It’ll be interesting to see how this plays out. Now that ‘their’ guy has won, and there is now a corporate puppet back in the white House will all those riots stop? The next time a black person gets shot by a cop, will it be blamed on Biden? How will they spin it when Biden launches the next war in the middle East? When he steps up the economic destruction to ‘tackle covid’ and more people lose their jobs, and this makes no difference to deaths, how will they reconcile this? Who will the insane left blame for all the world’s ills now their bogey man has gone?
Biden wants to put even more trillions on top of this. The Green New Deal won’t be paid by an organic Magic Money tree in the back garden of the White House.
And that will be the perfect time for Republicans/Conservatives to discover their “principled” opposition to debt. Trump promised to balance the budget not blow it up.
If the demtards could have left him alone instead of wasting 3 yrs and billions of dollars on that russia conspiracy, perhaps he could have moved in the direction of balancing the debt
Utter tripe (as our British friends might say). Trump is a self-admitted “lover” of debt – as long as he is not the one left holding the bag – one of the few things he actually excelled at during his checkered “business” career. Trump bounced from bankruptcy to bankruptcy until his epiphany that he could actual make money simply pretending to be a businessman on TV and licensing out his brand/name to any suitable charlatan or grifter. The ultimate con… and a poisoned chalice from which far too many Americans willingly consumed (and continue to do so).As president, Trump’s profligate spending and unwarranted tax cuts (stealing from future generations) were a key part of the economic “success” during his presidency that few (on either side of the aisle) even acknowledged let alone seriously sought to control…. No I fear we are all victims of his grift and are all f@#ked (as our our future descendants with this increasingly crushing debt).Also Van, the Mueller “Russia” Investigation (which contrary to Bill Barr’s spin (and Douglas Murray’s – whom I otherwise generally admire) was not an exoneration of Trump and was around $42 million (not “Billions” as you inaccurately claim). Roughly the cost of 1/2 of of one a F-35A fighter jet. But I should have recalibrated my expectations of you as soon as I saw your “clever” use of the term “Demtards” it is always a clear giveaway ….
Ha! Just wanted to add, that Biden also wants to, take away our second amendment, sensor our speech, raise our taxes, gut our military, and defund the police, just to name a few…
No matter how unpalatable it may be. this election was “won” by hatred. Chiefly of a man who dared to utter the truth concerning the differences between the sexes……women have come to expect kid glove treatment in today’s woke society, losing touch with sexual reality in the process. All of the examples you pose will be ignored, we live in a world of “identity politics”
There is a video of BLM threatening the Dems at the weekend as they party in “BLM Square”, accusing them in menacing chants of colonising the space. BLM didn’t seem to be celebrating. It was business as usual.
Yes, the riots will mostly stop. The infrastructure for them, provided by the likes of George Soros, will dry up. Most of the rioters will go home. Those who persist, will be arrested by the suddenly active police. As far as the next shooting of. a black by a white cop, it will not be blamed on Old Uncle Joe. It will be blamed on “systemic racism” and “white supremacy” and will result in further attacks on whites by Democrats.
I believe the US death tally on blacks killing blacks is hitting 700 for the year. No sign of BLM anywhere. Why? Because they don’t care. Black deaths matter only when the shooter is a white policeman because that’s where the money is. No riots, no broken windows, no destroyed businesses when a few blacks shoot their brethren. No money in it.
They will do the same thing they did when Obama took over from Bush. that is to blame everything on the Bush administration. They were even doing so 6 and 76 years into Obama’s tenure.
The enemy will do as they are doing now: lying like Soviet Russians when confronted. I called a local “news” outlet and when asked why they referred to Slow Joe as “president elect” they reacted with the NPC monotone “we were told to report that at this time….” Over and over again. I asked “Do you believe it?” “We were told to report that at this time….”
Their parent, CBS told them to.
Nuremburg, anyone?
Theoretical musings, however. POTUS is still POTUS. And will be, once we get the silliness cleared up in court.
I assumed BLM was about black lives mattering, but it’s not. See their website. They are a Marxist fundraising group using ‘Black Lives’ as a marketing scheme.
Alex Lekas
3 years ago
The most laughable thing has been Biden talking unity, and his dogwashers posting things about the same on social media. As if four years of being called nazis, racists, and whatever else somehow gives the left the moral high ground. Sorry, that’s not how it works. You don’t get to pull stunts ranging from not a single Dem showing up for Trump’s inauguration to the endless Russian fixation to the enemies lists being sought by the likes of AOC, and then suddenly ask “can’t we be friends?”
No, we can’t. My friends don’t call me racist. They may disagree with me and we may have vigorous discussions, but there is no name-calling, let alone violence. At this point, we’re exes. It means we can be civil and polite in mixed company because that’s how adults act. Some exes manage to be friends but those relationships were more likely to flame out than be burned down by either side. It’s okay. The left hates people like me. That’s been made abundantly clear.
Alex, the article was about lies and facts… and you start right off with ‘not a single dem’ showed up for Trumps inauguration, while of course not only were the Obama’s there, but the Clintons were too… you know, the lady he beat by fewer total votes than those he’s losing to Biden by? That dem. As you have thus disqualified yourself from being taken seriously, I won’t bother with the rest of your nonsense, and it’s clear why “the left hates people like” you.
My fault for using an absolute. A large chunk of Congress stayed home. That’s so much more mature. For former presidents to show up, that’s a low bar.
it’s clear why “the left hates people like” you. it’s who the left is. It hates anyone not 100% in lockstep agreement. Just look at how it treats minorities that dare to stray, or the occasional person in good standing who deviates on a single point. Funny how you skip right over the serial insults.
Low Bar? It’s one that I’m quite sure DJT will not clear, so I guess it’s looking a bit higher to you now. As to congressmen staying home, correct me if I’m wrong, but as I recall a certain Mitch McConnell was meeting with all the Republican senators at the exact time Obama was being sworn in… during which meeting they all swore to do everything the could to make Obama a one term president. That’s statesmanship for you!!
It wasn’t the ‘exact time’ it was the evening of the same day. I don’t know if you’ve noticed but the general purpose of being a politician is to win elections. All politicians and political parties would wish to make Presidents from the party they oppose one term presidents, this is not unusual and not something worthy of censure – it’s the norm.
Given the obstruction Trump has faced, anything Obama faced is dwarfed in comparison.
Notice how when discussing ANYTHING the dems don’t agree with, they immediately resort to name-calling, their tempers flair, they forget where they are, and with whom their speaking to… Lol😂 They are completely unhinged; burning down our cities like a bunch of babies, who didn’t get their way… I mean, it’s laughable. And, then they have their weak, cognitively impaired, and so obviously coached, Biden say, “we need to unify the country.” It’s psychotic.
do you know how many are in a dozen? Because your numbers point to five dozen. As in more than one, making dozens. THIS is what you’re defending? It’s classless. And the same would apply to Repubs who engaged in a similar tantrum.
Anyone who thinks for himself, knows how to do things, and loves liberty is in the crosshairs of the Marxists.
Which includes me.
Alex Mitchell
3 years ago
Which is all true and, as ever by Mr Murray, beautifully stated. The question for any genuine leader of the US is how to stop the cycle. Do the Republicans act as the bigger persons here and not play up in the same way? If they did, would it be recognized as such? I suspect not. So, do they then loudly identify the issues and the parallels before backing off into reasonable behaviour? And, if so, how would they get that message across in the polarized media world? My guess is that with a career politician in the White House, the swamp reestablishes itself fully and it loops back into low level grumbling and internal power games. If, that is, Biden can keep the more left-leaning sections of his party in check.
Dopey Nixon committed Watergate As he Was Paranoid after illinois was ‘Fixed’ by thousands of Votes going into Lake michigan in nov 1960 & Then Stuffing ballots in 1972 ….. Kennedy had enough electoral college votes but overall total was less than 100,000 in popular vote..
Well if you are saying that had there been no fraud and Kennedy lost the election, he would not have been assassinated that must be right, but I do not see the relevance.
Adding to my list you could include the decline of public and moral and ethical standards in the 60’s and 70’s, the huge expansion of the state and so on up to and including the election of President Trump
Kennedy already had 303 Electoral votes .nixon 219 .Even if illinois was Reversed as it should have been.! Kennedy’s sex exploits and terminal Addisons’ were hidden until Watergate hearings by conservative news media..
It’s the supercilious sneering that most Americans object to. It’s that one last kick in the head when your opponent is down. Your comment on its own is just an inconsequential petty meanness – a tiny pebble. But it’s a tiny pebble in an avalanche. I fear that rather than learning to get along with people who think differently to them, the Democrat party and the institutions that support them will spend the next four years humiliating and further alienating the ‘other side’ until another Trump-like figure or worse comes along and plays to their resentment.
“..most Americans object to.” – you don’t know that. When it comes to the American people (Democrats or Republican) I always refer to the H.L. Mencken. He got the measurement of the American people.
“The men the American people admire most extravagantly are the most daring liars; the men they detest most violently are those who try to tell them the truth.”
It is pointless trying to imitate what the democrats tried to do in the last four years. Action should be for the good of the country and not some kind of revenge as the democrats showed when Trump was elected. It has come to the time that one cannot rely on America to do the right thing as they did in the past although I know that there is a minority who are as true as ever.
You have a very selective version of history. Obama won the election (and Democracts controlled the House and the Senate). Republican Senate position (a historical fact that no one questions it) was: we are not going to co-operate with Obama and try to make him a 1 term president.
I don’t think so Alex, Biden will step down within a year when things have quietened down and the door will be open for the real villains to take the floor. I only hope that the fraud is exposed and the true President reinstated
Your comment is based on both sides being mature, honorable, and putting the country first. We are in this dilemma because the Republicans shy away from a fight and would rather give in on principle and reach across the aisle to get along.
The Democrat party on the other hand is no longer the Democrat Party that my Mom and Dad belonged to in the 1950’s. The Cultural Marxist Left has infiltrated the government, changed education to anti-America Leftist indoctrination, and taken over the Democrat Party.
If Biden becomes President there will be no violent demonstrations and riots like the Leftist Democrats gave us for four years. Our resistance will be through the Senate and then we will vote to take back the House in two years.
“The Democrat party on the other hand is no longer the Democrat Party that my Mom and Dad belonged to in the 1950’s. The Cultural Marxist Left has infiltrated the government, changed education to anti-America Leftist indoctrination, and taken over the Democrat Party.” You know what, I thought you were talking about the Labour Party in Britain. Weird, isn’t it?
bob alob
3 years ago
I really don’t think the Republicans, like the Conservatives here, can actually find within themselves the same measure of nastiness and hatred which has been displayed by the so called liberal left in both countries in recent years, it’s more likely the Democrats will continue their hate campaign against Trump and continue to seek his prosecution for whatever they can dig up, just as efforts continue here against cummings, hate campaigns and cancel culture have become the liberal left’s normal way of operating, Joe Biden’s success isn’t going to change that.
“…or whatever they can dig up,” tax evasion is not a crime? Assuming that he is guilty. He is being investigated (collaborated by his long time lawyer) for tax evasion.
Lawyers become politicians because you have a legalistic process in place (aka GOVERMENT). Drafting laws requires lawyers. Powerful people (with money) always and anywhere can get a better deal. Should be no problem for Trump.
You realize, Bob, the guy you are defending was forced to pay $2m back for misusing charitable funds from his “Trump Foundation’s” bank accounts… (all frankly criminal acts) and was forced to shutter the charity (under court supervision) and agree (along with 3 of his children) to 19 admission of misconduct and misuse….
This is the guy (who continues to undermine our democracy with false claims of widespread and material voter fraud) who is totally without a moral compass…. Your (and the conservatives in general) tolerance of this immoral cretin man/child never ceases to amaze (and sadden) me….
While I truly abhor and lament the far left’s decent into “wokeness” and identity politics (and the serious damage it does to the laudable causes it purportedly seeks to uplift), the blinders you, Bob, and your ilk are willing to put on are no less clueless, ignorant, and lamentable…. God (or some A.I. Deus ex machina) please help us all because if this is the best level of thought and discourse we can do as educated, rational souls …. we are all (once again) f@#$ked.
Sorry if I mistook your presumption that any prosecution of Trump’s “tax evasion” would “fail” and be quickly replaced with what I supposed you were inferring was yet another “trumped” up charge (pun intended) – as support for Trump. It just rubs me the wrong way when I see folks go into contortions to defend or excuse a man who from all actions – appears to be amoral, draft-dodging, low-IQ, narcissistic, grifter, and bully. Apologies….
As I noted, I too find much to fault with the modern left – who aren’t without their own set of charlatans and hypocrites – especially in the “woke” realm (see e.g., Robin D’Angelo, Ibrahim Kendi, etc) though I do still believe that most on the left are motivated and sincere in their laudable desire to advance a world where all people are accorded respect (unless their individual actions merit otherwise), fairness, and equality regardless of their race, sex or sexual orientation, etc. – even if they are currently grossly misguided to such an extent that they actually do a disservice to the values and people they purport to advance…. Cheers.
No, that is not how it works. Once accepted, the return is fixed unless there is some illegality. Not even the NYT is suggesting Trump did anything illegal.
There is zero chance that Trump and Cohen took the lead on Trump’s taxes. Multiple pass through entities, complex depreciation and other issues — please. Not to mention some of the related entities may use different accounting firms than Trump himself depending on ownership, control and other issues associated with the venture.
My favorite fake Trump tax scandal was evidenced in an in depth article (by the NYT I think) questioning his family’s estate/gift tax planning, going back decades and decades. It was a literal tour de force of basic, run of the mill estate tax avoidance methods (like generation skipping transfers) used by people with potential estate tax liabilities across the country every single day, even more so in the latter part of the 20th century based on the exemption amount at the time.
Wont happen All trump has to do is make sure All By elections,Mid terms &future Election ,Postal Voting is Limited To shift Workers,The Infirm &those on holiday ..& counted 10-14 days before the US election…I can’t see Donald T running in 2024 he’ll be 78 & should concentrate & News &business channel to rival sky &bloomberg both Democrat bias..
Frank James
3 years ago
With Democrats embracing divisive identity politics and the blood libel that is Critical Racial Theory, it can only get worse. They are openly kulak-ing a group of people and promising to disarm them. You know, because 4% of gun deaths each year are due to the very scary looking AR-15. For the safety of the children, you see. It has absolutely nothing to do with rubbing the deplorables faces in it by taking away their most treasured firearm. No, nothing at all…
I am not exactly sure what the end game for the Democrats is, but uniting and governing a wounded country does not seem to be a priority.
‘They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.’ Obviously, it’s the Democrats embracing divisive identity politics?
Thanks for demonstrating Douglas Murray’s point. You fail to point out that Trump was talking about illegal immigrants, not normal immigrants or those already resident. He is also arguably talking about a subset of illegal immigrants – that is “the ones sent ” to the US.
I believe this is the quote in full:
“”When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending the best,” he said during the announcement. “They’re not sending you, they’re sending people that have lots of problems and they’re bringing those problems. They’re bringing drugs, they’re bringing crime. They’re rapists and some, I assume, are good people, but I speak to border guards and they’re telling us what we’re getting.”
“He is also arguably” Yes, arguably. Trump was running for president of USA and not for sanitation commissioner in some small town rural America. With the long track record of Trump can you truly ARGUE ?
I think it was a statement designed to stoke anti-Mexican feelings among Americans. I think an expert in management of the message like Trump was well aware of that.
I hope not. I’m someone who thinks all people are of equal value and worthy of respect – whether they are American, Mexican or neither. If a Spanish person in Spain said ‘When England sends its people, they’re not sending the best’ I’d think that was wrong (and I’m not English).
I think you are wrong. It was a statement meant to appeal to the majority of ordinary people – but not the rich elite – who think that a country should guard it’s borders and keep illegal immigrants and foreign criminals out of the country.
When A Home Secretary has to Announce ”now we can Keep out EU criminals ie People traffickers,terror suspects,drug cartels” I think trying to say ”This is racist” shows Sanctomonius ignorance..
When Trump’s says ‘Mexico sends’, the only possible interpretation is some sort of state encouraged migration. You have evidence of this? In any case, there are an estimated 5 million illegal Mexican immigrants in the US. This is who Trump is describing. Tarring with the same brush rather a large number of people, don’t you think?
Everybody that runs for president. Trump as a president tweeted that his predecessor (Obama) had Team Seal 6 killed and faked the death of Bin Laden. Surely you can see the difference?
A lot of us white people were not born priveleged but had to work hard to overcome the odds. Some did not manage it. It’s a fallacy. People who talk about white privelege only look at certain people. We do have a good country that millions want to come to but it was the people of the country who made it like that. As an orphan I slipped through the cracks but I still see that the country is basically fair and compassionate.
Quite right. But some people are unable to admit or accept that the country is generally decent, because that would mean there’s no need to reimagine society entirely.
I believe that the Mexican government has published pamphlets and broadcast videos demonstrating how their people can evade US border security. So yes, if my understanding is correct, it is state encouraged migration, or at least it was at the time of this education on the breaking of US law. And Peter Kreff, you make an excellent point about the varying responses.
It’s never stopped the left in the UK from selectively quoting part of Mrs T’s ” They are casting their problems at society. And, you know, there’s no such thing as society. There are individual men and women and there are families. And no government can do anything except through people, and people must look after themselves first. It is our duty to look after ourselves and then, also, to look after our neighbours” speech.
And what’s more, they have no intention ever of putting their six-word “precis” into context.
Judicial activists. There will be appeals to higher courts and eventually they will get to judges who are not judicial acitivists but constitutional lawyers who uphold the law and the constitution.
“Judicial activists. ” How do you know that? I am pretty sure that you DO NOT understand anything about law or the Constitution. Your default position is “I don’t like it so it must be wrong”.
The last four and more years of politics in the USA can be summed up in one act, Nancy Pelosi ripping up the State of the Union speech in January 2020. It sent out a very clear signal, “we only accept democracy when we win”.
It is clear that a Pelosi House of Representatives will want revenge on Trump and his family and anyone who worked with him. Expect endless hearing into Trump, his business, his tax affairs, his family connections, etc. No stone will be left unturned in the search for dirt to throw at him.
If Biden is truly serious about ending the division he needs to declare now that he will not assist in any house investigations into Trump and that he will pardon anyone who is investigated, no matter what is found. It will take an unambiguous act like this to start the process of constructive engagement. If he doesn’t he will go down in history as one of the most ineffectual Presidents of all time because the Senate will obstruct every legislative program he puts forward just for the hell of it!
Red Asp
3 years ago
It took Al Gore over thirty days before he conceded victory to Bush because his own legal challenges were being churned over by due process. Why is it the main media outlets are pretending it’s all over?
About fifteen minutes ago the BBC news channel ran some footage of Trump meeting Obama, within a week of the 2016 result. The implication was that Trump is doing something awful and unheard of by bringing the lawyers in.
For some reason the BBC isn’t mentioning Al Gore’s legal efforts in 2000.
Gore/Bush was about Florida ONLY. And Gore had a case to make, NO ONE (certainly not BBC) is stopping Trump from going to courts and making his case. As of now judges in GE, AZ & NV have rejected his cases. BBC not mentioning Florida 2000 is not deciding the vote.
I never it was deciding anything. I was wondering why the BBC is pretending that Trump’s lack of concession is unique. In addition, why all large media outlets are acting ‘as if’ everything is decided when it obviously isn’t.
they are calling it, they have legally not decided anything because they can not. For example media called Alaska for Trump despite only 50% of the votes have been counted. I can not speak about BBC but Guardian, FT, NY Times all have referend to the Florida 2000 case.
I’m aware they are ‘calling’ it. This is strange. Why are they calling it when it isn’t over? I mean – it’s Florida which is the case in point. Not because it was one state, but because Al Gore was referred to as Mr President-elect for 30+ days before conceding he lost.
I would have thought the MSM would remember this and therefore not be referring to Biden in this way. Wouldn’t it be more sensible to ‘call it’ – but also to remind everyone what happened in 2000?
Is there any benefit from pretending Trump’s lack of an early concession is unique to him?
“I’m aware they are ‘calling’ it. This is strange. Why are they calling it” Because they think it is a closed deal. You might not agree but you are entitled to do so. Nothing new here BTW. That is what media does. Just like it called Brexit before the official count.
Yes – but you are not answering my question. I am aware the MSM is calling it. And yes – they are doing it because they think it’s a done deal. *Thats’s* the point.
Why do they think it’s a done deal when it isn’t? Have they forgot Al Gore being referred to as Mr President-elect for 30+ days before he conceded he lost?
I mean, the MSM could still ‘call it’ – as it looks done – yet remind people that things can change later. I’m just curious why, for example the BBC, is pretending that Trump’s lack of an early concession is unique to him.
If the BBC did mention, a – Al Gore’s lack of an early concession, and b – that 2000 shows how things could change, then Trump wouldn’t look so sad and stupid by calling in the lawyers. I’m suspicious that the BBC actually *wants* to offer a false picture of reality.
No, I’m referring to the 30+ days that Al Gore was described as Mr president-elect before he lost. I think that should be a lesson for the MSM – don’t you?
The problem is, by not learning how a candidate can be humiliated if it’s called for him too soon, Biden risks humilation, and so does the MSM. Usually the media outlets like to claim they were right.
I think it’s all very strange that the MSM is risking the wrath of many Dem supporters. they will certainly want to know why the MSM called it so soon – especially given the humiliation of Gore in 2000 when he was ‘Mr President-elect’ for 30+ days before conceding he lost.
Indeed. I have been enjoying it. I hope Trump fails in his attempt to win by legal goings-on. If he succeeds the howling at the sky from Biden fans will be almost too much to bear.
If he were to succeed, the military wings of the Democrat Party would burn the whole place down. What judge is going to risk that? First rule of the Law: there is no justice.
We have to accept it is a media coup. They made their announcement just as Giuliani was about to give his press conference. Before that the Dems had been telling us there would be no announcement until later this week. That press conference had to be drowned out. Just like the Laptop from Hell.
How on earth was it an advantage to get no coverage at all for the allegations and the witnesses? It was a huge advantage to the fraudsters because it covered up their misdoings, again.
The media monolith was focusing on the announcement it had just made, not on Giuliani. That was the intention, and premature though the announcement was, and unconstitutional, they gambled on getting away with it and making it a fait accompli.
Not a single state has elected the fraudsters yet, and the Electoral Colleges have not met. But a few media billionaires have pretended otherwise, to cover up the fraud.
Really ALL Opinion polls said Remain had Won a Landslide,Even Farage fell for it..Psychologically everyone loves a winner,So why not destroy All Polls now are suspect..it should be =6% either way not =3%
The BBC and Sky started saying “baseless” and “without evidence” far too soon to be credible. They have never before said that about allegations. More often than not they are reported with glee as fact. The Steele dossier for example.
It’s the same in the US. It’s very doubtful to me that they even looked for possible evidence before declaring them baseless. And good point about Gore, Red Asp.
Al B/Gore has made Billions from Green new Deal & lying on ”Scientific data”
Ian Cooper
3 years ago
I am most struck by how quickly the idea vanished that American politics would have to change tack in response to the continued level of support for Donald Trump. In just a few days the Democrats and their media have decided they can just rewind four years and pretend it never happened.
One argument made is that Trump has a unique connection with the voters, and I think it is true – sad but true. Would Trumpism survive without Trump? Especially since Trump was unable to deliver on his promises (Better and cheaper healthcare).
Trump delivered on more of his promised than any leader in living memory, with the possible exception of Thatcher. And he has actually brought down the cost of dugs and enforced the up-front pricing of all procedures by the insurance companies. (There is a name for this but I can’t remember it.)
Trump delivered on more of his promised than any leader in living memory,
Did he reform the immigration systems? Did he repeal and replace Obamacare Did he balance the budget? Did he release his tax returns? Did he build the wall with Mexico’s money?
The tax cut was Paul Ryan’s policy not Trump. He simply signed the bill. He boosted (and he did that) the economy with a massive tax cut paid by borrowing money. I am still waiting for the tax returns to be published!
