It was the first night of Blackpool’s Illuminations, when seven miles of promenade are transformed into a parade of glitter set against the ink-black Irish Sea. The traffic had poured in from across Lancashire to crawl, bumper to bumper, beneath the dazzling arrays. Yet by the following morning, the tourists had disappeared, and despite the September day of brilliant sunshine, the promenade was almost empty — apart from the rough sleepers.
From her bench facing the sea, one elderly lady rearranged her sleeping bag and sat up to light her first cigarette of the day; another rough sleeper was angry as he stumbled, yelling into the waves: “Yer English, yer oughter to be ashamed of yersain.”
He has a point. Britain’s biggest seaside resort is home to a sharp and uncomfortable paradox: while it accommodates millions of visitors every year, several of its wards are among the most deprived in the country and with the worst life expectancy. This is a place which, for all its beauty and associations with pleasure and fun, results in shortened lives blighted by debt, ill health and substance abuse.
When William Beveridge set out to eradicate five “Giant Evils” from Britain, “want” was first on his list. In the early Forties, as the social reformer gathered his data and prepared his plans, this priority seemed straightforward: people needed basics such as food, shelter, warmth and clothing. His plans for a social security system “from cradle to grave” would ensure that no one would go short. But 80 years on, Blackpool provides a grim example of deprivation not seen since the Thirties. Food banks report a 54% increase in the need for food parcels in the last year, dependence on charity has become normal for hundreds of families in the town, and the rise in energy prices brings particular hardship in a place with poor housing stock, well-known for its bitter winds and rain sweeping in off the sea.
Further up the coast, in Morecambe, a similar story is playing out. The North Lancashire Citizen Advice Bureau (CAB) has seen a massive rise in clients desperate for help — in some places, a staggering 566% increase in the last year. The most common issue is struggling with utility bills, followed closely by problems with debt. Households get caught in a pattern of borrowing and relying on charity because levels of benefit are not sufficient, suggests Joanna Young, the CAB’s head of research for North Lancashire. She adds that their clients talk of how one “mini-crisis” — it can be as routine as the need for a new pair of school shoes — can set a family back for months. Precarity has become a way of life.
What would Beveridge make of places such as Blackpool and Morecambe? No doubt he would view his dream as a failure, despite a huge increase in the country’s GDP in the intervening 80 years. But what would also have surprised Beveridge are the causes of that poverty, and the fact that at least some can be traced right back to gaps and mistakes in his original plans.
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SubscribeNow we have illegal migrants sent to seaside hotels, who are living on benefits and certainly won’t make seaside places any better but add more misery to seaside resort life for those already in dire straights.
They’re keeping hotels running. Why not give the refugees ( they’re not illegal migrants ) money or tokens to spend in the local shops? Would reinvigorate local business.
They are not refugees they come from a country that is not at war. What ever reason they come here in their thousands only time will tell.
The councils of seaside resorts have not got enough money to look after the local community without them being able to keep those who are coming into Dover illegally and putting them in hotels.
They obviously don’t come just from one country, but it is true that some countries are not at war, such as Albania, though they may be very poor and poorly governed.
Britain is poorly governed, too. No wonder so many people want to leave. Albanians evidently don’t get the true picture of life in the UK before they come. They may as well stay where they are.
Britain is poorly governed, too. No wonder so many people want to leave. Albanians evidently don’t get the true picture of life in the UK before they come. They may as well stay where they are.
They obviously don’t come just from one country, but it is true that some countries are not at war, such as Albania, though they may be very poor and poorly governed.
Naive.
You give them your money.
Most of them came here for handouts, it’d be a pity if you let them down.
They are not refugees they come from a country that is not at war. What ever reason they come here in their thousands only time will tell.
The councils of seaside resorts have not got enough money to look after the local community without them being able to keep those who are coming into Dover illegally and putting them in hotels.
Naive.
You give them your money.
Most of them came here for handouts, it’d be a pity if you let them down.
I worked in both Torquay and Exmouth in the 1990s, and lived in Plymouth. Under a vague sheen of seaside-holidayness both Torquay and Exmouth were plagued with drug problems, mental health issues, alcohol trouble, [very] young mums, and corruption. I can’t imagine they’re any better now.
