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The plan behind Ukraine’s counteroffensive After the dam attack, patience is wearing thin

Fighters of the Russian Volunteer Corps (SERGEY BOBOK/AFP via Getty Images)

Fighters of the Russian Volunteer Corps (SERGEY BOBOK/AFP via Getty Images)


June 9, 2023   5 mins

“Kill them all — I never thought I’d say that, but these bastards have no humanity.” Dasha stabs her finger into the air as she makes her point over coffee in Odesa. Across south-eastern Ukraine, people are enraged at the destruction of the Novaya Kakhovka Dam in the Kherson Oblast. TV screens show streets that have turned into rivers. Dead fish float where there used to be pavements. The Ukrainians I speak to are in no doubt: ecocide has joined genocide as a Russian weapon of war.

Beyond the anger, there is a renewed call to see the heavily anticipated counteroffensive make tangible gains — and quickly. People want Ukrainian lands back. They want Moscow to pay. “The first thing you have to understand,” a Whitehall source recently told me, “is that the Ukrainians got all this fancy new Western kit on the promise of a big counteroffensive. They have to do it. And make it work — or more equipment might not be so forthcoming.”

Military activity is duly intensifying; the so-called spring counteroffensive appears finally to be underway. At the start of this week, Ukrainian forces attacked the area around Velyka Novosilka and Novodonetske in the Donbas region, unofficially kicking things off. But what will happen next? And what, realistically, can be achieved?

The total liberation of the occupied territories, including Crimea, is President Zelenskyy’s official position — not just because he believes it’s morally right, but because he knows that anything less allows Moscow to keep attacking. Yet a chasm remains between what the Ukrainians want and what they have the capacity to do — as they so often point out to the West.

So, rather than liberating the occupied territories, the counteroffensive’s most realistic objective is to try to split them — dividing the Russian forces fighting in the Donbas from those in the south. Key to this will be retaking the area around the city of Melitopol in the Zaporizhzhia Oblast. Do this and they will sever the “land bridge” that snakes all the way from Russia through the cities of Donetsk, Mariupol and Melitopol, and into Crimea. This bridge was one of Putin’s stated war aims: it allows Moscow to give some military (and thus economic and political) reality to the fiction that those lands are Russian territory. Grain now flows from Melitopol into Russia, while Russian passports flow the other way — whether the locals like it or not.

The problem with this plan, however, is that it’s obvious. Looking at Ukraine’s most successful counterattacks over the past year, deception has always been a priority (which is probably why the spring counteroffensive did not come in spring). Last year’s lightning attack around Kharkiv, that sent the Russians scuttling back across the border, was predicated on convincing the enemy that Ukraine would attack much further south. Kyiv seems well-aware of this. After Ukraine launched a multi-pronged attack in Donetsk on Sunday, Defence Minister Oleksii Reznikov tweeted out lyrics from Depeche Mode’s “Enjoy the Silence”, showing a video of Ukrainian soldiers putting fingers to their lips. “There will be no announcement about the start,” it warned.

Surprise, then, remains the order of the day. But to expect to consistently deceive the Russians is naive. The Kremlin isn’t stupid. Putin knows the continuing feasibility of his occupation rests on their land bridge. Russia is prepared.

Right now, the Ukrainians are making a series of small strikes across the Russian lines. Peppering the enemy like this does two things. First, it tests the lines for weakness. Second, it helps to disguise where a major strike will take place. The broader the range of Ukraine’s preliminary attack, the harder it is for Moscow to work out where they will eventually try to break through. This is partly why Kyiv has also been striking further south, including near the cities of Mykhailivka, Melitopol and Tomak (the latter probably with US-supplied HIMARS systems), all of which are critical to regaining access to the Sea of Azov. Russian channels on Telegram also reported increased fire and assault of positions near Zaporizhzhia.

If Kyiv can recover Zaporizhzhia — whether or not its nuclear power plant functions is another matter — it will sever the land bridge and drive its forces right up against Crimea. Such an advance would not only terrify the pro-Russians living inside the peninsula, but also those ruling in the Kremlin. Ultimately, it would give Kyiv an excellent base from which to try to capture either Donetsk or Luhansk — with the latter being the most likely. The coal mines in Donetsk create a three-dimensional battlefield that Russian forces can use to hide underground, store equipment or booby-trap with ease. The Ukrainians were able to hold out for five months in the salt mines of Soledar by doing the same thing, despite being vastly outnumbered.

The Ukrainians, though, are only half the equation. Many “analysts” on pro-Russia Telegram channels cite the abilities of Putin’s elite forces as a major barrier to a successful Ukrainian counter-offensive. The reality is not so simple. Consider, for instance, the elite 74th Guards Motor Rifle Brigade, which was thrown into the heart of the fighting last May when it successfully crossed the Siverskyi Donets river. Towards the end of last month, the brigade was ordered to leave Donetsk for Belgorod, just across the border from Kharkiv, to deal with new threats there. To get there, it had to take a meandering route around the Ukrainian lines — the Russians clearly have no fresh troops to send.

Meanwhile, there are serious doubts over how “elite” they really are. Soon after crossing the Siverskyi Donets, the forces were chewed up by Ukrainian artillery, reportedly losing over 485 out of 550 men and 80 vehicles. The Brigade is still in the field, but whoever wears their cap badge now is almost certainly not an “elite troop”.

This appears to be part of a wider trend. “In Bakhmut, the Russians recently lost not only a brigade commander, but a Deputy of Political Affairs,” a Whitehall source tells me. “When those people are there, it’s usually because the front is falling apart. The Ukrainians understand this. They’re as close as you can get to the Russians.”

Then there is the problem of ammunition. Yevgeny Prigozhin, the leader of the Wagner Group, has spent months railing against the Russian high command, specifically Minister of Defence, Sergei Shoigu, and Commander-in Chief, Valery Gerasimov. “Their shelling rate is very low,” the mandarin continues. “It’s the Prigozhin problem writ large. They are dependent on massive bombardments — [when one calculates] the basic unit of fire for a BM-21 “Grad”, the mobile rocket launcher being used across the country, from what we’re seeing, they have enough for only three days.”

There are a host of other problems, too. “We’re seeing some ancient kit; so, is Russia holding back their best stuff in case of a broader war with Nato or are they simply out of things later than a T60 [tank produced by the Soviets in 1941-42]? And they’ve changed conscript regulations. They can now call up people with Type 1 diabetes, in a country of 150 million people. Just how desperate are they?”

And yet, despite the chaotic and largely ridiculed nature of Moscow’s partial mobilisations, it got the extra forces it wanted. While Western weapons flow into Ukraine, Russia is largely self-sufficient and, more than a year later, its lines still hold. And the troops populating them know a fierce battle is coming.

Yesterday morning, I spoke to a young waiter. “Smells like counteroffensive today,” he said with a grin. By the afternoon, word reached me that more offensive operations were beginning in the east. The people here are angry and increasingly expectant. “Time to advance!” said Dasha as we finished our coffee. Like most Ukrainians, she wants both revenge and progress — anything less would be a disaster.


