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August 16, 2024 - 8:15pm
Argentinian President Javier Milei has offered a sharp critique of the UK’s policies censoring social media activity.
“While other countries propose censorship, we propose freedom of expression,” Milei declared in a Thursday speech at the Council of the Americas. “Just look at what is happening in England. Since the socialists came to power, they are putting people in jail for posting on social networks.”
Arrests in the UK over social media posts have grabbed international attention, most recently in relation to the riots following the Southport attack. A 53-year-old woman with no criminal history has been sentenced to 15 months in prison over an unsavoury Facebook comment about blowing up a mosque, despite the prosecution conceding that her remarks were not a serious threat.
Some social media-related arrests tied to the riots have involved posts advocating for violence, but the government shows every intention of expanding penalties to posts which incite hate in a more vague sense. The UK’s official X account ominously warned users, “think before you post.” The UK police commissioner even suggested that the extradition of citizens of foreign countries for “stirring up racial hatred” online was on the table last week.
Keir Starmer has blamed the riots on social media misinformation, and the UK is now looking to crack down further on social media posts. The director of public prosecutions of England and Wales has warned that even retweeting social media posts that may be considered “insulting or abusive” or which could “start racial hatred” could be cause for punishment. “It’s very, very serious. People might think they’re not doing anything harmful. They are. And the consequences will be visited upon them,” he said.
Milei, a committed libertarian, said his country was “undertaking a paradigm shift not only economic but also social, political and cultural,” adding that Argentina was going “against the direction that many countries in the world have been taking lately.”
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SubscribeHe’s not wrong. Especially not where he says this:
“Apparently aware of this, Milei suggested in his speech that reporters in his own country would support laws similar to those of the UK. “The journalists here would also like it, because they don’t like that they have lost the monopoly of the microphone …”
Bang on. It’s about control and coercion.
This is eerily similar to the introduction of the printing press and the widespread social disorder that took place because of it. The clergy and scribes lost their gatekeeping privilege with the written word and reacted violently against the democratization of information because of the printing press.
Jimbo, do you think issuing death threats is “democratization of information”?
Jimbo, whaddabout farting in lifts? Do you think *that’s* democratisation of information? Huh? Huh? Gotcha! See, betcha ya can’t answer *that*!
Hey weirdo!
Good luck in your next suicide attempt.
Issuing death threats has never been protected by freedom of speech laws.
Your question is based on a false premise therefore is bogus.
False premises are the foundation of socialism.
Really good and concise summary of the doctrine. Thanks for this!
And the foundation of C.S.’s entire personality.
Could you tell us how many people have been arrested for issuing death threats against the teacher in Batley or JK Rowling? It appears only certain people get arrested for social media posts and making violent threats in Starkers Britain..
Magna Carta. The Mother of Parliaments. Now being (rightly) chided by Argentina. If it wasn’t so serious it would be hysterical. How have the mighty fallen.
Making public death threats has never been legal. Not sure why you guys are confused about that?
This guy is an utter clown.
You’d know one when you saw one.
And I see plenty of them around here, our kid!
Just for your information (since you’re incredibly ill-informed in your little champagne bubble), the 53yo woman who’s been jailed issued no death threats. She – inadvisedly – posted about “burning down a mosque” which isn’t a death threat. If you weren’t really thick, you’d understand the difference. I don’t condone burning down anything, although it’s dead easy to torch your spurious nonsense.
“Blow the mosque up with the adults in it”
Try harder, sonny, this is too easy.
The post wasn’t a threat by her, which is what constitutes (using your words) a death threat. If your understanding of the English language (outside Islingtonian) wasn’t so poor, you’d understand the difference.
As i say, it was ill-advised. And so are you. Consider yourself on the very same level as her.
I don’t even know what you are trying to say now! This is really funny! You didn’t even get the wording of her post right, which really isn’t that difficult even for the likes of you, but now you are trying to say that saying that a mosque should be blown up with the people inside somehow isn’t a death threat by her?!?!?