Plymouth, as a city, was hard. But it never pretended to be anything else – a naval city through and through.
In the USA, Benton Harbor, Michigan was a world famous resort town, home of the House of David and their businesses.
When Indiana residents found out welfare benefits were much more generous, a huge influx of poor Indiana Black folks turned Benton Harbor into a desolate crime ridden ghetto virtually overnight.
The mayor was on TV when I was staying in a hotel on business, and said he could shoot a cannon down Main St. with no fear of hurting anyone.
This has since extended up the coast.
I guess things are the same all over.
In the USA, Benton Harbor, Michigan was a world famous resort town, home of the House of David and their businesses.
When Indiana residents found out welfare benefits were much more generous, a huge influx of poor Indiana Black folks turned Benton Harbor into a desolate crime ridden ghetto virtually overnight.
The mayor was on TV when I was staying in a hotel on business, and said he could shoot a cannon down Main St. with no fear of hurting anyone.
This has since extended up the coast.
I guess things are the same all over.
Not to mention importing diphtheria…
And COVID-22.
And COVID-22.
Yes, they need somewhere to lay their heads, and take showers. I wish towns would pay out for tiny houses, or renting hotels. However, the people need to be able to clean their spaces, and someone has to pay liability insurance if there are rapes or stabbings.
The govt. seems prepared to do this for refugees, so I wish they would do for people who have got themselves mentally off the rails at a point in their lives.
Handouts of bananas with slogans, one Christmas or Thanksgiving meal, or fruit gummies and cereal bars are not going to change lives. They need shelter they can count on, showers, and nutritious food.
Correct. I live in one of the towns mentioned and agree completely with the analysis. The preponderance of old people, untrained ‘carers’ and care homes, together with a dearth of GPs because they move to better places creates a horrible decay. I’m moving out soon…
They’re keeping hotels running. Why not give the refugees ( they’re not illegal migrants ) money or tokens to spend in the local shops? Would reinvigorate local business.
I worked in both Torquay and Exmouth in the 1990s, and lived in Plymouth. Under a vague sheen of seaside-holidayness both Torquay and Exmouth were plagued with drug problems, mental health issues, alcohol trouble, [very] young mums, and corruption. I can’t imagine they’re any better now.
Plymouth, as a city, was hard. But it never pretended to be anything else – a naval city through and through.
Not to mention importing diphtheria…
Yes, they need somewhere to lay their heads, and take showers. I wish towns would pay out for tiny houses, or renting hotels. However, the people need to be able to clean their spaces, and someone has to pay liability insurance if there are rapes or stabbings.
The govt. seems prepared to do this for refugees, so I wish they would do for people who have got themselves mentally off the rails at a point in their lives.
Handouts of bananas with slogans, one Christmas or Thanksgiving meal, or fruit gummies and cereal bars are not going to change lives. They need shelter they can count on, showers, and nutritious food.
Correct. I live in one of the towns mentioned and agree completely with the analysis. The preponderance of old people, untrained ‘carers’ and care homes, together with a dearth of GPs because they move to better places creates a horrible decay. I’m moving out soon…
Now we have illegal migrants sent to seaside hotels, who are living on benefits and certainly won’t make seaside places any better but add more misery to seaside resort life for those already in dire straights.
Tories, Labour and LibDems to the middle-class: “You’re screwed!”
Tories, Labour and LibDems to the working-class: “You’re even more screwed!!”
Tories, Labour and LibDems to veterans living on the streets with PTSD: “Guess what?!….”
Tories, Labour and LibDems to illegal immigrants: “You can have an upgrade because all the four star hotels are full now.”
Tories, Labour and LibDems to the working-class: “Don’t look at the rich ripping the country off for billions! LOOK! Some refugees!”
And you fall for it.
‘some’ illegal economic queue jumpers? 40,000 + this year and counting.
What is an illegal economic queue jumper? Someone who wants a job more than someone else? What do you mean illegal? Refugees are not illegal. Those who are not refugees get deported, or would do if the government actually invested in the immigration system. Most of the boat people are refugees btw and are not economic migrants. And are you aware how small that 40,000 is in the overall figures? https://www.migrationwatchuk.org/news/2022/08/25/immigration-at-all-time-record-level-with-record-1-1-million-visas-issued-to-come-and-live-in-the-uk
Try as you might, mass migration will never be anything but evil, either for those wrenched from their homes, or those being invaded.
