’s worth considering at least. Some men like submissive girls, and some men like dominant girls. And plenty of men like women in the middle. Rather than try to meet some ideal, why not try to be your best self and see what kind of partner you can attract that way?

A Spetzari
A Spetzari
2 years ago
Reply to  Sam

Where’s the money in marketing that Sam?!

Last edited 2 years ago by A Spetzari
Claire D
Claire D
2 years ago
Reply to  Sam

” why not try to be your best self and see what kind of partner you can attract that way?”
I think that is the right solution.

Rasmus Fogh
Rasmus Fogh
2 years ago
Reply to  Claire D

I cannot speak for women, but for a number of men ‘being yourself and seeing what partner you can attract that way’ will get the answer ‘none at all’. What then?

Claire D
Claire D
2 years ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

Only patience, keep trying and maintain belief that there is someone out there for you, God willing.

Sam
Sam
2 years ago
Reply to  Rasmus Fogh

That’s a very good question, and there is no easy answer. However, I think one frame with which to look at this is: how many men are actually “being themselves?”
For example, a 25 year old man, working at an insurance office, commuting 90 minutes a day, watching football on the weekend and cheering for the team he grew up with.
Is this man actually living up to his own idealized version? Is he truly “being himself?”
I mean this in the sense of, when that man was 12 or 15 or even 18, is that the life he dreamed of? Or did he have dreams of adventure, of doing big things, of seeing the world? Of learning a new language? Of living in a foreign country? Or becoming a great computer programmer?
And if he’s doing a job he doesn’t like, living somewhere he doesn’t like, possibly without hobbies. Then yes, if that man just “is himself” then he’s not likely to attract many women. Because he’s not really being true to his inner desires.
I know this all sounds a little bit new age and what not, but I can’t think of how else to describe it. Women say, just be yourself! And guys try that and fail and they get frustrated. But I think that being yourself only works if you’re truly living the life you’re supposed to live.

Ethniciodo Rodenydo
Ethniciodo Rodenydo
2 years ago
Reply to  Claire D

I think the point is that woman have been educated that it is their responsibility to behave men when it comes to sex and it has not worked out for them, and in some ways also not for a lot of men.

Sharon Overy
Sharon Overy
2 years ago

I think a lot of the market for this sort of stuff comes from women’s tendency to lie, to themselves as well as others, about what they want in life. Too often, it seems their answer is not an honest one, it’s what they imagine their inner idealised conception of themselves, their private inner Mary-Sue, would give.

If your life is to some degree a LARP, there’s a good chance of coming to find yourself discontent.

JP Martin
JP Martin
2 years ago
Reply to  Sharon Overy

Rather than call it “lying to themselves”, I would say that they are very confused. Most do not understand what they want. They have allowed others to influence them and convince them that they want things they don’t want, etc.

Jon Redman
Jon Redman
2 years ago
Reply to  Sharon Overy

There’s also a sense of entitlement here and a tendency not to take responsibility for yourself. I can’t find a man, boo hoo, I’m entitled to one and it’s men’s fault. Nobody sympathises with men who think this way – in fact, they’re called “incels” – so why this sense of entitlement is treated with such reverence just because it’s female entitlement is quite weird and any expectation of it a further form of entitlement.
Maybe the women who buy this advice are just duds?

George Glashan
George Glashan
2 years ago
Reply to  Jon Redman

has anyone copyrighted femcels yet?

Jon Redman
Jon Redman
2 years ago
Reply to  George Glashan

The original self-professed incel was female IIRC…

Maighread G
Maighread G
2 years ago
Reply to  Jon Redman

I don’t think that there is much sympathy for women who can’t or haven’t found a man. I don’t think single women have a sense of entitlement either. Spinsters are still derided in our society.
Incels are involuntary celibates, often virgins. It’s not usually difficult for women to find a man to have sex with them That part is easy. The challenge is forming a lasting relationship. So, there is a difference there.

J Hop
J Hop
2 years ago
Reply to  Sharon Overy

This became clear to me with that whole Ansari blow up a couple of years ago, where a woman went apopolyptic on a guy she hooked up with for not reading her mind and being more romantic. If she wanted committment why was she engaging in one night stands? Why would she expect him to want to make her his girlfriend or fiance when he just met her that night? Why was she saying “yes” to casual sex and then becoming angered that he accepted? Such an obvious example of a woman who wanted romance and deeper committment but having no idea how to get it.