Must be getting late in Rochdale or whatever slum it is you call home. Had a couple of pints, have we? Maybe time for bed before you embarrass yourself further…
Are you seriously this obtuse? The prosecution isn’t at issue. The problem is a 15-month jail sentence for a 53-year-old woman with no prior criminal record, for an offence the prosecutor said no one took seriously as a real threat.
“although it’s dead easy to torch your spurious nonsense”
This aged poorly!
.
The only thing that’s aging poorly is you, you poor thing.
This is really the best you can do? Not worth my time, our kid…
Seriously, your trolling skills aren’t as impressive as you think, CS. We found out in a thread a couple of months ago that many commenters here have PhDs, and if they’re on UnHerd, they’re usually independent critical thinkers. Your clumsy party-line efforts are very much below the par.
And yet… here you are again, trying desperately to make yourself relevant when the only motivation for your banalities is your sense of irrelevance; otherwise, you’d have other, more meaningful contributions to make.
Toddle off to bed and tell your teddy bear how you wish people would like you.
So this is what we’ve come… taking lessons (or not) from the leaders of countries notorious for vicious authoritarian regimes, even if that appellation no longer applies to the current incumbent.
Of course, Argentina has good reason to try to “point score” over the UK but even so, Milei has nailed it with his critique. We’re only about 6 weeks into the new UK government and i’ve no idea where, or how far, this is going.
What i do know is that there will be resistance, both of the intellectual kind and if that doesn’t work – the physical kind. Brits just will not be cowed like this – we’ve come too far, too much blood has been shed over the last thousand years in the cause of freedom – to allow this government to have its way.
You take lessons from this idiot if you want – but you won’t learn anything useful.
Not sure why you think normal people will resist against criminals being held accountable for making public death threats against minorities. Seems to me that is precisely what Britain is about, other than the highly vocal but numerically insignificant racist extreme right which you seem to be a part of.
Is it possible to be a shill & a traitor at the same time?
Just asking a question.
Posters have been issuing threats of death, rape and infanticide on a daily basis for years without being bothered by the police because the targets have been public figures like politicians, J K Rowling, et al. Apparently that’s fine. But threaten an immigrant or a Muslim and you go to jail. Some people in the Labour government are proposing a definition of Islamophobia that will usher in a de facto blasphemy law. How is any of this remotely OK? The problem is not social media. The problem is leafy-suburb-dwelling elites establishing huge migrant centres in poor areas in part housing men who have not the slightest intention of integrating into any British way of life and indeed would consider such a lifestyle change heinously sinful. Get serious about that problem and the social media invective and the riots will go away.
The reputations of formerly admired British institutions are sinking like so many pieces of lead in the ocean. The Post Office, the NHS, the police, the civil service..not to mention the entire political class.
With Whitehall, there needs to be the political equivalent of sluicing vomit off the pavement.
Keir Starmer and his cabinet are of the far-left, therefore they are fascistic. Expecting anything else but ‘hate speech’ inquisition is silly. Fascism under the guise of ‘hate speech’ has been a far-left tactic forever.
He is a National Socialist
Just to be absolutely clear, making death threats is not and never has been protected speech anywhere or anytime. You shouldn’t need me to tell you that but here we are…
Making death threats online is absolutely illegal and should be prosecuted. I would hope the law is applied equally to everyone.
I think we all know that it won’t be.
Hiw many trans activists have been arrested for sending threats to JK Rowling. I bet it’s none.
Of course sending death threats is just fine and dandy when your sort does it.
And yet people make them with impunity,and are protected
From his lips to god’s ears…
For some people, an all-expenses-paid extended stay in the UK (extradition) could be a very attractive offer. Another immigration stream. And anyway, chances are that you’d get there and the authorities would decide the prisons are too full, so you’ll have to serve your time in a migrant hostel, where you’ll find out how to stay permanently. Just treat it all as a joke, bring a thick skin, and laugh it off at the preposterous holier-than-thou UK elite’s expense. Although, you might need to write not one but an entire series of outrageously inflammatory social media posts, to prod the politicized UK police into action and override the empty-threat factor.