And? It was delivering on something he said would be delivered. I’m far more interested in the tax returns of veteran members of Congress, and how a salary of less than 200K in one of America’s most expensive cities creates multi-millionaires.
The tax cut doesn’t “borrow money.” Who’s it borrowing from? It’s people keeping more of what they earn.
I am not asking what you are interested in or not. You are entitled to that position. I am simply asking the president to honor his word. He promised the American people (that is me BTW) that he was going to publish his tax returns. 4 years later…nothing! Surely a man like you that claims to be principled would demand the same thing?
“Who’s it borrowing from?” – Future generations of Americans. Do i have to explain you how fiscal policy (budget) works?
“Who’s it borrowing from?” – Future generations of Americans. Uh, no. Me keeping more of what I earn is just that. Future generations are no more entitled to my income than is the present generation.
Since you don’t understand fiscal policy, you’re not going to be able to explain it well. In a nutshell, though, money in has to be equal to or greater than money out. No one ever looks at the money out, which is always rising. Every home and business knows to cut spending when necessary, yet the federal govt acts as if it’s exempt from that.
Of course he is, did I say he was not? But there is a difference. Obama had to deal with the crash. Trump has to deal with C19. That is WHY i keep pointing out the deficits pre-C19 – not the current one.
The crash was not an eight year event. Besides, this began with Trump and the number of promises delivered. No president delivers on all; he’s delivered on quite a few. Obama delivered on health care, for better or worse.
Alex Lekas, that’s a good point. But it would be helpful to know how many of them entered as multimillionaires. Probably quite a few did, and so they would have to be separated from those who entered as relative paupers, and became very rich while “serving” in Congress.
1) It’s quite clear that the amount of Democrat voter fraud has been shocking, and enough to sway the (yet to be determined) outcome. How the country that produced Microsoft, Apple and Google has the voting mechanisms of a third world banana republic is unbelievable (not that the UK is any better, with our pencils and black/Muslim (not Oriental) postal fraud). 2) I’ve been saying that I think the US need to partition, as India and Pakistan did, into the Republic of Woke-istan and the United States of America… and I’m not joking. Also, I’d be very surprised if this election didn’t excite talks of Texas secession from The Union. Already there’s gossip about federal mask mandates – that’ll drive the wedge further.
1) it is not clear at all. Trump has provided (in court not Twitter) no evidence for that. 2) Woke-istan pays the bill, it is not Montana that contributes to the Federal budget or US technological dominance.
Big Tech has been to the fore in rigging the election through censorship. They are still at it. The voting mechanisms have also been manipulated by technology – “glitches”. It isn’t all manual tampering with the ballots.
The lesson we must learn is that postal voting is open to widespread fraud – we already knew from Birmingham, Tower Hamlets, and Peterborough etc – and we must do away with it except for seriously disabled people.
Postal Votes for Shift Workers,Infirm,people on holiday or business.. I think i got 24 Postal votes out of 389 in 2019 GE ..even though i’d said Postal fraud is a danger in mulitiple occupancy
Alan Thorpe
3 years ago
For views on American politics, in fact on anything, I turn to Thomas Sowell. He said of Obama that he prevented Jimmy Carter being the worst president ever, but I think that was before Trump. He said of Obama and Trump that he reached for the off switch when either appeared on TV.
He said recently: “If the election goes to Biden there’s a good chance that the Democrats will then control the two branches of Congress and the White House. And considering the kinds of things that they’re proposing, that could well be the point of no return for this country.” “What is frightening is how many people in responsible positions are caving into every demand that is made, repeating any kind of nonsense that you’re supposed to repeat. I do believe that we may well reach a point of no return. I hope that, of course, will never happen. But there is such a thing as a point of no return. The Roman empire overcame many problems in its long history but eventually it reached a point where it could no longer continue on, and much of that was from within, not just the barbarians attacking from outside.” He also said that Democrats pushing the concept of systemic racism in the U.S. reminded him of the propaganda tactics of the Nazis.
Nobody gets to the true like Dr Sowell and at 90 he has experienced more than most.
Yes, Thomas Sowell is a great man. Everyone should check out his interviews. For those who don’t know, he is a black academic who was among the first to see through all the progressive lies and nonsense, many decades ago.
“Point of no Return”- Maybe thats why, a few days ago, a vision entered my mind. My memory brought up the picture from years back when Krushchev banged his shoe on the lecturn at the UN and told the USA that their grandchildren will live under communism.
Indeed we see the same here with the left constantly accusing the Tories of wanting to starve children, introducing tax cuts for the rich etc., and as for their opinion of Brexit voters!
What, like not extending free school meals for Christmas break at a cost of a poxy £20M after spunking £1.5B on our “world-leading” test & trace programme that was in effect just a huge corporate welfare splurge to party donors and their companies? That sort of thing?
I honestly don’t think the Tories want to starve British children – it looks so bad at election time. I do think they’d be quite content to starve foreign children.
Chuck Burns
3 years ago
Another extremely well written article by Douglas Murray. I always enjoy reading his point of view in which I find agreement almost all the time.
Something Douglas seems to disregard is the possibility that the election was corrupt, rigged, and manipulated. There are now allegations, which trust worthy named sources say will show involvement of CIA operatives and CIA software and equipment used to manipulate the election results.
What we Deplorables and Trump voters want is assurance that the election results reflect the will of the people. That investigation is underway as we speak. If the outcome is in Bidens favor then we will simply say “God Bless America” and carry on for the next four years as best we can. If it is in Our favor we will smile and say “Thank You President Trump for saving us once again from the anti-America Left”.
‘There are now allegations, which trust worthy named sources say will show involvement of CIA operatives and CIA software and equipment used to manipulate the election results.’
Quite plainly there was mail-in ballot harvesting/laundering/fraud on a large scale. I guess it’s entirely possible that the CIA was involved as they are part of the swamp that Trump was challenging. Thus far he has got off lightly. The last President to ask questions about them was JFK…
Ironic The Demagogues sorry ”Democrats” have learnt from putin,Erdogan &several Sudan Elections?..
Dominic Straiton
3 years ago
Trump hasnt gone. If he does Trumpism isnt going anywhere. Its interesting to note that those in the UK denouncing Trump for his resorting to law have spent four years reverting to law to bring down democracy here. Its still all the same thing. A battle lost . The war remains the same since 1642.
Tony Conrad
3 years ago
Mr Murray is an asset to this country and to the west for his astute observations based on the truth. Jordan Peterson is another one who exposes lies and corruption without judging but keeping to the facts for the good of society. The real criminal in this matter is the fake news media and press who instead of reporting the facts of news have their own biased agenda. Under Communism or Nazism a free press was the first to go. It appears now that a lot of the press and media are already corrupted all or their own without any dictator pulling the strings.
Yes Tony, and bizarrely I have been called a “nazi” by the “left” and a “communist” by the “right” for even discussing Peterson’s ideas, let alone agreeing with any of them. Perhaps thankfully most of the punters haven’t heard of the priceless Mr Murray yet so I am at least able to mention his name in polite circles.
rosie mackenzie
3 years ago
This is such unoriginal, lazy journalism, suggesting there is a moral equivalence between what the Democrats have done and continue to do, and the predicament the Republicans now find themselves in as a result.
We have witnessed the Democrats mounting three coups against the President, and this, the final one, may succeed. There is no moral equivalence. That the fraud has been botched, and done in full view of the world, only serves to rub it in: this is an exercise of raw power, and the Republicans had better remember its lesson: they will never, ever be allowed in again.
It isn’t journalism. It’s an opinion piece. The difference between the Democratic Party and the Republican Party is that the the Democrats manage to disguise their hypocrisy whereas, with the Republicans, what you see is what you get (or at least the disparity is a whole lot narrower).
Inevitably, that kind of hypocrisy leads to dirty tricks. I sincerely believe the Democrats would stop at nothing to win this election and the media has helped them do so by suppressing tough questions and creating a near-consensus where practically no one dares to raise comments or questions, such as …..
1) Compared with live votes, there has been an unexpected surge of postal votes on this occasion, double that of previous elections (for various understandable reasons not easy to pin down). 2) As in previous elections, there has been a significantly higher Democrat percentage share of posted votes than of live votes 3) In this particular election the above-average percentage of Democrat posted votes, within an already much enlarged share of posted votes, has had the effect in several states of reversing what was a consistently stable lead for Trump gained from the live votes and which would have most probably have prevailed, albeit by a reduced margin as the postal votes weighed in. 4) Both types of votes (live and postal) have to be received by the voting time deadline. Yet the process of counting the postal votes begins after or lags behind the live votes. This alone destroys what ought to be a random distribution of votes across all voters in that specific voting area. It is statistically unhealthy to allow potentially biased lumps to appear in what should be a natural random representation of voter granularity. 5) The identity of the postal voter is detached from the paper showing the actual vote and from that moment on it is impossible to re-match. This detachment of voters’ identity from their actual vote is to preserve the democratic golden rule of an anonymous vote. Unfortunately this detaching also removes the safeguard of checking that the vote itself is not counterfeit, duplicated (if Democrat), lost, disposed of or placed “accidentally” an in an already-counted pile (if Republican). The idea to separate postal voters’ identity from their voting paper was made and implemented by the Democrat Party 6) In short, once detached, there is no way of checking the authenticity of the vote. Consequently, there is no way of checking the checker. The postal checker’s identity could easily be stamped on the voting paper but it isn’t. If it was, it would be a way to determine whether one postal checker’s batch of votes has yielded a significantly above average percentage of Democrat votes. 7) Surveillance or video-streaming cameras are popping up in some states but not others and are mostly theatrical rather than purposeful, to reassure voters, although quite of what is unclear, lots of blathering about voter privacy, but nothing of much substance about voter fraud. 8) Overseeing the counting by both parties is supposed to be permitted but this time there were incident(s) where Republican Party’s campaign staff members were barred from overseeing the process. 9) To cut a long story short, quality control of the voting process is poor, patchy and varies across the 50 states from conscientious to a bad joke. This from a country that likes to see itself as the cradle of democracy. I don’t know one way or the other whether Trump is a victim of an electoral-counting process contaminated by fraud, corruption or functional stupidity. But there are some suspiciously bad smells. And I do know that justice has to not only be done but be seen to be done. .
All my life Republicans/Conservatives told us (us as in Americans) that character matters. And then DJT took over the party and aside from Never Trumpers (I include myself in that group) the rest of the party (conservative movement) embraced DJT. How is that for hypocrisy. In relation to your comment about voting it should be no problem (especially in conservative states like GE, AZ) for Trump and his supporters to go to court and provide evidence. As of now Trump’s cases have been thrown out in GE, AZ and NV.
Yes, a small number of votes have been (even before Trump legal case) quarantined. But that is not fraud it is a constitutional question that i partly understand. 1 out of 4 (GE, AZ, NV) doesn’t look good!
Yes partly constitutional where the elecoral officiates seem to have been acting inappropriately. It raises the question of why were they ? I think Trumps lawyers will use it as evidence of Impropriety rather than fraud but which also carries legal consequesces.
“Yes partly constitutional where the elecoral officiates seem to have been acting inappropriately.” NO! It is a unresolved conflict about constitutional authority between Pen Supreme Court and Pen Legislators.
“ it is a constitutional question that i partly understand.” Whilst I agree it is not fraud but rather Impropriety and wont affect the outcome, given the margin. The Penn. Supreme court ordered them to change procedure so something was amiss. I argue for elecoral integrity not for for narrow partisanship of which you are an example. Your candidate won. Calm down and try to be objective.
Q1 Is quarantined a euphemism for not counted? Q2 Were they almost all votes for Trump? Q3 What do you mean by small number? Q4 Do you realise that a “small number” in Penn can flip the result?
And then DJT took over the party and aside from Never Trumpers (I include myself in that group) the rest of the party (conservative movement) embraced DJT. so the better option was Hillary? Really? A woman who sold the influence of her office as SoS is superior character to Trump. Yeah, go with that.
Trump, in office, did things conservatives historically cheer, from tax cuts to reduced regulations to originalist judges. There comes a point when the NT bit starts to look like a tantrum for no good reason. He wasn’t my first choice, either. But she was the last option, right after leaving that spot on the ballot blank.
1) tax cuts and massive budget deficits 2) originalist judges – those judges were found and nurtured by the Federalist Society (the Swamp as he says) and were shepherd through the process by McConnell while Trump was tweeting and watching Fox News. he would have appointed Judge Judy if she said something good about him on TV.
Let me quote Trump: ” Russia if you are listening”
Juilan Bonmottier
3 years ago
We live in truly paranoid schizoid times -to borrow a term from psychoanalysis.
The splitting is ferocious. Things are either all good, or all bad; one side idealised; the other denigrated. No nuance, complexity or ambivalence allowed or tolerated.
An example: a person, otherwise broadly supportive of gay rights happens to disagree with gay marriage. S/he is instantly condemned, by those who are splitting, as all homophobe -with no accounting for that part of the person who generally supports freedom of sexual choice. The whole person is denigrated.
In another case, a hitherto considerate, sane and normal person tweets something which disagrees with some aspect concerning race -they are all racist suddenly.
This is largely what is going on now on a massive scale.
The basis of paranoid schizoid behaviours is usually overwhelming fear and anxiety for one’s survival in the face of perceived existential threat, suffering and discomfort. Under such a perceived threat, the paranoid schizoid mind cannot cope with the overwhelming sense of painful truth; it creates splits as a defence.
Why are so many now resorting to such primitive and infantile responses? All adults split, but the ferocious splitting we are witnessing in the States seems out of all proportion. On the whole, we have never been more comfortable, nor so safe in terms of our capacity to continue existing.
One answer might be that we have been steadily infantilised over a period of some decades by those who wish to manipulate us to be increasingly dependent on whatever it is they are selling? This has stripped us of our human dignity, and our valuing of real freedom; and in many, the wish to keep striving for it. Have we become so demoralised as a consequence that we now cannot cope with pain and suffering so we split and project it all away?
I think Covid is not so much a disease but a symptom of these processes.
Quite correct, any opposition to homosexuality is now completely forbidden, even discussions regarding the severe sexual health problems associated with male homosexuality. This is in the interests of no one, neither homosexuals, or wider society.
The same tired old excuse for an argument. Most people have no problem in trying persuade people to give up smoking or gambling, in fact legislation has been formulated for that purpose. I do not oppose their “sexuality”, I oppose their behaviour which is undeniably dangerous and unhealthy. My personal view is that homosexuality is closely related to addiction a condition which is as yet unexplained by medical science…….as is the existence of the “gay” gene.
David Shaw
3 years ago
Another great Article, to go along with your books. The trouble, as you have pointed out so many times, people of the left are unable to read your article in the spirit it is intended. Look for instance at Andrew Harman’s comments below who immediately denounces your piece by saying it is full of ‘hyperbole’ and that ‘anyone who believes Donald Trump is the answer is seriously misguided’. Andrew, why don’t you re-read the article and say when Douglas said he was the answer? The one reason why so many people voted for Trump was because of the corruption of the Democrats. Why he got in last time was because of the cynical manipulation and corruption of the Clintons. And here it is again with the double standards of the left wing press over Biden! As Douglas says you can’t expect to kick someone in the teeth for 4 years and expect that person and his followers not to want some revenge; unless of course you are a liberal left winger because of course then you would be so wrapped up in your own entitlement that you would believe you are always right, the other side always wrong and therefore you are justified in telling others what to do and scarily what to think!
I was not referring to the article, I was referring to some of the comments below. Apologies if that was not clear. However, it seems you did not read the first part of my post if you are implying that I am of the left! I would also point out that I do not fall into a neat pigeon hole: I think lockdowns are a bad idea, I am extremely sceptical regarding masks and I think the modern left is hugely intolerant of dissent. As it happens, I like may of DM’s writings, although I think this one was not his best. The problem is so many are trying to present false dichotomies now. A plague on both their houses.
Simon Denis
3 years ago
You state the dilemma as elegantly as ever: should the right shrug its shoulders and try business as formerly usual, thereby handing an unfair moral advantage to a corrupt and unscrupulous left? Or should it do as it has been done by, at the risk of further fraying an already threadbare social peace? Into this should enter calculations of advantage and weakness, of course – and the moment you get into detail a way forward emerges logically. The right in today’s America is hamstrung by the alliance of Big Tech, social media and deep state. In a position of weakness, one plays the Fox, not the Lion. This was perhaps Trump’s essential mistake: he roared too openly and united his enemies. Therefore, the right should be focussed on going through the motions of democracy with measured language and principled well argued stands, whilst busily setting up new, alternative networks of communication. It should reframe its rhetoric in such a way as to hang on to its loyal voters from various communities and use whatever power it has to block, stymie, scrutinise and amend the Biden programme in Congress. Only once the chickens of left wing profligacy have started coming home to roost should it begin moving in with the more aggressive tactics. As Baden-Powell used to say: Be Prepared. Alas, poor Trump was not prepared; hence his defeat – whether by hook or by crook.
Significant that you refer to Baden-Powell’s advice to boy scouts. Your advice on the best way for the right to regroup and carry on the struggle displays all the naive honesty and good intentions of the caricature boy scout.
“…measured language and principled well argued stands…” (?!) Do you really believe that the electorate have the patience for that?
As for the “…the chickens of left wing profligacy…” coming home to roost ““ that has been going on for decades. The right fondly imagine that the people will be shocked and outraged as the damaging effects of socialist policies become apparent ““ yet it never seems to happen.
In fact the left become ever more extreme in their demands and denunciations. The public, cowed by moral bullying, grudgingly aquiesce ““ they just want to be left in peace to get on with their lives. How many people voted for Biden in the hope that with Trump out of the way the left would “lay down their arms” and let America go back to normal?
The prospects you indicate are all more than possible. But as you will see, if you peruse my words again, I allow for this. The problem then confronts us: have we the sheer muscle to rebel? Look at it another way – at the Battle of Bosworth, Richard III, suddenly outnumbered by the defection of Stanley, charged directly at Henry Tudor, hoping to knock him out and win against the odds. Alternatively, he could have beaten a hasty retreat – conceding the battle but prolonging the war. In a way, Trump has tried – is trying – the Richard III tactic. It seems perilously likely that he has suffered a similar fate – politically – and that, like the last Plantagenet, his reputation will be trashed. There are already rumours circulating in the press that he faces gaol. The new regime will be foul to its leading opponents, just as the Tudors were. So again I put it to you, in Machiavelli’s language – Fox? Or Lion? The Fox knows how to play “Boy-scout” when the dangers loom; much in the way that Robert Graves’ Claudius plays the fool – before becoming Emperor. Above all, those of us aware of all that is going on: the “great reset”, the climate change scam, the political use of migration, the advance of Marxist “social constructivism” and the smelly fiasco of this latest election, should prepare the ground for our next moves and do so in a spirit of patience and unity. Impatience, disunity and recrimination – you will recall – were the greatest enemies of resistance movements in occupied Europe. With the left in control of so much, we need to develop the same virtues – and fast.
“climate change scam” Yes, policies that deliver cleaner air and water are terrible right? I am a paleoconservative (google its meaning) but the problem with “us” is not the left is “our” INCOMPETENCE.
I think you mean “write about”. And a deep state is not a conspiracy, it’s a mentality, a disposition, a shared body of assumptions and ethics among a number of people, working together. It requires no conspiracy to be mobilised in resistance to any government policy of which it disapproves.
Garbage Left Marxists Piers Corbyn & Left Wing Michael Moore have clearly shown.climate is not warming,Carbon is vital for life to exist..& Scientific models have been falsified….Univ of east anglia in 2008/9 ..If you have Weather Apps on your phone after 3-4 days their Forecasts ARE inaccurate….Its Taxpayers that deliver Cleaner Water,Not Left or Right.. Forest fires have been made Worse in USA and Australia by ‘Green” Policies not allowing Firebreaks..
Where’s the fox? Does the main force of the conservative right consist of an army of keyboard warriors preparing the ground for the next move by grumbling about George Soros, cultural Marxism, woke lunacy, the MSM and (inevitably) “the long march through the institutions”?
Conservatives waste their days longing for a return to a world preceding the one which began with the social upheavals of the late 1960s. Meanwhile, the left wing forces they fear have taken the institutions not with a march but a stroll (so little resistance did they meet). Even Britain’s Conservative party now seeks woke approval.
The forces of the left will only be successfully countered by forward-looking political movements which offer a realistic chance of a better future for the young. Do you have a fox working on that?
In a simple world competence! You don’t respond to the left wing biased in MSM/Academia with Fox News (and talk radio) insanities but with hard facts and planning.
The record of the left when achieving power is abysmal. can you name one left wing economy which can support its people in an acceptable manner?Capitalism has given better living standards everywhere, but these standards are being undermined by the left who, allied to the mad “liberals” seek to overthrow the system through social measures.
Sweden is richer than UK and is far more socialists. When democrats in USA talk about socialism they are talking (wrongly in my thinking, USA Is not Scandinavia) about Denmark/Sweden. That is what they want. They want Denmark. I would think Germany would be a better example…but my opinion doesn’t matter.
None of these countries equate to the USA in social or political terms Jeremy, They are certainly not socialist though they do have a high tax economy, but the huge social problems of America or even the UK do not apply and they have additional oil benefits from the original boom in the seventies. The Squad don’t want democratic socialism.
Presumably the US is unaware that Denmark is in the process of slaughtering 17 million grey Mink, that would otherwise be gracing the bodies of millions of dog eating Han Chinese beauties?
Do you think I am speaking up for left wing economies? Not at all. I am just weary of all the knee-jerk comments trotted out by those keyboard warriors who despise the Left but flatter themselves that expressing a low opinion of the Left online is the same as somehow striking a telling blow against them.
Your contrasting of socialism against capitalism is already a well worn trope (that doesn’t mean I reject it!). If I had £5 for every time I have read or heard that opinion I’d be a wealthy capitalist myself.
Does it really help to label liberals as “mad” when, allied with the Left, they are consistently getting their way on the issues they campaign for? Surely that is a classic case of underestimating your opponent.
Their views on freedom of speech, parental control of children, gender, teaching on homosexuality and various other social issues can only be described as mad. Oh I forgot “equality of outcome” the maddest of them all.
“…can ONLY be described as mad.” That sort of rhetoric may give you some personal satisfaction (rather like a football supporter on the losing side jeering at a rival team) but it does not show any understanding of the success of the Left/liberal project. How have they so successfully captured the moral highground with beliefs you dismiss as mad?
If you can’t counter them with better arguments than that you may as well consign your conservative values to the dustbin of history.
Bosworth was lost well before the treachery of the Stanley’s.
The only competent fighting force on the battlefield were the French /Swiss mercenaries under command of Philibert de Chandee, specially hired for the occasion. They opened the attack (uphill) and fairly easily broke Norfolk’s charge and killed him at the start of the battle. From there on “it was all over bar the shouting” as they say.
Chandee was rewarded with one of the very few peerages (Earl of Bath) dished out by the notoriously parsimonious Henry Tudor, after the battle. A just reward, for a sterling performance.
Moral of the story? Trump should have ‘hired’ better support!
“Moral of the story? Trump should have ‘hired’ better support!” I agree with you but that requires competence. And Trump just wants to tweet.
Michael Whittock
3 years ago
I agree “American polarisation predates Trump by decades.” I was a student in the States 71-72 and was shocked by the depth of division I felt and witnessed way back then mainly over race and Vietnam. Internal divisions ultimately become an important factor in the decline and fall of empires. We may now be seeing that accelerating in the American Empire. Donald Trump is accused of fostering division. I believe he has uncovered it rather than foster it. He found a language which articulated what the great Unheard were thinking and brought it to the surface. I see a link between him and Mikhail Gorbachev in this regard. Although light years separate him from Trump politically and intellectually Gorbachev similarly laid bare the great weaknesses of the Soviet Empire which were so lethal it could not stand against their exposure for more than a few years. The American Empire is made of stronger stuff but its gradual demise as a superpower is advancing. I doubt that Biden/Harris will be able to stop it. They will find the polarisation symptom of decline particularly difficult to treat.