Ethniciodo Rodenydo
Ethniciodo Rodenydo
2 years ago
Reply to  J Hop

I think this is yet another Anglosphere problem. In my experience French woman are not afflicted by these issues.
As to how dystopian things have become, I was told by someone I know well who has recently at university that there was an app used by female students to contact males to se if they were up for casual sex.
As toTo reconstitute yourself around someone else’s needs, to never asking for more than the almighty man has signalled that he is willing to give” – utter nonsense. In my experience woman never stop asking.
Similarly withbut because despite feminism’s cajoling, men have still not been inspired to pick up the pinny.” If I want the house cleaning I will do it. I am not going to do it because you want it cleaning to a to a higher standard. If you want a higher standard you do it. The fact is that men by and large are willing to live with a higher level of untidiness and a lower standard of cleanliness.

Jon Redman
Jon Redman
2 years ago

men by and large are willing to live with a higher level of untidiness and a lower standard of cleanliness

My direct personal experience has been the exact opposite. I have had several cleaners who refused to clean for women because they are so slovenly.

Ethniciodo Rodenydo
Ethniciodo Rodenydo
2 years ago
Reply to  Jon Redman

Exceptions that prove the rule?

Claire D
Claire D
2 years ago

Quoting Mary Wollstonecraft and suggesting her theories are fact based evidence is false. The unfortunate woman made a complete mess of her life trying to live by those theories, it’s a very sad story.
It seems quite irrational to me to hold up her views as in any way useful, only determined ideologues could do it.
The books in the article are hardly surprising, 21st century women are having to live with a dichotomy that is practically impossible to reconcile. They are indoctrinated at school and by the media to believe they are equal to men and must go on to prove that in their careers to be worthwhile. At the same time their instinct, for the majority, is to find a mate, settle down and reproduce.
One set of misconceived rules – feminism, is countermanded by another set of equally misconceived rules – the self help books.

Last edited 2 years ago by Claire D
Allison Barrows
Allison Barrows
2 years ago
Reply to  Claire D

I’ve been reading articles like this since 7th grade. My take away is that we women complain. A lot.

Claire D
Claire D
2 years ago

Perhaps that’s what feminism is at rock bottom, one never ending complaint.

Allison Barrows
Allison Barrows
2 years ago
Reply to  Claire D

Yep. For my part, I’m deeply grateful to my husband of 40 years. He’s the one I call if there’s a spider in the tub.

Eddie Johnson
Eddie Johnson
2 years ago

Same in my household.
I’m always the one who has to call the firebrigade to have it removed…

Last edited 2 years ago by Eddie Johnson
Jonathan Ellman
Jonathan Ellman
2 years ago
Reply to  Eddie Johnson

Who calls the electrician to change a lightbulb?

Eddie Johnson
Eddie Johnson
2 years ago

We try to tackle crises like that together.

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago

An interesting question to the author and to other women.
What reduction in earning power would you accept in a man if he: can cook, and does so; does a fair share of the housework; loves spending time with his children and looking after them; doesn’t work late; will make sacrifices for your career etc. 10,000, 20,000, 30,000? What trade offs will you accept?
Ah – you want both. I see. Well if you’ve dabbled with Venn diagrams I think you’ll see that by definition that is a rarer fish. There are more rich men than rich nice men. And that’s even before we compare the personalities of money focussed and home focussed men.
Of course you could just go for the money and then complain for ever more.

Samir Iker
Samir Iker
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

Great and underrated observation.

The most rabid feminist women I have met are invariably married to highly qualified, successful men…

Niobe Hunter
Niobe Hunter
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

You don’t really want an answer, do you? Lots of couples I know do really discuss who is going to make the larger financial contribution, and who is going to take up the domestic and yes, the emotional,slack. Lots of us have switched roles from time to time as circumstances change.
I supported my husband financially when he was starting a new business, and I spent a lot of time listening to his anxieties as well. When it was successful, he encouraged me to do more art, and less paid for work.
but I guess, you get what you expect. If you expect someone to exploit you and misunderstand you, that’s probably what you’ll get : because the women who don’t behave like that will search for a partner with a slightly less cynical view .