David Patrikarakos is UnHerd‘s foreign correspondent. His latest book is War in 140 characters: how social media is reshaping conflict in the 21st century. (Hachette)

dpatrikarakos

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Steve White
Steve White
11 months ago

The one thing that should be happening from all of this is it should be a great reality check. If George Soros is right then in his words the counterattack will be a “positive shock” and a victory for Ukraine, because Russia is a ‘paper tiger’. The other take on all of this is that it’s reminiscent of the way Covid was handled here particularly in the West. Which is to say propaganda about the effectiveness of things, what should be done, who to listen to, and who not to listen to all seems like a dĂ©jĂ  vu.
One where we will all find out in time that those in charge and their media priesthood, those who told us all the way it was, what is true, what needed to be done, all the imperatives that we must comply with agree with, and even promote or else we are (insert whatever derogatory label here). We might just find out once again it was all a house of cards, and we’ve all been used, and lied to, and a lot of people died and once again that no one who pushed it all is going to be held accountable.
This counteroffensive should hopefully be the great revelation. There will be attempts to spin either direction, making gains or losses seem greater than they are, or less than they are, but hopefully the ruse is up, and we should find out if the establishment position is right, or if the alternative, outsider take on everything is right yet again. 

Last edited 11 months ago by Steve White
Elena R.
Elena R.
11 months ago
Reply to  Steve White

when he has woes everyone knows …

Elena R.
Elena R.
11 months ago
Reply to  Steve White

when he has woes everyone knows …

Steve White
Steve White
11 months ago

The one thing that should be happening from all of this is it should be a great reality check. If George Soros is right then in his words the counterattack will be a “positive shock” and a victory for Ukraine, because Russia is a ‘paper tiger’. The other take on all of this is that it’s reminiscent of the way Covid was handled here particularly in the West. Which is to say propaganda about the effectiveness of things, what should be done, who to listen to, and who not to listen to all seems like a dĂ©jĂ  vu.
One where we will all find out in time that those in charge and their media priesthood, those who told us all the way it was, what is true, what needed to be done, all the imperatives that we must comply with agree with, and even promote or else we are (insert whatever derogatory label here). We might just find out once again it was all a house of cards, and we’ve all been used, and lied to, and a lot of people died and once again that no one who pushed it all is going to be held accountable.
This counteroffensive should hopefully be the great revelation. There will be attempts to spin either direction, making gains or losses seem greater than they are, or less than they are, but hopefully the ruse is up, and we should find out if the establishment position is right, or if the alternative, outsider take on everything is right yet again. 

Last edited 11 months ago by Steve White
Corrie Mooney
Corrie Mooney
11 months ago

T-60s were designed in – get this – 1960.

Anthony Havens
Anthony Havens
11 months ago
Reply to  Corrie Mooney

Exactly, makes you wonder what else the writer got wrong..!

Dominic A
Dominic A
11 months ago
Reply to  Anthony Havens

Exactly wrong.

Dominic A
Dominic A
11 months ago
Reply to  Anthony Havens

Exactly wrong.

Mike Doyle
Mike Doyle
11 months ago
Reply to  Corrie Mooney

Per Wikipedia it was produced in 1941 / 42. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T-60_tank

Paul Sowden
Paul Sowden
11 months ago
Reply to  Mike Doyle

That really should have been picked up in editing as that’s not the T-60 MBT we are seeing the Russians deploy in Ukraine

Paul Sowden
Paul Sowden
11 months ago
Reply to  Mike Doyle

That really should have been picked up in editing as that’s not the T-60 MBT we are seeing the Russians deploy in Ukraine

Anthony Havens
Anthony Havens
11 months ago
Reply to  Corrie Mooney

Exactly, makes you wonder what else the writer got wrong..!

Mike Doyle
Mike Doyle
11 months ago
Reply to  Corrie Mooney

Per Wikipedia it was produced in 1941 / 42. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T-60_tank

Corrie Mooney
Corrie Mooney
11 months ago

T-60s were designed in – get this – 1960.

D Walsh
D Walsh
11 months ago

I don’t know how much the Ukrainians paid for those Leopard tanks, but they should ask for their money back

The Russians are winning

Liam Brady
Liam Brady
11 months ago
Reply to  D Walsh

Winning? It’s not a football match, it’s a war. And What do you define as winning? Between 40k to 150k Russian soldiers dead – is that winning? The expansion of nato – is that winning? Russias economy tanking – is that winning? Russian military leaders on the brink of another civil war- is that winning?

D Walsh
D Walsh
11 months ago
Reply to  Liam Brady

You don’t know how an army wins a war, what age are you ?

The Russian economy is fine

There is no civil war about to start in Russia, if you believe that you’re falling for BS

The Russians are winning

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago
Reply to  D Walsh

The real problem is that the Donbas “republics” annexed Russia. They now have almost no one of military age not in the army or dead. The same thing will eventually happen to Russia, because fears a genuine mobilization–until it’s too late.
Also:
–The ruble is at 80 R per dollar and climbing.
–Not enough workers to man the factories, which, instead of useful saleable goods, are being converted for war.
–The majority of IT professionals emigrating to other countries.
Putin wanted to return to the Russia of Peter the Great.
And now he HAS the Russia of Peter the Great.

Last edited 11 months ago by martin logan
martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago
Reply to  D Walsh

The real problem is that the Donbas “republics” annexed Russia. They now have almost no one of military age not in the army or dead. The same thing will eventually happen to Russia, because fears a genuine mobilization–until it’s too late.
Also:
–The ruble is at 80 R per dollar and climbing.
–Not enough workers to man the factories, which, instead of useful saleable goods, are being converted for war.
–The majority of IT professionals emigrating to other countries.
Putin wanted to return to the Russia of Peter the Great.
And now he HAS the Russia of Peter the Great.

Last edited 11 months ago by martin logan
D Walsh
D Walsh
11 months ago
Reply to  Liam Brady

You don’t know how an army wins a war, what age are you ?

The Russian economy is fine

There is no civil war about to start in Russia, if you believe that you’re falling for BS

The Russians are winning

Billy Bob
Billy Bob
11 months ago
Reply to  D Walsh

Winning that much that they’re videoing themselves blowing up farm machinery parked in a field and claiming it was a Leopard tank?

Liam Brady
Liam Brady
11 months ago
Reply to  D Walsh

Winning? It’s not a football match, it’s a war. And What do you define as winning? Between 40k to 150k Russian soldiers dead – is that winning? The expansion of nato – is that winning? Russias economy tanking – is that winning? Russian military leaders on the brink of another civil war- is that winning?

Billy Bob
Billy Bob
11 months ago
Reply to  D Walsh

Winning that much that they’re videoing themselves blowing up farm machinery parked in a field and claiming it was a Leopard tank?