Kiran Grimm
3 years ago
Almost to illustrate Douglas Murray’s final paragraph there are signs that young far left democrats imagine that they are at the head of an occupying army. Something called The Trump Accountability Project has been initiated. They are calling for lists to be drawn up of “those who have been complicit in aiding Trump”. Sounds quite sinister.
sumidormann
3 years ago
Douglas – you are such an astute observer and you get so much of this right. (I think. Who knows what is right and what is wrong anymore?) What makes you dismiss the allegations of voter fraud so glibly then? If the media has conjured up such a faulty narrative before, often by omission, could they perhaps be downplaying fraud allegations too?
I found it strange how the media waited until the last moment to call a state while it looked like Trump was winning, yet so quickly declared a Democrat victory when Biden was winning. It’s almost like the media is the Democrat party.
Ferdinand Ficklewidget
3 years ago
It is to be hoped that internal divisions in his own country and opportunistic mischief making by China will keep President Biden fully occupied and spare us any moth-eaten stage-Irish shenanigans such as we used to receive from the likes of Senator Edward Kennedy. However, I am not optimistic.
John Woods
3 years ago
Does a Biden victory presage a calmer more understanding era of American political and civil life ? I’m afraid not. Leaving the republican response aside I say it for several reasons but the main one being the battle between the progressive left of the party and the Democratic establishment that Biden represents. Right now there is unity in the struggle to get Trump out but the left are expecting their reward in the cabinet and in policy. However, Biden said in September ,
“I beat the socialist. That’s how I got elected. That’s how I got the nomination,“ Biden added, referencing his overwhelming defeat of Sanders following a strong showing by Sanders in several early states. “Do I look like a socialist?“ Biden continued. “Look at my career, my whole career. I’m not a socialist.”. Trouble ahead and its is starting already with the anger over the losses in congress with each side blaming the other. Also, as Mr. Murray points out, BLM and Antifa both predate Trump and will continue under Biden but without the ralling call of “bad man Trump”.
After years of declaring half the country as racist or nazi or whatever else, there is no walking that back. The people suddenly wanting unity do not get absolution from treating fellow Americans like scum. I hope that the effort to destroy family relationships and friendships was worth it, but I don’t see going back. We’re not friends. We’re not like exes.
Exes can usually be civil and polite in mixed company because that’s how adults behave. Well, most adults. On occasion, they can be friendly, especially if there are children still in the home. They are almost never friends as the word is defined. They are exes for a reason. And this is where we are. Like I said, I hope those who contributed so mightily to this outcome believe the effort was worth it.
After years of declaring half the country as racist or worse, there is no walking that back. The people suddenly wanting unity do not get absolution from treating fellow Americans like scum. I hope that the effort to destroy family relationships and friendships was worth it, but I don’t see going back. We’re not friends. We’re not like exes.
Exes can usually be civil and polite in mixed company because that’s how adults behave. Well, most adults. On occasion, they can be friendly, especially if there are children still in the home. They are almost never friends as the word is defined. They are exes for a reason. And this is where we are. Like I said, I hope those who contributed so mightily to this outcome believe the effort was worth it.
griergg
3 years ago
Cast your mind back to the Obama years and you could safely conclude, that perhaps Trump wasn’t the precursor but he certainly did his best to separate people from the truth eg. The endless birther blather was obviously both a lie, and designed to appeal to people who were not happy that Obama was president. One doesn’t have to agree with who is leader but there’s a method in place to assuage those concerns, it’s called voting.
It’s hard to say whether or not this reference to Israel/Palestine or Bosnia is hyperbole but Bosnia is really a terrible analogy when you think about the history and so is Israel – these are not populations at each other’s throats due to disagreements over facts but borders and religion, unless you conclude that religion is a lie that one side doesn’t agree with the other on, and borders in both places have been contentious always which I guess, is true but past that”¦a stretch.
The Tea Party were pretty vocal and given an open platform by Fox News – it’s not hard to imagine a % of a population, not given to critical thinking, accepting at face value much of this clearly counter-factual rhetoric, particularly in the US where so many are prone to fall for huxterism.
What other advanced western civilization has fortune-tellers and crystal ball gazers behind neon lights in every town or city? Or so many cults masquerading as religions? There is seemingly a large enough % of the population that have such a tenuous grasp on reality to start with, that a deviation from fact is almost inevitable. This is not about politics per se it’s about opportunists from all points taking advantage of a population.
Alex Tickell
3 years ago
It must be remembered that a large portion of the Republican Party were part of “The Swamp” that Donal John so despised. They will be glad to see the back of the best President America ever had, and relax back into the mud and corruption; so I do not think that the Republicans will give Biden or his almost immediate successor Harris the treatment handed out to President Trump. Very few politicians are loved by their voters, in fact almost none in my long lifetime, but President Trump had the common touch and I flatter myself that it comes from his Mother who was born to a poor crofting family in the Isle of Lewis and who never lost touch with her roots or her native language. I think Donal John is too good for politics.
“…best President America ever had…” – Ike was a failure right? FDR? Teddy Roosevelt? When you ask Trump supporters what are his great achievement ? Judges is their universal answer! DO YOU AGREE? Well who found and nurtured these judges? The Federalist Society – aka The Swamp Who managed the process of appointing them and getting them through the Senate? Mitch McConnel – member of the Swamp right? It took years and years of hard work to find and nurture those judges…not angry tweets or watching hours and hours of Fox News! P.S. If it was up to DJT he would appoint Judge Judy in the Supreme Court…because he has seen her on TV.
Well Judges are important when faced with such an extensive and corrupt opposition, but Donal John was the first president who actively tried to implement the promises he made to his supporters in2016. Although incomplete, these are to me his greatest achievements. I find your tone rather disagreeable, a poor start for the new era of togetherness? Right?
“who actively tried to implement the promises he made to his supporters in 2016” NO! He promised to repeal and replace Obamacare! Where is it? He promised a tax reform that would increase taxation on rich people – like himself. We know from many sources (including Bannon) that it was Paul Ryan that developed the tax plan and pushed through a tax cut for rich people. He promised to balance the budget. Before Covid he borrowed in 3 years 2x as much as Obama did in his last 4 years. I can go on…. To get stuff done YOU (trump in this case) got to be COMPETENT.
If you read my comment, you will see the word “tried”, I did not say that he accomplished all that he promised. Given his treatment by the media, his lack of a proper majority and the dissenting members of his own Party he did exceptionally well In boosting the economy, cutting unemployment, fighting Globalism, starting dialogue with other powerful regimes, Moving forward the peace process in the Middle East(for which he should certainly have been awarded the N PP) many other achievements too numerous to mention Certainly ONE of the best!
He had a proper majority in his first 2 years. That is how he passed the tax cut – opposed by the democrats. His party under his leadership lost the majority in 2018. That wasn’t beamed from space! The American people voted against Trump. Unemployment was going down (easy to measure) year after year. He boosted the economy because he boosted the deficit – easy to measure again. I too can boost the economy if I run $1 trillion annual deficit. He also promised to publish his tax returns! Where are they? Or did MSM, Democrats, the Swap stopped him from publishing his tax returns.
In my youth I was a socialist, over the years the reality dawned upon me that all socialist economies finally collapse. Even the Soviet Union and China have been forced to adopt Capitalist economics. For Capitalism to work effectively, financial aspiration must be encouraged chiefly through tax cuts to industry, this can often be achieved by borrowing or printing money….BUT the money must be invested wisely so that the economy grows and profits flow back into the exchequer. Unfortunately socialists today understand that their economics are unworkable , so have moved on to the “identity politics” which gifted a hollow victory to Biden. The results of a Harris govt supported by “The Squad” are almost too horrific to contemplate.
I know nothing about the President’s tax returns, if there are irregularities they will presumably be dealt with, but it is unlikely that anything illegal has transpired. I run a small business and tax liabilities are variable according to income and expenditure. I was actually attempting to address your points regarding tax cuts to business and working class families. The president increased his vote in many poorer demographics, who seem to understand Capitalist economic slightly better than you do.
“I know nothing about the President’s tax returns…” Nice try! He promised to publish his tax returns. He has not done so. 4 years later he has failed to keep his promise. He lied – not very hard to know that. You just don’t want to.
Perfectly fine to cut taxes, but he ALSO Promised to balance the budget. He was running (before Covid) $1 trillion deficit. Obama’s deficit was c.$450 billion.
I remember being at an ancient Greek Temple and realising that the people who built it at the time probably had no conception of the fact their society and religion would collapse. I don’t disagree with you about socialist economies though I’d differ I’m sure on definitions of socialism – but I do think we need to bear in mind that the capitalist economic model probably won’t last forever either. We should think about what follows socialism/capitalism.
Well Mark I’m pretty sure I know what will follow and it will be Fascism where all freedoms will be granted by the state depending on ones degree of dependence. I also think family life and perhaps even the male of the species will be abolished, but even these things will pass away as you say. The pandemic is interesting as it illustrates how economies can be brought down through blind panic and political expediency and systems of government made unworkable…..much more likely than the Climate Change ruse. The planet will be here and in good heart long after humanity is gone.
Have you ever talked to people with medium to small businesses in the US. I did, and they told me, that Trump cutting all the regulation Obama put in their way, their businesses started booming. Result: More employment and more salary to employees.
I could talk (anecdotally as you did) to business OR i could check out the official statistics published by the current administration! What do you think is the more accurate source of news?
Jeremy I salute your indefatigability but when you are deaing with people who believe that “Obama shut down US manufacturing and outsourced jobs globally” you are wasting your time I’m afraid. The Unherd comments section is basically Brietbart with a slightly better vocabulary…….
I think we’re a long way from seeing if the peace process in the middle east has moved forward. I suspect what has happened is the further division of middle east actors along political lines rather than straightforward Arab vs Israeli. Though I concede Trump didn’t start any new wars.
andrew harman
3 years ago
My word, the rancour, hyperbole and bile on here. I am no leftist and I think the likes of Antifa have corrupted a noble cause; the same with ER and climate change. I am wary and concerned at the move of the Democrats to the left and i am contemptuous of the wokeflakes and their antipathy to free speech The obsession with identity politics and pronouns has carried them away from the lives and aspirations of so many people who need and deserve better.
However, anyone who thinks Donald Trump is the answer is seriously misguided. He has used these divisions to serve his own ego and any benefits that came from his presidency have been incidental and qualified. Moreover, they have been more than outweighed by the damage he has done. Yes, the media deserve chastisement but he has dubbed anything contrary to his own interests as fake news, a dangerous thing to do. I don’t know how true the allegations against him are but would anyone be surprised if they turned out to be true? All Trumps life has has been about self promotion and self aggrandisement; why should that have changed?
I don’t agree, conservatives must fight fire with fire and Donal John has the guts(ego?) to motivate even the staid centre right. For years we have stood back and watched our values trashed and our children indoctrinated; enough is enough if we do not get behind a charismatic figure like The President we may as well lay down and die. I for one, don’t want to see the future projected by the very powerful “liberal” elite come to fruition. If Donald is really finished, a new Talisman will surely arise ……but we must not give in.
Tom Jennings
3 years ago
Adding to the fun, “democracy advocates” have started the Trump Accountability Project. The purpose is to develop a list of Trump enablers, presumably to punish them or potential employers. Biden calls for unity and the left plans revenge.
fitzangus
3 years ago
Brilliant as always.
mccool0211
3 years ago
This is an interesting article and I agree with the general premise. I should start by clarifying that I am not a Democrat or a Republican. I tend to vote conservative in the UK if that helps.
Although I agree with many of the points made above I can’t get myself to the point where I can see that both sides are equally contributing to the problem and I think there are a number of corrections that need to be made to the points above to make this clearer.
1) Trump didn’t call all Mexicans rapists. This is correct and I’m not sure that anyone has ever claimed that he did. He claimed that most of the Mexicans that are coming to America illegally are rapists and murderers. A claim that I suspect was made with no data to back it up.
2) The Democrats came up with fake allegations about Russian interference in the election. These allegations were not false and in fact they led to the prosecution of a number of people in the US connected with the US including the Chair of the Trump election campaign (Paul Manafort).
3) Both sides are attacking each others family. I agree that this should be avoided but I feel less sympathy with family members who are employed in senior government positions.
I don’t claim that the Democrats are innocent here and I believe the lack of action as a result of the claims made against Hillary Clinton’s email issues were partisan and too dismissive of what was a real issue.
The Trump team and the Republicans have taken the problem to a new level. in 2016, Clinton accepted the result and conceded the election. Obama participated in a full transition. While I accept that Trump didn’t start this and was more a consequence that a cause, I still believe that a return to a more civil political discussion will be possible when he departs the White House.
You’ve saved me having to type my response. This is disappointing from Douglas Murray. The Mueller inquiry found repeated examples of the Russian state meddling in the 2016 election to try and produce a result favourable to them. That’s documented in the report. The direct link between the Trump family and Russia was not definitively established. However, a cursory glance of Mueller’s findings can leave you in no doubt what he thought about Trump’s behaviour.
The one line comment about Trump and Ukraine would give some readers the impression that the impeachment was about a clumsy telephone call. It wasn’t. Douglas Murray knows that.
David Waring
3 years ago
Ah Big Tech Companies The ones like Fakebook which employs failed Politically Correct Politicians? Big Tech means Lockheed Martin or Boeing surely.
Are you jealous that you didn’t get the Facebook job?
robert scheetz
3 years ago
The photo says it all. Trumpism signifies the rise of Flyoverlandia. Himself was sadly too too imperfect a vessel, and the red center has an whole congeries of motives, some of which do it no credit; but, its defiance of the mega-metro coastal cultural with all its billionaires and corrupt institutions supporting the Big Lie articulated By Douglas Murray bears comparison with the long heroic, quixotic tilting of Eire against John Bull.
Your usage “elites v people” is artful. Though, polemics aside, there is an whole sociology could be brought to bear to discomfit your irony.
However, my point was that Flyoverlandia, exploited, abandoned and despised for onto 40 yrs while all the gov is directed at increasing the wealth and cultural ascendancy of the coastal cosmopoloi (and secondarily, their interior satellite metro areas), is justly aggrieved.
But, amazingly, though deprived of effective representation and expression, they did break through with the crude gesture of Trump.
annettehowey
3 years ago
This canadian has so enjoyed watching Trump drive the liberals crazy. If as you said that this presidency is going to be as much fun, I say bring it on. I could care less who’s president. It’s not my country.
JP Edwards
3 years ago
Imagine it had been Trump and his son rather than Biden, it would’ve been splashed all over the news 24/7 for weeks.
The question now is, after the dust settles are the press going to own up and hang their heads in shame.
How many truth tellers are there left in that profession or have they all become their mortal enemy.
Jane Jones
3 years ago
American citizen here.
Basically I agree with Murray, up to “irresponsibly.” WTF? “Irresponsible” are the media for calling a winner when this is still in contention. “Irrsponsible” is the collusion of the media and Big Social Media to suppress news and to cancel both social media accounts and the sitting president himself when he calls a prees conference. It it pretty interesting that the farcical impeachment attempt was unleashed by a perfectly anodyne phone call between Trump and Zeleny or whatever his name was, the subject being possible Biden corruption in Ukraine. Now the same crew of conspirators attempt, again, to suppress and censor the President in the carrying out of normal presidential duties—which include taking steps to investigate and prevent corruption (in this case, of the results of the election).
Are you saying, sir, that if Trump is the victim of a lying and censorship campaign or of election fraud, he has to recuse himself from his presidential duties and prerogatives and make like it’s all OK with him if both he and the country of which he is the Executive get screwed and he is just going to pull his punches and let Dem and media bullies kick sand in his and the nation’s face in order to look “gentlemanly,” a la Al Gore and John Kerry? ? That is really weird, man . . .
I am not fan of Trump but I am also not dumb and not a fan of wimpos who will not defend themselves and the country. Go kick your sand elsewhere!
Last Jacobin
3 years ago
On the subject of Johnson’s racist comments about Obama – Johnson was being racist. He was saying that Obama’s views on what was best for his country, which he was President of, were influenced more by his race rather than his intellect or judgement. He was not saying his understanding of events could be influenced by his heritage – he was saying it was the prime motivation behind his understanding.
It would be equally racist to say Joe Biden’s views on Ireland are influenced by the fact his ancestors came from there.
On the subject of Trump’s comments on Mexicans. He said ‘They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.’ He did not say all Mexicans are rapists – and that is not what his opponents claim. He used his position to make a statement that he knew would be understood by racists to mean he supported their belief that a higher proportion of Mexicans are criminals than white people.
“It would be equally racist to say Joe Biden’s views on Ireland are influenced by the fact his ancestors came from there.” You’re saying Biden’s Irish ancestry can’t influence his views on Ireland?
I’m saying that if you disagree with someone you argue with them on points of fact and analysis. You don’t use their family history, race, heritage or religion as an argument.
“I’m going back to Ireland ““ the country from which my ancestors hailed, and a country whose independence the Easter Rising set in motion, 100 years ago this year. It is my first dedicated trip to this nation as Vice President ““ during which I’ll meet with the country’s leaders, discuss issues of trade, economic recovery, migration and refugee policy, and other national security challenges, and celebrate our shared heritage. Our shared values of tolerance. Diversity. Inclusiveness.” He seems to be claiming shared values based in large part on his heritage. Also, which race in particular would the -ists be dissing?
There is a picture of Biden shaking hands with a convicted terrorist and the leader of the political wing of the IRA while this organisation was bombing civilians and members of our govt.
True; but that man made peace. Think of Arafat, Peres and Clinton. You make peace with your enemy not with your friend. Donald Trump and the North Korean monkey?
Fact is Biden was shaking hands with Adams, who denies to this day being an IRA leader despite overwhelming evidence to contrary, AND with his arm around Rita O’Hare, an IRA fugitive from justice. The IRA ‘made peace’ mainly because they were almost defeated in NI in the 1990’s. To this day their nasty Marxist thugs mete out ‘justice’ beatings in NI while sinn fein grease their way to power in the Republic.
So North Koreans are not people that Trump made peace with, they are monkeys. I understand now why everything you say is downvoted – because you sir are a c**t.
It seems a bit of a stretch to believe that people’s decision making is not influenced by their ethnicity, when if we are to believe the current culture, that the colour of a persons skin has such a huge impact on their life experiences, so no I don’t believe that Johnsons comments were racist.
There you go again Mark – making Douglas Murray’s point for him. There was nothing racist in Johnson’s comment about Obama’s part Kenyan heritage. If he said Ghandi was anti British because he was brought up under colonialism, would that be racist? Or how about saying the same thing about Irish people being anti-British? Even the Guardian has asked the same question – ie could Obama’s part Kenyan ancestry reshape UK/US relations?
It is not racist to say any of these three things. This continual watering down of a word which had four different meanings anyway, isn’t advancing political discourse. And don’t always imagine other people are thinking what you are thinking.
He did not say all Mexicans are rapists – and that is not what his opponents claim. Actually, it is what his opponents claim. It’s what they’ve have claimed for four years now. And what in that statement is untrue? There are drugs coming from Mexico. There are criminals among the illegals who enter the country. By your reckoning, all the Latinos voting for Trump must be self-hating.
He used his position to make a statement that he knew would be understood by racists to mean he supported their belief that a higher proportion of Mexicans are criminals than white people. This is you projecting what you believe. We have enough home-grown criminals without importing more.
The Kenyan antipathy towards (imperialist?) Britain is not racist and neither is recognising it.
Mark Corby
3 years ago
Perhaps Mr Biden should consider calling himself ‘His High Mightiness, the President of the United States and Protector of Their Liberties’, just as George Washington did?
Sidney Eschenbach
3 years ago
Douglas, it’s difficult to count the falsehoods, but let me try. 1. No one ever said that Trump said that ‘all’ Mexicans. He didn’t. He said that the Mexicans are sending people with problems, among them rapists. 2. He did not in fact, condemn white supremacy in his original comments about Charlottesville, and like much of what Trump says, it was cleaned up by a statement from the White House two days later. The problem he has is that, for example, he denied knowing who David Duke, the head of the KKK, was, during his campaign, which is a clear lie because he made prior comments about him, on the record, when Duke was running for senator and also governor of Louisiana… which contextualizes his comments about Charlottesville. If Bernie Sanders said he didn’t know who Fidel Castro was, I doubt few would find it credible, and would suspect his related comments disavowing Antifa were believable. 3. The fact that your two ‘examples’ of the left believing lies about Trump are both squishy strawmen start your argument off poorly to say the least. 4. Hunter Biden’s laptop. Dourlas,f this story were even marginally believable, don’t you think that either Bill Barr’s DOJ or Chris Wray’s FBI, both Trump appointees, would have picked it up and run with it? What could have been better than to discover that the opponents holier than thou feet… are made of clay? Because you know that they would have attacked had there been any opportunity to do so, it’s now your job to turn yourself into a pretzel to explain why… and your answer, incredibly, is because the “left” and ‘social media’ covered it up. Really? That’s the best you’ve got? The left and social media covered it all up… so that the DOJ and the FBI couldn’t find anything there to actually investigate? Wow… they are REALLY good!! Who knew that Facebook and Twitter could control all knowledge so perfectly!! As to why no one paid much attention to the NY Post, the famous bastion of all that’s right and truthful you leave as a mystery as yet not understood. In short, your example of Hunter Biden’s laptop is indeed a good example of different facts that form the basis for the opinions held by the left and right, and you might start by putting the koolaid bottle down and simply searching any reputable fact checking organization and they all say the same thing; it’s nonsense. That you believe it is, as I said, a perfect example of why we’re so divided, because to believe that you must, perforce, believe that ALL the credible news organizations, ALL the credible fact checking organizations, and the DOJ and the FBI are wrong. What, Douglas, do you think the chances of that are… that you’re right, and they are all wrong?
I could go on, but why. Anyone who believes such things is beyond reason, beyond facts… the very thing that you find at the bottom of our divisions as a nation. You, Douglas, are the problem.
No one you say. Many may agree that CNN is ‘no one,’ but that’s really true:
Trump basically called Mexicans rapists again – CNNPoliticswww.cnn.com “º 2018/04/06 “º politics “º trump-mexico-ra… Apr 6, 2018 ” President Donald Trump wants to be a provocateur again. Why else would he bring up his specious and repeatedly disproven claim that …
“If Bernie Sanders said he didn’t know who Fidel Castro was” Bernie praised Castro. Again, let’s consult the evidence: Election 2020: Bernie Sanders’ praise for Fidel Castro angers …www.usatoday.com “º politics “º elections “º 2020/03/13 Mar 13, 2020 ” Bernie Sanders continues to praise Fidel Castro’s literacy program in Cuba, but those who lived through it saw more propaganda than …
The same person who took issue with “all Dems” when I should have used “many” drops a couple of whoppers and calls the author a liar.
Sean Robinson
3 years ago
A Trumpian display of sly dishonesty here. I read Unherd articles precisely because most contributors provide actual ideas and perspective worth considering. Few are so nakedly partisan (and in this chap’s case, for reasons unknown – maybe to flog books, I suppose…). Aside from dismissing whole swathes of recent history because they inconveniently interfere withe the “The Left lies and distorts more than the Right in America” narrative, a few points really rankled, so a few thoughts in reply:
One can read the transcript of Trump’s escalator speech ( https://time.com/3923128/do… ) and see clearly that the implied equation is “Mexicans = rapists”. Tone and context provide the emphasis even in the absence of the word “all”. The after-the-fact, offhand, addition of “and some are good people” is at best an after-the-fact attempt to undo some of the initial blackballing of the group.
And as for that C’ville statement – it was issued a day after the initial refusal to engage on the matter of whether he would condemn supremacists. ( https://qz.com/1053270/full… ). And read out verbatim from the Teleprompter with all the sincerity of Mitch McConnell’s justifications for scuppering the Garland nomination.
And the Hunter laptop? Take a look here ( https://www.vox.com/2020/10… ) and consider whether there ever was an actual laptop, or if the repair-store story was concocted to mask another hack. Either way the details that have actually emerged about the contents of the supposed email exchanges are far from damning of Joe Biden.