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago
Reply to  Niobe Hunter

Yes, I did want an answer, but no, I don’t think I got one.

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago

To reconstitute yourself around someone else’s needs, to never asking for more than the almighty man has signalled that he is willing to give — these are very, very feminine ways to behave

Where has the author been living!
The authors description of femininity is one that scarcely any man wants – who wants a doormat. But has she really missed how self – centred women have become? How entitled?
Reconstituting themselves around someone else’s needs? Half of them are reconstituting themselves around their social media feeds!
Almighty man? In the U.K.? Most men just go along with what women want in order to have an easy life. In gratitude for which their wives get together in coffee bars and botch about how pathetic they are.

Ethniciodo Rodenydo
Ethniciodo Rodenydo
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

You only have to hear woman speak about their partners at work, and also on the phone to them) to think why would anyone put up with that. As you say, with most men it boils down to anything for a quiet life

Julian Farrows
Julian Farrows
2 years ago

Men do themselves no favors when they opt for a quiet life. In my experience that just creates a whole set of problems for later on. I think many women test men to see how much nonsense they’re willing to put up with and end up having greater respect for men who just say ‘no, I’m not doing that.’

Wilfred Davis
Wilfred Davis
2 years ago
Reply to  Julian Farrows

There is a whole ‘literature’ (I use the term loosely) to be found on this topic on the internet. According to it, women do indeed test men for their nonsense tolerance levels. This is, rather imaginatively, called the s**t test.

Kat L
Kat L
2 years ago
Reply to  Julian Farrows

yes i always said i could never respect a man who would put up with my schidt. that is why handbag harry and his boss lady will not last because it’s apparent she has little to no respect for him.

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago

It’s really terrible and entirely socially acceptable. You rarely hear men doing it, at least not in public, and other men wouldn’t think much of them if they did.

Jean Nutley
Jean Nutley
2 years ago

I have enjoyed reading the comments as much as I did the article. The point seems to be that feminism is the antithesis of femininity.
I will most likely have the gender police after me, but I have never understood why equality between the sexes meant femininity had to go out the window.

Peta Seel
Peta Seel
2 years ago
Reply to  Jean Nutley

According to the feminists masculinity needs to go out of the window too.

Julian Farrows
Julian Farrows
2 years ago
Reply to  Peta Seel

To me it seems more like feminists want to become masculine (believing that such behavior brings about material success), while wanting to feminize men (question themselves and become more subservient to women). At the same time, as women become more man-like, a subset of men are filling the feminine-shaped void by presenting themselves as women.

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago
Reply to  Jean Nutley

Good point.
And in France women generally do not think that. If you’ve read Simone de Beauvoir’s reaction to her doctor telling her she should wear thermal underwear in the winter, you’ll know that even she did not think that.
Does that mean that French women are little China dolls or botoxed bimbos? No, they’ll go hiking in the morning and put on a stylish dress in the evening. And at any time of day are more than a match for men.

Eddie Johnson
Eddie Johnson
2 years ago
Reply to  Jean Nutley

Because “femininity” is a function of patriarchy. And, according to Ms Bindel at least, without the oppressive and distorting socialisation of patriarchy many women would not feel coerced into engaging in hetereosexual relationships.

Michael Johnston
Michael Johnston
2 years ago
Reply to  Eddie Johnson

Yes, it’s often occurred to me that many of the tenets of radical feminism – especially those concerning ostensible male iniquity – suit lesbians very well, but heterosexual women … not so much.

David George
David George
2 years ago

Don’t mothers teach their daughters a few basic rules about dating any more or are the girls just not listening. Seems to be some strange behaviour out there; what’s up with otherwise attractive girls making themselves as unappealing as possible. Metal bits in the face, tattoos, weird coloured hair and graceless clothes suggest a cultivated antipathy towards the very idea of attractiveness. Perhaps that’s the idea: I’m so cool I don’t even need to try. Good luck with that.

Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
2 years ago
Reply to  David George

You can’t believe that girls are going to take this sort of advice from their mothers? And who is to say the mothers aren’t the very creatures you describe?