Try as you might, mass migration will never be anything but evil, either for those wrenched from their homes, or those being invaded.
What is an illegal economic queue jumper? Someone who wants a job more than someone else? What do you mean illegal? Refugees are not illegal. Those who are not refugees get deported, or would do if the government actually invested in the immigration system. Most of the boat people are refugees btw and are not economic migrants. And are you aware how small that 40,000 is in the overall figures? https://www.migrationwatchuk.org/news/2022/08/25/immigration-at-all-time-record-level-with-record-1-1-million-visas-issued-to-come-and-live-in-the-uk
Rich ripping the country off. What a dishonest old trope
Successive governments have let the population down. Lack of investment and billions of pounds squirrelled away into offshore accounts have made this rich country into a very unequal country. Our rulers use their rightwing media to convince the public that all our woes are to do with the poor and unfortunate souls of society and nothing to do with their greed. The worst thing of all is that people believe it just like many on here do. Disappointing.
Hardly a new phenomenon, though. Ever read Oliver Twist?
Hardly a new phenomenon, though. Ever read Oliver Twist?
Huh your new PM is richer than the royals, then his wife …
Of course those last two PMs failed in performance ?
We used to tar & feather Tories in the USA
Not a trope, a simple fact.
Things will not change until the politicians agree to have houses in their neighborhoods available to refugees or people who ended up on the streets.
it would also help if whole charity were given. That is, responsibility for a family or group, rather than attending charity dinners that actually give a pitiful amount of money to charities. cereal bars and fruit rolls and bananas with slogans should also not be seen as acceptable.
The charitable dinner folks should give the cost of a Givenchy dress or two to support families, one at a time. Once stable, they can contribute, if people provide jobs.
But they are, and Mass Migration is how.
It would not happen if they didn’t derive benefit from it.
Successful people are not inherently evil, but it is not vaguely unusual.
Most people got their wealth the old fashioned way:
They stole it.
Successive governments have let the population down. Lack of investment and billions of pounds squirrelled away into offshore accounts have made this rich country into a very unequal country. Our rulers use their rightwing media to convince the public that all our woes are to do with the poor and unfortunate souls of society and nothing to do with their greed. The worst thing of all is that people believe it just like many on here do. Disappointing.
Huh your new PM is richer than the royals, then his wife …
Of course those last two PMs failed in performance ?
We used to tar & feather Tories in the USA
Not a trope, a simple fact.
Things will not change until the politicians agree to have houses in their neighborhoods available to refugees or people who ended up on the streets.
it would also help if whole charity were given. That is, responsibility for a family or group, rather than attending charity dinners that actually give a pitiful amount of money to charities. cereal bars and fruit rolls and bananas with slogans should also not be seen as acceptable.
The charitable dinner folks should give the cost of a Givenchy dress or two to support families, one at a time. Once stable, they can contribute, if people provide jobs.
But they are, and Mass Migration is how.
It would not happen if they didn’t derive benefit from it.
Successful people are not inherently evil, but it is not vaguely unusual.
Most people got their wealth the old fashioned way:
They stole it.
It’s why the ruling class rule… divide people.
I just don’t understand why people go on these tangents when you posted the whole answer in one concise sentence.
I just don’t understand why people go on these tangents when you posted the whole answer in one concise sentence.
As you related to Nye Bevan by any chance?
And how are they doing it?
By mass separation of immigrants from their heritage and divorcing citizens from theirs and giving them a polyglot in return, comprised of various migrant heritage and powered by state sponsored miscegenation, that’s how.
‘some’ illegal economic queue jumpers? 40,000 + this year and counting.
Rich ripping the country off. What a dishonest old trope
It’s why the ruling class rule… divide people.
As you related to Nye Bevan by any chance?
And how are they doing it?
By mass separation of immigrants from their heritage and divorcing citizens from theirs and giving them a polyglot in return, comprised of various migrant heritage and powered by state sponsored miscegenation, that’s how.