D Walsh
D Walsh
11 months ago

I don’t know how much the Ukrainians paid for those Leopard tanks, but they should ask for their money back

The Russians are winning

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

The main result of this war is that Putin has trashed the lives of 140 million Russians.
Whether or not he can hang on to what little he has gained in Donbas is unknown. But the West is sending ever-more modern equpt, and as long is he is still too frightened to mobilize, any offensives with meet with teh same fate as the winter attacks.
Russia is now exclusively a petro-power, that won’t be able to deliver most of its west Siberian gas to China for years. And by that time, China will be using solar exclusively for a shrinking population. Indeed, the only other industry Russia has is military equpt, and the droll turret-tossing videos show every customer that you only want your enemy to have Russian equpt.
This means that generations of almost all Russians will live impoverished lives, very much like their serf forbears in the 18th C.
The West planned none of this. But looks like the future will be a bi-polar world, with Chia’s Russian and Iranian minions paying the price for Putin’s folly.

Stoater D
Stoater D
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

The west most definitely planned this.
Stop lying.

Stoater D
Stoater D
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

The west most definitely planned this.
Stop lying.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

The main result of this war is that Putin has trashed the lives of 140 million Russians.
Whether or not he can hang on to what little he has gained in Donbas is unknown. But the West is sending ever-more modern equpt, and as long is he is still too frightened to mobilize, any offensives with meet with teh same fate as the winter attacks.
Russia is now exclusively a petro-power, that won’t be able to deliver most of its west Siberian gas to China for years. And by that time, China will be using solar exclusively for a shrinking population. Indeed, the only other industry Russia has is military equpt, and the droll turret-tossing videos show every customer that you only want your enemy to have Russian equpt.
This means that generations of almost all Russians will live impoverished lives, very much like their serf forbears in the 18th C.
The West planned none of this. But looks like the future will be a bi-polar world, with Chia’s Russian and Iranian minions paying the price for Putin’s folly.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

A sober assessment. It will be events on the ground that determine the outcome.
Still, Ukraine’s one trump card is Putin. His delusions continue to degrade the Russian military’s abilities, mainly by keeping loyal but incompetent people like Shoigu and Gerasimov in command. That Patrushev lives in a fantasy world is only an added bonus.
I recall how Russian prisoners kept saying “if only Stalin knew!” they would have been free. Of course, Stalin knew everything. That also enabled him to win the war with 28 million casualties.
Russia’s tragedy is that Putin doesn’t know.

Last edited 11 months ago by martin logan
Liam Brady
Liam Brady
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

Putin only trusts his “yes man” mates. He doesn’t select on merits.

Liam Brady
Liam Brady
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

Putin only trusts his “yes man” mates. He doesn’t select on merits.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

A sober assessment. It will be events on the ground that determine the outcome.
Still, Ukraine’s one trump card is Putin. His delusions continue to degrade the Russian military’s abilities, mainly by keeping loyal but incompetent people like Shoigu and Gerasimov in command. That Patrushev lives in a fantasy world is only an added bonus.
I recall how Russian prisoners kept saying “if only Stalin knew!” they would have been free. Of course, Stalin knew everything. That also enabled him to win the war with 28 million casualties.
Russia’s tragedy is that Putin doesn’t know.

Last edited 11 months ago by martin logan
Iris C
Iris C
11 months ago

According to Sky News, Ukraine’s Spring offensive was thwarted in a two-day attack this week with the loss of a large number of tanks and 250 troops killed. It also reported that the detonation of the dam was a terrorist attack rather than a decision taken by the warring sides and this was semi-confirmed by Zelensky’s response immediately after its destruction..
What is one to believe?.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago
Reply to  Iris C

Which “terrorists” planted several hundred pounds of explosive in the inside of the dam then?
Under the noses of the Russian garrison?
And just as the Ukrainian offensive got underway.
Can you say Russian “diversanty?”

Last edited 11 months ago by martin logan
Adrian Pearson
Adrian Pearson
11 months ago
Reply to  Iris C

Certainly not Sly News

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago
Reply to  Iris C

Which “terrorists” planted several hundred pounds of explosive in the inside of the dam then?
Under the noses of the Russian garrison?
And just as the Ukrainian offensive got underway.
Can you say Russian “diversanty?”

Last edited 11 months ago by martin logan
Adrian Pearson
Adrian Pearson
11 months ago
Reply to  Iris C

Certainly not Sly News

Iris C
Iris C
11 months ago

According to Sky News, Ukraine’s Spring offensive was thwarted in a two-day attack this week with the loss of a large number of tanks and 250 troops killed. It also reported that the detonation of the dam was a terrorist attack rather than a decision taken by the warring sides and this was semi-confirmed by Zelensky’s response immediately after its destruction..
What is one to believe?.

Daniel P
Daniel P
11 months ago

I guess we will wait and see.
My bet is that the Ukrainians blew up the dam, just as they blew up Nordstream.
Hard to keep an army in the field without water. Harder to keep a civilian population under control if they are dying of thirst and desperate to get out.
All in all, I think the Ukrainians are gonna win in the end. They know what they are fighting for and why. The Russian troops mainly just want to get it over with and go home. Big difference between the way a man defending his home fights and the way a man who is ordered to take someone elses home and has no good idea why will.
If it is true that the Russians are fielding T60s. If the ammo shortage in Russia is real, and it may well be, and IF the west keeps funneling ammo and advance weapons and if it keeps providing intel and command and control support, I think the Ukrainians have a decent shot. That is a lot of “if’s” but none of them are unrealistic.
There is however always the biggest IF. If Putin decides to use tactical nukes. That will be a global game changer.

polidori redux
polidori redux
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

“My bet is that the Ukrainians blew up the dam,”
I doubt it. Truth will come out in the end, and The Ukrainian government would lose all credibility with its own people and risk Western support if it were seen to have deliberately killed its own citizens and destroyed their homes. Remember, for the Ukrainians this is a patriotic war: Ukrainians will tolerate losses at the hands of the Russians but not from their own army. Anyway as you said yourself, they are winning, so why do it?

Last edited 11 months ago by polidori redux
Nell Clover
Nell Clover
11 months ago
Reply to  polidori redux

In a patriotic war anything is permissible. And in the case of Ukraine, the lack of control over the patriotic forces makes anything possible.

The UK’s own WW2 home defence plans included the formation of the Auxiliary Units. These were trained (some by Ian Fleming’s brother) in guerilla war should the Germans occupy. Their approved tactics included damaging infrastructure civilians depended on. Blowing up a Peak District dam wouldn’t have been off the table.

polidori redux
polidori redux
11 months ago
Reply to  Nell Clover

You are referring to desperate measures in a desperate situation.
The Ukrainian counter-offensive hasn’t failed yet. If and when it fails, then we can talk about resorting to last ditch defense. But we haven’t got there yet.