I’ve had the luck to live in three countries, getting a chance to compare the political media first hand. No outlets are as partisan and untruthful as American right-wing (I refuse to dignify them with the label “conservative”) TV, radio and internet personalities. They’ve been lying to themselves and their audiences for so long that I’m not sure they know they’re lying. It’s disheartening to see that level of dishonesty in a UK-based portal like UnHerd…
alistarb
3 years ago
Many Hispanics are voting for Trump because the falsely believe that a Biden Presidency equates to the same type of socialism that ruined Venezuela. It isn’t because they overlook his racists views, towards Mexicans. They just care more about the US economy than a racists president. I don’t understand the controversy over Hunter Biden’s laptop. A business owner decided to illegally submit private data contained on the laptop to Rudy’s lawyer for what? Because he was illegally snooping around on the private hard drive of one of his clients and took it upon himself to share it with others? And then somehow the FBI has the right to investigate the laptop based on what suspicion? The illegal breach of privacy committed by the store owner? It would be a bit like a cop just coming into your house for no reason, finding some drugs and then watch the case get dropped because it is illegal to just snoop around someone’s house if you have no evidence a crime has been committed, even if one was. The right to privacy in this case is more important than the crimes it turns out were taking place in many cases. Are we going to start allowing private citizens to just harass others and infringe on their privacy because hey they’re left wingers so they MUST be doing something wrong. And if we happen to discover some of them were doing something wrong well now in the new right wing America, the breach of privacy used to discover the crime is now no longer relevant because the right has decided to change the law for their own benefit and to target their opponents. That doesn’t sound like the kind of American anyone wants to live in because it goes both ways. How is this laptop scenario any different? So his son his a shitbag for smoking crack and whatever. Is that Biden’s responsibility? What does that have to do with Biden’s ability to run the government? You don’t even need to use the Russian disinformation theory to tear down the laptop storyline the right wants to push as a means to undermining Biden’s run for office, which is irrelevant now anyway. And so Biden was using his position to justify some business deals overseas. Trump and his friend have this problem with hypocrisy and petty vindictiveness. Their reasoning goes like this. The left and the media persecuted Trump and his followers for doing something. But Trump didn’t think there was anything wrong with what they were doing. But then, they decide that even though they saw no problem with, say, making money off your political position in other countries, now they are upset when they see Biden purportedly do it and they want justice? Two wrongs don’t make a right. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think any politician is perfect. I know Biden will fail, will break promises, etc. But I think we need a president that takes global warming seriously, and recognizes the trillions we stand to lose by 2100 if we pretend its all a Chinese hoax and keep kissing the ass of the oil lobbyists, is going to bite us all in the ass. The left’s position on global warming and their bid to create a carbon negative economy is, in the long-run, far more intelligent and realistic than just short-term profit at the expense of the future. I think too that we need a president that respects science and doesn’t approach it like your drunk Boomer Uncle at thanksgiving who watched some Facebook meme on how science is an atheistic conspiracy to make money off vaccines meant to monitor the world through 5G nanobots in your blood and other such right wing tripe.
Bill Gaffney
3 years ago
Doubtful if the Repugs (I am a former DemocratSlaveryParty Stooge who left in 79 and went Republican) will do much of anything. Except roll over. Heard today that Mitt Romney had been offered Helf and Hooman Svcs by Groper Joe. The DemocratSlaveryParty is the vilest group on the planet, second only to the ChiComs, but as the DemocratSlaveryParty and Groper Joe are in the pocket of Xi the second isn’t much.
in_de_vise
3 years ago
These are your same liberals that they are a one way liberals… but not when it comes to the others that have different ideas than them. In that instance they switch to full-on commies and want to annihilate you. If they have nothing to hide, why so quickly move on without allowing those in doubt a fair review of what they think might have gone out of wack?
alistairgorthy
3 years ago
I’m no longer surprised by what Douglas posts, just disappointed. His has been a very public and quick journey from that of an independent, if somewhat mischievous, commentary, to that of full grown cheerleading for Trump and the authoritarian politics and distain for the rule of law that he embodies. So now Douglas has joined the fray in undermining belief in the American democratic process he supposedly applauds. And all for the support of someone who appears to manifest all that is criminal and unseemly in US politics. It will be a position that will be hard for him to live down.
I assume me refers to a holdover of (justified) resentment of the colonized toward the colonizers.Your cluelessness is just another symptom . . .Jeez . . .
Well … Jeez, Jane. I and me in the same sentence. You do have a thing for a possessive pronoun, don’t you? In fact, all your assumption does is make u come across as an ass. Clever girl!
My ”’cluelessness” is just another symptom of what exactly… Jeez .…?
M Blanc
3 years ago
President Trump is not only not being irresponsible for pointing out to the American people that this election was stolen from him by the Democrats, it would be a monumental dereliction of duty for him to not do so. “But it will tear the country apart!” The country is already torn apart. Most of us on the so-called right are not yet ready to engage in the rioting and looting and burning that the Left so enjoy, but it is now entirely clear to us that the electoral system is now permanently rigged against us. We will now act outside of electoral politics.
President Trump (and his supporters like you) are lying. If he has the evidence (not BSing in twitter) he can go to court and show the whole world how he “won”. As of now, aside from Pennsylvania case (judge Alito less than 8,000 votes that are not opened) all his cases have been thrown out – FOR LACK OF EVIDENCE.
andrewdevinerattigan
3 years ago
Let’s not also forget the upcoming ideological purity battles between the radical woke left within the Democratic party and a semi-woke centre left Biden White House. Left wing infighting is vicious. His arse will barely be getting warm in the Oval office before he’s being denounced as just another privileged white male and Harris is being referred to as an ‘Oreo.’ Harris & Biden have proposed some crazy left wing policies, whether they enact them or are even able to with a Republican controlled congress wont matter to the radical left within their party because they aren’t near as radical as the growing woke mob want them to be.
Liz Walsh
3 years ago
Absolutely spot on. The disingenuous call for unity, reconciliation etc all decode in actuality to “submit or die”. In a nation where the Fourth Estate has become the Fifth Column, a strongly alternative agora is evolving.
pearce.douglas
3 years ago
I’ve just had a comment placed under moderation. Does the dark blue moniker ‘U’ indicate others who have also been moderated? I find this somewhat disturbing as my comment was not defamatory, racist , homophobic, or misogynistic. Neither was it a tribute to the Klu Klux Klan or in any way a sleight on LGBQT or JK Rowling’s hairstyle … or anything else JK, for that matter. It contained nothing acrimonious or libelous about Donald Trump’s far-right comb-over and as the chances of hundreds of unHerd subscribers suddenly flagging only my third comment is as likely as Douglas Murray endorsing conversion therapy for his dog thus allowing him to marry a canine, I am, quite frankly, at a loss why my comment was moderated. After all, as Brian of Nazareth pointed out . ”You’re (we’re) all individuals.”
Tom Jennings
3 years ago
The New York Times is reporting that they have called officials in all 50 States and the officials report no evidence of voter fraud. One more drop of bitterness in the cauldron.
Andrew Baldwin
3 years ago
Great blog as usual by Douglas, but I disagree with him on voting fraud. Biden himself said in October: “”We’re in a situation where we have put together, and you guys did it for our … for President Obama’s administration before this….We have put together, I think the most extensive and inclusive voter fraud organization in the history of American politics.” The Democrats made excuses for him. Joe’s brain is fried and he will say the craziest things. We know that, but in this case, this really looks like an inadvertent, damaging admission of the truth. Trump has 232 electoral votes now if one puts North Carolina in his column now. It seemed inexplicable that Pennsylvania with its 20 electoral votes, did not go to him after Biden’s promise to destroy the US oil industry, when Pennsylvania is such an important shale oil producer. Arguably Trump lost the state because the Supreme Court supinely refused to hear a case appealing a decision of the Pennsylvania Supreme Court to strike down Pennsylvania’s own law to only accept mail-in votes until election day. If the Supreme Court, which now includes Justice Amy Barrett, does hear the case and rules these votes are illegal, they are supposedly sequestered and can be omitted from the count. If all this happens, the state could still go to Trump. If the Supreme Court rules in Trump’s favour, and the sequestered votes are not sufficient to give Trump the win, many people will conclude that Philadelphia being the cesspool of Democratic voter fraud that it is, all of the late votes were not properly sequestered as they should have been, and Trump would have won if they had been. In any case, there were other issues with the balloting in Pennsylvania, e.g. differential treatment of cured ballots, that the Supreme Court probably cannot do much about that likely unfairly hurt Trump’s count related to Biden’s. The other five states in contention all had no-excuse-needed availability of mail-in ballots, and Nevada, whose economy stood to be hit hard by basement dweller Biden’s strict lockdown policies, sent mail-in ballots to everyone on the voters’ list, opening the doors a little wider to voter fraud. As the legal affidavits alleging fraud continue to pile up in those states, surely it is simply realistic to think that Trump would have picked up at least 18 of their 59 electoral votes, which would be all he would need, with Pennsylvania, to win a second term, if there had not been voter fraud related to mail-in ballots. Finally, let’s not forget that for 2016, when mail-in ballots weren’t much of an issue, Professor Jesse Richman calculated that Trump’s voting margin across the country against Hillary Clinton was hurt by 830 thousand votes due to illegal voting by non-citizens, a figure that rises to 900 thousand if one replaces the Census undercount adjustment for illegal immigrants, 10%, with a quite possible 20% estimate. This is the elephant in the room no-one seems to have noticed. Possibly it is because the McCarthy style witch-hunt organized against Richman by left-leaning academics has scared people away from looking at non-citizen voter fraud. They seem to have scared away Richman himself, who, as far as I know, hasn’t published anything on the issue since he defended his November 2016 analysis of the 2016 election in March 2017.
billhickey105
3 years ago
All Joe Biden has to do to start the healing is acknowledge his countrymen’s suspicions and say he fully supports President Trump’s legitimate requests for recounts and voter fraud inquiries. Period.
That’s what a statesmen who is trying to forestall predictable catastrophes would do.
Kathy Leicester
3 years ago
He isn’t “gone,” Douglas. And he won’t be: Trump won the night of the election, and we’re busy proving it in court.
Other than the faulty premise, the rest of the article is dead on.
samsa
3 years ago
I adore Murray but am very disappointed in this article. One would hope that Murray, of all people, would be above the idiotic tendency to use “divisiveness” and “polarization” to describe a situation that they clearly know is neither.
There is no polarization. The majority of the US is still where it’s always been politically, right near the center. If anything, the alleged “right” (I hate the term) has drifted closer to center and center-left, conceding on the welfare state, and turning a blind eye to blatant crimes in the name of conciliation.
The problem is not polarization. It’s that an unchecked government class has used censorship terrorism to expand its ability to get the public to pay it to engage in censorship and to encourage or at least turn a blind eye to politically expedient terrorism. All in the name of eliminating law enforcement, borders, individual liberties, and indeed the Constitution itself.
Murray clearly knows this, because he describes the situation in detail. And yet he concludes that those of us who, like him, recognize it are simply one of two “sides” in a process of “polarization.”
That’s moronic. Imagine that a large government class began insisting that 2+2=5. Only the most Stockholm-syndromed among us would start conceding that, well, all right, maybe 2+2=4.5 to meet them halfway. Bull. The answer is 4. Period. And to recognize that fact is not polarizing or divisive. Those who’ve decided to believe it’s 5 have separated themselves from reality, perhaps. But the rest of us are where we’ve always been, in reality.
After all he’s been through, for Murray to suggest that only a small fraction of Americans think there’s election fraud is not only insulting to our intelligence and his, it’s outright wrong. Every rogue state around the world is celebrating Biden’s “victory,” while their own beleaguered citizens assail us American citizens (where they’re able to communicate with us at all, usually because they live here) to PLEASE see to it that this country does not go the way of their own.
This is why I detest the Unity 2020 movement, “recovered” leftists who obviously aren’t as recovered as they think, and self-proclaimed “conservatives” or “classical liberals” who think it’s measured and conciliatory to portray what’s happening as though the entire normal, sane world of laws and freedoms just became divisive and extreme.
Douglas, you can do better. Now go clean your room!
Ah, another who believes “the rest of us” are seeing it clearly – sweet folly! I give thanks every day for the “moronic” Mr Murray who has almost a child’s wisdom in his ability to describe things just as he sees them – indeed even just as “moron” would see them if s/he would simply give up their political bias. Yes clean your room, but beware you don’t blind yourself with an intoxicating disinfectant.
Sean Booth
3 years ago
The US electorate will get what they deserve. It will be interesting to see how they enjoy the economic and social demise of a once great power.
sharon johnson
3 years ago
Until the election of 2016 I had only the vaguest sense that the United States had a two party system. My family were Democrats, as were my friends, and my first husband and his family. And then came 2016 and Hillary. She was a bridge too far. I’d done volunteer work on the Bill Clinton ’92 campaign (he was very cute and friendly) and was asked to attend a small gathering of supporters to meet Mrs. Clinton. One hour in a small room with 12 fellow travelers and Hillary, arm on the corner of a lectern, talking. And talking. Without inflection. Without joy. Without basic signs of humanness. More than a little creepy. And then she left. Poof. I totally understood the Monica thing. I sympathized with Bill. I had to wait decades before she publicly called half the country Deplorables, but I knew in 1992 that’s how she felt about we the people. So I voted for Trump and have enjoyed every minute since.
kinelll086
3 years ago
Pedantry ! Trump said about Mexico “they are sending all their rapists to us” suggesting that the Mexicans crossing the border are rapists. He said of the white power demo “there are good people on both sides ” I agree with Douglas on most points but he seems to have planted his flag on the side of trump. Me ? I have no flag, a plague on all their houses
Jack Ingham
3 years ago
“Take two of the claims about Trump that most enraged the Left in recent years: that he described all Mexicans as rapists…”
He didn’t quite say that, here’s what he said;
“They’re bringing crime. They’re / their rapists.”
Yeah, he never said anything inflammatory about Mexicans. OK. Don’t think it’s mandatory to be left-wing to see that that’s objectively blatant divisive rhetoric.
But America is divided anyway, so what’s a few more lazy fear-mongering tropes from a Presidential candidate thrown into the mix going to do in the grand scheme really?
Nun Yerbizness
3 years ago
not only did Trump say “…Mexicans as rapists and that he refused to condemn white supremacy…” he has relentlessly reiterated it from the podium and in his many tweets and retweest.
Jeremy Smith
3 years ago
Nice try Douglas DJT is by any stretch of imagination a degenerate. As president of USA he accused his predecessor (Obama) of killing Team Seal 6 and faking the death of Bin Laden. He shamelessly lied about his inauguration crowd – how pathetic! He supported (until the end) the senate candidacy of Roy Moore, a man accused by 7/8 women of sexual assaults. At the time of the assaults some of those women were underage. Ann Coulter (conservative enough?) on twitter about DJT: – the most disloyal person ever – blithering id*ot – disloyal actual re*ard – a complete m*ron
The list goes on.
omarsiddiquee
3 years ago
Hitler didn’t invent anti-semitism, but he sure as hell elevated it to new levels. Republicans rejected President Obama for being black since before Trump declared his run for office. They depicted him as an African tribal in effigy, attacked his wife. Trump entered into the race by claiming he had proof of President Obama being born in Kenya.
Republicans and conservatives are hateful and bigoted. There’s no blame on liberals for that. This rhetorical nonsense about how Trump is somehow the fault of liberals, is the Right exploiting the liberal tendency to self-blame and reflect, a bit too much for their own good. What incivility continues, is the product of Right wing thought. No different than the neo-Nazis or other fascist movements.
Fraser, I think the expression is “Not all Republicans are racists, but all racists are Republicans.” As you point out, there were people who voted Obama and then Trump. What that proves, however, is that you do not have to be a racist to vote for Trump, but all the racists in fact did. If you don’t believe me, find one… just one of the Proud Boys, the Aryan Nation, the KKK, etc, who didn’t vote for him. I’m waiting.
all the racists in fact did. weren’t you just lecturing me for using an absolute re: Dems and the inauguration? Every time a black person dared step out of the leftist line, the crackdown was nasty and it was harsh.
The foolishness of this talking point is compounded only by the ignorance of Latinos and blacks within the Proud Boys. Richard Spencer, by the way, endorsed Biden.
Critical Race Theory isn’t Repub work. Nor are constructs like privilege, labeling math and science and other subjects are racist, and that ridiculous Smithsonian thing that painted everyday things like hard work and personal responsibility as white constructs. That had to be a surprise to the millions of black people who go to to work and are responsible. But, sure; everyone else is racist.
So I’m going to take a wild guess here and assume that you think that the statement “Black Lives Matter” is racist. Is that it? People protesting disproportionate police related deaths among blacks… are racist for pointing it out? Ok.
The racism on the left is rooted in the bigotry of low expectations. Rather than tackle black problems at the roots, they make a grand display of attacking the leaves, calling those who disagree with their methods ‘white supremacists’. I have the distinct impression that if they adopted a more grassroots approach to racial inequality, they would discover that many of their policies have in fact entrenched black poverty rather than alleviated it. A black Republican told me that African Americans are the most gullible people in America and, until they learn to realize they don’t need white custodians empowering them, will continue to fall for policies and movements that further infantilize them.
the statement isn’t racist, obviously. The organization is very racist, just as obviously. And there havent been disproportionate police related deaths among blacks. Check the stats.
Must we accept your definition of a racist, or a homophobe, or a misogynist….there are a thousand of those sorts of definitions, mostly wildly inaccurate The people referred to by Alex above certainly think and behave, if not like Fascists, then perhaps the juvenile section of the organisation.
Biden gave A 20 minute Eulogy to KKK Grand nKnights funeral ..but that Explains some of Why Latinos,venezuelans ,Cubans voted for Trump ,they’d never vote for No delegates kamel harris
these days, there are as many democrat racists as there are GOP, maybe more. They just don’t see themselves that way, even as they wrap themselves up in identity politics and critical race theory, which are about as racist as you can get. Try quoting MLK “content of character” speech to a young Democrat these days, he/she will call you a racist.
Repubs rejected Obama for being a Dem and for being too liberal for their tastes. Did Dems reject Trump or Bush or Reagan for being white? Racism is when you won’t hold the black office-holder to the same standard as the white ones.
What incivility continues, is the product of Right wing thought. No different than the neo-Nazis or other fascist movements. is that why the likes of AOC and Robert Reich, among others, want to compile “enemies lists”? That seems just like every fascist movement that has ever existed.
hmmm… pretty sure Trump has one. So…? Or will your bias allow you to go there? And re your opening sentence, I’m quite sure that explains birtherism, which gave rise to the tea party, which gave rise to trump. Had nothing whatsoever to do with his original sin of blackness, right? Whatever gets you through the night, Alex.
Egypt ,Japan , Some Indians Supported Axis countries were they ”Racist”
georgetskendall
3 years ago
This is a truly awful article.
At times I really value UnHerd, especially when I am trying to understand the conservative mindset over identity politics. I would like to recommend it to my liberal friends. But because of articles like this, I just can’t.
To take just one example: the Mueller report found that the Russian government “interfered in the 2016 presidential election in sweeping and systematic fashion” and “violated U.S. criminal law”. The author must know this, but his article states as fact that the claim of Russian interference in the election was fake.
The author then argues that Democrat complaints about Russian interference would make it fair game for the Republicans to claim that Biden has stolen the election, when even Fox News has called the election for Biden.
The author talks about fake news and vitriol. I’m afraid, UnHerd, by publishing his piece, UnHerd is guilty of exactly that.
A word of advice – if the author is Douglas Murray, you can easily skip it. His writing is pure drivel. His “analysis” is nonsensical. He single-handedly brings down the writing in Unherd.
The Mueller report also found that not a single American conspired with any Russians. Not one. Not one witness before Adam Schiff’s House Intel Committee produced any evidence, least of all Schiff himself who repeatedly claimed to have it by the bucketload. And we’ve learned that Biden, among others, knew full well of the surveillance on the Trump campaign and went along with it. Are we to ignore that?
If you’re to cherry-pick parts you don’t like as the pretext for not sharing with your liberal friends, just say you have no desire to share in the first place.
The Russian government may well have attempted to influence the outcome of the 2016 election (I believe the American government has had several goes, some quite successful, at interfering in other countries’ elections) – that’s not the point. The charge was that Trump conspired with the Russians, and that has been shown to be completely unfounded, and that, if anything, there was a criminal conspiracy by the Democrats, the “intelligence ” services and the media, to frame Trump.
It’ll be interesting to see how this plays out. Now that ‘their’ guy has won, and there is now a corporate puppet back in the white House will all those riots stop? The next time a black person gets shot by a cop, will it be blamed on Biden? How will they spin it when Biden launches the next war in the middle East? When he steps up the economic destruction to ‘tackle covid’ and more people lose their jobs, and this makes no difference to deaths, how will they reconcile this? Who will the insane left blame for all the world’s ills now their bogey man has gone?
Under Trump debt went up by 40% (before Covid); now Biden has to deal with it.
If he knows how to deal with it Boris and Sunak will need his advice.
Biden wants to put even more trillions on top of this. The Green New Deal won’t be paid by an organic Magic Money tree in the back garden of the White House.
And that will be the perfect time for Republicans/Conservatives to discover their “principled” opposition to debt.
Trump promised to balance the budget not blow it up.
If the demtards could have left him alone instead of wasting 3 yrs and billions of dollars on that russia conspiracy, perhaps he could have moved in the direction of balancing the debt
Utter tripe (as our British friends might say). Trump is a self-admitted “lover” of debt – as long as he is not the one left holding the bag – one of the few things he actually excelled at during his checkered “business” career. Trump bounced from bankruptcy to bankruptcy until his epiphany that he could actual make money simply pretending to be a businessman on TV and licensing out his brand/name to any suitable charlatan or grifter. The ultimate con… and a poisoned chalice from which far too many Americans willingly consumed (and continue to do so).As president, Trump’s profligate spending and unwarranted tax cuts (stealing from future generations) were a key part of the economic “success” during his presidency that few (on either side of the aisle) even acknowledged let alone seriously sought to control…. No I fear we are all victims of his grift and are all f@#ked (as our our future descendants with this increasingly crushing debt).Also Van, the Mueller “Russia” Investigation (which contrary to Bill Barr’s spin (and Douglas Murray’s – whom I otherwise generally admire) was not an exoneration of Trump and was around $42 million (not “Billions” as you inaccurately claim). Roughly the cost of 1/2 of of one a F-35A fighter jet. But I should have recalibrated my expectations of you as soon as I saw your “clever” use of the term “Demtards” it is always a clear giveaway ….
I’m glad you’re not my countryman.
Man, you’re awful. Really, really awful. Resentful, petty, bitter.
LOL
How does Russian investigation affects the budget?
Ha! Just wanted to add, that Biden also wants to, take away our second amendment, sensor our speech, raise our taxes, gut our military, and defund the police, just to name a few…
Where do all those ”Ungreen” Windfarms &Solar panels Go they dont seem to be recycled?..”planet of the Humans” by left michael Moore
After he and his girlfriend, Barry piled on debt more than every year of the nation combined? Yeah, woe is Pedo Joe.
No matter how unpalatable it may be. this election was “won” by hatred. Chiefly of a man who dared to utter the truth concerning the differences between the sexes……women have come to expect kid glove treatment in today’s woke society, losing touch with sexual reality in the process. All of the examples you pose will be ignored, we live in a world of “identity politics”
Trump is the hater in chief.
Did your sweetie pay you with special things to create that witty witty?
We are blessed with Trump. He’s a great human being. We love him, personally and professionally. We’ll fight to the death for him.
I won’t fight to the death for him, but I will watch him clean up what appears to be ballot disasters with joy in my heart. He’s so cute.
Don’t wear those kid gloves while grabbing women’s pussies. Is that what you mean?
There is a video of BLM threatening the Dems at the weekend as they party in “BLM Square”, accusing them in menacing chants of colonising the space. BLM didn’t seem to be celebrating. It was business as usual.
I thought they were both marxists.
It was raw class and race hatred being displayed, to their own side.
The Mighty Boosh?.