Hersch Schneider
Hersch Schneider
2 years ago

“creatures” 🙂

Lesley van Reenen
Lesley van Reenen
2 years ago

In my defence, I like a lot of creatures more than I do humans 🙂

Oliver Wright
Oliver Wright
2 years ago

Perfectly valid usage, the sense being ‘people of a particular kind’. It didn’t imply that these women were less than human. He could have said ‘exactly the type of people’, or something like that, but it would have been much less elegant.

Ethniciodo Rodenydo
Ethniciodo Rodenydo
2 years ago

Very true. A long, long time ago 2 young women got talking to me who lived with their mother. They had different fathers but either of them knew who their respective fathers were. Still the mother got the council house and the benefits

David George
David George
2 years ago

I don’t know, Lesley, there are many influences on people now, not all of them positive by any means. The girls looking like a cross between a clown and a construction worker usually wake up to how empowering and enjoyable it is to be attractive I suppose.
A lot of young men seem lost as well, unable or unwilling to bring out the positive masculine; the courageous, competent, loving provider and protector. Soyboy McSnowflake isn’t going to get the juices flowing. Viva La Difference.

Cathy Carron
Cathy Carron
2 years ago
Reply to  David George

The worst aspect of the feminist movement / birth control pill is the unrelenting push to offer sex no matter the occasion and / or feeling. The ‘hook-up culture’ has been incredibly detrimental to young women today.

Kat L
Kat L
2 years ago
Reply to  David George

their mothers were out working instead of bonding with them and teaching them how to survive in life like cooking and sewing and laundry. feminists have truly focked up women and their potential for happiness and stability.

Wilfred Davis
Wilfred Davis
2 years ago

It might take all your powers to reinvent yourself as someone new and amenable, but it’s still less effort than trying to reinvent the world to be fair to women.

The underlined words sum up the tone of the article, essentially a tone of helpless complaint.

“It’s not fair, it’s not fair, it’s not fair. The world isn’t fair to women. It’s not fair!

Men aren’t fair to women. Women aren’t fair to women. Women aren’t even fair to themselves.”

And so on. Forever.

Ethniciodo Rodenydo
Ethniciodo Rodenydo
2 years ago
Reply to  Wilfred Davis

We all know that every aspect of the game is fixed to advantage women

Niobe Hunter
Niobe Hunter
2 years ago

Is this a joke?

Ethniciodo Rodenydo
Ethniciodo Rodenydo
2 years ago
Reply to  Niobe Hunter

Why would you think it is a joke?

Hubert Knobscratch
Hubert Knobscratch
2 years ago

If women want to know what dating is like for men- give it a go.
Create an online profile with a picture of an average bloke with all the necessary attributes you think women would go for.
See how much work is required to get even a response, even if it’s just “no thanks
”
For the next month, increase the quality of the man, and see what happens.
Keep doing this until you get a reasonable response.
Be amazed as to how good the man has to be before the women contact you.
10% of the men get 90% of the women.
Read Norah Vincent’s “Self-Made Man”
Type “tinder experiment” into YouTube and be dismayed at the level some of your fellow women operate at. 

David B
David B
2 years ago

Recommend for Norah Vincent. A very interesting book indeed.

Kat L
Kat L
2 years ago

yes i’m sure you are right but seriously would you want a person that goes on tinder for anything beyond a one nighter?

Dave Corby
Dave Corby
2 years ago

God created man and woman in His image and of equal worth. He created us, however, with very different physical and mental characteristics, different strengths and weaknesses, so that we can complement each other.
I believe that all the self-help courses are saying is to find peace in your designated role. The one that the genetics and hormones programmed you with in the first days and weeks in the womb.
Joy comes from acceptance – but this is stolen from you if you fight against it.