Kathleen Lillard
Kathleen Lillard
11 months ago
Reply to  polidori redux

upvote

Kathleen Lillard
Kathleen Lillard
11 months ago
Reply to  polidori redux

upvote

polidori redux
polidori redux
11 months ago
Reply to  Nell Clover

You are referring to desperate measures in a desperate situation.
The Ukrainian counter-offensive hasn’t failed yet. If and when it fails, then we can talk about resorting to last ditch defense. But we haven’t got there yet.

Stoater D
Stoater D
11 months ago
Reply to  polidori redux

Of course the Ukrainians blew up the dam.
Had the Russians wished cause a flood, all they would have to do is open the floodgates.

Dominic A
Dominic A
11 months ago
Reply to  Stoater D

….and then be blamed for it as they are i/c of the damn dam.

David Alsop
David Alsop
11 months ago
Reply to  Stoater D

The dam could only be blown up with explosives planted in side of it, it was in Russian hands so it was them and no one else. The Ukrainians dont have the jets needed to hit it and even if they did it would have bene seen by everyone, no one saw any jets.

Elena R.
Elena R.
11 months ago
Reply to  Stoater D

’cause you know how dam was designed ? been there?
A horde of invisible Ukrainiens have surely smuggled tons of explosifs, just to help Russians to remove 200 km of the potential front line and facilitate their defense effort. Very magnanimous of Ukrainiens, isn’t it?

Dominic A
Dominic A
11 months ago
Reply to  Stoater D

….and then be blamed for it as they are i/c of the damn dam.

David Alsop
David Alsop
11 months ago
Reply to  Stoater D

The dam could only be blown up with explosives planted in side of it, it was in Russian hands so it was them and no one else. The Ukrainians dont have the jets needed to hit it and even if they did it would have bene seen by everyone, no one saw any jets.

Elena R.
Elena R.
11 months ago
Reply to  Stoater D

’cause you know how dam was designed ? been there?
A horde of invisible Ukrainiens have surely smuggled tons of explosifs, just to help Russians to remove 200 km of the potential front line and facilitate their defense effort. Very magnanimous of Ukrainiens, isn’t it?

Michael McElwee
Michael McElwee
11 months ago
Reply to  polidori redux

On the Stephan Gardner Youtube show, Scott Ritter made a compelling case that Ukraine did indeed destroy the dam.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

Scott Ritter has yet to make a compelling case for anything.
Starting with his amazing prediction that Putin would take Kyiv.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

Scott Ritter has yet to make a compelling case for anything.
Starting with his amazing prediction that Putin would take Kyiv.

Nell Clover
Nell Clover
11 months ago
Reply to  polidori redux

In a patriotic war anything is permissible. And in the case of Ukraine, the lack of control over the patriotic forces makes anything possible.

The UK’s own WW2 home defence plans included the formation of the Auxiliary Units. These were trained (some by Ian Fleming’s brother) in guerilla war should the Germans occupy. Their approved tactics included damaging infrastructure civilians depended on. Blowing up a Peak District dam wouldn’t have been off the table.

Stoater D
Stoater D
11 months ago
Reply to  polidori redux

Of course the Ukrainians blew up the dam.
Had the Russians wished cause a flood, all they would have to do is open the floodgates.

Michael McElwee
Michael McElwee
11 months ago
Reply to  polidori redux

On the Stephan Gardner Youtube show, Scott Ritter made a compelling case that Ukraine did indeed destroy the dam.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

Sorry, that’s simply saying that the Ukrainians flooded themselves, for no tactical advantage.
The Russian army will still have enough water, and no Russian cares about the fate of Ukrainians. By now they know everyone in Ukraine is a “traitor.”
But Russian morale does seem below zero. The attempt to recruit volunteers has fallen flat, and Putin dare not announce another call-up, which would be far too late anyway.

Last edited 11 months ago by martin logan
Michael McElwee
Michael McElwee
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

But they did gain a tactical advantage. If reports are to be believed, the Ukrainians fired several missals at the dam in recent months, preparatory to its ultimate destruction. The flooding, after the dam was destroyed, buried key Russian tactical positions. The net gain was all Ukrainian; the losses all Russian (“all” may be too strong a word). Again, I would have you watch Scott Ritter’s report.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

The Rudolf Hess defence:
“Hitler’s victims hypnotized him to kill them.”
So why would Ukraine blow a dam (under Russian control!!), so that it had to divert scarce resources to save its own people?
And flood vast areas of its own farmland?
And halt water supplies to a Crimea it hopes to take very soon?
“Putin’s victims…”

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

The Rudolf Hess defence:
“Hitler’s victims hypnotized him to kill them.”
So why would Ukraine blow a dam (under Russian control!!), so that it had to divert scarce resources to save its own people?
And flood vast areas of its own farmland?
And halt water supplies to a Crimea it hopes to take very soon?
“Putin’s victims…”

Kathleen Lillard
Kathleen Lillard
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

upvote. (click doesn’t always work)

Michael McElwee
Michael McElwee
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

But they did gain a tactical advantage. If reports are to be believed, the Ukrainians fired several missals at the dam in recent months, preparatory to its ultimate destruction. The flooding, after the dam was destroyed, buried key Russian tactical positions. The net gain was all Ukrainian; the losses all Russian (“all” may be too strong a word). Again, I would have you watch Scott Ritter’s report.

Kathleen Lillard
Kathleen Lillard
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

upvote. (click doesn’t always work)

Isabel Ward
Isabel Ward
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

Doubt if Ukraine blew up their own dam. It well known that the Russians put in loads of mines at the end of last year. Further, the dam was designed to survive massive attacks.ie it would need to be bombed directly in the same place from the air. Not something the Ukrainians have the capability for. Another possibility is that it was not done deliberately at this time but anyway I’m sure the Russians are responsible

stephen archer
stephen archer
11 months ago
Reply to  Isabel Ward

A commenter on a DT article posted a translated message from a Russian mil blogger the day after the explosion citing the Russian guards by name who mistakenly set off the charges in the turbine hall 4 days earlier than planned (this evening). Like all information from the war, it’s questionable but would explain why the Russian forces on the left bank were caught unaware.

Elena R.
Elena R.
11 months ago
Reply to  stephen archer

very plausible

Elena R.
Elena R.
11 months ago
Reply to  stephen archer

very plausible

stephen archer
stephen archer
11 months ago
Reply to  Isabel Ward

A commenter on a DT article posted a translated message from a Russian mil blogger the day after the explosion citing the Russian guards by name who mistakenly set off the charges in the turbine hall 4 days earlier than planned (this evening). Like all information from the war, it’s questionable but would explain why the Russian forces on the left bank were caught unaware.

Howard Gleave
Howard Gleave
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

The dam was in Russian hands. If you’ve ever read the Dam Busters or seen the film, you’d know that conventionally bombing a dam will have no effect. A bomb needs to be exploded hard up against the wall at depth so that the blast wave is channelled through the concrete, not cushioned by the water. In the case of the Ruhr dams in 1943 the bomb weighed 5 tons all up, with over 2 tons of high explosive, with a hydrostatic pistol set to detonate at 30 feet.

