“Imagine foreigners come to your homeland, kill some of you, and tell the rest everything you ever believed is rubbish. Your religion is rubbish, your traditions are rubbish, your values are rubbish, the way you organise your entire economy and life is wrong.”
We don’t have to imagine it – we have social justice warriors. (All but the kill some of you part is essentially the same.)
Not kill, true; but cancel you, lose you your job, destroy your business, shame and vilify you in front of the world. And can you today enter any profession or public life, or expect promotion, if you do not bow down and worship at the prescribed altar?
F Healey
3 years ago
Good article but still confusing. History is fascinating and the details is where truth lies. Sorry, but feelings and emotions should not get in the way. You can cry about the Holocaust but don’t put stage directions in your history books. ( Time to cry now!) Tell the events accurately and let the student reach conclusions and derive any emotions. Each student of history will have a differing opinion and if they can back it up in a debate then great. The student must read everything factual, there are no “sides” to accurate reporting Nigerian history is fascinating and the British did both wonderful and terrible things. The Nigerians did also. Tell the complete story but please spare us the 20-20 judgmental morally superior hindsight. Your sophisticated condemnation will be applied to yourself in future years so a little historical context is required as we will all eventual fail to measure up to future judges.
I liked the close of your comment: “we will all eventually fail to measure up to future judges.” Sad but true.
susiebalducci
3 years ago
Agreed, especially as I live in Aberdeen! Everything she is doing with the we’re coming out of lockdown a few weeks later than England, is political. What really annoys me is how many people are buying into it.
The Scots may be buying into it but the English see her for what she is – a chancer. Of course in respect of a referendum she only has to swing Scots – if the English were included to vote then independence would be a shoo-in. This is unfortunate but down to her deep deep hatred of the English. I am English and live in Wales but the dumb First Minister here is playing the same political game, however he isn’t as canny as Krankie – both transparent though.
Cheryl Jones
3 years ago
I don’t have to ignore or celebrate or self flagellate about the British Empire. I see it for what it was, as with all historical periods, it was a product of its time when such things were normal. The idea that I should feel guilt at a past I played no part in and that I cannot change is ridiculous. I don’t understand this whining and bleating about it. Sorry but you got conquered. Get over it. My ancestors were conquered and enslaved by Romans, Vikings and Normans. So what? All of that has left its mark I’m our culture, language, architecture and landscape but I don’t feel the need to obsess over it, it’s fascinating to me as a story weaved from history, I can see Roman ruins and I have no antipathy towards them or modern Italians, why on earth would I? I love that we were touched by Roman superiority, it benefitted us in the long run. We can enjoy it now. To compare historical modes of thinking to today’s is frankly stupid. Every people, every nation has had its fair share of being conqueror and conquered – including the Nigerians, whose brutal suppressions are touched on but not with such hand wringing emotion as the idea that wypipo came and had a go. I found it very interesting that some Nigerians trusted the ‘fairness’ of British rule more compared to their own leaders – because the reality is that sharing a culture or a skin colour doesn’t make you more righteous or better at making life better for your compatriots. I know a few people from ex colonies who say they were glad they got the British and not the French or the Spanish. Britain has nothing to be ashamed of because self flagellating about the past does not create confident successful people. Looking to the future and to self improvement is far more positive. I can know and understand the darkness and light of empires without feeling *personally responsible* which is what modern activists are attempting to make me do. I say No. The fact that the British spent time, money, lives and ships stopping the transatlantic slave trade, at zero benefit to itself, and probably resulted in its own downfall, and thanks to that we now live in a world that no longer thinks slavery is normal or acceptable, more than makes up for any transgressions as far as I’m concerned because it brought forward momentum out of that longest period of human history when it was entirely normal. In all cultures. That is a momentous achievement and says far more to me about the character of the British and its Empire than anything else. Can the Nigerians say the same about their own conquests? No. I refuse to hate myself or my people or my history in order to appease the inherited (and not experienced) ‘hurt’ of people who now benefit from the fruits of it.
Adrian Smith
3 years ago
The anti-colonialist ranting reminds me of that bit from “life of Brian” – “What have the Romans ever done for us”
A good, nuanced article, but a couple of points I’d like to make. I am white but refuse to feel guilt over the Empire, most of which was gone by the time I was born. Secondly, it kind of bothers me greatly that there is a sort of reverse racism in imaging white people as a homogeneous mass of people with little variation outside of our whiteness. When people start up about BLM I’ll say something like:
I had a great grandfather who was a dataller (which in coal mine terminology means taking care of roadways and, more importantly of shoring up the roofs of mines), and other relatives on my father’s side were hewers and fillers. My grandmother was born in a workhouse (which, with huge irony, later became the hospital where I was born). My mother was an evacuee and I spent some years being brought up in a two up two down with an outside toilet and a single cold water tap inside the house. If you wanted a bath the water had to be heated in the copper (etc). In other words there were huge differences in the lived experiences of our forebears and one of the reasons I despise the hordes of white youths ostentatiously strutting their wokedom like peacocks is they have no idea they have been born, and no way of relating to the reality of the past.