Tories, Labour and LibDems to the working-class: “Don’t look at the rich ripping the country off for billions! LOOK! Some refugees!”
And you fall for it.
Tories, Labour and LibDems to the middle-class: “You’re screwed!”
Tories, Labour and LibDems to the working-class: “You’re even more screwed!!”
Tories, Labour and LibDems to veterans living on the streets with PTSD: “Guess what?!….”
Tories, Labour and LibDems to illegal immigrants: “You can have an upgrade because all the four star hotels are full now.”
Beveridge identified idleness, but this ‘evil’ has been suppressed in the cradle to the grave welfare industry, derided as ‘workfare’ and ‘victim shaming’. What Beveridge failed to anticipate, just as in the US with the Great Society, was that in removing responsibility from those most able to discharge it, people themselves, to a remote and disinterested ‘state’, the safety net of welfarism would turn into idleness and dependency.
On the subject of Beveridge “… his great achievement, the founding of the NHS.”
Some might say it was the worst disaster ever foisted on the British people
“The road to Hell is paved……………..”
…….with good intentions.
…….with good intentions.
The NHS was brilliant for generations, it’s crumbling now – as is everything. You have to be very strange to hate it though.
“The road to Hell is paved……………..”
The NHS was brilliant for generations, it’s crumbling now – as is everything. You have to be very strange to hate it though.
The article says the poor are often working. Low pay in the service industry is a big problem.
On the subject of Beveridge “… his great achievement, the founding of the NHS.”
Some might say it was the worst disaster ever foisted on the British people
The article says the poor are often working. Low pay in the service industry is a big problem.
Beveridge identified idleness, but this ‘evil’ has been suppressed in the cradle to the grave welfare industry, derided as ‘workfare’ and ‘victim shaming’. What Beveridge failed to anticipate, just as in the US with the Great Society, was that in removing responsibility from those most able to discharge it, people themselves, to a remote and disinterested ‘state’, the safety net of welfarism would turn into idleness and dependency.
There are rough sleepers in seaside towns and inequalities exist, true. Some rough sleepers become so because of their bad circumstances and some because of their poor choices.
But moaning about it achieves nothing. Are you prepared to compel rough sleepers to be housed in camps, barracks, or workhouses elsewhere? If not then you lack the moral strength to resolve the problem. Other solutions are possible but merely increasing benefits is unlikely to have a major impact… and none of the major parties appear to give a damn.
There are rough sleepers in seaside towns and inequalities exist, true. Some rough sleepers become so because of their bad circumstances and some because of their poor choices.
But moaning about it achieves nothing. Are you prepared to compel rough sleepers to be housed in camps, barracks, or workhouses elsewhere? If not then you lack the moral strength to resolve the problem. Other solutions are possible but merely increasing benefits is unlikely to have a major impact… and none of the major parties appear to give a damn.
I know Blackpool, I grew up in the fishing port of Fleetwood just miles away. Spent my teenage years enjoying the entertainment and had my first job at the Bank Hey Street Woolworths. These seaside towns were very robust, people had jobs and pride, until cheap overseas travel (and the decline of out-of-season industries to support the winter economy) killed the seasonal hospitality businesses. Remember when the major political parties and the TUC held their annual conferences in Blackpool? The place was smart and energetic. And the homeless and drug-addicted haven’t found their way to Blackpool by choice, they have been placed there, in their thousands, by councils far from the coast, using the emptied bed and breakfast accommodation now bought up by absent landlords.
The elderly population in Blackpool and other seaside towns represent the best of the generations who worked and built these places, and they should not be treated as a burden now. Indeed it is the younger generations in these areas who are often sickest and most dependent on state help. But there are always pockets of good people – the council, many community groups – trying to keep people from wasting their lives.
I know Blackpool, I grew up in the fishing port of Fleetwood just miles away. Spent my teenage years enjoying the entertainment and had my first job at the Bank Hey Street Woolworths. These seaside towns were very robust, people had jobs and pride, until cheap overseas travel (and the decline of out-of-season industries to support the winter economy) killed the seasonal hospitality businesses. Remember when the major political parties and the TUC held their annual conferences in Blackpool? The place was smart and energetic. And the homeless and drug-addicted haven’t found their way to Blackpool by choice, they have been placed there, in their thousands, by councils far from the coast, using the emptied bed and breakfast accommodation now bought up by absent landlords.