After the Tiananmen Square Massacre Australia’s Prime Minister at the time gave asylum to Chinese students in Australia, who feared prosecution for their political stance.
When this became known, scores of Chinese students posted in Chinese language newspapers in Australia statements IN ENGLISH about the massacre. Allegedly.
You do the maths.
PS: I have a consistently positive experience with Australians from a Chinese heritage.
“It’s very, very serious. People might think they’re not doing anything harmful. They are. And the consequences will be visited upon them,” he said.”
Too true these MPs and DPPs might think they’re not doing anything harmful promoting an On Line Safety Bill to outlaw insulting and abusive social media posts but they are. It is indeed very serious. Hopefully the consequences will be visited on them in due course. Next step the Enabling Acts perhaps.
First they came for those posting insulting and abusive social media posts that cause psychological harm but I didn’t stand up for them because I never post such material and then …they came for me and there was no one to stand up for me.
I’m not sure that comparing the fate of European Jews at the hands of the Nazis to a vicious old racist calling for mass murder of members of a different religion is a great look for you, gramps….
How did you think it started with the Jews though? It was also little by little.
Without platforms like Facebook, LinkedIn & Twitter, the Australian public would not know how far Victoria Police officers’ long tradition of criminality has evolved, thanks to 21st century technology.
Freedom of speech provided by these fora are likely life-savers, because false security via the assumption of having functional law-enforcement is deadly. 8,000 men & boys died in Srebrenica in 1995, because of the false security provided by UN peace-keepers.
— I posted the below comment on Spectator earlier —
I lost my ability to earn a salary in 2017 to ongoing, unpunished crime in physical & cyber-space in Clare O’Neil’s electorate. Last crime minutes ago, behind locked doors, on my own. None of the crimes against me since 2009 show up in any statistics. Here is why:
If you watch the 60 Minutes episode on CFMEU crimes (1), at this point (2) in the video former Assistant Commissioner of the Australian Federal Police Mark NEY acknowledges that police will do nothing about obvious, proven bikie crimes bankrupting the state of Victoria uncovered by investigative journalists – they would only deal with “straight up & down extortions/assaults”. “The police don’t have the time”. No one picks up the “issue” of even organised crime infiltration of the construction industry bankrupting the state of Victoria evidenced by reputable investigative journalists. Admitted on TV!
It’s no wonder crime victims like me have no hope. This is why I share my story. I am so horrified by Australia’s absurd crime reality, I lost all fear, all inhibitions.
I tried every channel, every avenue anyone I knew could think of, in Australia & beyond, by the end of 2018 to get crimes against me at least on some official record. I am not a willing crime victim. Michael KEENAN, the Minister for Justice in 2015 confirmed how serious crimes I witnessed, crimes committed against me are.
Over the years it became obvious, mainstream media won’t touch stories like mine. While the truth is a valid defence against defamation, it is only the victim of crimes committed by e.g. Victoria Police/Australian Signals Directorate or ADF insiders/associates, who can swear in front of a judge to be telling the truth. Especially about crimes involving technology the public doesn’t even know about, let alone the law dealing with the technology used in crimes against civilians.
I had to learn: no act is a crime in Australia, unless a police officer acknowledges it as a crime & all evidence is hearsay/worthless rubbish, unless a police officer accepts BOTH, the act as a crime & the evidence as evidence. While police officers have no accountability/duty of care, are subject to a culture of criminality within the police, and have a vested interest in keeping their own workloads & crime statistics down.
Crime victims like me must be small fish/too risky to touch for investigative journalists. Especially since in Australia crime victims are assumed to have done “something” to deserve what they are subjected to. I was palmed off to charities time & time again, until I stopped trying to report crimes to any authority. I was treated as if trying to report crimes was something obscene, people stared at me like crimes are things victims ought to carry with obedient resignation & silent dignity – out of sight at all times! Crimes are the victims’ shame!
A private detective told me in 2015(?), I have zero hope of stopping the stalker’s crimes – that was before I knew about the MARCUCCI crime dynasty, before I knew that crimes against me are committed by police officers & their accomplices, dozens of thugs roaming around on motorbikes with unregistered/swapped licence plates, who know, they have nothing to fear, likely via thousands of crimes committed already, over many decades.