This, therefore, clearly suggests that the Russians demolished the dam by lowering a large explosive device, or devices, deep into the water and hard against the wall then detonating it. The Ukrainians would have completely lacked the means to do so.

Corrie Mooney
Corrie Mooney
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

It suits the Russians tactically to blow up the dam.

Peter Joy
Peter Joy
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

The idea that a ‘freelance Ukrainian group’ blew up Nordstream is so laughable as to be ridiculous. It is a feeble cover-story offered up – with a smirk on its face – by the Biden State Dept.
The resources, equipment, support and technical expertise required all place this job well beyond the capabilities of anything but a reasonably capable national naval force.
It was a joint operation between the US and Norweigians: Seymour Hersch, the veteran intelligence reporter, has already published the details. Yet for some reason, after first blaming the ‘evil terrorist’ Russians for, er, destroying their own pipeline and industrial Germany’s access to Russian gas (and despite the fact that Biden twice publicly promised to destroy it) the MSM have chosen to go with the approved ‘freelance Ukrainians unconnected with the Ukrainian Government’ line.
Perhaps there’s a D-notice (and its overseas equivalents) on the true story.

Last edited 11 months ago by Peter Joy
Malcolm Robbins
Malcolm Robbins
11 months ago
Reply to  Peter Joy

If one gets out a detailed relief map and looks at the areas flooded that will tell part of the story as to who blew the dam up. My take is that 2/3rd of the low-land is on the east and that is also where Russian defensive positions were well established.
In addition the big lake above the dam, once drained will be just a river again and it’ll be much easier for Ukrainians from the west to make incursions along approx 1000km. Russia will need to bring in hundreds of thousands of soldiers just to maintain a defensive line.
If you accept that Ukrainian forces are far more depleted than Russian (which they are) then using this kind of asymmetric tactic greatly levels the playing field. The Ukrainian spring offensive has been a bit of a fiction so far really as they are so depleted they’ll be lucky if they can muster more than 20,000 decent fighting men BUT now the dam gone they can be a much more effective “terrorist” force with spot attacks here and there, bogging down the Russians (and this is exactly what the US/Nato want to do, because everyone knows the war is essentially over (for Ukraine), except for the killing.
Finally it’s a desperate act and one that, in my opinion, unfortunately will lead to Russia deciding it can no longer just accept the territory east of the river but will need to press much further west to create a “DMZ”. Sad indeed.

Last edited 11 months ago by Malcolm Robbins
martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

Indeed, that’s why the undepleted Russian forces made no gains over the winter.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

Indeed, that’s why the undepleted Russian forces made no gains over the winter.

Michael McElwee
Michael McElwee
11 months ago
Reply to  Peter Joy

Exactly.

Malcolm Robbins
Malcolm Robbins
11 months ago
Reply to  Peter Joy

If one gets out a detailed relief map and looks at the areas flooded that will tell part of the story as to who blew the dam up. My take is that 2/3rd of the low-land is on the east and that is also where Russian defensive positions were well established.
In addition the big lake above the dam, once drained will be just a river again and it’ll be much easier for Ukrainians from the west to make incursions along approx 1000km. Russia will need to bring in hundreds of thousands of soldiers just to maintain a defensive line.
If you accept that Ukrainian forces are far more depleted than Russian (which they are) then using this kind of asymmetric tactic greatly levels the playing field. The Ukrainian spring offensive has been a bit of a fiction so far really as they are so depleted they’ll be lucky if they can muster more than 20,000 decent fighting men BUT now the dam gone they can be a much more effective “terrorist” force with spot attacks here and there, bogging down the Russians (and this is exactly what the US/Nato want to do, because everyone knows the war is essentially over (for Ukraine), except for the killing.
Finally it’s a desperate act and one that, in my opinion, unfortunately will lead to Russia deciding it can no longer just accept the territory east of the river but will need to press much further west to create a “DMZ”. Sad indeed.

Last edited 11 months ago by Malcolm Robbins
Michael McElwee
Michael McElwee
11 months ago
Reply to  Peter Joy

Exactly.

Michael McElwee
Michael McElwee
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

Your point about defending “one’s own” is a good one. I wonder, however, if the home field advantage operates with equal vigor in a country as corrupt as Ukraine. The views expressed here are all over the map, but there appears to be wide (if sometimes begrudging) agreement that Ukraine is the single most corrupt country in the world. One wonders how vigorous the flag waving really is in such a country. At the same time, those in a sea of corruption have a lot to lose. What is your take on this?

polidori redux
polidori redux
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

“My bet is that the Ukrainians blew up the dam,”
I doubt it. Truth will come out in the end, and The Ukrainian government would lose all credibility with its own people and risk Western support if it were seen to have deliberately killed its own citizens and destroyed their homes. Remember, for the Ukrainians this is a patriotic war: Ukrainians will tolerate losses at the hands of the Russians but not from their own army. Anyway as you said yourself, they are winning, so why do it?

Last edited 11 months ago by polidori redux
martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

Sorry, that’s simply saying that the Ukrainians flooded themselves, for no tactical advantage.
The Russian army will still have enough water, and no Russian cares about the fate of Ukrainians. By now they know everyone in Ukraine is a “traitor.”
But Russian morale does seem below zero. The attempt to recruit volunteers has fallen flat, and Putin dare not announce another call-up, which would be far too late anyway.

Last edited 11 months ago by martin logan
Isabel Ward
Isabel Ward
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

Doubt if Ukraine blew up their own dam. It well known that the Russians put in loads of mines at the end of last year. Further, the dam was designed to survive massive attacks.ie it would need to be bombed directly in the same place from the air. Not something the Ukrainians have the capability for. Another possibility is that it was not done deliberately at this time but anyway I’m sure the Russians are responsible

Howard Gleave
Howard Gleave
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

The dam was in Russian hands. If you’ve ever read the Dam Busters or seen the film, you’d know that conventionally bombing a dam will have no effect. A bomb needs to be exploded hard up against the wall at depth so that the blast wave is channelled through the concrete, not cushioned by the water. In the case of the Ruhr dams in 1943 the bomb weighed 5 tons all up, with over 2 tons of high explosive, with a hydrostatic pistol set to detonate at 30 feet.

This, therefore, clearly suggests that the Russians demolished the dam by lowering a large explosive device, or devices, deep into the water and hard against the wall then detonating it. The Ukrainians would have completely lacked the means to do so.

Corrie Mooney
Corrie Mooney
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

It suits the Russians tactically to blow up the dam.