Prashant Kotak
Prashant Kotak
2 years ago
Reply to  Dave Corby

“God created man and woman in His image”

If God created man and woman in His image, then all we Men are within our rights to do as He did (indeed we cannot do otherwise ipso facto) and go ahead and create:

– angels and demons (full scale genetic reengineering here we come)
– the universe (or at least, very realistic virtual reality environments for us and our creations to inhabit)
– the earth (flat. very flat, obviously) with eden complete, but Engerland will do as an approximation
– man (and eventually, woman – I can already see this as the advertising tag line for the company making and selling you a robot girlfriend. Or three)
– set it all rolling while we have a breather after all those days of hard work and creativity (the seventh day as it coincidentally happens), sitting in starbucks with a drink head down scrolling twitter
– very severe and contradictory moral codes impossible to navigate and deliberately designed to trick you into sooner or later falling foul – but we have already created the apple (or in our case Apple), the left and the inland revenue for that, so we are ahead of the game there

Samir Iker
Samir Iker
2 years ago
Reply to  Prashant Kotak

By that logic, your photographic image should be able to eat, pee and drive a car.

Prashant Kotak
Prashant Kotak
2 years ago
Reply to  Samir Iker

Explain please, not clear what you mean.

Eddie Johnson
Eddie Johnson
2 years ago

” but it’s still less effort than trying to reinvent the world to be fair to women.”
Your cause would probably be helped if women themselves were fairer towards each other. By far the most critical and yes sexist comments I’ve heard about (other) women usually derive from women themselves.
And besides, life isn’t “fair” to most of us, Ms Ditum, in case you hadn’t noticed.
Cast your eyes around…
However, in my experience accepting this basic, unpalatable fact of life is the key to leading a fairly contented existence.
Whereas celebrating one’s own self-declared victimhood, as you seem compelled to do, most certainly isn’t.

Last edited 2 years ago by Eddie Johnson
Eddie Johnson
Eddie Johnson
2 years ago

At a rough, completely unscientific guess, I’d wager that some 30%-40% of articles appearing in UnHerd are in some way related to the gender wars, or the Battle of the Sexes, as it was once endearingly referred to.
Invariably, it seems, these are written by women, and understandably through the prism of a woman’s experience.
Yet equally invariably, these pieces also contain a long litany of grievances about men in general, with whom the various female authors appear to have a highly ambivalent, if not schizophrenic relationship, ie. cursed by their confounded heterosexuality to be attracted sexually and emotionally to the very creatures they intellectually reject and even despise in some cases.
Would it not be possible to commission a – shock horror – male writer, well versed in this difficult terrain, to at least present a man’s perspective for a change?
You know, for the sake of balance, and all that…

Emre Emre
Emre Emre
2 years ago

Don’t see the conflict here. Feminism (as shown in this article) is telling women to turn away the majority of men since those men can’t be changed. This necessarily creates a big scarcity of eligible men and lots of lonely feminist women. Femininity coaches are offering a way back in for those who think they made the wrong choice (due to their middle class education also according to this article).

Douglas McNeish
Douglas McNeish
2 years ago

I have yet to come across an article written by a man complaining about women’s failure to fulfill his preconceived requirements of them. It would not be taken seriously by other men who would see unrealistic expectations, or presume he was just pursuing the wrong females. And women would respond with the usual arsenal of “the entitled patriarchy” retorts.

But women-whinging-about-men is a whole genre of journalism and academic research. There is an unending demand for it throughout the media, especially in the Standard, and of course the Guardian.

It is also a whole field of pedagogy in the universities, usually under the moniker of “Gender Studies.” I inquired with a woman friend who is a lecturer in that discipline if the field included any courses about men. Her response? “That would be the rest of the curriculum.”

As for patriarchal oppression of women in the workplace, I am still waiting after twenty years in the building trade for any woman to respond to an ad for plasterer, plumber, bricklayer or electrician. The plaster board ceiling imposed ruthlessly by the patriarchy to exclude women? Or perhaps women only rant about entry and equal pay in the genteel positions reserved for the educated elite.

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago

I have seen one female painter and decorator, and even a female bin lady. Both, coincidentally, very attractive, and for me at least rendered more so by the job they were doing. Not so much because you instantly knew the kind of women they were – but because you instantly knew the kind of women they weren’t!

Eddie Johnson
Eddie Johnson
2 years ago

“But women-whinging-about-men is a whole genre of journalism and academic research.”
A point I’ve made on here a couple of times. Only the always-readable Mary Harrington ventures beyond the confines of the gender wars, whereas the majority of her UnHerd peers are obsessed with discovering ever new grievances about men and bemoaning their sad and oppressed lives in our oh-so “unfair”, allegedly patriarchal society.
Most of their articles would are typical Guardian fare, and none the better for it.