Well said, Mike. There appears to be a view that all whites are middle class exploiters, but most white people were the exploited. My forebears were agricultural labourers. My grandfather was working in the fields when he was 10, never had any schooling, and when his mother remarried, ran away to sea where he was beaten and starved. My other grandfather was a coal miner, grandmother working and bearing eight children as well. Many of us have no pride in our colonial past. Why should we? We had nothing to do with it. I have only indifference. It is history, and there’s nothing we can do to change it, and we should all learn to live with it and not expect people alive hundreds of years later to feel responsible for it; our ancestors had nothing to do with it.
Robert Lush
3 years ago
Thank you Dr Adekoya, best wishes to you
Tony Taylor
3 years ago
Substitute “Scotland” for “Victoria” and you can republish the same about the situation here in Australia.
Adrian Smith
3 years ago
The other 2 words those who believe all white people did in Africa was bad are: ROBERT MUGABE
From bread basket of Africa to basket case in one presidency.
Andrea X
3 years ago
Why has this article been published twice, once with the word “canny”, the second with “sly” in the title?
Michael Hanson
3 years ago
I think this article is being too critical of Nicola Sturgeon and the Scots in general.
It’s not unusual for a politician to be grim about fresh outbreaks of coronavirus! And Nicola normally has someone signing for the deaf when she speaks to be fair and inclusive – this doesn’t seem like a thing to criticise to me.
It’s a fair point about her ‘doom-mongering’ but again she’s not alone in the world at the moment where every new covid case – not even death – is met with doom-mongering. England locks down Leicester and Scotland locks down Aberdeen – it’s pathetic in both cases not just here in Scotland.
And talking about the SNP, yes of course it has a single purpose to remain in government but specifically to get independence for Scotland. After that there will still be a democratically elected government just like the UK government.
– The peasants are revolting. -Yes, they are pretty disgusting!
Peter KE
3 years ago
Nice article.
Andrew Baldwin
3 years ago
A pity that Polish references appear with the mention that Remi’s wife is Polish, and then immediately disappear. Christmas at the Adekoya home must have been something else! What is Remi’s view of Poland between the World Wars, I wonder, a country which could be construed as another kind of empire. Was it a brutal military dictatorship where Marshall Pilsudski kept in thrall Ukrainians, Belarusans, and Jews? Was it an enlightened nation where Pilsudski, whose socialist background taught him that “all forms of ethnic and religious bigotry…were diversions from the class struggle” insisted on fair treatment for everyone in the country, and Anti-Semitism in particular was rejected? Something else? These aren’t rhetorical questions. I would really like to know his views on the subject. (The quote above is from American historian Richard Pipes, a Polish-born Jew.)
“Imagine foreigners come to your homeland, kill some of you, and tell the rest everything you ever believed is rubbish. Your religion is rubbish, your traditions are rubbish, your values are rubbish, the way you organise your entire economy and life is wrong.”
We don’t have to imagine it – we have social justice warriors. (All but the kill some of you part is essentially the same.)
Not kill, true; but cancel you, lose you your job, destroy your business, shame and vilify you in front of the world. And can you today enter any profession or public life, or expect promotion, if you do not bow down and worship at the prescribed altar?
Good article but still confusing. History is fascinating and the details is where truth lies.
Sorry, but feelings and emotions should not get in the way.
You can cry about the Holocaust but don’t put stage directions in your history books. ( Time to cry now!) Tell the events accurately and let the student reach conclusions and derive any emotions. Each student of history will have a differing opinion and if they can back it up in a debate then great.
The student must read everything factual, there are no “sides” to accurate reporting
Nigerian history is fascinating and the British did both wonderful and terrible things. The Nigerians did also.
Tell the complete story but please spare us the 20-20 judgmental morally superior hindsight.
Your sophisticated condemnation will be applied to yourself in future years so a little historical context is required as we will all eventual fail to measure up to future judges.
I liked the close of your comment: “we will all eventually fail to measure up to future judges.” Sad but true.
Agreed, especially as I live in Aberdeen! Everything she is doing with the we’re coming out of lockdown a few weeks later than England, is political. What really annoys me is how many people are buying into it.
The Scots may be buying into it but the English see her for what she is – a chancer. Of course in respect of a referendum she only has to swing Scots – if the English were included to vote then independence would be a shoo-in. This is unfortunate but down to her deep deep hatred of the English. I am English and live in Wales but the dumb First Minister here is playing the same political game, however he isn’t as canny as Krankie – both transparent though.