Yes, the riots will mostly stop. The infrastructure for them, provided by the likes of George Soros, will dry up. Most of the rioters will go home. Those who persist, will be arrested by the suddenly active police. As far as the next shooting of. a black by a white cop, it will not be blamed on Old Uncle Joe. It will be blamed on “systemic racism” and “white supremacy” and will result in further attacks on whites by Democrats.
A yes, George Soros…he is paying for everything isn’t he?
Not just George, Kamala and Biden staffers helped with bail money to get “mostly peaceful” protestors back on the street. A real team effort.
A lot of them are so consumed with hatred for their own country that they do it for nothing. They after all have jobs, graduate jobs.
I believe the US death tally on blacks killing blacks is hitting 700 for the year. No sign of BLM anywhere. Why? Because they don’t care. Black deaths matter only when the shooter is a white policeman because that’s where the money is. No riots, no broken windows, no destroyed businesses when a few blacks shoot their brethren. No money in it.
They will do the same thing they did when Obama took over from Bush. that is to blame everything on the Bush administration. They were even doing so 6 and 76 years into Obama’s tenure.
Now, everything will still be Trump’s fault.
The enemy will do as they are doing now: lying like Soviet Russians when confronted. I called a local “news” outlet and when asked why they referred to Slow Joe as “president elect” they reacted with the NPC monotone “we were told to report that at this time….” Over and over again. I asked “Do you believe it?” “We were told to report that at this time….”
Their parent, CBS told them to.
Nuremburg, anyone?
Theoretical musings, however. POTUS is still POTUS. And will be, once we get the silliness cleared up in court.
I assumed BLM was about black lives mattering, but it’s not. See their website. They are a Marxist fundraising group using ‘Black Lives’ as a marketing scheme.
The most laughable thing has been Biden talking unity, and his dogwashers posting things about the same on social media. As if four years of being called nazis, racists, and whatever else somehow gives the left the moral high ground. Sorry, that’s not how it works. You don’t get to pull stunts ranging from not a single Dem showing up for Trump’s inauguration to the endless Russian fixation to the enemies lists being sought by the likes of AOC, and then suddenly ask “can’t we be friends?”
No, we can’t. My friends don’t call me racist. They may disagree with me and we may have vigorous discussions, but there is no name-calling, let alone violence. At this point, we’re exes. It means we can be civil and polite in mixed company because that’s how adults act. Some exes manage to be friends but those relationships were more likely to flame out than be burned down by either side. It’s okay. The left hates people like me. That’s been made abundantly clear.
Alex, the article was about lies and facts… and you start right off with ‘not a single dem’ showed up for Trumps inauguration, while of course not only were the Obama’s there, but the Clintons were too… you know, the lady he beat by fewer total votes than those he’s losing to Biden by? That dem. As you have thus disqualified yourself from being taken seriously, I won’t bother with the rest of your nonsense, and it’s clear why “the left hates people like” you.
My fault for using an absolute. A large chunk of Congress stayed home. That’s so much more mature. For former presidents to show up, that’s a low bar.
it’s clear why “the left hates people like” you.
it’s who the left is. It hates anyone not 100% in lockstep agreement. Just look at how it treats minorities that dare to stray, or the occasional person in good standing who deviates on a single point. Funny how you skip right over the serial insults.
Low Bar? It’s one that I’m quite sure DJT will not clear, so I guess it’s looking a bit higher to you now. As to congressmen staying home, correct me if I’m wrong, but as I recall a certain Mitch McConnell was meeting with all the Republican senators at the exact time Obama was being sworn in… during which meeting they all swore to do everything the could to make Obama a one term president. That’s statesmanship for you!!
It wasn’t the ‘exact time’ it was the evening of the same day. I don’t know if you’ve noticed but the general purpose of being a politician is to win elections. All politicians and political parties would wish to make Presidents from the party they oppose one term presidents, this is not unusual and not something worthy of censure – it’s the norm.
Given the obstruction Trump has faced, anything Obama faced is dwarfed in comparison.
Notice how when discussing ANYTHING the dems don’t agree with, they immediately resort to name-calling, their tempers flair, they forget where they are, and with whom their speaking to… Lol😂 They are completely unhinged; burning down our cities like a bunch of babies, who didn’t get their way… I mean, it’s laughable. And, then they have their weak, cognitively impaired, and so obviously coached, Biden say, “we need to unify the country.” It’s psychotic.
“….,not a single Dem showing up for Trump’s inauguration “
THAT IS FACTUALLY WRONG!
Why do you lie?
Because dozens not showing up makes it sound better?
60 members of the house (including senators) didn’t show up. The rest almost 200 did…so how is that dozens for you?
do you know how many are in a dozen? Because your numbers point to five dozen. As in more than one, making dozens. THIS is what you’re defending? It’s classless. And the same would apply to Repubs who engaged in a similar tantrum.
No dozens (200 and the last 3 democratic presidents) completely disproves your point.
You said “a large chunk of congress” – about 60 stayed away.
He is right. There is a media wasteland. Fox news has been okay but little else. I have to get my news from Youtube.
“I have to get my news from Youtube.”
And so can everyone else. You are not a pioneer.
Leave him alone. He has already explained.
And me as it happens. They don’t reason that just call you racist or homophobic or anything like that. It is pointless discussing with them.
Anyone who thinks for himself, knows how to do things, and loves liberty is in the crosshairs of the Marxists.
Which includes me.
Which is all true and, as ever by Mr Murray, beautifully stated. The question for any genuine leader of the US is how to stop the cycle. Do the Republicans act as the bigger persons here and not play up in the same way? If they did, would it be recognized as such? I suspect not. So, do they then loudly identify the issues and the parallels before backing off into reasonable behaviour? And, if so, how would they get that message across in the polarized media world?
My guess is that with a career politician in the White House, the swamp reestablishes itself fully and it loops back into low level grumbling and internal power games. If, that is, Biden can keep the more left-leaning sections of his party in check.
Republicans act as the bigger person….
LOL
Nixon 1960
That was Ike’s party (the last great American president). Trump is not Ike.
Dopey Nixon committed Watergate As he Was Paranoid after illinois was ‘Fixed’ by thousands of Votes going into Lake michigan in nov 1960 & Then Stuffing ballots in 1972 ….. Kennedy had enough electoral college votes but overall total was less than 100,000 in popular vote..
Nixon gave in to Kennnedy’s fraud for the sake of the country.
Nixon conceded for the good of the country and the US got Vietnam and the Cuban missile crisis
And, er…. the assassination.
Well if you are saying that had there been no fraud and Kennedy lost the election, he would not have been assassinated that must be right, but I do not see the relevance.
Adding to my list you could include the decline of public and moral and ethical standards in the 60’s and 70’s, the huge expansion of the state and so on up to and including the election of President Trump
Kennedy already had 303 Electoral votes .nixon 219 .Even if illinois was Reversed as it should have been.! Kennedy’s sex exploits and terminal Addisons’ were hidden until Watergate hearings by conservative news media..
Nixon 1974
This type of comment is exactly the problem in America. Blanket judgement and inflammatory provocation. Way to bring us together.
Yes, my comment here is pushing Americans apart.
It’s the supercilious sneering that most Americans object to. It’s that one last kick in the head when your opponent is down. Your comment on its own is just an inconsequential petty meanness – a tiny pebble. But it’s a tiny pebble in an avalanche. I fear that rather than learning to get along with people who think differently to them, the Democrat party and the institutions that support them will spend the next four years humiliating and further alienating the ‘other side’ until another Trump-like figure or worse comes along and plays to their resentment.
“..most Americans object to.” – you don’t know that.
When it comes to the American people (Democrats or Republican) I always refer to the H.L. Mencken. He got the measurement of the American people.
“The men the American people admire most extravagantly are the most daring liars; the men they detest most violently are those who try to tell them the truth.”
P.S. I am American and a paleoconservative.
It is pointless trying to imitate what the democrats tried to do in the last four years. Action should be for the good of the country and not some kind of revenge as the democrats showed when Trump was elected. It has come to the time that one cannot rely on America to do the right thing as they did in the past although I know that there is a minority who are as true as ever.
You have a very selective version of history.
Obama won the election (and Democracts controlled the House and the Senate).
Republican Senate position (a historical fact that no one questions it) was: we are not going to co-operate with Obama and try to make him a 1 term president.
I don’t think so Alex, Biden will step down within a year when things have quietened down and the door will be open for the real villains to take the floor. I only hope that the fraud is exposed and the true President reinstated
As far as being a career politician is concerned Biden’s career was finished with Obama’s
Your comment is based on both sides being mature, honorable, and putting the country first. We are in this dilemma because the Republicans shy away from a fight and would rather give in on principle and reach across the aisle to get along.
The Democrat party on the other hand is no longer the Democrat Party that my Mom and Dad belonged to in the 1950’s. The Cultural Marxist Left has infiltrated the government, changed education to anti-America Leftist indoctrination, and taken over the Democrat Party.
If Biden becomes President there will be no violent demonstrations and riots like the Leftist Democrats gave us for four years. Our resistance will be through the Senate and then we will vote to take back the House in two years.
“The Democrat party on the other hand is no longer the Democrat Party that my Mom and Dad belonged to in the 1950’s. The Cultural Marxist Left has infiltrated the government, changed education to anti-America Leftist indoctrination, and taken over the Democrat Party.”
You know what, I thought you were talking about the Labour Party in Britain.
Weird, isn’t it?
I really don’t think the Republicans, like the Conservatives here, can actually find within themselves the same measure of nastiness and hatred which has been displayed by the so called liberal left in both countries in recent years, it’s more likely the Democrats will continue their hate campaign against Trump and continue to seek his prosecution for whatever they can dig up, just as efforts continue here against cummings, hate campaigns and cancel culture have become the liberal left’s normal way of operating, Joe Biden’s success isn’t going to change that.
“…or whatever they can dig up,”
tax evasion is not a crime? Assuming that he is guilty.
He is being investigated (collaborated by his long time lawyer) for tax evasion.
And when that fails there will be another prosecution to take it’s place.
I don’t know! Do you ?
You pretend that the US justice system is the Russian justice system.
The justice system is able to be taken advantage of by those with political purpose, it’s how so many lawyers become politicians.
Lawyers become politicians because you have a legalistic process in place (aka GOVERMENT).
Drafting laws requires lawyers.
Powerful people (with money) always and anywhere can get a better deal. Should be no problem for Trump.
Isn’t it? It certainly looks that way from the top of a 38 bus.
Yes it does.
You realize, Bob, the guy you are defending was forced to pay $2m back for misusing charitable funds from his “Trump Foundation’s” bank accounts… (all frankly criminal acts) and was forced to shutter the charity (under court supervision) and agree (along with 3 of his children) to 19 admission of misconduct and misuse….
This is the guy (who continues to undermine our democracy with false claims of widespread and material voter fraud) who is totally without a moral compass…. Your (and the conservatives in general) tolerance of this immoral cretin man/child never ceases to amaze (and sadden) me….
While I truly abhor and lament the far left’s decent into “wokeness” and identity politics (and the serious damage it does to the laudable causes it purportedly seeks to uplift), the blinders you, Bob, and your ilk are willing to put on are no less clueless, ignorant, and lamentable…. God (or some A.I. Deus ex machina) please help us all because if this is the best level of thought and discourse we can do as educated, rational souls …. we are all (once again) f@#$ked.
Since when does a dislike of the modern liberal left amount to a defence of Trump?, my comment should obviously be read in context to the article.
Hi Bob,
Sorry if I mistook your presumption that any prosecution of Trump’s “tax evasion” would “fail” and be quickly replaced with what I supposed you were inferring was yet another “trumped” up charge (pun intended) – as support for Trump. It just rubs me the wrong way when I see folks go into contortions to defend or excuse a man who from all actions – appears to be amoral, draft-dodging, low-IQ, narcissistic, grifter, and bully. Apologies….
As I noted, I too find much to fault with the modern left – who aren’t without their own set of charlatans and hypocrites – especially in the “woke” realm (see e.g., Robin D’Angelo, Ibrahim Kendi, etc) though I do still believe that most on the left are motivated and sincere in their laudable desire to advance a world where all people are accorded respect (unless their individual actions merit otherwise), fairness, and equality regardless of their race, sex or sexual orientation, etc. – even if they are currently grossly misguided to such an extent that they actually do a disservice to the values and people they purport to advance…. Cheers.
“tax evasion is not a crime” – if the IRS accept your tax returns how can it be tax evasion?
IRS can accept your tax returns and come back to you with questions…you are not supposed to lie in your tax form.
No, that is not how it works. Once accepted, the return is fixed unless there is some illegality. Not even the NYT is suggesting Trump did anything illegal.
“Assuming that he is guilty” – yes, that is the sum of it.
There is zero chance that Trump and Cohen took the lead on Trump’s taxes. Multiple pass through entities, complex depreciation and other issues — please. Not to mention some of the related entities may use different accounting firms than Trump himself depending on ownership, control and other issues associated with the venture.
My favorite fake Trump tax scandal was evidenced in an in depth article (by the NYT I think) questioning his family’s estate/gift tax planning, going back decades and decades. It was a literal tour de force of basic, run of the mill estate tax avoidance methods (like generation skipping transfers) used by people with potential estate tax liabilities across the country every single day, even more so in the latter part of the 20th century based on the exemption amount at the time.
EDIT: Link to the NYT article: https://www.nytimes.com/int…
Like the “secret Chinese bank account” (lol), this is all complete BS.
70 million Americans will beg to disagree with your verdict
I dare say the results more reflect a vote against
Many of whom voted against Trump rather than voted for Biden.
Wont happen All trump has to do is make sure All By elections,Mid terms &future Election ,Postal Voting is Limited To shift Workers,The Infirm &those on holiday ..& counted 10-14 days before the US election…I can’t see Donald T running in 2024 he’ll be 78 & should concentrate & News &business channel to rival sky &bloomberg both Democrat bias..
With Democrats embracing divisive identity politics and the blood libel that is Critical Racial Theory, it can only get worse. They are openly kulak-ing a group of people and promising to disarm them. You know, because 4% of gun deaths each year are due to the very scary looking AR-15. For the safety of the children, you see. It has absolutely nothing to do with rubbing the deplorables faces in it by taking away their most treasured firearm. No, nothing at all…
I am not exactly sure what the end game for the Democrats is, but uniting and governing a wounded country does not seem to be a priority.
‘They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.’ Obviously, it’s the Democrats embracing divisive identity politics?
Thanks for demonstrating Douglas Murray’s point. You fail to point out that Trump was talking about illegal immigrants, not normal immigrants or those already resident. He is also arguably talking about a subset of illegal immigrants – that is “the ones sent ” to the US.
I believe this is the quote in full:
“”When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending the best,” he said during the announcement. “They’re not sending you, they’re sending people that have lots of problems and they’re bringing those problems. They’re bringing drugs, they’re bringing crime. They’re rapists and some, I assume, are good people, but I speak to border guards and they’re telling us what we’re getting.”
“He is also arguably”
Yes, arguably.
Trump was running for president of USA and not for sanitation commissioner in some small town rural America.
With the long track record of Trump can you truly ARGUE ?
I think it was a statement designed to stoke anti-Mexican feelings among Americans. I think an expert in management of the message like Trump was well aware of that.
Why do you think that? Are you, as they say, projecting?
I hope not. I’m someone who thinks all people are of equal value and worthy of respect – whether they are American, Mexican or neither. If a Spanish person in Spain said ‘When England sends its people, they’re not sending the best’ I’d think that was wrong (and I’m not English).
I think you are wrong.
It was a statement meant to appeal to the majority of ordinary people – but not the rich elite – who think that a country should guard it’s borders and keep illegal immigrants and foreign criminals out of the country.
What rich elitist wants to let foreign criminals in the country?
The UK for one.
When A Home Secretary has to Announce ”now we can Keep out EU criminals ie People traffickers,terror suspects,drug cartels” I think trying to say ”This is racist” shows Sanctomonius ignorance..
When Trump’s says ‘Mexico sends’, the only possible interpretation is some sort of state encouraged migration. You have evidence of this? In any case, there are an estimated 5 million illegal Mexican immigrants in the US. This is who Trump is describing. Tarring with the same brush rather a large number of people, don’t you think?
Tarring with the same brush rather a large number of people, don’t you think?
Sure, but it’s funny that tarring all white people with being privileged oppressors and innately racist doesn’t create such a storm.
Yes it does, that is why a candidate for US president should be careful how they use language.
At whom is that directed, Trump or Biden – or maybe Hillary with her “Deplorables and Irredeemables” speech?
Everybody that runs for president.
Trump as a president tweeted that his predecessor (Obama) had Team Seal 6 killed and faked the death of Bin Laden.
Surely you can see the difference?
Well, that’s something we agree on.
A lot of us white people were not born priveleged but had to work hard to overcome the odds. Some did not manage it. It’s a fallacy. People who talk about white privelege only look at certain people. We do have a good country that millions want to come to but it was the people of the country who made it like that. As an orphan I slipped through the cracks but I still see that the country is basically fair and compassionate.
Quite right. But some people are unable to admit or accept that the country is generally decent, because that would mean there’s no need to reimagine society entirely.
I believe that the Mexican government has published pamphlets and broadcast videos demonstrating how their people can evade US border security. So yes, if my understanding is correct, it is state encouraged migration, or at least it was at the time of this education on the breaking of US law. And Peter Kreff, you make an excellent point about the varying responses.
It’s never stopped the left in the UK from selectively quoting part of Mrs T’s ” They are casting their problems at society. And, you know, there’s no such thing as society. There are individual men and women and there are families. And no government can do anything except through people, and people must look after themselves first. It is our duty to look after ourselves and then, also, to look after our neighbours” speech.
And what’s more, they have no intention ever of putting their six-word “precis” into context.
You’ve left out “They don’t send their best…”
BTW, the President of Mexico has refused to join the stampede to congratulate the corrupt fraudster before the legal processes have been completed.
“…legal processes have been completed.”
As of now Trump’s legal cases have been thrown out in GE, AZ, NV. 1 case has been approved in PEN.
Judicial activists. There will be appeals to higher courts and eventually they will get to judges who are not judicial acitivists but constitutional lawyers who uphold the law and the constitution.
“Judicial activists. ” How do you know that? I am pretty sure that you DO NOT understand anything about law or the Constitution.
Your default position is “I don’t like it so it must be wrong”.
In the same club as Russia, China and Brazil, in that regard.
So has Putin and China as it happens for the same reason. The Legal must be sorted first.
Precisely.👌ðŸ»
The last four and more years of politics in the USA can be summed up in one act, Nancy Pelosi ripping up the State of the Union speech in January 2020. It sent out a very clear signal, “we only accept democracy when we win”.
It is clear that a Pelosi House of Representatives will want revenge on Trump and his family and anyone who worked with him. Expect endless hearing into Trump, his business, his tax affairs, his family connections, etc. No stone will be left unturned in the search for dirt to throw at him.
If Biden is truly serious about ending the division he needs to declare now that he will not assist in any house investigations into Trump and that he will pardon anyone who is investigated, no matter what is found. It will take an unambiguous act like this to start the process of constructive engagement. If he doesn’t he will go down in history as one of the most ineffectual Presidents of all time because the Senate will obstruct every legislative program he puts forward just for the hell of it!
It took Al Gore over thirty days before he conceded victory to Bush because his own legal challenges were being churned over by due process. Why is it the main media outlets are pretending it’s all over?
About fifteen minutes ago the BBC news channel ran some footage of Trump meeting Obama, within a week of the 2016 result. The implication was that Trump is doing something awful and unheard of by bringing the lawyers in.
For some reason the BBC isn’t mentioning Al Gore’s legal efforts in 2000.
Gore/Bush was about Florida ONLY.
And Gore had a case to make, NO ONE (certainly not BBC) is stopping Trump from going to courts and making his case. As of now judges in GE, AZ & NV have rejected his cases.
BBC not mentioning Florida 2000 is not deciding the vote.
I never it was deciding anything. I was wondering why the BBC is pretending that Trump’s lack of concession is unique. In addition, why all large media outlets are acting ‘as if’ everything is decided when it obviously isn’t.
they are calling it, they have legally not decided anything because they can not. For example media called Alaska for Trump despite only 50% of the votes have been counted.
I can not speak about BBC but Guardian, FT, NY Times all have referend to the Florida 2000 case.
I’m aware they are ‘calling’ it. This is strange. Why are they calling it when it isn’t over? I mean – it’s Florida which is the case in point. Not because it was one state, but because Al Gore was referred to as Mr President-elect for 30+ days before conceding he lost.
I would have thought the MSM would remember this and therefore not be referring to Biden in this way. Wouldn’t it be more sensible to ‘call it’ – but also to remind everyone what happened in 2000?
Is there any benefit from pretending Trump’s lack of an early concession is unique to him?
“I’m aware they are ‘calling’ it. This is strange. Why are they calling it”
Because they think it is a closed deal. You might not agree but you are entitled to do so.
Nothing new here BTW. That is what media does. Just like it called Brexit before the official count.
Yes – but you are not answering my question. I am aware the MSM is calling it. And yes – they are doing it because they think it’s a done deal. *Thats’s* the point.
Why do they think it’s a done deal when it isn’t? Have they forgot Al Gore being referred to as Mr President-elect for 30+ days before he conceded he lost?
I mean, the MSM could still ‘call it’ – as it looks done – yet remind people that things can change later. I’m just curious why, for example the BBC, is pretending that Trump’s lack of an early concession is unique to him.
If the BBC did mention, a – Al Gore’s lack of an early concession, and b – that 2000 shows how things could change, then Trump wouldn’t look so sad and stupid by calling in the lawyers. I’m suspicious that the BBC actually *wants* to offer a false picture of reality.
“..remind people that things can change later.” – media has not reported that Trump is taking legal action in certain states?
No, I’m referring to the 30+ days that Al Gore was described as Mr president-elect before he lost. I think that should be a lesson for the MSM – don’t you?
The problem is, by not learning how a candidate can be humiliated if it’s called for him too soon, Biden risks humilation, and so does the MSM. Usually the media outlets like to claim they were right.
I think it’s all very strange that the MSM is risking the wrath of many Dem supporters. they will certainly want to know why the MSM called it so soon – especially given the humiliation of Gore in 2000 when he was ‘Mr President-elect’ for 30+ days before conceding he lost.
And if you are right MSM will be humiliated. Get out the popcorn and enjoy the show.
Indeed. I have been enjoying it. I hope Trump fails in his attempt to win by legal goings-on. If he succeeds the howling at the sky from Biden fans will be almost too much to bear.
If he were to succeed, the military wings of the Democrat Party would burn the whole place down. What judge is going to risk that? First rule of the Law: there is no justice.
Is this the latest Q Anon theory?
There is no justice is what pupil masters teach their pupils on their first day in Chambers.
It certainly is not. The first thing taught is how to work the photocopier, the kettle and the Archbold index.
We have to accept it is a media coup. They made their announcement just as Giuliani was about to give his press conference. Before that the Dems had been telling us there would be no announcement until later this week. That press conference had to be drowned out. Just like the Laptop from Hell.
Media announce a win and countries congratulate Biden. Russia, Brazil and China have refrained until full legal process.
Surely that would be benficial to the Trump campaign?
How on earth was it an advantage to get no coverage at all for the allegations and the witnesses? It was a huge advantage to the fraudsters because it covered up their misdoings, again.
The media monolith was focusing on the announcement it had just made, not on Giuliani. That was the intention, and premature though the announcement was, and unconstitutional, they gambled on getting away with it and making it a fait accompli.
Not a single state has elected the fraudsters yet, and the Electoral Colleges have not met. But a few media billionaires have pretended otherwise, to cover up the fraud.
Have you only just discovered BBC fake news?
Really ALL Opinion polls said Remain had Won a Landslide,Even Farage fell for it..Psychologically everyone loves a winner,So why not destroy All Polls now are suspect..it should be =6% either way not =3%
The BBC and Sky started saying “baseless” and “without evidence” far too soon to be credible. They have never before said that about allegations. More often than not they are reported with glee as fact. The Steele dossier for example.
Sky news Australia differ. They know what is going on.