First crime against me today (13 Aug 2024) in my home, on my own, behind locked doors, at around 5:45am. I stopped taking the trouble of writing down exact times/details. There is no point.
(Update: last crime against me violating the Geneva Convention at home, behind locked doors, on my own today, 17 August 2024, less than 4 hours ago. There is no sign of these evident intimidation attempts stopping. Thankfully I am so outraged, each crime adds to my determination to expose the MARCUCCI, Mick GATTO, Australia’s absurd crime reality.)
I don’t know how many crime families/dynasties like the MARCUCCI exist in Australia. Their complete comfort as criminals suggests what they do is quite common.
PS: when Mick GATTO claims he can stop anyone doing anything – evidently without any risk of prosecution – he might be referring to contactless extortion. I have documented some of my forced exposure to this via my LinkedIn account (3).
False security is far worse than no security at all. People need to know what to expect.
#ididnotstaysilent
—
Remove spaces from the URLs below:
(1) https :// www .youtube .com/watch?v=EuoWv-VKvy0
(2) https :// www .youtube .com/watch?v=EuoWv-VKvy0&t=1730s
(3) https :// www .linkedin .com/pulse/contactless-extortion-australia-katalin-kish-upqyc/
— I posted this comment on Spectator too, hoping to provide relevant info to anyone willing/able to change Australia’s absurd crime reality –
I never even dated the stalker ex-coworker. I never called any MARCUCCI a friend of any kind. I haven’t made poor life choices or costly mistakes leading to my inevitable demise. I feel compelled to share my story via every possible platform, because false security is far worse than no security at all: people need to know what to expect in/from Australia.
As a former refugee from a communist country in Europe, I was a migrant success story – STEM graduate from Monash University, MBA, e-commerce world-champion (1) – until a middle-aged, highschool-dropout, married-with-children, rockstar-wannabe stalker IT Helpdesk Assistant coworker at the Victorian Electoral Commission (VEC) added me to his already long list of concurrent targets. I was only 1 of at least 7 of his obvious, concurrent targets just from the VEC 2009-2012, while I worked there as a Business Analyst.
The stalker had (still has?) unrestricted access to the up-to-date home address of every Victorian, possibly every Australian legally in the country, because voting is compulsory in Australia.
Being a silent elector does NOT protect anyone’s confidential information from government insiders. Clare O’Neil’s grotesque incompetence shows you the value of government guarantees about the security of your information in government databases.
There is no point in trying to move house, unless I become a homeless fugitive always on the run. The stalker & the MARCUCCI crime dynasty will always know my whereabouts. The stalker appears to be connected to the MARCUCCI via a Victoria Police officer relative, M.A.A. MEEHAN, an ex-Purana Taskforce officer. He is about the age of Mario MARCUCCI. They are both Wall-To-Wall-Ride enthusiasts.
When I tried to report the stalker’s crimes to my management first, and when this did not work, to the executive of the VEC, because the stalker started withholding emails from my key stakeholders, so I could not do my job, it was me, who had to resign & leave – fast. The stalker kept his job for at least another 5 years, the Head of the IT Department at the VEC, who enjoyed the stalker’s crimes in front of him so much, he used to giggle with excitement, when he saw something exceptionally vile, was promoted to director.
Leaving the VEC meant no protection from crimes against me. The stalker’s typical crimes against my work environment followed me to subsequent workplaces, until in 2017 I had to give up trying to earn a salary due to debilitating, ongoing, unpunished crimes evidently aided by technology paid by my taxes still.
While working in the open offices of the VEC, the stalker’s victory laps around my desk with a r*tarded grin on his face after “achievements”, like breaking into my home after expensive lock changes, while I worked long hours, usually within 24 hours, were unmissable.