Peter Joy
Peter Joy
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

The idea that a ‘freelance Ukrainian group’ blew up Nordstream is so laughable as to be ridiculous. It is a feeble cover-story offered up – with a smirk on its face – by the Biden State Dept.
The resources, equipment, support and technical expertise required all place this job well beyond the capabilities of anything but a reasonably capable national naval force.
It was a joint operation between the US and Norweigians: Seymour Hersch, the veteran intelligence reporter, has already published the details. Yet for some reason, after first blaming the ‘evil terrorist’ Russians for, er, destroying their own pipeline and industrial Germany’s access to Russian gas (and despite the fact that Biden twice publicly promised to destroy it) the MSM have chosen to go with the approved ‘freelance Ukrainians unconnected with the Ukrainian Government’ line.
Perhaps there’s a D-notice (and its overseas equivalents) on the true story.

Last edited 11 months ago by Peter Joy
Michael McElwee
Michael McElwee
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

Your point about defending “one’s own” is a good one. I wonder, however, if the home field advantage operates with equal vigor in a country as corrupt as Ukraine. The views expressed here are all over the map, but there appears to be wide (if sometimes begrudging) agreement that Ukraine is the single most corrupt country in the world. One wonders how vigorous the flag waving really is in such a country. At the same time, those in a sea of corruption have a lot to lose. What is your take on this?

Daniel P
Daniel P
11 months ago

I guess we will wait and see.
My bet is that the Ukrainians blew up the dam, just as they blew up Nordstream.
Hard to keep an army in the field without water. Harder to keep a civilian population under control if they are dying of thirst and desperate to get out.
All in all, I think the Ukrainians are gonna win in the end. They know what they are fighting for and why. The Russian troops mainly just want to get it over with and go home. Big difference between the way a man defending his home fights and the way a man who is ordered to take someone elses home and has no good idea why will.
If it is true that the Russians are fielding T60s. If the ammo shortage in Russia is real, and it may well be, and IF the west keeps funneling ammo and advance weapons and if it keeps providing intel and command and control support, I think the Ukrainians have a decent shot. That is a lot of “if’s” but none of them are unrealistic.
There is however always the biggest IF. If Putin decides to use tactical nukes. That will be a global game changer.

Emil Castelli
Emil Castelli
11 months ago

War Porn and confusing what one wished was true, and what is true wile repeating the ‘Official Agenda..

Russia is currently 5 times Ukraine’s population, has 5 – 10 times the artillery and unlimited ammunition (this is a war of artiliary as they sit out of range of eachother and just shell.) This is a slaughter. Ukraine loses 7 men for every Russian.

You are watching Biden and Boris Proxy War completely destroy Ukraine. This Hideously EVIL was is entirely engineered – it has nothing to do with Ukrainian freedom or democracy – it is Globalism weirdness, sheer $$$$ to Military Industrial, Corruption – every one of the $113 billion gets clipped a dozen times on the way till very little gets there. And finally – Biden just Gave Ukraine to Blackrock and Vanguard to be their personal fiefdoms and cows to milk – of the endless streams of money the rebuilding will allow to be pillaged. Ukraine is now owned by Global Finance!

I appearently cannot link here, but on Youtube go to Colonel Macgregor, Alexander Mercouris, Scott Ritter. to get something other than this agenda propaganda

On Rumble (the uncensored youtube) go to Redacted News.

Daniel P
Daniel P
11 months ago
Reply to  Emil Castelli

I do not necessarily disagree with your second point.
As to your first…well…if the Russians were so well equipped and trained as you describe, then they should have won last year.
I do not think that Putin has been holding back to minimize collateral damage.
No, I think the Russian army has some of the same issues the Soviet army did. Lots of equipment and men but the equipment is badly maintained and the troops poorly trained except for small special units. If they are truly fielding T60s and they are using large numbers of conscripts and pushing them into battle, then the Russians are weaker than they appear to be. But then, so were the Soviets.
If it comes down to a test of wills, my money is on the Ukrainians.

J Bryant
J Bryant
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

I agree with your assessment of the Russian military. It’s fashionable now to sneer at the notion the Putin might use nukes if Ukraine makes significant advances, but I believe he might if he feels cornered. Then the terrible logic of nuclear weapons takes hold. The West has threatened him with massive retribution if he uses a single nuke, so if he decides to use one why not use more and deal a heavy blow to Ukraine’s military and infrastructure? We’ve all become a little complacent about this war, imo.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago
Reply to  J Bryant

Putin’s problem is that if he uses any nukes, NATO will just use its conventional forces to destroy what’s left of Russia’s military.
His air force is particularly degraded.
That’s why he’s kept his nuclear sabre-rattling in check. He’s more afraid of what NATO can do to him than losing the war.
Given the latter, he knows he might still survive. Lose his entire military, and he’s toast.

Malcolm Robbins
Malcolm Robbins
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

Your reply is an example of western hubris and your logic is wrong. MAD applies. If either side (NATO or Russia) uses a nuclear weapon on the other side it will quickly escalate to full scale nuclear war in which there will be no winners worldwide, period! So no Putin is only afraid of what NATO can do to him in so far as the consequences for the entire world and he’s no nutter.
BUT I agree with John Mearsheimer that if Russia became existentially threatened (which they are far from being right now) but would be if Ukraine actually regained all the territory in the east because I doubt they would stop there, then they could conceivable use nukes against Ukraine without causing further escalation because Ukraine don’t have nuclear weapons and are not part of NATO, plus NATO would be absolutely aware that if they responded in any way against Russia a full scale nuclear exchange would occur.

Last edited 11 months ago by Malcolm Robbins
martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

And your evidence for this is…
What?
Watched Dr. Strangelove a little too often, I fear…

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

And your evidence for this is…
What?
Watched Dr. Strangelove a little too often, I fear…

Kathleen Lillard
Kathleen Lillard
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

upvote. (click didn’t work)

Malcolm Robbins
Malcolm Robbins
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

Your reply is an example of western hubris and your logic is wrong. MAD applies. If either side (NATO or Russia) uses a nuclear weapon on the other side it will quickly escalate to full scale nuclear war in which there will be no winners worldwide, period! So no Putin is only afraid of what NATO can do to him in so far as the consequences for the entire world and he’s no nutter.
BUT I agree with John Mearsheimer that if Russia became existentially threatened (which they are far from being right now) but would be if Ukraine actually regained all the territory in the east because I doubt they would stop there, then they could conceivable use nukes against Ukraine without causing further escalation because Ukraine don’t have nuclear weapons and are not part of NATO, plus NATO would be absolutely aware that if they responded in any way against Russia a full scale nuclear exchange would occur.

Last edited 11 months ago by Malcolm Robbins
Kathleen Lillard
Kathleen Lillard
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

upvote. (click didn’t work)

John Croteau
John Croteau
11 months ago
Reply to  J Bryant

Putin’s generals will not comply with any order to deploy nukes of any kind. They know it’s signing their death sentence, either as a war casualty or in a war crime tribunal. Russia cannot “win” this war, so it’s a matter of people saving their own necks.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago
Reply to  J Bryant

Putin’s problem is that if he uses any nukes, NATO will just use its conventional forces to destroy what’s left of Russia’s military.
His air force is particularly degraded.
That’s why he’s kept his nuclear sabre-rattling in check. He’s more afraid of what NATO can do to him than losing the war.
Given the latter, he knows he might still survive. Lose his entire military, and he’s toast.