Which is that Rupert is having an each way bet?
It’s the same in the US. It’s very doubtful to me that they even looked for possible evidence before declaring them baseless. And good point about Gore, Red Asp.
Well. We all know the BBC.
Al B/Gore has made Billions from Green new Deal & lying on ”Scientific data”
I am most struck by how quickly the idea vanished that American politics would have to change tack in response to the continued level of support for Donald Trump. In just a few days the Democrats and their media have decided they can just rewind four years and pretend it never happened.
One argument made is that Trump has a unique connection with the voters, and I think it is true – sad but true.
Would Trumpism survive without Trump? Especially since Trump was unable to deliver on his promises (Better and cheaper healthcare).
Trump delivered on more of his promised than any leader in living memory, with the possible exception of Thatcher. And he has actually brought down the cost of dugs and enforced the up-front pricing of all procedures by the insurance companies. (There is a name for this but I can’t remember it.)
Never upset Big Pharma or Big Tech or Big Money or Big Media. You will be toppled.
Trump delivered on more of his promised than any leader in living memory,
Did he reform the immigration systems?
Did he repeal and replace Obamacare
Did he balance the budget?
Did he release his tax returns?
Did he build the wall with Mexico’s money?
so not delivering on all means not delivering on any?
The tax cut was Paul Ryan’s policy not Trump. He simply signed the bill.
He boosted (and he did that) the economy with a massive tax cut paid by borrowing money.
I am still waiting for the tax returns to be published!
And? It was delivering on something he said would be delivered. I’m far more interested in the tax returns of veteran members of Congress, and how a salary of less than 200K in one of America’s most expensive cities creates multi-millionaires.
The tax cut doesn’t “borrow money.” Who’s it borrowing from? It’s people keeping more of what they earn.
I am not asking what you are interested in or not. You are entitled to that position. I am simply asking the president to honor his word. He promised the American people (that is me BTW) that he was going to publish his tax returns. 4 years later…nothing!
Surely a man like you that claims to be principled would demand the same thing?
“Who’s it borrowing from?” – Future generations of Americans. Do i have to explain you how fiscal policy (budget) works?
“Who’s it borrowing from?” – Future generations of Americans.
Uh, no. Me keeping more of what I earn is just that. Future generations are no more entitled to my income than is the present generation.
Since you don’t understand fiscal policy, you’re not going to be able to explain it well. In a nutshell, though, money in has to be equal to or greater than money out. No one ever looks at the money out, which is always rising. Every home and business knows to cut spending when necessary, yet the federal govt acts as if it’s exempt from that.
“yet the federal govt acts as if it’s exempt from that.”
Trump is the president, he signed the bill. He could have demanded the cuts. He did not. Therefore Trump is responsible.
So Obama is responsible for the debt doubling on his watch, right? I did not realize that presidents were basically emperors.
Of course he is, did I say he was not? But there is a difference. Obama had to deal with the crash. Trump has to deal with C19. That is WHY i keep pointing out the deficits pre-C19 – not the current one.
The crash was not an eight year event. Besides, this began with Trump and the number of promises delivered. No president delivers on all; he’s delivered on quite a few. Obama delivered on health care, for better or worse.
I gave you the list of things he has not delivered. He can deliver the tax returns…and still nothing.
Each government in the ”Great Reset;;(Davos 2020 on youtube) has mortgaged Not Just our Grandchildren,but Our great,great grandchildren..
Alex Lekas, that’s a good point. But it would be helpful to know how many of them entered as multimillionaires. Probably quite a few did, and so they would have to be separated from those who entered as relative paupers, and became very rich while “serving” in Congress.
Leadership?
The battle is basically between good and evil in the USA. Same as the UK.
That’s how sociopaths respond, exactly.
1) It’s quite clear that the amount of Democrat voter fraud has been shocking, and enough to sway the (yet to be determined) outcome. How the country that produced Microsoft, Apple and Google has the voting mechanisms of a third world banana republic is unbelievable (not that the UK is any better, with our pencils and black/Muslim (not Oriental) postal fraud).
2) I’ve been saying that I think the US need to partition, as India and Pakistan did, into the Republic of Woke-istan and the United States of America… and I’m not joking. Also, I’d be very surprised if this election didn’t excite talks of Texas secession from The Union. Already there’s gossip about federal mask mandates – that’ll drive the wedge further.
1) it is not clear at all. Trump has provided (in court not Twitter) no evidence for that.
2) Woke-istan pays the bill, it is not Montana that contributes to the Federal budget or US technological dominance.
Big Tech has been to the fore in rigging the election through censorship. They are still at it. The voting mechanisms have also been manipulated by technology – “glitches”. It isn’t all manual tampering with the ballots.
The lesson we must learn is that postal voting is open to widespread fraud – we already knew from Birmingham, Tower Hamlets, and Peterborough etc – and we must do away with it except for seriously disabled people.
Postal Votes for Shift Workers,Infirm,people on holiday or business.. I think i got 24 Postal votes out of 389 in 2019 GE ..even though i’d said Postal fraud is a danger in mulitiple occupancy
For views on American politics, in fact on anything, I turn to Thomas Sowell. He said of Obama that he prevented Jimmy Carter being the worst president ever, but I think that was before Trump. He said of Obama and Trump that he reached for the off switch when either appeared on TV.
He said recently: “If the election goes to Biden there’s a good chance that the Democrats will then control the two branches of Congress and the White House. And considering the kinds of things that they’re proposing, that could well be the point of no return for this country.”
“What is frightening is how many people in responsible positions are caving into every demand that is made, repeating any kind of nonsense that you’re supposed to repeat. I do believe that we may well reach a point of no return. I hope that, of course, will never happen. But there is such a thing as a point of no return. The Roman empire overcame many problems in its long history but eventually it reached a point where it could no longer continue on, and much of that was from within, not just the barbarians attacking from outside.”
He also said that Democrats pushing the concept of systemic racism in the U.S. reminded him of the propaganda tactics of the Nazis.
Nobody gets to the true like Dr Sowell and at 90 he has experienced more than most.
Yes, Thomas Sowell is a great man. Everyone should check out his interviews. For those who don’t know, he is a black academic who was among the first to see through all the progressive lies and nonsense, many decades ago.
“Point of no Return”- Maybe thats why, a few days ago, a vision entered
my mind. My memory brought up the picture from years back when Krushchev banged his shoe on the lecturn at the UN and told the USA that their grandchildren will live under communism.
1960 Archive krushchev response to harold Macmillan.
macmillan ”I think I have annoyed the Soviet Leader” ..laughter when UN wasn’t full of nitwits..
I thought it was impossible to be more evil than Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld. But over the last few years the Democrats have achieved this sickening feat.
Yes, they are eating conservative babies.
Indeed we see the same here with the left constantly accusing the Tories of wanting to starve children, introducing tax cuts for the rich etc., and as for their opinion of Brexit voters!
What, like not extending free school meals for Christmas break at a cost of a poxy £20M after spunking £1.5B on our “world-leading” test & trace programme that was in effect just a huge corporate welfare splurge to party donors and their companies? That sort of thing?
I honestly don’t think the Tories want to starve British children – it looks so bad at election time. I do think they’d be quite content to starve foreign children.
Another extremely well written article by Douglas Murray. I always enjoy reading his point of view in which I find agreement almost all the time.
Something Douglas seems to disregard is the possibility that the election was corrupt, rigged, and manipulated. There are now allegations, which trust worthy named sources say will show involvement of CIA operatives and CIA software and equipment used to manipulate the election results.
What we Deplorables and Trump voters want is assurance that the election results reflect the will of the people. That investigation is underway as we speak. If the outcome is in Bidens favor then we will simply say “God Bless America” and carry on for the next four years as best we can. If it is in Our favor we will smile and say “Thank You President Trump for saving us once again from the anti-America Left”.
‘There are now allegations, which trust worthy named sources say will show involvement of CIA operatives and CIA software and equipment used to manipulate the election results.’
Quite plainly there was mail-in ballot harvesting/laundering/fraud on a large scale. I guess it’s entirely possible that the CIA was involved as they are part of the swamp that Trump was challenging. Thus far he has got off lightly. The last President to ask questions about them was JFK…
“Quite plainly there was mail-in ballot harvesting/laundering/fraud on a large scale.”
It should be very easy for Trump team to prove you right.
Ironic The Demagogues sorry ”Democrats” have learnt from putin,Erdogan &several Sudan Elections?..
Trump hasnt gone. If he does Trumpism isnt going anywhere. Its interesting to note that those in the UK denouncing Trump for his resorting to law have spent four years reverting to law to bring down democracy here. Its still all the same thing. A battle lost . The war remains the same since 1642.
Mr Murray is an asset to this country and to the west for his astute observations based on the truth. Jordan Peterson is another one who exposes lies and corruption without judging but keeping to the facts for the good of society. The real criminal in this matter is the fake news media and press who instead of reporting the facts of news have their own biased agenda. Under Communism or Nazism a free press was the first to go. It appears now that a lot of the press and media are already corrupted all or their own without any dictator pulling the strings.
Yes Tony, and bizarrely I have been called a “nazi” by the “left” and a “communist” by the “right” for even discussing Peterson’s ideas, let alone agreeing with any of them. Perhaps thankfully most of the punters haven’t heard of the priceless Mr Murray yet so I am at least able to mention his name in polite circles.
This is such unoriginal, lazy journalism, suggesting there is a moral equivalence between what the Democrats have done and continue to do, and the predicament the Republicans now find themselves in as a result.
We have witnessed the Democrats mounting three coups against the President, and this, the final one, may succeed. There is no moral equivalence. That the fraud has been botched, and done in full view of the world, only serves to rub it in: this is an exercise of raw power, and the Republicans had better remember its lesson: they will never, ever be allowed in again.
It isn’t journalism. It’s an opinion piece. The difference between the Democratic Party and the Republican Party is that the the Democrats manage to disguise their hypocrisy whereas, with the Republicans, what you see is what you get (or at least the disparity is a whole lot narrower).
Inevitably, that kind of hypocrisy leads to dirty tricks. I sincerely believe the Democrats would stop at nothing to win this election and the media has helped them do so by suppressing tough questions and creating a near-consensus where practically no one dares to raise comments or questions, such as …..
1) Compared with live votes, there has been an unexpected surge of postal votes on this occasion, double that of previous elections (for various understandable reasons not easy to pin down).
2) As in previous elections, there has been a significantly higher Democrat percentage share of posted votes than of live votes
3) In this particular election the above-average percentage of Democrat posted votes, within an already much enlarged share of posted votes, has had the effect in several states of reversing what was a consistently stable lead for Trump gained from the live votes and which would have most probably have prevailed, albeit by a reduced margin as the postal votes weighed in.
4) Both types of votes (live and postal) have to be received by the voting time deadline. Yet the process of counting the postal votes begins after or lags behind the live votes. This alone destroys what ought to be a random distribution of votes across all voters in that specific voting area. It is statistically unhealthy to allow potentially biased lumps to appear in what should be a natural random representation of voter granularity.
5) The identity of the postal voter is detached from the paper showing the actual vote and from that moment on it is impossible to re-match. This detachment of voters’ identity from their actual vote is to preserve the democratic golden rule of an anonymous vote. Unfortunately this detaching also removes the safeguard of checking that the vote itself is not counterfeit, duplicated (if Democrat), lost, disposed of or placed “accidentally” an in an already-counted pile (if Republican). The idea to separate postal voters’ identity from their voting paper was made and implemented by the Democrat Party
6) In short, once detached, there is no way of checking the authenticity of the vote. Consequently, there is no way of checking the checker. The postal checker’s identity could easily be stamped on the voting paper but it isn’t. If it was, it would be a way to determine whether one postal checker’s batch of votes has yielded a significantly above average percentage of Democrat votes.
7) Surveillance or video-streaming cameras are popping up in some states but not others and are mostly theatrical rather than purposeful, to reassure voters, although quite of what is unclear, lots of blathering about voter privacy, but nothing of much substance about voter fraud.
8) Overseeing the counting by both parties is supposed to be permitted but this time there were incident(s) where Republican Party’s campaign staff members were barred from overseeing the process.
9) To cut a long story short, quality control of the voting process is poor, patchy and varies across the 50 states from conscientious to a bad joke. This from a country that likes to see itself as the cradle of democracy. I don’t know one way or the other whether Trump is a victim of an electoral-counting process contaminated by fraud, corruption or functional stupidity. But there are some suspiciously bad smells. And I do know that justice has to not only be done but be seen to be done.
.
All my life Republicans/Conservatives told us (us as in Americans) that character matters. And then DJT took over the party and aside from Never Trumpers (I include myself in that group) the rest of the party (conservative movement) embraced DJT. How is that for hypocrisy.
In relation to your comment about voting it should be no problem (especially in conservative states like GE, AZ) for Trump and his supporters to go to court and provide evidence.
As of now Trump’s cases have been thrown out in GE, AZ and NV.
What about the Pennsylvania Case he just won ?
Yes, a small number of votes have been (even before Trump legal case) quarantined. But that is not fraud it is a constitutional question that i partly understand.
1 out of 4 (GE, AZ, NV) doesn’t look good!
Yes partly constitutional where the elecoral officiates seem to have been acting inappropriately. It raises the question of why were they ? I think Trumps lawyers will use it as evidence of Impropriety rather than fraud but which also carries legal consequesces.
“Yes partly constitutional where the elecoral officiates seem to have been acting inappropriately.”
NO!
It is a unresolved conflict about constitutional authority between Pen Supreme Court and Pen Legislators.
Look, you have already admitted
“ it is a constitutional question that i partly understand.” Whilst I agree it is not fraud but rather Impropriety and wont affect the outcome, given the margin. The Penn. Supreme court ordered them to change procedure so something was amiss. I argue for elecoral integrity not for for narrow partisanship of which you are an example. Your candidate won. Calm down and try to be objective.
Q1 Is quarantined a euphemism for not counted?
Q2 Were they almost all votes for Trump?
Q3 What do you mean by small number?
Q4 Do you realise that a “small number” in Penn can flip the result?
1) Yes
2) no one knows because they are not opened
3) don’t know the number – a few thousands as I understand it.
4) Biden is up 45,000
Trump has to provide evidence (and he has not in any case as of today) that fraud took place.
And then DJT took over the party and aside from Never Trumpers (I include myself in that group) the rest of the party (conservative movement) embraced DJT.
so the better option was Hillary? Really? A woman who sold the influence of her office as SoS is superior character to Trump. Yeah, go with that.
Trump, in office, did things conservatives historically cheer, from tax cuts to reduced regulations to originalist judges. There comes a point when the NT bit starts to look like a tantrum for no good reason. He wasn’t my first choice, either. But she was the last option, right after leaving that spot on the ballot blank.
1) tax cuts and massive budget deficits
2) originalist judges – those judges were found and nurtured by the Federalist Society (the Swamp as he says) and were shepherd through the process by McConnell while Trump was tweeting and watching Fox News. he would have appointed Judge Judy if she said something good about him on TV.
Let me quote Trump: ” Russia if you are listening”
We live in truly paranoid schizoid times -to borrow a term from psychoanalysis.
The splitting is ferocious. Things are either all good, or all bad; one side idealised; the other denigrated. No nuance, complexity or ambivalence allowed or tolerated.
An example: a person, otherwise broadly supportive of gay rights happens to disagree with gay marriage. S/he is instantly condemned, by those who are splitting, as all homophobe -with no accounting for that part of the person who generally supports freedom of sexual choice. The whole person is denigrated.
In another case, a hitherto considerate, sane and normal person tweets something which disagrees with some aspect concerning race -they are all racist suddenly.
This is largely what is going on now on a massive scale.
The basis of paranoid schizoid behaviours is usually overwhelming fear and anxiety for one’s survival in the face of perceived existential threat, suffering and discomfort. Under such a perceived threat, the paranoid schizoid mind cannot cope with the overwhelming sense of painful truth; it creates splits as a defence.
Why are so many now resorting to such primitive and infantile responses? All adults split, but the ferocious splitting we are witnessing in the States seems out of all proportion. On the whole, we have never been more comfortable, nor so safe in terms of our capacity to continue existing.
One answer might be that we have been steadily infantilised over a period of some decades by those who wish to manipulate us to be increasingly dependent on whatever it is they are selling? This has stripped us of our human dignity, and our valuing of real freedom; and in many, the wish to keep striving for it. Have we become so demoralised as a consequence that we now cannot cope with pain and suffering so we split and project it all away?
I think Covid is not so much a disease but a symptom of these processes.
Quite correct, any opposition to homosexuality is now completely forbidden, even discussions regarding the severe sexual health problems associated with male homosexuality. This is in the interests of no one, neither homosexuals, or wider society.
Yes, it is Alex. You do not have the right to oppose someone else’s sexuality. It has got absolutely nothing to do with you or your opinions.
The same tired old excuse for an argument.
Most people have no problem in trying persuade people to give up smoking or gambling, in fact legislation has been formulated for that purpose. I do not oppose their “sexuality”, I oppose their behaviour which is undeniably dangerous and unhealthy.
My personal view is that homosexuality is closely related to addiction a condition which is as yet unexplained by medical science…….as is the existence of the “gay” gene.
Another great Article, to go along with your books.
The trouble, as you have pointed out so many times, people of the left are unable to read your article in the spirit it is intended. Look for instance at Andrew Harman’s comments below who immediately denounces your piece by saying it is full of ‘hyperbole’ and that ‘anyone who believes Donald Trump is the answer is seriously misguided’. Andrew, why don’t you re-read the article and say when Douglas said he was the answer?
The one reason why so many people voted for Trump was because of the corruption of the Democrats. Why he got in last time was because of the cynical manipulation and corruption of the Clintons. And here it is again with the double standards of the left wing press over Biden!
As Douglas says you can’t expect to kick someone in the teeth for 4 years and expect that person and his followers not to want some revenge; unless of course you are a liberal left winger because of course then you would be so wrapped up in your own entitlement that you would believe you are always right, the other side always wrong and therefore you are justified in telling others what to do and scarily what to think!
I was not referring to the article, I was referring to some of the comments below. Apologies if that was not clear. However, it seems you did not read the first part of my post if you are implying that I am of the left! I would also point out that I do not fall into a neat pigeon hole: I think lockdowns are a bad idea, I am extremely sceptical regarding masks and I think the modern left is hugely intolerant of dissent. As it happens, I like may of DM’s writings, although I think this one was not his best. The problem is so many are trying to present false dichotomies now. A plague on both their houses.
You state the dilemma as elegantly as ever: should the right shrug its shoulders and try business as formerly usual, thereby handing an unfair moral advantage to a corrupt and unscrupulous left? Or should it do as it has been done by, at the risk of further fraying an already threadbare social peace? Into this should enter calculations of advantage and weakness, of course – and the moment you get into detail a way forward emerges logically. The right in today’s America is hamstrung by the alliance of Big Tech, social media and deep state. In a position of weakness, one plays the Fox, not the Lion. This was perhaps Trump’s essential mistake: he roared too openly and united his enemies. Therefore, the right should be focussed on going through the motions of democracy with measured language and principled well argued stands, whilst busily setting up new, alternative networks of communication. It should reframe its rhetoric in such a way as to hang on to its loyal voters from various communities and use whatever power it has to block, stymie, scrutinise and amend the Biden programme in Congress. Only once the chickens of left wing profligacy have started coming home to roost should it begin moving in with the more aggressive tactics. As Baden-Powell used to say: Be Prepared. Alas, poor Trump was not prepared; hence his defeat – whether by hook or by crook.
Significant that you refer to Baden-Powell’s advice to boy scouts. Your advice on the best way for the right to regroup and carry on the struggle displays all the naive honesty and good intentions of the caricature boy scout.
“…measured language and principled well argued stands…” (?!) Do you really believe that the electorate have the patience for that?
As for the “…the chickens of left wing profligacy…” coming home to roost ““ that has been going on for decades. The right fondly imagine that the people will be shocked and outraged as the damaging effects of socialist policies become apparent ““ yet it never seems to happen.
In fact the left become ever more extreme in their demands and denunciations. The public, cowed by moral bullying, grudgingly aquiesce ““ they just want to be left in peace to get on with their lives. How many people voted for Biden in the hope that with Trump out of the way the left would “lay down their arms” and let America go back to normal?
The prospects you indicate are all more than possible. But as you will see, if you peruse my words again, I allow for this. The problem then confronts us: have we the sheer muscle to rebel? Look at it another way – at the Battle of Bosworth, Richard III, suddenly outnumbered by the defection of Stanley, charged directly at Henry Tudor, hoping to knock him out and win against the odds. Alternatively, he could have beaten a hasty retreat – conceding the battle but prolonging the war. In a way, Trump has tried – is trying – the Richard III tactic. It seems perilously likely that he has suffered a similar fate – politically – and that, like the last Plantagenet, his reputation will be trashed. There are already rumours circulating in the press that he faces gaol. The new regime will be foul to its leading opponents, just as the Tudors were. So again I put it to you, in Machiavelli’s language – Fox? Or Lion? The Fox knows how to play “Boy-scout” when the dangers loom; much in the way that Robert Graves’ Claudius plays the fool – before becoming Emperor. Above all, those of us aware of all that is going on: the “great reset”, the climate change scam, the political use of migration, the advance of Marxist “social constructivism” and the smelly fiasco of this latest election, should prepare the ground for our next moves and do so in a spirit of patience and unity. Impatience, disunity and recrimination – you will recall – were the greatest enemies of resistance movements in occupied Europe. With the left in control of so much, we need to develop the same virtues – and fast.
“climate change scam”
Yes, policies that deliver cleaner air and water are terrible right?
I am a paleoconservative (google its meaning) but the problem with “us” is not the left is “our” INCOMPETENCE.
Were you drunk when you wrote this?
I should ask you that quesiton…Tudor history, occupied Europe, Claudius
So knowledge is inebriation, is it? In which case I advise you to stop being teetotal.
It has nothing to do with the article. Why not bang on about Bismarck.
Don’t you understand analogies?
I do, and yours are completely pointless.
Oh? How so?
1) Your original comment is half a conspiracy theory and half stupidity
2) Analogies are pointless because see point 1
Are you Donald Trump? Or rather, are you the Donald Trump of the left’s perfervid imaginings? You fit the bill perfectly.
Nope
So why behave in the same coarse, ignorant, unintelligent way?
Why do you write conspiracies (deep state)?
I think you mean “write about”. And a deep state is not a conspiracy, it’s a mentality, a disposition, a shared body of assumptions and ethics among a number of people, working together. It requires no conspiracy to be mobilised in resistance to any government policy of which it disapproves.
It is a conspiracy! Obeying Federal Law is their legal duty. What LEGAL government policy did the Deep State oppose?
Garbage
Left Marxists Piers Corbyn & Left Wing Michael Moore have clearly shown.climate is not warming,Carbon is vital for life to exist..& Scientific models have been falsified….Univ of east anglia in 2008/9 ..If you have Weather Apps on your phone after 3-4 days their Forecasts ARE inaccurate….Its Taxpayers that deliver Cleaner Water,Not Left or Right.. Forest fires have been made Worse in USA and Australia by ‘Green” Policies not allowing Firebreaks..
Where’s the fox?
Does the main force of the conservative right consist of an army of keyboard warriors preparing the ground for the next move by grumbling about George Soros, cultural Marxism, woke lunacy, the MSM and (inevitably) “the long march through the institutions”?
Conservatives waste their days longing for a return to a world preceding the one which began with the social upheavals of the late 1960s. Meanwhile, the left wing forces they fear have taken the institutions not with a march but a stroll (so little resistance did they meet). Even Britain’s Conservative party now seeks woke approval.
The forces of the left will only be successfully countered by forward-looking political movements which offer a realistic chance of a better future for the young. Do you have a fox working on that?
Can you be more specific in your prescriptions?
In a simple world competence! You don’t respond to the left wing biased in MSM/Academia with Fox News (and talk radio) insanities but with hard facts and planning.
No.
So how are you any better than the objects of your criticism?