The stalker’s cringe-worthy cowardice & incompetence on daily, open display at the VEC were in stark contrast with his fearlessness as a criminal, with the skills & resources required to carry out the crimes he kept showing off in physical & cyber-space – also resulting in victory laps around my desk, while he was a coworker. He walks up & down the footpath in front of my house in bizarre disguises after new/damaging crimes to this day.
It was a relief as well as a horror to see uniformed Victoria Police officers participating in the stalker’s crimes in 2019, in broad daylight, while Victoria Police forced me to fight at court in an admitted silencing attempt: the stalker is a fearless criminal, because Victoria Police officers are themselves criminals. Because we (Australia) have no functional law-enforcement. By the time Victoria Police forced me to fight at court I knew, there is no authority on earth that can MAKE Victoria Police fight crimes. I only came across Raymond T. Hoser’s courageous work (2) about Victoria Police’s long tradition of criminality after the court case finished (I won) in 2020.
The MARCUCCI crime frenzy in 2023 that lead me to their identity via their Facebook posts & the Facebook posts of the Wall-To-Wall-Ride in 2018, was another relief/trauma.
It became clear that resources used against me are government/military-grade. The Faraday Cage breach (3) demoed on me in 2022 while I was at home was not a random act against a random target.
No civilian has any hope of defending themselves against technology civilian experts don’t even know about, like “transcranial direct current stimulus” from DARPA (4) – electric shocks delivered to human bodies from a distance through walls. My last forced experience of this today, 14 August 2024, before dawn, in my home, on my own, behind locked doors.
(Update: last crime against me violating the Geneva Convention at home, behind locked doors, on my own today, 17 August 2024, less than 4 hours ago. There is no sign of these evident intimidation attempts stopping. Thankfully I am so outraged, each crime adds to my determination to expose the MARCUCCI, Mick GATTO, Australia’s absurd crime reality.)
The number of bikies – once I lost count after 50 in a vulgar group display of risk-free criminality – the expensive, obviously prized, HUGE & LOUD motorbikes also made sense at last, especially in light of the fact that the ADF don’t report crimes Australian soldiers commit (5) to civilian police. These soldiers, like criminal ex-police officers get high trust civilian positions after leaving the police/ADF based on their assumed virtues.
I also need to mention that in 2016 I found out, that refusing infantilising counselling by clueless volunteers at charities, offers of sedation/institutionalisation of ME, THE CRIME VICTIM, in lieu of anyone trying to stop crimes against me, results in Victoria Police “welfare checks”. This is a clear, grave threat to liberty, to life. See what sadistic pervert Victoria Police officers did to “John” (6). And, “John” didn’t try to expose Victoria Police officers’ crimes, Australia’s absurd crime reality.
“Youth” crime meanwhile, likely even Islamic terrorism are welcome distractions for Mick GATTO, whatever the CFMEU will phenix itself into, the MARCUCCI, bikies etc. Enterprising bikies are already known to use “youth” to steal/drive getaway vehicles. It is only a matter of time before “youth” are also used to carry out assassinations of people like me, who cannot be terrorised into silence. Making use of Doli Incapax.
#ididnotstaysilent
— remove spaces from URLs —
(1) https :// googleblog . blogspot .com/2009/07/announcing-2009-google-online-marketing.html
(2) Don’t look for these in bookshops. Deakin University Library had copies in 2020: “Victoria Police Corruption”, Raymond T. Hoser, (736 pp.) Kotabi, 1999. ISBN 0-9586769-6-8
“Victoria Police Corruption 2”, Raymond T. Hoser, (800 pp.) Kotabi, 2000. ISBN 0-9586769-7-6
(3) https :// blog . avast .com/exploiting-air-gaps-avast
This was doable by 2022, definitely not trivial.
(4) https :// www . darpa .mil/program/next-generation-nonsurgical-neurotechnology
(5) https :// www . heraldsun .com.au/news/national/adf-fails-to-report-crimes-convicted-military-personnel-walk-free-in-civilian-life/news-story/debe853751b5c6d2fc37630030440e8f
(6) https :// www . smh .com.au/national/victoria/disability-pensioner-feared-he-would-die-during-alleged-assault-by-police-20200109-p53q7l.html
I can’t help feeling that there are probably some problems in Argentina that Milei would do well to focus on.