I don’t have to ignore or celebrate or self flagellate about the British Empire. I see it for what it was, as with all historical periods, it was a product of its time when such things were normal. The idea that I should feel guilt at a past I played no part in and that I cannot change is ridiculous. I don’t understand this whining and bleating about it. Sorry but you got conquered. Get over it. My ancestors were conquered and enslaved by Romans, Vikings and Normans. So what? All of that has left its mark I’m our culture, language, architecture and landscape but I don’t feel the need to obsess over it, it’s fascinating to me as a story weaved from history, I can see Roman ruins and I have no antipathy towards them or modern Italians, why on earth would I? I love that we were touched by Roman superiority, it benefitted us in the long run. We can enjoy it now. To compare historical modes of thinking to today’s is frankly stupid. Every people, every nation has had its fair share of being conqueror and conquered – including the Nigerians, whose brutal suppressions are touched on but not with such hand wringing emotion as the idea that wypipo came and had a go. I found it very interesting that some Nigerians trusted the ‘fairness’ of British rule more compared to their own leaders – because the reality is that sharing a culture or a skin colour doesn’t make you more righteous or better at making life better for your compatriots. I know a few people from ex colonies who say they were glad they got the British and not the French or the Spanish. Britain has nothing to be ashamed of because self flagellating about the past does not create confident successful people. Looking to the future and to self improvement is far more positive. I can know and understand the darkness and light of empires without feeling *personally responsible* which is what modern activists are attempting to make me do. I say No. The fact that the British spent time, money, lives and ships stopping the transatlantic slave trade, at zero benefit to itself, and probably resulted in its own downfall, and thanks to that we now live in a world that no longer thinks slavery is normal or acceptable, more than makes up for any transgressions as far as I’m concerned because it brought forward momentum out of that longest period of human history when it was entirely normal. In all cultures. That is a momentous achievement and says far more to me about the character of the British and its Empire than anything else. Can the Nigerians say the same about their own conquests? No. I refuse to hate myself or my people or my history in order to appease the inherited (and not experienced) ‘hurt’ of people who now benefit from the fruits of it.
The anti-colonialist ranting reminds me of that bit from “life of Brian” – “What have the Romans ever done for us”
https://www.youtube.com/wat…
A good, nuanced article, but a couple of points I’d like to make. I am white but refuse to feel guilt over the Empire, most of which was gone by the time I was born. Secondly, it kind of bothers me greatly that there is a sort of reverse racism in imaging white people as a homogeneous mass of people with little variation outside of our whiteness. When people start up about BLM I’ll say something like:
I had a great grandfather who was a dataller (which in coal mine terminology means taking care of roadways and, more importantly of shoring up the roofs of mines), and other relatives on my father’s side were hewers and fillers. My grandmother was born in a workhouse (which, with huge irony, later became the hospital where I was born). My mother was an evacuee and I spent some years being brought up in a two up two down with an outside toilet and a single cold water tap inside the house. If you wanted a bath the water had to be heated in the copper (etc). In other words there were huge differences in the lived experiences of our forebears and one of the reasons I despise the hordes of white youths ostentatiously strutting their wokedom like peacocks is they have no idea they have been born, and no way of relating to the reality of the past.
Well said, Mike. There appears to be a view that all whites are middle class exploiters, but most white people were the exploited. My forebears were agricultural labourers. My grandfather was working in the fields when he was 10, never had any schooling, and when his mother remarried, ran away to sea where he was beaten and starved. My other grandfather was a coal miner, grandmother working and bearing eight children as well.
Many of us have no pride in our colonial past. Why should we? We had nothing to do with it. I have only indifference. It is history, and there’s nothing we can do to change it, and we should all learn to live with it and not expect people alive hundreds of years later to feel responsible for it; our ancestors had nothing to do with it.
Thank you Dr Adekoya, best wishes to you
Substitute “Scotland” for “Victoria” and you can republish the same about the situation here in Australia.
The other 2 words those who believe all white people did in Africa was bad are: ROBERT MUGABE
From bread basket of Africa to basket case in one presidency.
Why has this article been published twice, once with the word “canny”, the second with “sly” in the title?
I think this article is being too critical of Nicola Sturgeon and the Scots in general.
It’s not unusual for a politician to be grim about fresh outbreaks of coronavirus! And Nicola normally has someone signing for the deaf when she speaks to be fair and inclusive – this doesn’t seem like a thing to criticise to me.
It’s a fair point about her ‘doom-mongering’ but again she’s not alone in the world at the moment where every new covid case – not even death – is met with doom-mongering. England locks down Leicester and Scotland locks down Aberdeen – it’s pathetic in both cases not just here in Scotland.
And talking about the SNP, yes of course it has a single purpose to remain in government but specifically to get independence for Scotland. After that there will still be a democratically elected government just like the UK government.
I like new discussion about covid but the SNP bashing was not ‘unherd’ but the same old mainstream cliché after cliché!
– The peasants are revolting.
-Yes, they are pretty disgusting!
Nice article.
A pity that Polish references appear with the mention that Remi’s wife is Polish, and then immediately disappear. Christmas at the Adekoya home must have been something else! What is Remi’s view of Poland between the World Wars, I wonder, a country which could be construed as another kind of empire. Was it a brutal military dictatorship where Marshall Pilsudski kept in thrall Ukrainians, Belarusans, and Jews? Was it an enlightened nation where Pilsudski, whose socialist background taught him that “all forms of ethnic and religious bigotry…were diversions from the class struggle” insisted on fair treatment for everyone in the country, and Anti-Semitism in particular was rejected? Something else? These aren’t rhetorical questions. I would really like to know his views on the subject. (The quote above is from American historian Richard Pipes, a Polish-born Jew.)