The record of the left when achieving power is abysmal. can you name one left wing economy which can support its people in an acceptable manner?Capitalism has given better living standards everywhere, but these standards are being undermined by the left who, allied to the mad “liberals” seek to overthrow the system through social measures.
Sweden is richer than UK and is far more socialists. When democrats in USA talk about socialism they are talking (wrongly in my thinking, USA Is not Scandinavia) about Denmark/Sweden. That is what they want. They want Denmark.
I would think Germany would be a better example…but my opinion doesn’t matter.
None of these countries equate to the USA in social or political terms Jeremy, They are certainly not socialist though they do have a high tax economy, but the huge social problems of America or even the UK do not apply and they have additional oil benefits from the original boom in the seventies.
The Squad don’t want democratic socialism.
Presumably the US is unaware that Denmark is in the process of slaughtering 17 million grey Mink, that would otherwise be gracing the bodies of millions of dog eating Han Chinese beauties?
What is the connection between Danish (Scandi) economic style and mink farming?
Greed and hypocrisy?
Ni, Sweden is not “more socialist.”
it is SOCIAL Democratic and has been except 1975-80 since 1930s ..They were neutral until EU membership robbed them of that
Do you think I am speaking up for left wing economies? Not at all. I am just weary of all the knee-jerk comments trotted out by those keyboard warriors who despise the Left but flatter themselves that expressing a low opinion of the Left online is the same as somehow striking a telling blow against them.
Your contrasting of socialism against capitalism is already a well worn trope (that doesn’t mean I reject it!). If I had £5 for every time I have read or heard that opinion I’d be a wealthy capitalist myself.
Does it really help to label liberals as “mad” when, allied with the Left, they are consistently getting their way on the issues they campaign for? Surely that is a classic case of underestimating your opponent.
Their views on freedom of speech, parental control of children, gender, teaching on homosexuality and various other social issues can only be described as mad. Oh I forgot “equality of outcome” the maddest of them all.
“…can ONLY be described as mad.”
That sort of rhetoric may give you some personal satisfaction (rather like a football supporter on the losing side jeering at a rival team) but it does not show any understanding of the success of the Left/liberal project. How have they so successfully captured the moral highground with beliefs you dismiss as mad?
If you can’t counter them with better arguments than that you may as well consign your conservative values to the dustbin of history.
Bosworth was lost well before the treachery of the Stanley’s.
The only competent fighting force on the battlefield were the French /Swiss mercenaries under command of Philibert de Chandee, specially hired for the occasion. They opened the attack (uphill) and fairly easily broke Norfolk’s charge and killed him at the start of the battle.
From there on “it was all over bar the shouting” as they say.
Chandee was rewarded with one of the very few peerages (Earl of Bath) dished out by the notoriously parsimonious Henry Tudor, after the battle. A just reward, for a sterling performance.
Moral of the story? Trump should have ‘hired’ better support!
“Moral of the story? Trump should have ‘hired’ better support!”
I agree with you but that requires competence. And Trump just wants to tweet.
I agree “American polarisation predates Trump by decades.” I was a student in the States 71-72 and was shocked by the depth of division I felt and witnessed way back then mainly over race and Vietnam.
Internal divisions ultimately become an important factor in the decline and fall of empires. We may now be seeing that accelerating in the American Empire.
Donald Trump is accused of fostering division. I believe he has uncovered it rather than foster it. He found a language which articulated what the great Unheard were thinking and brought it to the surface. I see a link between him and Mikhail Gorbachev in this regard. Although light years separate him from Trump politically and intellectually Gorbachev similarly laid bare the great weaknesses of the Soviet Empire which were so lethal it could not stand against their exposure for more than a few years.
The American Empire is made of stronger stuff but its gradual demise as a superpower is advancing. I doubt that Biden/Harris will be able to stop it. They will find the polarisation symptom of decline particularly difficult to treat.
Almost to illustrate Douglas Murray’s final paragraph there are signs that young far left democrats imagine that they are at the head of an occupying army. Something called The Trump Accountability Project has been initiated. They are calling for lists to be drawn up of “those who have been complicit in aiding Trump”. Sounds quite sinister.
Douglas – you are such an astute observer and you get so much of this right. (I think. Who knows what is right and what is wrong anymore?)
What makes you dismiss the allegations of voter fraud so glibly then? If the media has conjured up such a faulty narrative before, often by omission, could they perhaps be downplaying fraud allegations too?
I found it strange how the media waited until the last moment to call a state while it looked like Trump was winning, yet so quickly declared a Democrat victory when Biden was winning. It’s almost like the media is the Democrat party.
It is to be hoped that internal divisions in his own country and opportunistic mischief making by China will keep President Biden fully occupied and spare us any moth-eaten stage-Irish shenanigans such as we used to receive from the likes of Senator Edward Kennedy. However, I am not optimistic.
Does a Biden victory presage a calmer more understanding era of American political and civil life ? I’m afraid not. Leaving the republican response aside I say it for several reasons but the main one being the battle between the progressive left of the party and the Democratic establishment that Biden represents. Right now there is unity in the struggle to get Trump out but the left are expecting their reward in the cabinet and in policy. However, Biden said in September ,
“I beat the socialist. That’s how I got elected. That’s how I got the nomination,“ Biden added, referencing his overwhelming defeat of Sanders following a strong showing by Sanders in several early states.
“Do I look like a socialist?“ Biden continued. “Look at my career, my whole career. I’m not a socialist.”. Trouble ahead and its is starting already with the anger over the losses in congress with each side blaming the other. Also, as Mr. Murray points out, BLM and Antifa both predate Trump and will continue under Biden but without the ralling call of “bad man Trump”.
After years of declaring half the country as racist or nazi or whatever else, there is no walking that back. The people suddenly wanting unity do not get absolution from treating fellow Americans like scum. I hope that the effort to destroy family relationships and friendships was worth it, but I don’t see going back. We’re not friends. We’re not like exes.
Exes can usually be civil and polite in mixed company because that’s how adults behave. Well, most adults. On occasion, they can be friendly, especially if there are children still in the home. They are almost never friends as the word is defined. They are exes for a reason. And this is where we are. Like I said, I hope those who contributed so mightily to this outcome believe the effort was worth it.
After years of declaring half the country as racist or worse, there is no walking that back. The people suddenly wanting unity do not get absolution from treating fellow Americans like scum. I hope that the effort to destroy family relationships and friendships was worth it, but I don’t see going back. We’re not friends. We’re not like exes.
Exes can usually be civil and polite in mixed company because that’s how adults behave. Well, most adults. On occasion, they can be friendly, especially if there are children still in the home. They are almost never friends as the word is defined. They are exes for a reason. And this is where we are. Like I said, I hope those who contributed so mightily to this outcome believe the effort was worth it.
Cast your mind back to the Obama years and you could safely conclude, that perhaps Trump wasn’t the precursor but he certainly did his best to separate people from the truth eg. The endless birther blather was obviously both a lie, and designed to appeal to people who were not happy that Obama was president. One doesn’t have to agree with who is leader but there’s a method in place to assuage those concerns, it’s called voting.
It’s hard to say whether or not this reference to Israel/Palestine or Bosnia is hyperbole but Bosnia is really a terrible analogy when you think about the history and so is Israel – these are not populations at each other’s throats due to disagreements over facts but borders and religion, unless you conclude that religion is a lie that one side doesn’t agree with the other on, and borders in both places have been contentious always which I guess, is true but past that”¦a stretch.
The Tea Party were pretty vocal and given an open platform by Fox News – it’s not hard to imagine a % of a population, not given to critical thinking, accepting at face value much of this clearly counter-factual rhetoric, particularly in the US where so many are prone to fall for huxterism.
What other advanced western civilization has fortune-tellers and crystal ball gazers behind neon lights in every town or city? Or so many cults masquerading as religions? There is seemingly a large enough % of the population that have such a tenuous grasp on reality to start with, that a deviation from fact is almost inevitable. This is not about politics per se it’s about opportunists from all points taking advantage of a population.
It must be remembered that a large portion of the Republican Party were part of “The Swamp” that Donal John so despised. They will be glad to see the back of the best President America ever had, and relax back into the mud and corruption; so I do not think that the Republicans will give Biden or his almost immediate successor Harris the treatment handed out to President Trump.
Very few politicians are loved by their voters, in fact almost none in my long lifetime, but President Trump had the common touch and I flatter myself that it comes from his Mother who was born to a poor crofting family in the Isle of Lewis and who never lost touch with her roots or her native language.
I think Donal John is too good for politics.
“…best President America ever had…” – Ike was a failure right? FDR? Teddy Roosevelt?
When you ask Trump supporters what are his great achievement ? Judges is their universal answer! DO YOU AGREE?
Well who found and nurtured these judges? The Federalist Society – aka The Swamp
Who managed the process of appointing them and getting them through the Senate? Mitch McConnel – member of the Swamp right? It took years and years of hard work to find and nurture those judges…not angry tweets or watching hours and hours of Fox News!
P.S. If it was up to DJT he would appoint Judge Judy in the Supreme Court…because he has seen her on TV.
Well Judges are important when faced with such an extensive and corrupt opposition, but Donal John was the first president who actively tried to implement the promises he made to his supporters in2016. Although incomplete, these are to me his greatest achievements.
I find your tone rather disagreeable, a poor start for the new era of togetherness? Right?
“who actively tried to implement the promises he made to his supporters in 2016”
NO!
He promised to repeal and replace Obamacare! Where is it?
He promised a tax reform that would increase taxation on rich people – like himself. We know from many sources (including Bannon) that it was Paul Ryan that developed the tax plan and pushed through a tax cut for rich people.
He promised to balance the budget. Before Covid he borrowed in 3 years 2x as much as Obama did in his last 4 years.
I can go on….
To get stuff done YOU (trump in this case) got to be COMPETENT.
If you read my comment, you will see the word “tried”, I did not say that he accomplished all that he promised. Given his treatment by the media, his lack of a proper majority and the dissenting members of his own Party he did exceptionally well In boosting the economy, cutting unemployment, fighting Globalism, starting dialogue with other powerful regimes, Moving forward the peace process in the Middle East(for which he should certainly have been awarded the N PP) many other achievements too numerous to mention
Certainly ONE of the best!
He had a proper majority in his first 2 years. That is how he passed the tax cut – opposed by the democrats.
His party under his leadership lost the majority in 2018. That wasn’t beamed from space! The American people voted against Trump.
Unemployment was going down (easy to measure) year after year. He boosted the economy because he boosted the deficit – easy to measure again.
I too can boost the economy if I run $1 trillion annual deficit.
He also promised to publish his tax returns!
Where are they?
Or did MSM, Democrats, the Swap stopped him from publishing his tax returns.
In my youth I was a socialist, over the years the reality dawned upon me that all socialist economies finally collapse. Even the Soviet Union and China have been forced to adopt Capitalist economics.
For Capitalism to work effectively, financial aspiration must be encouraged chiefly through tax cuts to industry, this can often be achieved by borrowing or printing money….BUT the money must be invested wisely so that the economy grows and profits flow back into the exchequer. Unfortunately socialists today understand that their economics are unworkable , so have moved on to the “identity politics” which gifted a hollow victory to Biden.
The results of a Harris govt supported by “The Squad” are almost too horrific to contemplate.
Your comment did not address any of my points.
Where are (as he promised) his tax returns?
I know nothing about the President’s tax returns, if there are irregularities they will presumably be dealt with, but it is unlikely that anything illegal has transpired. I run a small business and tax liabilities are variable according to income and expenditure.
I was actually attempting to address your points regarding tax cuts to business and working class families. The president increased his vote in many poorer demographics, who seem to understand Capitalist economic slightly better than you do.
“I know nothing about the President’s tax returns…”
Nice try!
He promised to publish his tax returns. He has not done so. 4 years later he has failed to keep his promise. He lied – not very hard to know that. You just don’t want to.
Perfectly fine to cut taxes, but he ALSO Promised to balance the budget. He was running (before Covid) $1 trillion deficit. Obama’s deficit was c.$450 billion.
I remember being at an ancient Greek Temple and realising that the people who built it at the time probably had no conception of the fact their society and religion would collapse. I don’t disagree with you about socialist economies though I’d differ I’m sure on definitions of socialism – but I do think we need to bear in mind that the capitalist economic model probably won’t last forever either. We should think about what follows socialism/capitalism.
Well Mark I’m pretty sure I know what will follow and it will be Fascism where all freedoms will be granted by the state depending on ones degree of dependence. I also think family life and perhaps even the male of the species will be abolished, but even these things will pass away as you say. The pandemic is interesting as it illustrates how economies can be brought down through blind panic and political expediency and systems of government made unworkable…..much more likely than the Climate Change ruse. The planet will be here and in good heart long after humanity is gone.
Capitalism is the ‘non-violent’ alternative to war.
Have you ever talked to people with medium to small businesses in the US. I did, and they told me, that Trump cutting all the regulation Obama put in their way, their businesses started booming. Result: More employment and more salary to employees.
I could talk (anecdotally as you did) to business OR i could check out the official statistics published by the current administration!
What do you think is the more accurate source of news?
Jeremy I salute your indefatigability but when you are deaing with people who believe that “Obama shut down US manufacturing and outsourced jobs globally” you are wasting your time I’m afraid. The Unherd comments section is basically Brietbart with a slightly better vocabulary…….
I think we’re a long way from seeing if the peace process in the middle east has moved forward. I suspect what has happened is the further division of middle east actors along political lines rather than straightforward Arab vs Israeli.
Though I concede Trump didn’t start any new wars.
My word, the rancour, hyperbole and bile on here. I am no leftist and I think the likes of Antifa have corrupted a noble cause; the same with ER and climate change. I am wary and concerned at the move of the Democrats to the left and i am contemptuous of the wokeflakes and their antipathy to free speech The obsession with identity politics and pronouns has carried them away from the lives and aspirations of so many people who need and deserve better.
However, anyone who thinks Donald Trump is the answer is seriously misguided. He has used these divisions to serve his own ego and any benefits that came from his presidency have been incidental and qualified. Moreover, they have been more than outweighed by the damage he has done. Yes, the media deserve chastisement but he has dubbed anything contrary to his own interests as fake news, a dangerous thing to do. I don’t know how true the allegations against him are but would anyone be surprised if they turned out to be true? All Trumps life has has been about self promotion and self aggrandisement; why should that have changed?
I don’t agree, conservatives must fight fire with fire and Donal John has the guts(ego?) to motivate even the staid centre right. For years we have stood back and watched our values trashed and our children indoctrinated; enough is enough if we do not get behind a charismatic figure like The President we may as well lay down and die. I for one, don’t want to see the future projected by the very powerful “liberal” elite come to fruition. If Donald is really finished, a new Talisman will surely arise ……but we must not give in.
Adding to the fun, “democracy advocates” have started the Trump Accountability Project. The purpose is to develop a list of Trump enablers, presumably to punish them or potential employers. Biden calls for unity and the left plans revenge.
Brilliant as always.
This is an interesting article and I agree with the general premise. I should start by clarifying that I am not a Democrat or a Republican. I tend to vote conservative in the UK if that helps.
Although I agree with many of the points made above I can’t get myself to the point where I can see that both sides are equally contributing to the problem and I think there are a number of corrections that need to be made to the points above to make this clearer.
1) Trump didn’t call all Mexicans rapists. This is correct and I’m not sure that anyone has ever claimed that he did. He claimed that most of the Mexicans that are coming to America illegally are rapists and murderers. A claim that I suspect was made with no data to back it up.
2) The Democrats came up with fake allegations about Russian interference in the election. These allegations were not false and in fact they led to the prosecution of a number of people in the US connected with the US including the Chair of the Trump election campaign (Paul Manafort).
3) Both sides are attacking each others family. I agree that this should be avoided but I feel less sympathy with family members who are employed in senior government positions.
I don’t claim that the Democrats are innocent here and I believe the lack of action as a result of the claims made against Hillary Clinton’s email issues were partisan and too dismissive of what was a real issue.
The Trump team and the Republicans have taken the problem to a new level. in 2016, Clinton accepted the result and conceded the election. Obama participated in a full transition. While I accept that Trump didn’t start this and was more a consequence that a cause, I still believe that a return to a more civil political discussion will be possible when he departs the White House.
You’ve saved me having to type my response.
This is disappointing from Douglas Murray. The Mueller inquiry found repeated examples of the Russian state meddling in the 2016 election to try and produce a result favourable to them. That’s documented in the report. The direct link between the Trump family and Russia was not definitively established. However, a cursory glance of Mueller’s findings can leave you in no doubt what he thought about Trump’s behaviour.
The one line comment about Trump and Ukraine would give some readers the impression that the impeachment was about a clumsy telephone call. It wasn’t. Douglas Murray knows that.
Ah Big Tech Companies The ones like Fakebook which employs failed Politically Correct Politicians?
Big Tech means Lockheed Martin or Boeing surely.
Are you jealous that you didn’t get the Facebook job?
The photo says it all. Trumpism signifies the rise of Flyoverlandia. Himself was sadly too too imperfect a vessel, and the red center has an whole congeries of motives, some of which do it no credit; but, its defiance of the mega-metro coastal cultural with all its billionaires and corrupt institutions supporting the Big Lie articulated By Douglas Murray bears comparison with the long heroic, quixotic tilting of Eire against John Bull.
Clinton and Biden got more votes, so how is that their voters are the elite but Trump voters are the people?
Your usage “elites v people” is artful. Though, polemics aside, there is an whole sociology could be brought to bear to discomfit your irony.
However, my point was that Flyoverlandia, exploited, abandoned and despised for onto 40 yrs while all the gov is directed at increasing the wealth and cultural ascendancy of the coastal cosmopoloi (and secondarily, their interior satellite metro areas), is justly aggrieved.
But, amazingly, though deprived of effective representation and expression, they did break through with the crude gesture of Trump.
This canadian has so enjoyed watching Trump drive the liberals crazy. If as you said that this presidency is going to be as much fun, I say bring it on. I could care less who’s president. It’s not my country.
Imagine it had been Trump and his son rather than Biden, it would’ve been splashed all over the news 24/7 for weeks.
The question now is, after the dust settles are the press going to own up and hang their heads in shame.
How many truth tellers are there left in that profession or have they all become their mortal enemy.
American citizen here.
Basically I agree with Murray, up to “irresponsibly.”
WTF? “Irresponsible” are the media for calling a winner when this is still in contention. “Irrsponsible” is the collusion of the media and Big Social Media to suppress news and to cancel both social media accounts and the sitting president himself when he calls a prees conference.
It it pretty interesting that the farcical impeachment attempt was unleashed by a perfectly anodyne phone call between Trump and Zeleny or whatever his name was, the subject being possible Biden corruption in Ukraine. Now the same crew of conspirators attempt, again, to suppress and censor the President in the carrying out of normal presidential duties—which include taking steps to investigate and prevent corruption (in this case, of the results of the election).
Are you saying, sir, that if Trump is the victim of a lying and censorship campaign or of election fraud, he has to recuse himself from his presidential duties and prerogatives and make like it’s all OK with him if both he and the country of which he is the Executive get screwed and he is just going to pull his punches and let Dem and media bullies kick sand in his and the nation’s face in order to look “gentlemanly,” a la Al Gore and John Kerry? ? That is really weird, man . . .
I am not fan of Trump but I am also not dumb and not a fan of wimpos who will not defend themselves and the country. Go kick your sand elsewhere!
On the subject of Johnson’s racist comments about Obama – Johnson was being racist. He was saying that Obama’s views on what was best for his country, which he was President of, were influenced more by his race rather than his intellect or judgement. He was not saying his understanding of events could be influenced by his heritage – he was saying it was the prime motivation behind his understanding.
It would be equally racist to say Joe Biden’s views on Ireland are influenced by the fact his ancestors came from there.
On the subject of Trump’s comments on Mexicans. He said ‘They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.’ He did not say all Mexicans are rapists – and that is not what his opponents claim. He used his position to make a statement that he knew would be understood by racists to mean he supported their belief that a higher proportion of Mexicans are criminals than white people.
Exactly!
Heritage and race are not the same thing
Nice try
“It would be equally racist to say Joe Biden’s views on Ireland are influenced by the fact his ancestors came from there.” You’re saying Biden’s Irish ancestry can’t influence his views on Ireland?
I’m saying that if you disagree with someone you argue with them on points of fact and analysis. You don’t use their family history, race, heritage or religion as an argument.
“I’m going back to Ireland ““ the country from which my ancestors hailed,
and a country whose independence the Easter Rising set in motion, 100
years ago this year. It is my first dedicated trip to this nation as
Vice President ““ during which I’ll meet with the country’s leaders,
discuss issues of trade, economic recovery, migration and refugee
policy, and other national security challenges, and celebrate our shared
heritage. Our shared values of tolerance. Diversity. Inclusiveness.”
He seems to be claiming shared values based in large part on his heritage. Also, which race in particular would the -ists be dissing?
There is a picture of Biden shaking hands with a convicted terrorist and the leader of the political wing of the IRA while this organisation was bombing civilians and members of our govt.
True; but that man made peace. Think of Arafat, Peres and Clinton.
You make peace with your enemy not with your friend.
Donald Trump and the North Korean monkey?
Fact is Biden was shaking hands with Adams, who denies to this day being an IRA leader despite overwhelming evidence to contrary, AND with his arm around Rita O’Hare, an IRA fugitive from justice.
The IRA ‘made peace’ mainly because they were almost defeated in NI in the 1990’s. To this day their nasty Marxist thugs mete out ‘justice’ beatings in NI while sinn fein grease their way to power in the Republic.
So North Koreans are not people that Trump made peace with, they are monkeys.
I understand now why everything you say is downvoted – because you sir are a c**t.
It seems a bit of a stretch to believe that people’s decision making is not influenced by their ethnicity, when if we are to believe the current culture, that the colour of a persons skin has such a huge impact on their life experiences, so no I don’t believe that Johnsons comments were racist.
There you go again Mark – making Douglas Murray’s point for him. There was nothing racist in Johnson’s comment about Obama’s part Kenyan heritage. If he said Ghandi was anti British because he was brought up under colonialism, would that be racist? Or how about saying the same thing about Irish people being anti-British? Even the Guardian has asked the same question – ie could Obama’s part Kenyan ancestry reshape UK/US relations?
https://www.theguardian.com…
It is not racist to say any of these three things. This continual watering down of a word which had four different meanings anyway, isn’t advancing political discourse. And don’t always imagine other people are thinking what you are thinking.
He did not say all Mexicans are rapists – and that is not what his opponents claim.
Actually, it is what his opponents claim. It’s what they’ve have claimed for four years now. And what in that statement is untrue? There are drugs coming from Mexico. There are criminals among the illegals who enter the country. By your reckoning, all the Latinos voting for Trump must be self-hating.
He used his position to make a statement that he knew would be understood by racists to mean he supported their belief that a higher proportion of Mexicans are criminals than white people.
This is you projecting what you believe. We have enough home-grown criminals without importing more.
The Kenyan antipathy towards (imperialist?) Britain is not racist and neither is recognising it.
Perhaps Mr Biden should consider calling himself ‘His High Mightiness, the President of the United States and Protector of Their Liberties’, just as George Washington did?
Douglas, it’s difficult to count the falsehoods, but let me try.
1. No one ever said that Trump said that ‘all’ Mexicans. He didn’t. He said that the Mexicans are sending people with problems, among them rapists.
2. He did not in fact, condemn white supremacy in his original comments about Charlottesville, and like much of what Trump says, it was cleaned up by a statement from the White House two days later. The problem he has is that, for example, he denied knowing who David Duke, the head of the KKK, was, during his campaign, which is a clear lie because he made prior comments about him, on the record, when Duke was running for senator and also governor of Louisiana… which contextualizes his comments about Charlottesville. If Bernie Sanders said he didn’t know who Fidel Castro was, I doubt few would find it credible, and would suspect his related comments disavowing Antifa were believable.
3. The fact that your two ‘examples’ of the left believing lies about Trump are both squishy strawmen start your argument off poorly to say the least.