Strange one to major on Milieu’s comment about this. There is a debate about where one places the boundary for on-line hate speech. But media in Argentina remains heavily concentrated and Milieu just called a load of protesters in Buenos Aires terrorists. Having a pop at the Brits a nice distraction one assumes.
The Article therefore didn’t really add anything to how we find an appropriate boundary. Clearly though when riot contagion threatens it’s no surprise the boundary gets moved, at least temporarily in how Judges interpret, and the vast majority of the public will prioritise law and order before the right to spit bile into cyberspace.
What’s your view from the left of two-tier policing? You are right about the boundary but it seems to me having different boundaries for different parts of the electorate is extremely dangerous.
I saw this on Substack recently under a comment about a 12 year old boy being prosecuted for kicking a window in the riots. Rather sums it up.
https://substack.com/@lowstatus/note/c-65243046?r=1fl6hp&utm_medium=ios&utm_source=notes-share-action
I think the risk of Riot contagion inevitably changes the threshold for a period, but in this period they do need to demonstrate even handed without question. Confirmed in news today some counter demo custodial sentences been issued and suspect some more to come. However that’s perhaps more an issue for the Courts and CPS rather than Policing.
As regards crime and justice system – the Govt’s own figures and report shows greatest disparity appears at the point of stop and search, custodial remands and prison population. And it’s not the white population showing the disparity. So if we want to get into two-tier Policing and how the Justice system works let’s be honest and cover this too.
As regards Policing of demos – I suspect the threat of riot contagion would probably now have some small alterations in how a pro-Palestinian demo policed, but important we recognise those did not generate violence and trying to firebomb a Synagogue for example. Some of the two-tier contention is a stretch, but not entirely bad the Police sensitised to it.
I’ll be honest I didn’t expect that answer. POC are disproportionately on remand or in prison because of two tier (presumably racist) policing? Not because they commit more crimes. Seriously? Have you any data to back that up?
I do agree it’s possibly the justice system that’s two tiered. The people pulling down Coulson’s statue (criminal damage in any real world) were prosecuted but found innocent (with some heavy direction from the judge).
Just go to YouGov for stats. You won’t find stats for which backgrounds commit more crimes though, partly because not all crimes result in the perpetrator being identified. The SaS stats are especially damning. Ever been SaS’d just because of your colour and know how that feels? It’s based on racial profiling, conscious and subconscious. I’ve no prob with SaS as Police tactic, in fact welcome it, but they exhibit far too much unjustifiable bias. As regards remand, – same crime so why would the non white end up on remand more often?
As regards Colston statue – if the anti-immigration yobs had just focused on a statue then we might be in different territory but they didn’t. It’s no equivalence to personal violent intimidation and attempting to fire bomb a hotel full of people. They also didn’t loot the adjacent shops.
I’m not sure how an Argentine is going to line up alongside English nationalists but it might please a few of his supporters. Who amongst them, I’m not sure…
Britain, or nu britinstan, is merely becoming another Paraguay cross with an Islamic dictatorship.
Collective persecution generates group solidarity. By shifting from a universal approach to civil society government oppression will regenerate the native English identity. It will also create martyrs and new heros. This will also enliven the native English diaspora, just as happened during the Irish troubles.
“Since the socialists came to power,” While I agree with the thrust of Milei’s argument I would have to suggest it is “accelerated since the socialists came to power”
In reality, Starmer’s socialists came to power replacing Sunak’s branch of the socialist uniparty.
That comment was so good, it was obviously worth making it twice.
When politicians blame the people, instead of taking responsibility, revolution eventuates.
The UK is in crisis.
It is time to look in the mirror and ask the hard questions, and make some fearless policy decisions.
Locking people up is reminiscent of COVID lockdowns – curtailing the freedom of the people for an erroneous reason.
Never again.
The socialists did not just come into power. Starmer’s branch of the socialist uniparty simply replaced Sunak’s branch.
Keir Starmer? AFUERA!