Last edited 2 years ago by Eddie Johnson
furma371
furma371
2 years ago

I see the problem in the contradiction of the image of modern aggressive females with the ancestral biological instincts of motherhood. Conquering a world dominated by men comes with a price, and this price should not be renouncing the proper nature of their own being. The art is to find the right equilibrium.

Last edited 2 years ago by furma371
Saul D
Saul D
2 years ago

It’s not about finding a man. It’s about finding the right man. Often a man that leads to higher steps on the social ladder, and a finer nest to bring up children.
And the competition is played out against other women. The men in these games are often shallow shadows and targets, blind to the machinations of ‘the rules’, to be hooked and hitched. Jane Austin understood, as does every popular romantic fiction writer.

Carol Moore
Carol Moore
2 years ago

Young men known to me tell me they are eschewing relationships with women their age because they think they seem to have an entitlement issue and are unwilling to take responsibility for their behaviour, ever blaming men. Yet it’s true too that some young women are forever contorting themselves into strange looking creatures 
. Whatever the truth, there seems to be more dissatisfaction in their generation than I recall growing up
.

Charles Lawton
Charles Lawton
2 years ago

I realise this is light hearted but with a Son and Daughter-in-law working as detectives in the Met I realise just how much domestic violence happens every day and a large majority of victims are women. Can we stop bleating about feminism and deal with the day to day violence against women in society.

Tom Lewis
Tom Lewis
2 years ago

Speaking as a man, I would say the problem with women is one of trust. They just don’t trust themselves. They are bombarded with information, and images, that before long, being simple creatures, they don’t know which way to turn or what to think. All that fakery, boobs, buts and Botox is all a mask, not so much to convince others, but to convince themselves, ironically, probably attracting the very men that they should be wary of.

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago
Reply to  Tom Lewis

Some truth in that – though it clearly isn’t all women. But the issue does seem to have something to do with fragile sense of self, looking to others for validation etc. In other words – narcissistic traits.
I think part of the idea of feminism was that as women attained greater freedom and equality these characteristics would change. They would become more sure of themselves, less easily influenced, less obsessed with shopping and appearance, more curious about aspects of the world not centred around themselves, less dependent but more dependable.
Some women clearly have changed in this positive way. But a lot have become worse.

Last edited 2 years ago by David Morley
Caroline Watson
Caroline Watson
2 years ago

How ridiculous. I’ve never had a ‘date’ in my life. Do things that you want to do and meet people who like doing the same. Make friends with them and see what happens. In the meantime, make sure that you earn enough to live on and put a roof over your head so that a man is an added extra, not a necessity. Keep them in a separate box so that they don’t take over your life and, if they disappear, everything else stays the same. Never give up a job or ditch a friend to please a man.

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago

Caroline, you must be a WGTOW. Unless you are having kids, and from the man’s perspective, I’m inclined to agree. Though I have to say that I would want a bit more emotional connection than that with my partner/girlfriend. But agree on the advantages of keeping yourself materially independent.
if the cost of accommodation was lower I think more people would do this.

Peta Seel
Peta Seel
2 years ago

We always did have dating coaches – they were called parents. These days far too many parents are still trying to negotiate the dating jungle themselves.

Kat L
Kat L
2 years ago
Reply to  Peta Seel

yes and they set the examples by *gasp* staying married.

tom j
tom j
2 years ago

If your starting assumption is that men & women are the same, life gets pretty complicated pretty quickly.

Kat L
Kat L
2 years ago

women are unhappier than ever and men are just dropping out altogether. when the division of work was separated, both were happier. complaining about the men not being inspired to do housework was a laugh, the rest of it was bollocks.

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago

All this points to the idea that men can’t be reformed. All you can do is avoid the bad ones. 

Probably eternally good advice. But it cuts both ways.
If he buys you meals out but is incapable of cooking himself – avoid him and forgo the dosh. He’s not going to be taking you to restaurants for every meal when your married.
Likewise if she wants to be treated like a princess and doesn’t like to get her hands dirty, don’t expect her to help with the diy.