The elderly population in Blackpool and other seaside towns represent the best of the generations who worked and built these places, and they should not be treated as a burden now. Indeed it is the younger generations in these areas who are often sickest and most dependent on state help. But there are always pockets of good people – the council, many community groups – trying to keep people from wasting their lives.
This is the kind of ‘Gosh I’ve just noticed that the Pope’s a Catholic’ shock revelation you get when you let journalists pretend to be academics.
Mixing up the problems of coastal communities with very different demographics and economics just because you’ve noticed that the road ends when it gets to the sea.
Are academics any better?
Neither appear to get out much.
No, but The 2nd Smartest Man in the World is. He is hosted on Substack and he answers accurately many of the mysteries that confound people on this and other boards.
Check him out, he can use support, and offers subscriptions but doesn’t block anyone for not paying, not even comments because he is spreading truth, not turning a buck on censorship refugees.
And he wouldn’t want these coastal folk blocked from finding out who is manipulating them and why.
Who is he?
Who is he?
Neither appear to get out much.
No, but The 2nd Smartest Man in the World is. He is hosted on Substack and he answers accurately many of the mysteries that confound people on this and other boards.
Check him out, he can use support, and offers subscriptions but doesn’t block anyone for not paying, not even comments because he is spreading truth, not turning a buck on censorship refugees.
And he wouldn’t want these coastal folk blocked from finding out who is manipulating them and why.
I still remember the last mass-poverty safari in 2016 following the ‘shocking’ Brexit vote. In enough six years the cycle will repeat again.
A great book: Poverty Safari by Darren McGarvey. Puts into words what working class people experience every day, but what those in power just do not seem to comprehend, no matter how many safaris they venture on.
They comprehend just fine, it’s all intentional and they have been playing this game for a millennia.
No money means no power, simple as that.
They comprehend just fine, it’s all intentional and they have been playing this game for a millennia.
No money means no power, simple as that.
A great book: Poverty Safari by Darren McGarvey. Puts into words what working class people experience every day, but what those in power just do not seem to comprehend, no matter how many safaris they venture on.
Are academics any better?
I still remember the last mass-poverty safari in 2016 following the ‘shocking’ Brexit vote. In enough six years the cycle will repeat again.
This is the kind of ‘Gosh I’ve just noticed that the Pope’s a Catholic’ shock revelation you get when you let journalists pretend to be academics.
Mixing up the problems of coastal communities with very different demographics and economics just because you’ve noticed that the road ends when it gets to the sea.
Intriguing to imagine what Beveridge would have made of the vast ‘issues’ of relationship breakdown and substance abuse in driving the rise of poverty and despair in these grim areas – or whether he would have even understood those terms. Autre temps…
I imagine Beveridge was aware of Hogarth’s Gin Lane and the English history of substance abuse.
He would have been a lot blunter than that (was my point).
I don’t like the superior tone, ‘English history of substance abuse’ we like to have a good time, heard the saying work hard, play hard? If you’d been raised in margate or ramsgate, you’d understand the appeal of a gin.
You have your fair share of problems too Mr usa, at least we’re not all hooked on opiates and painkillers, didn’t your own big pharma cause that? Wasn’t Afghanistan an American opiate war? All the people in Afghanistan growing poppies for the Americans on the hush? Then they decided they could cut out the middle man and you lost control. Part of the reason they haven’t enough wheat is because they all moved to cultivating poppies.
Quote: in October 2001 poppies were grown on around 74,000 hectares – 285 square miles.
The new figures showed production had increased more than four-fold in 15 years: now opium was being grown on 328,000 hectares – 1,266 square miles.
Source: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-47861444.amp
Brewing alcohol is as old as the hills, you read the iliad? Doesn’t noah get trollied in his vineyard in the bible and God tells him off? As are recreational drugs, history of substance abuse is not unique to England, neither is the brewing of alcohol, these things become problems in all places where they are the ONLY escape. You go visit Margate or Ramsgate, Chatham or Stroud if you’re feeling brave. Where hope goes to die. I spent a fair amount of time down there as a teenager, worrying my mum, no jobs, no hope, everything apart from £1 shops and betting agencies was either shut down or falling down. It’s probably only got worse. You’d have to be half cut to walk round and not immediately feel the urge to jump off the closest building….