4. Hunter Biden’s laptop. Dourlas,f this story were even marginally believable, don’t you think that either Bill Barr’s DOJ or Chris Wray’s FBI, both Trump appointees, would have picked it up and run with it? What could have been better than to discover that the opponents holier than thou feet… are made of clay? Because you know that they would have attacked had there been any opportunity to do so, it’s now your job to turn yourself into a pretzel to explain why… and your answer, incredibly, is because the “left” and ‘social media’ covered it up. Really? That’s the best you’ve got? The left and social media covered it all up… so that the DOJ and the FBI couldn’t find anything there to actually investigate? Wow… they are REALLY good!! Who knew that Facebook and Twitter could control all knowledge so perfectly!! As to why no one paid much attention to the NY Post, the famous bastion of all that’s right and truthful you leave as a mystery as yet not understood.
In short, your example of Hunter Biden’s laptop is indeed a good example of different facts that form the basis for the opinions held by the left and right, and you might start by putting the koolaid bottle down and simply searching any reputable fact checking organization and they all say the same thing; it’s nonsense. That you believe it is, as I said, a perfect example of why we’re so divided, because to believe that you must, perforce, believe that ALL the credible news organizations, ALL the credible fact checking organizations, and the DOJ and the FBI are wrong. What, Douglas, do you think the chances of that are… that you’re right, and they are all wrong?
I could go on, but why. Anyone who believes such things is beyond reason, beyond facts… the very thing that you find at the bottom of our divisions as a nation. You, Douglas, are the problem.
No one you say. Many may agree that CNN is ‘no one,’ but that’s really true:
Trump basically called Mexicans rapists again – CNNPoliticswww.cnn.com “º 2018/04/06 “º politics “º trump-mexico-ra…
Apr 6, 2018 ” President Donald Trump wants to be a provocateur again. Why else would he bring up his specious and repeatedly disproven claim that …
“If Bernie Sanders said he didn’t know who Fidel Castro was”
Bernie praised Castro. Again, let’s consult the evidence:
Election 2020: Bernie Sanders’ praise for Fidel Castro angers …www.usatoday.com “º politics “º elections “º 2020/03/13
Mar 13, 2020 ” Bernie Sanders continues to praise Fidel Castro’s literacy program in Cuba, but those who lived through it saw more propaganda than …
The same person who took issue with “all Dems” when I should have used “many” drops a couple of whoppers and calls the author a liar.
A Trumpian display of sly dishonesty here. I read Unherd articles precisely because most contributors provide actual ideas and perspective worth considering. Few are so nakedly partisan (and in this chap’s case, for reasons unknown – maybe to flog books, I suppose…). Aside from dismissing whole swathes of recent history because they inconveniently interfere withe the “The Left lies and distorts more than the Right in America” narrative, a few points really rankled, so a few thoughts in reply:
One can read the transcript of Trump’s escalator speech ( https://time.com/3923128/do… ) and see clearly that the implied equation is “Mexicans = rapists”. Tone and context provide the emphasis even in the absence of the word “all”. The after-the-fact, offhand, addition of “and some are good people” is at best an after-the-fact attempt to undo some of the initial blackballing of the group.
And as for that C’ville statement – it was issued a day after the initial refusal to engage on the matter of whether he would condemn supremacists. ( https://qz.com/1053270/full… ). And read out verbatim from the Teleprompter with all the sincerity of Mitch McConnell’s justifications for scuppering the Garland nomination.
And the Hunter laptop? Take a look here ( https://www.vox.com/2020/10… ) and consider whether there ever was an actual laptop, or if the repair-store story was concocted to mask another hack. Either way the details that have actually emerged about the contents of the supposed email exchanges are far from damning of Joe Biden.
I’ve had the luck to live in three countries, getting a chance to compare the political media first hand. No outlets are as partisan and untruthful as American right-wing (I refuse to dignify them with the label “conservative”) TV, radio and internet personalities. They’ve been lying to themselves and their audiences for so long that I’m not sure they know they’re lying. It’s disheartening to see that level of dishonesty in a UK-based portal like UnHerd…
Many Hispanics are voting for Trump because the falsely believe that a Biden Presidency equates to the same type of socialism that ruined Venezuela. It isn’t because they overlook his racists views, towards Mexicans. They just care more about the US economy than a racists president.
I don’t understand the controversy over Hunter Biden’s laptop. A business owner decided to illegally submit private data contained on the laptop to Rudy’s lawyer for what? Because he was illegally snooping around on the private hard drive of one of his clients and took it upon himself to share it with others? And then somehow the FBI has the right to investigate the laptop based on what suspicion? The illegal breach of privacy committed by the store owner? It would be a bit like a cop just coming into your house for no reason, finding some drugs and then watch the case get dropped because it is illegal to just snoop around someone’s house if you have no evidence a crime has been committed, even if one was. The right to privacy in this case is more important than the crimes it turns out were taking place in many cases.
Are we going to start allowing private citizens to just harass others and infringe on their privacy because hey they’re left wingers so they MUST be doing something wrong. And if we happen to discover some of them were doing something wrong well now in the new right wing America, the breach of privacy used to discover the crime is now no longer relevant because the right has decided to change the law for their own benefit and to target their opponents. That doesn’t sound like the kind of American anyone wants to live in because it goes both ways.
How is this laptop scenario any different? So his son his a shitbag for smoking crack and whatever. Is that Biden’s responsibility? What does that have to do with Biden’s ability to run the government? You don’t even need to use the Russian disinformation theory to tear down the laptop storyline the right wants to push as a means to undermining Biden’s run for office, which is irrelevant now anyway.
And so Biden was using his position to justify some business deals overseas. Trump and his friend have this problem with hypocrisy and petty vindictiveness. Their reasoning goes like this. The left and the media persecuted Trump and his followers for doing something. But Trump didn’t think there was anything wrong with what they were doing. But then, they decide that even though they saw no problem with, say, making money off your political position in other countries, now they are upset when they see Biden purportedly do it and they want justice? Two wrongs don’t make a right.
Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think any politician is perfect. I know Biden will fail, will break promises, etc. But I think we need a president that takes global warming seriously, and recognizes the trillions we stand to lose by 2100 if we pretend its all a Chinese hoax and keep kissing the ass of the oil lobbyists, is going to bite us all in the ass. The left’s position on global warming and their bid to create a carbon negative economy is, in the long-run, far more intelligent and realistic than just short-term profit at the expense of the future.
I think too that we need a president that respects science and doesn’t approach it like your drunk Boomer Uncle at thanksgiving who watched some Facebook meme on how science is an atheistic conspiracy to make money off vaccines meant to monitor the world through 5G nanobots in your blood and other such right wing tripe.
Doubtful if the Repugs (I am a former DemocratSlaveryParty Stooge who left in 79 and went Republican) will do much of anything. Except roll over. Heard today that Mitt Romney had been offered Helf and Hooman Svcs by Groper Joe. The DemocratSlaveryParty is the vilest group on the planet, second only to the ChiComs, but as the DemocratSlaveryParty and Groper Joe are in the pocket of Xi the second isn’t much.
These are your same liberals that they are a one way liberals… but not when it comes to the others that have different ideas than them. In that instance they switch to full-on commies and want to annihilate you. If they have nothing to hide, why so quickly move on without allowing those in doubt a fair review of what they think might have gone out of wack?
I’m no longer surprised by what Douglas posts, just disappointed. His has been a very public and quick journey from that of an independent, if somewhat mischievous, commentary, to that of full grown cheerleading for Trump and the authoritarian politics and distain for the rule of law that he embodies. So now Douglas has joined the fray in undermining belief in the American democratic process he supposedly applauds. And all for the support of someone who appears to manifest all that is criminal and unseemly in US politics. It will be a position that will be hard for him to live down.
What exactly did Johnson mean by this?
I assume me refers to a holdover of (justified) resentment of the colonized toward the colonizers.Your cluelessness is just another symptom . . .Jeez . . .
Well … Jeez, Jane. I and me in the same sentence. You do have a thing for a possessive pronoun, don’t you?
In fact, all your assumption does is make u come across as an ass.
Clever girl!
My ”’cluelessness” is just another symptom of what exactly… Jeez .…?
President Trump is not only not being irresponsible for pointing out to the American people that this election was stolen from him by the Democrats, it would be a monumental dereliction of duty for him to not do so. “But it will tear the country apart!” The country is already torn apart. Most of us on the so-called right are not yet ready to engage in the rioting and looting and burning that the Left so enjoy, but it is now entirely clear to us that the electoral system is now permanently rigged against us. We will now act outside of electoral politics.
President Trump (and his supporters like you) are lying. If he has the evidence (not BSing in twitter) he can go to court and show the whole world how he “won”.
As of now, aside from Pennsylvania case (judge Alito less than 8,000 votes that are not opened) all his cases have been thrown out – FOR LACK OF EVIDENCE.
Let’s not also forget the upcoming ideological purity battles between the radical woke left within the Democratic party and a semi-woke centre left Biden White House. Left wing infighting is vicious. His arse will barely be getting warm in the Oval office before he’s being denounced as just another privileged white male and Harris is being referred to as an ‘Oreo.’ Harris & Biden have proposed some crazy left wing policies, whether they enact them or are even able to with a Republican controlled congress wont matter to the radical left within their party because they aren’t near as radical as the growing woke mob want them to be.
Absolutely spot on. The disingenuous call for unity, reconciliation etc all decode in actuality to “submit or die”. In a nation where the Fourth Estate has become the Fifth Column, a strongly alternative agora is evolving.
I’ve just had a comment placed under moderation.
Does the dark blue moniker ‘U’ indicate others who have also been moderated?
I find this somewhat disturbing as my comment was not defamatory, racist , homophobic, or misogynistic. Neither was it a tribute to the Klu Klux Klan or in any way a sleight on LGBQT or JK Rowling’s hairstyle … or anything else JK, for that matter. It contained nothing acrimonious or libelous about Donald Trump’s far-right comb-over and as the chances of hundreds of unHerd subscribers suddenly flagging only my third comment is as likely as Douglas Murray endorsing conversion therapy for his dog thus allowing him to marry a canine, I am, quite frankly, at a loss why my comment was moderated.
After all, as Brian of Nazareth pointed out . ”You’re (we’re) all individuals.”
The New York Times is reporting that they have called officials in all 50 States and the officials report no evidence of voter fraud. One more drop of bitterness in the cauldron.
Great blog as usual by Douglas, but I disagree with him on voting fraud.
Biden himself said in October: “”We’re in a situation where we have put together, and you guys did it for our … for President Obama’s administration before this….We have put together, I think the most extensive and inclusive voter fraud organization in the history of American politics.” The Democrats made excuses for him. Joe’s brain is fried and he will say the craziest things. We know that, but in this case, this really looks like an inadvertent, damaging admission of the truth.
Trump has 232 electoral votes now if one puts North Carolina in his column now. It seemed inexplicable that Pennsylvania with its 20 electoral votes, did not go to him after Biden’s promise to destroy the US oil industry, when Pennsylvania is such an important shale oil producer. Arguably Trump lost the state because the Supreme Court supinely refused to hear a case appealing a decision of the Pennsylvania Supreme Court to strike down Pennsylvania’s own law to only accept mail-in votes until election day. If the Supreme Court, which now includes Justice Amy Barrett, does hear the case and rules these votes are illegal, they are supposedly sequestered and can be omitted from the count. If all this happens, the state could still go to Trump. If the Supreme Court rules in Trump’s favour, and the sequestered votes are not sufficient to give Trump the win, many people will conclude that Philadelphia being the cesspool of Democratic voter fraud that it is, all of the late votes were not properly sequestered as they should have been, and Trump would have won if they had been. In any case, there were other issues with the balloting in Pennsylvania, e.g. differential treatment of cured ballots, that the Supreme Court probably cannot do much about that likely unfairly hurt Trump’s count related to Biden’s.
The other five states in contention all had no-excuse-needed availability of mail-in ballots, and Nevada, whose economy stood to be hit hard by basement dweller Biden’s strict lockdown policies, sent mail-in ballots to everyone on the voters’ list, opening the doors a little wider to voter fraud. As the legal affidavits alleging fraud continue to pile up in those states, surely it is simply realistic to think that Trump would have picked up at least 18 of their 59 electoral votes, which would be all he would need, with Pennsylvania, to win a second term, if there had not been voter fraud related to mail-in ballots.
Finally, let’s not forget that for 2016, when mail-in ballots weren’t much of an issue, Professor Jesse Richman calculated that Trump’s voting margin across the country against Hillary Clinton was hurt by 830 thousand votes due to illegal voting by non-citizens, a figure that rises to 900 thousand if one replaces the Census undercount adjustment for illegal immigrants, 10%, with a quite possible 20% estimate. This is the elephant in the room no-one seems to have noticed. Possibly it is because the McCarthy style witch-hunt organized against Richman by left-leaning academics has scared people away from looking at non-citizen voter fraud. They seem to have scared away Richman himself, who, as far as I know, hasn’t published anything on the issue since he defended his November 2016 analysis of the 2016 election in March 2017.
All Joe Biden has to do to start the healing is acknowledge his countrymen’s suspicions and say he fully supports President Trump’s legitimate requests for recounts and voter fraud inquiries. Period.
That’s what a statesmen who is trying to forestall predictable catastrophes would do.
He isn’t “gone,” Douglas. And he won’t be: Trump won the night of the election, and we’re busy proving it in court.
Other than the faulty premise, the rest of the article is dead on.
I adore Murray but am very disappointed in this article. One would hope that Murray, of all people, would be above the idiotic tendency to use “divisiveness” and “polarization” to describe a situation that they clearly know is neither.
There is no polarization. The majority of the US is still where it’s always been politically, right near the center. If anything, the alleged “right” (I hate the term) has drifted closer to center and center-left, conceding on the welfare state, and turning a blind eye to blatant crimes in the name of conciliation.
The problem is not polarization. It’s that an unchecked government class has used censorship terrorism to expand its ability to get the public to pay it to engage in censorship and to encourage or at least turn a blind eye to politically expedient terrorism. All in the name of eliminating law enforcement, borders, individual liberties, and indeed the Constitution itself.
Murray clearly knows this, because he describes the situation in detail. And yet he concludes that those of us who, like him, recognize it are simply one of two “sides” in a process of “polarization.”
That’s moronic. Imagine that a large government class began insisting that 2+2=5. Only the most Stockholm-syndromed among us would start conceding that, well, all right, maybe 2+2=4.5 to meet them halfway. Bull. The answer is 4. Period. And to recognize that fact is not polarizing or divisive. Those who’ve decided to believe it’s 5 have separated themselves from reality, perhaps. But the rest of us are where we’ve always been, in reality.
After all he’s been through, for Murray to suggest that only a small fraction of Americans think there’s election fraud is not only insulting to our intelligence and his, it’s outright wrong. Every rogue state around the world is celebrating Biden’s “victory,” while their own beleaguered citizens assail us American citizens (where they’re able to communicate with us at all, usually because they live here) to PLEASE see to it that this country does not go the way of their own.
This is why I detest the Unity 2020 movement, “recovered” leftists who obviously aren’t as recovered as they think, and self-proclaimed “conservatives” or “classical liberals” who think it’s measured and conciliatory to portray what’s happening as though the entire normal, sane world of laws and freedoms just became divisive and extreme.
Douglas, you can do better. Now go clean your room!
Ah, another who believes “the rest of us” are seeing it clearly – sweet folly! I give thanks every day for the “moronic” Mr Murray who has almost a child’s wisdom in his ability to describe things just as he sees them – indeed even just as “moron” would see them if s/he would simply give up their political bias. Yes clean your room, but beware you don’t blind yourself with an intoxicating disinfectant.
The US electorate will get what they deserve. It will be interesting to see how they enjoy the economic and social demise of a once great power.
Until the election of 2016 I had only the vaguest sense that the United States had a two party system. My family were Democrats, as were my friends, and my first husband and his family. And then came 2016 and Hillary. She was a bridge too far. I’d done volunteer work on the Bill Clinton ’92 campaign (he was very cute and friendly) and was asked to attend a small gathering of supporters to meet Mrs. Clinton. One hour in a small room with 12 fellow travelers and Hillary, arm on the corner of a lectern, talking. And talking. Without inflection. Without joy. Without basic signs of humanness. More than a little creepy. And then she left. Poof. I totally understood the Monica thing. I sympathized with Bill.
I had to wait decades before she publicly called half the country Deplorables, but I knew in 1992 that’s how she felt about we the people. So I voted for Trump and have enjoyed every minute since.
Pedantry ! Trump said about Mexico “they are sending all their rapists to us” suggesting that the Mexicans crossing the border are rapists. He said of the white power demo “there are good people on both sides ” I agree with Douglas on most points but he seems to have planted his flag on the side of trump. Me ? I have no flag, a plague on all their houses
“Take two of the claims about Trump that most enraged the Left in recent years: that he described all Mexicans as rapists…”
He didn’t quite say that, here’s what he said;
“They’re bringing crime. They’re / their rapists.”
Yeah, he never said anything inflammatory about Mexicans. OK. Don’t think it’s mandatory to be left-wing to see that that’s objectively blatant divisive rhetoric.
But America is divided anyway, so what’s a few more lazy fear-mongering tropes from a Presidential candidate thrown into the mix going to do in the grand scheme really?
not only did Trump say “…Mexicans as rapists and that he refused to condemn white supremacy…” he has relentlessly reiterated it from the podium and in his many tweets and retweest.
Nice try Douglas
DJT is by any stretch of imagination a degenerate. As president of USA he accused his predecessor (Obama) of killing Team Seal 6 and faking the death of Bin Laden.
He shamelessly lied about his inauguration crowd – how pathetic!
He supported (until the end) the senate candidacy of Roy Moore, a man accused by 7/8 women of sexual assaults. At the time of the assaults some of those women were underage.
Ann Coulter (conservative enough?) on twitter about DJT:
– the most disloyal person ever
– blithering id*ot
– disloyal actual re*ard
– a complete m*ron
The list goes on.
Hitler didn’t invent anti-semitism, but he sure as hell elevated it to new levels. Republicans rejected President Obama for being black since before Trump declared his run for office. They depicted him as an African tribal in effigy, attacked his wife. Trump entered into the race by claiming he had proof of President Obama being born in Kenya.
Republicans and conservatives are hateful and bigoted. There’s no blame on liberals for that. This rhetorical nonsense about how Trump is somehow the fault of liberals, is the Right exploiting the liberal tendency to self-blame and reflect, a bit too much for their own good. What incivility continues, is the product of Right wing thought. No different than the neo-Nazis or other fascist movements.
‘Republicans rejected President Obama for being black since before Trump declared his run for office.’
Absolute nonsense. Millions of white Americans voted twice for Obama, then for Trump.
Fraser, I think the expression is “Not all Republicans are racists, but all racists are Republicans.” As you point out, there were people who voted Obama and then Trump. What that proves, however, is that you do not have to be a racist to vote for Trump, but all the racists in fact did. If you don’t believe me, find one… just one of the Proud Boys, the Aryan Nation, the KKK, etc, who didn’t vote for him. I’m waiting.
all the racists in fact did.
weren’t you just lecturing me for using an absolute re: Dems and the inauguration? Every time a black person dared step out of the leftist line, the crackdown was nasty and it was harsh.
The foolishness of this talking point is compounded only by the ignorance of Latinos and blacks within the Proud Boys. Richard Spencer, by the way, endorsed Biden.
Critical Race Theory isn’t Repub work. Nor are constructs like privilege, labeling math and science and other subjects are racist, and that ridiculous Smithsonian thing that painted everyday things like hard work and personal responsibility as white constructs. That had to be a surprise to the millions of black people who go to to work and are responsible. But, sure; everyone else is racist.
Then why is most of the racism I’ve been hearing the last few years coming from the left?
Oh that’s right, because they redefined racism to let themselves off the hook.
So I’m going to take a wild guess here and assume that you think that the statement “Black Lives Matter” is racist. Is that it? People protesting disproportionate police related deaths among blacks… are racist for pointing it out? Ok.
The racism on the left is rooted in the bigotry of low expectations. Rather than tackle black problems at the roots, they make a grand display of attacking the leaves, calling those who disagree with their methods ‘white supremacists’. I have the distinct impression that if they adopted a more grassroots approach to racial inequality, they would discover that many of their policies have in fact entrenched black poverty rather than alleviated it.
A black Republican told me that African Americans are the most gullible people in America and, until they learn to realize they don’t need white custodians empowering them, will continue to fall for policies and movements that further infantilize them.
You guess wrongly. However I do think casting white people as innately and irredeemably evil is racist.
And I don’t even put the blame for that on black people. I know damn well that’s the work of white people.
f*****g white people, amiright?
They are Marxist dummy. Like Momentum in Soon Splitting Liebour party
the statement isn’t racist, obviously. The organization is very racist, just as obviously. And there havent been disproportionate police related deaths among blacks. Check the stats.
Must we accept your definition of a racist, or a homophobe, or a misogynist….there are a thousand of those sorts of definitions, mostly wildly inaccurate The people referred to by Alex above certainly think and behave, if not like Fascists, then perhaps the juvenile section of the organisation.
Biden gave A 20 minute Eulogy to KKK Grand nKnights funeral ..but that Explains some of Why Latinos,venezuelans ,Cubans voted for Trump ,they’d never vote for No delegates kamel harris
these days, there are as many democrat racists as there are GOP, maybe more. They just don’t see themselves that way, even as they wrap themselves up in identity politics and critical race theory, which are about as racist as you can get. Try quoting MLK “content of character” speech to a young Democrat these days, he/she will call you a racist.
Repubs rejected Obama for being a Dem and for being too liberal for their tastes. Did Dems reject Trump or Bush or Reagan for being white? Racism is when you won’t hold the black office-holder to the same standard as the white ones.
What incivility continues, is the product of Right wing thought. No different than the neo-Nazis or other fascist movements.
is that why the likes of AOC and Robert Reich, among others, want to compile “enemies lists”? That seems just like every fascist movement that has ever existed.
hmmm… pretty sure Trump has one. So…? Or will your bias allow you to go there? And re your opening sentence, I’m quite sure that explains birtherism, which gave rise to the tea party, which gave rise to trump. Had nothing whatsoever to do with his original sin of blackness, right? Whatever gets you through the night, Alex.
Republicans rejected Obama for the same reason democrats did: because he couldn’t run for a third term.
this is el stupido, and I’m a liberal.
Whites voted Obama in twice.
exhibit A : the existence of systemic racism in the USA (NOT)
Egypt ,Japan , Some Indians Supported Axis countries were they ”Racist”
This is a truly awful article.
At times I really value UnHerd, especially when I am trying to understand the conservative mindset over identity politics. I would like to recommend it to my liberal friends. But because of articles like this, I just can’t.
To take just one example: the Mueller report found that the Russian government “interfered in the 2016 presidential election in sweeping and systematic fashion” and “violated U.S. criminal law”. The author must know this, but his article states as fact that the claim of Russian interference in the election was fake.
The author then argues that Democrat complaints about Russian interference would make it fair game for the Republicans to claim that Biden has stolen the election, when even Fox News has called the election for Biden.
The author talks about fake news and vitriol. I’m afraid, UnHerd, by publishing his piece, UnHerd is guilty of exactly that.
A word of advice – if the author is Douglas Murray, you can easily skip it. His writing is pure drivel. His “analysis” is nonsensical. He single-handedly brings down the writing in Unherd.
The Mueller report also found that not a single American conspired with any Russians. Not one. Not one witness before Adam Schiff’s House Intel Committee produced any evidence, least of all Schiff himself who repeatedly claimed to have it by the bucketload. And we’ve learned that Biden, among others, knew full well of the surveillance on the Trump campaign and went along with it. Are we to ignore that?
If you’re to cherry-pick parts you don’t like as the pretext for not sharing with your liberal friends, just say you have no desire to share in the first place.
The Russian government may well have attempted to influence the outcome of the 2016 election (I believe the American government has had several goes, some quite successful, at interfering in other countries’ elections) – that’s not the point. The charge was that Trump conspired with the Russians, and that has been shown to be completely unfounded, and that, if anything, there was a criminal conspiracy by the Democrats, the “intelligence ” services and the media, to frame Trump.