John Croteau
John Croteau
11 months ago
Reply to  J Bryant

Putin’s generals will not comply with any order to deploy nukes of any kind. They know it’s signing their death sentence, either as a war casualty or in a war crime tribunal. Russia cannot “win” this war, so it’s a matter of people saving their own necks.

Michael McElwee
Michael McElwee
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

We are sadly all hampered by a legacy of lying by successive American administrations re all matters war related. We must rely on the Daniel Ellsbergs and Seymour Hershes (ph) of the world to leak the truth to us. I would include Scott Ritter amongst the leakers.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

Since the latter two have no evidence other than their unsupporteed musings (due to senility in Seymour’s case) rather laughable.
And Scott Ritter does not “leak” anything.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

Since the latter two have no evidence other than their unsupporteed musings (due to senility in Seymour’s case) rather laughable.
And Scott Ritter does not “leak” anything.

J Bryant
J Bryant
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

I agree with your assessment of the Russian military. It’s fashionable now to sneer at the notion the Putin might use nukes if Ukraine makes significant advances, but I believe he might if he feels cornered. Then the terrible logic of nuclear weapons takes hold. The West has threatened him with massive retribution if he uses a single nuke, so if he decides to use one why not use more and deal a heavy blow to Ukraine’s military and infrastructure? We’ve all become a little complacent about this war, imo.

Michael McElwee
Michael McElwee
11 months ago
Reply to  Daniel P

We are sadly all hampered by a legacy of lying by successive American administrations re all matters war related. We must rely on the Daniel Ellsbergs and Seymour Hershes (ph) of the world to leak the truth to us. I would include Scott Ritter amongst the leakers.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago
Reply to  Emil Castelli

The Conspiracy Theory of History!
Everything is manipulated by “Dark Forces,” which only a few of the illuminati (like Scot and Col. MacGregor) can discern! The rest of us who foolishly read actual news outlets are but dupes.
So you have tapped into Secret Knowledge that is unavailable to the rest of us! The leaders of huge businesses in Europe and America are just puppets in the hands of the Globalists, and go against their own economic interests for the sake of…Hillary Clinton!
…or is it Hunter Biden?
I keep forgetting.
BTW, did you get all this through the Kabbala–or a Ouiji Board?

Simon Blanchard
Simon Blanchard
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

None of which is to say that the Americans don’t spot a business opportunity in the post conflict reconstruction.

Peter B
Peter B
11 months ago

So what ? They (the Americans) didn’t cause the conflict. Someone has to clean up the mess afterwards. Russia should pay for it. They caused it.

stephen archer
stephen archer
11 months ago
Reply to  Peter B

The only way Russia will be able to pay is through free oil and gas with the revenues charged by the importers going to Ukraine.

John Croteau
John Croteau
11 months ago
Reply to  stephen archer

Kind of like the first Gulf War


John Croteau
John Croteau
11 months ago
Reply to  stephen archer

Kind of like the first Gulf War


stephen archer
stephen archer
11 months ago
Reply to  Peter B

The only way Russia will be able to pay is through free oil and gas with the revenues charged by the importers going to Ukraine.

Peter B
Peter B
11 months ago

So what ? They (the Americans) didn’t cause the conflict. Someone has to clean up the mess afterwards. Russia should pay for it. They caused it.

Dominic A
Dominic A
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

Indeed. Conspiracy theories have great psychological appeal as they deliver emotional relief where there are problems with the self (shaky self-esteem/narcissism); others (zenophobia, paranoia), and the World (epistemic matters; e.g. the need for certainty in an uncertain world). Specifically, conspiracy theories can supply certainty, in response to overwhelming anxiety (a sure path when one feels lost); prestige, where there are self-esteem problems (‘I possess important information most people do not have) & ability (‘I have the power to reject “experts” and expose hidden cabals’); vindication when one feels besieged (my ‘enemies’ are wrong, morally, scientifically)’; connection when one feels alone; and liberation:, ‘If I imagine my foes are completely malevolent, then I can use any tactic I want’.

Judy Englander
Judy Englander
11 months ago
Reply to  Dominic A

Exactly.

Judy Englander
Judy Englander
11 months ago
Reply to  Dominic A

Exactly.

Malcolm Robbins
Malcolm Robbins
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

You clearly aren’t aware just how propagandised the western media has become in recent years and even more so since Covid 19. John Mearsheimer claims that the last time the west was subject to this much propaganda was in the build up to WW1. You turkeys in Europe are going down the gurgler big time. Good luck.

Last edited 11 months ago by Malcolm Robbins
martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

Wheareas people in Moscow will be dining on T-90 tanks.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

Wheareas people in Moscow will be dining on T-90 tanks.

Michael McElwee
Michael McElwee
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

So, there is no such thing as a conspiracy? All conspiracy theories are lunacy? Connecting dots is the work of a fool?

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

About sums it up.

Kathleen Lillard
Kathleen Lillard
11 months ago

Conspiracy is simply people meeting privately to plan something they think will benefit them. Wherever there is competition for power or wealth in business or politics, naturally there is conspiracy. The word can be misused of course, but that doesn’t cancel the ubiquity of the practice. It’s how histories are made.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago

About sums it up.

Kathleen Lillard
Kathleen Lillard
11 months ago

Conspiracy is simply people meeting privately to plan something they think will benefit them. Wherever there is competition for power or wealth in business or politics, naturally there is conspiracy. The word can be misused of course, but that doesn’t cancel the ubiquity of the practice. It’s how histories are made.

Simon Blanchard
Simon Blanchard
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

None of which is to say that the Americans don’t spot a business opportunity in the post conflict reconstruction.

Dominic A
Dominic A
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

Indeed. Conspiracy theories have great psychological appeal as they deliver emotional relief where there are problems with the self (shaky self-esteem/narcissism); others (zenophobia, paranoia), and the World (epistemic matters; e.g. the need for certainty in an uncertain world). Specifically, conspiracy theories can supply certainty, in response to overwhelming anxiety (a sure path when one feels lost); prestige, where there are self-esteem problems (‘I possess important information most people do not have) & ability (‘I have the power to reject “experts” and expose hidden cabals’); vindication when one feels besieged (my ‘enemies’ are wrong, morally, scientifically)’; connection when one feels alone; and liberation:, ‘If I imagine my foes are completely malevolent, then I can use any tactic I want’.

Malcolm Robbins
Malcolm Robbins
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

You clearly aren’t aware just how propagandised the western media has become in recent years and even more so since Covid 19. John Mearsheimer claims that the last time the west was subject to this much propaganda was in the build up to WW1. You turkeys in Europe are going down the gurgler big time. Good luck.