Peta Seel
Peta Seel
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

I have no problem with men who can’t cook, in fact I prefer it. I love to cook myself, by myself and without distractions or anyone telling me what to do, but I never say no to a man who will wash up after me 🙂 I’m good at DIY too, and an ace wall-paper hanger!

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago
Reply to  Peta Seel

What are you doing this weekend? 🙂
You seem to have assumed I meant “help with the cooking”. No I meant cook.

Last edited 2 years ago by David Morley
Peta Seel
Peta Seel
2 years ago
Reply to  David Morley

Not a lot – your place or mine? 😀
My late husband needed a map to find the kitchen, but I later had a companion who was a good cook. He had had to learn because he had cared for his Alzheimer-stricken wife for 12 years. When I moved in he was very happy to hand the kitchen over to me but did occasionally like to cook himself just to keep his hand in. When he did I left him to it – he didn’t like “advice” either 🙂

Oliver Wright
Oliver Wright
2 years ago

Absurd to call women ‘a race’!

Earl King
Earl King
2 years ago

I wanted a family. That was my impetus for marriage. If a man or a woman do not want children a relationship during child Bering years becomes far more complicated. Some men prefer multiple partners some prefer a steady. Without children in the picture what is the catalyst for marriage? Economics?

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago
Reply to  Earl King

The modern western marriage seems to be, in essence, an agreement to share a mortgage.

Tony Taylor
Tony Taylor
2 years ago

Don’t know about women – in general, too – but I needed one.

Kathryn Dwyer
Kathryn Dwyer
2 years ago

How interesting that the vast majority of comments are from men!!
Does that reflect the readership of Unherd (I sincerely hope not) or is it that men are also looking for guidance in a weird world?

Niobe Hunter
Niobe Hunter
2 years ago
Reply to  Kathryn Dwyer

Yes , and most of them are just moaning in and on about ‘women’. Especially the ones with female names, who seem to be consumed with hatred for their own sex ( or is it?).

David Morley
David Morley
2 years ago
Reply to  Niobe Hunter

You’ll find that women are always the most damning critics of their own sex.

Eddie Johnson
Eddie Johnson
2 years ago
Reply to  Niobe Hunter

“Yes , and most of them are just moaning in and on about ‘women’”
Only in response to the sheer relentless conveyor belt of rants “moaning in and on about men”.
To quote Basil Fawlty: “you started it”.
Would make a pleasant change for female contributors to write about something else – but men and relationships appear to be their obsession.

Last edited 2 years ago by Eddie Johnson
Kat L
Kat L
2 years ago
Reply to  Niobe Hunter

i don’t hate my own sex but since i know my own foibles i see it ever more clearly in other women. feminists i simply have disdain for since i believe they have contributed mightily to womens discontent and destabilization of western society.

Kasia Chapman
Kasia Chapman
2 years ago
Reply to  Kathryn Dwyer

I observed the same thing : very few women comment, and wanted to post about it but in the end was too busy with cooking and organising our family life . Which I love doing but feminists insist that I should not! Instead I should be interested in DIY, cars and computer games and football. I should not love to be married to a strong man who is useful in the house and brings home ‘bacon’ . That is a terrible stereotype of a man and a relationship. I should insist that all house chores are equally and fairly divided . But I don’t. I am very happy to be stereotypical woman ( despite PHD and a professional career) and very happy to have a stereotypical husband. There , I said it. Awaiting cancellation.

Claire D
Claire D
2 years ago
Reply to  Kasia Chapman

Good for you.
I’m another one.

Last edited 2 years ago by Claire D
David Batlle
David Batlle
2 years ago

Men don’t need to commit. They get the milk for free.

Milos Bingles
Milos Bingles
2 years ago

All these dating coaches, for women and men, require people to deny their authentic selves. To present a version of ourselves that isn’t authentic. This is the issue. First, we have to reconnect to our true inner selves before we can connect with someone else. No amount of acting classes or sales techniques or tricks will alter that fact.

Vijay Kant
Vijay Kant
2 years ago

When women play hard to get, they usually end up with a man who does not take No for an answer. Decent men usually move on after the first rejection.