Last edited 11 months ago by Malcolm Robbins
Michael McElwee
Michael McElwee
11 months ago
Reply to  martin logan

So, there is no such thing as a conspiracy? All conspiracy theories are lunacy? Connecting dots is the work of a fool?

Jane H
Jane H
11 months ago
Reply to  Emil Castelli

‘And finally – Biden just Gave Ukraine to Blackrock and Vanguard to be their personal fiefdoms and cows to milk – of the endless streams of money the rebuilding will allow to be pillaged. Ukraine is now owned by Global Finance!‘

Spot on!

Dominic A
Dominic A
11 months ago
Reply to  Jane H

Just like the Americans did after they won in Europe, Japan, Grenada, Panama, Afghanistan, Iran and Korea – took over the country, ran it for their own ends, made money from it, and never gave it back.

Peter Joy
Peter Joy
11 months ago
Reply to  Dominic A

Only a few years ago did Britain finish paying off its Great War debts to the USA. But the closer analogy to the potential fate of Ukraine, courtesy of Blackrock and Goldman Sachs, would be the fate of Egypt, after Khedive borrowed more money from Paris and London bankers than his people could ever repay.

Last edited 11 months ago by Peter Joy
Dominic A
Dominic A
11 months ago
Reply to  Peter Joy

Are you saying they ‘helped’ us out to make money off us; or that we should not have borrowed it; or that they should have waived the debt?

Dominic A
Dominic A
11 months ago
Reply to  Peter Joy

Are you saying they ‘helped’ us out to make money off us; or that we should not have borrowed it; or that they should have waived the debt?

Jane H
Jane H
11 months ago
Reply to  Dominic A

And Iraq too

Peter Joy
Peter Joy
11 months ago
Reply to  Dominic A

Only a few years ago did Britain finish paying off its Great War debts to the USA. But the closer analogy to the potential fate of Ukraine, courtesy of Blackrock and Goldman Sachs, would be the fate of Egypt, after Khedive borrowed more money from Paris and London bankers than his people could ever repay.

Last edited 11 months ago by Peter Joy
Jane H
Jane H
11 months ago
Reply to  Dominic A

And Iraq too

Dominic A
Dominic A
11 months ago
Reply to  Jane H

Just like the Americans did after they won in Europe, Japan, Grenada, Panama, Afghanistan, Iran and Korea – took over the country, ran it for their own ends, made money from it, and never gave it back.

Anthony Havens
Anthony Havens
11 months ago
Reply to  Emil Castelli

“Ukraine loses 7 men for every Russian..”
Have you been out drinking vodka with Dmitry Peskov..?

Peter Joy
Peter Joy
11 months ago
Reply to  Anthony Havens

How do you know he’s wrong?

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago
Reply to  Peter Joy

Because attacking forces always suffer more casualties initially than defenders.
It only changes when the attackers get in open country and surround the defenders.
And Ukraine seems a lot closer to that now than Russia. Hear about their winter offensive?

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago
Reply to  Peter Joy

Because attacking forces always suffer more casualties initially than defenders.
It only changes when the attackers get in open country and surround the defenders.
And Ukraine seems a lot closer to that now than Russia. Hear about their winter offensive?

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago
Reply to  Anthony Havens

No, Dmitri Medvedev.
Peskov lies, but is still sane.

Peter Joy
Peter Joy
11 months ago
Reply to  Anthony Havens

How do you know he’s wrong?

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago
Reply to  Anthony Havens

No, Dmitri Medvedev.
Peskov lies, but is still sane.

Elena R.
Elena R.
11 months ago
Reply to  Emil Castelli

better even, travel to Russia. Mind that you smartphone will be checked. High chances you will end up at a pre-trial detention center where you will have ample time to contemplate upon evil and will be fed an ultimate truth 24/7

Daniel P
Daniel P
11 months ago
Reply to  Emil Castelli

I do not necessarily disagree with your second point.
As to your first…well…if the Russians were so well equipped and trained as you describe, then they should have won last year.
I do not think that Putin has been holding back to minimize collateral damage.
No, I think the Russian army has some of the same issues the Soviet army did. Lots of equipment and men but the equipment is badly maintained and the troops poorly trained except for small special units. If they are truly fielding T60s and they are using large numbers of conscripts and pushing them into battle, then the Russians are weaker than they appear to be. But then, so were the Soviets.
If it comes down to a test of wills, my money is on the Ukrainians.

martin logan
martin logan
11 months ago
Reply to  Emil Castelli

The Conspiracy Theory of History!
Everything is manipulated by “Dark Forces,” which only a few of the illuminati (like Scot and Col. MacGregor) can discern! The rest of us who foolishly read actual news outlets are but dupes.
So you have tapped into Secret Knowledge that is unavailable to the rest of us! The leaders of huge businesses in Europe and America are just puppets in the hands of the Globalists, and go against their own economic interests for the sake of…Hillary Clinton!
…or is it Hunter Biden?
I keep forgetting.
BTW, did you get all this through the Kabbala–or a Ouiji Board?

Jane H
Jane H
11 months ago
Reply to  Emil Castelli

‘And finally – Biden just Gave Ukraine to Blackrock and Vanguard to be their personal fiefdoms and cows to milk – of the endless streams of money the rebuilding will allow to be pillaged. Ukraine is now owned by Global Finance!‘

Spot on!

Anthony Havens
Anthony Havens
11 months ago
Reply to  Emil Castelli

“Ukraine loses 7 men for every Russian..”
Have you been out drinking vodka with Dmitry Peskov..?

Elena R.
Elena R.
11 months ago
Reply to  Emil Castelli

better even, travel to Russia. Mind that you smartphone will be checked. High chances you will end up at a pre-trial detention center where you will have ample time to contemplate upon evil and will be fed an ultimate truth 24/7

Emil Castelli
Emil Castelli
11 months ago

War Porn and confusing what one wished was true, and what is true wile repeating the ‘Official Agenda..

Russia is currently 5 times Ukraine’s population, has 5 – 10 times the artillery and unlimited ammunition (this is a war of artiliary as they sit out of range of eachother and just shell.) This is a slaughter. Ukraine loses 7 men for every Russian.

You are watching Biden and Boris Proxy War completely destroy Ukraine. This Hideously EVIL was is entirely engineered – it has nothing to do with Ukrainian freedom or democracy – it is Globalism weirdness, sheer $$$$ to Military Industrial, Corruption – every one of the $113 billion gets clipped a dozen times on the way till very little gets there. And finally – Biden just Gave Ukraine to Blackrock and Vanguard to be their personal fiefdoms and cows to milk – of the endless streams of money the rebuilding will allow to be pillaged. Ukraine is now owned by Global Finance!

I appearently cannot link here, but on Youtube go to Colonel Macgregor, Alexander Mercouris, Scott Ritter. to get something other than this agenda propaganda

On Rumble (the uncensored youtube) go to Redacted News.