These places need enormous investment, they look like no one’s bothered since 1900. And they probably haven’t.
Chatham and for that matter Stroud were sacrificed in 1984 to placate the wretched Scotch, and thus keep the worthless base at Rosyth open!
There is absolutely no need for such a base so far north, it is simply a strategic extravagance.
It had a use in 1911 when we faced the Kaiser and even later when we still used Scapa Flow,* but NO longer.
(* Until the sad sinking of H.M.S. Royal Oak, by Gunther Prien & U-47.)
American here. Our big pharma produced the supply but not the demand. If nobody wanted opioids except for legitimate medical purposes, they wouldn’t get produced. Meanwhile, big pharma produces, at a very affordable price, the medications that keep me alive and reasonably healthy.
We have our coal mining regions, you have those plus I guess seaside resorts. Bundoran, Ireland isn’t looking too good either.
I don’t know about Brits, but Americans used to migrate in search of opportunity when things dried up in their place of origin. That is how California got 40,000,000 people. Now that the unemployed are paid to stay in place as long as they remain unemployed, we’ve stopped moving. The average American used to move house every 5 years, now it’s every 11. The social cost of this stagnation is unbelievable.
From the source I provided above:
The White House declared it a national public health emergency in October 2017. More than two million Americans are addicted to opioids, and opioid overdoses have become the leading cause of death in America, ahead of car crashes and gun violence.
The American epidemic began with prescription drugs but, as the rules around prescribing opioids were tightened, addicts had been increasingly turning to heroin, as well as synthetic opioids like Fentanyl.
Your big pharma actively encouraged prescription of those strong opioid painkillers, often in cases where they were unnecessary, then took them away, that’s what I mean by them causing your opiate and heroin problems.
The demand was often created by doctors in the pockets of the Pharma industry. Moving house isnt the same as moving city. People moved house more within cities because the housing was cheaper. And a good percentage of that 40M are immigrants. So almost everything is wrong there.
From the source I provided above:
The White House declared it a national public health emergency in October 2017. More than two million Americans are addicted to opioids, and opioid overdoses have become the leading cause of death in America, ahead of car crashes and gun violence.
The American epidemic began with prescription drugs but, as the rules around prescribing opioids were tightened, addicts had been increasingly turning to heroin, as well as synthetic opioids like Fentanyl.
Your big pharma actively encouraged prescription of those strong opioid painkillers, often in cases where they were unnecessary, then took them away, that’s what I mean by them causing your opiate and heroin problems.
The demand was often created by doctors in the pockets of the Pharma industry. Moving house isnt the same as moving city. People moved house more within cities because the housing was cheaper. And a good percentage of that 40M are immigrants. So almost everything is wrong there.
Pharma? Britain came out untouched by the Death Jab?
There is zero superiority expressed by staying on topic, and guess what the topic is?
Hint: Not Outer Mongolia.
You seem to have a chip on your shoulder.
Chatham and for that matter Stroud were sacrificed in 1984 to placate the wretched Scotch, and thus keep the worthless base at Rosyth open!
There is absolutely no need for such a base so far north, it is simply a strategic extravagance.
It had a use in 1911 when we faced the Kaiser and even later when we still used Scapa Flow,* but NO longer.
(* Until the sad sinking of H.M.S. Royal Oak, by Gunther Prien & U-47.)
American here. Our big pharma produced the supply but not the demand. If nobody wanted opioids except for legitimate medical purposes, they wouldn’t get produced. Meanwhile, big pharma produces, at a very affordable price, the medications that keep me alive and reasonably healthy.
We have our coal mining regions, you have those plus I guess seaside resorts. Bundoran, Ireland isn’t looking too good either.
I don’t know about Brits, but Americans used to migrate in search of opportunity when things dried up in their place of origin. That is how California got 40,000,000 people. Now that the unemployed are paid to stay in place as long as they remain unemployed, we’ve stopped moving. The average American used to move house every 5 years, now it’s every 11. The social cost of this stagnation is unbelievable.
Pharma? Britain came out untouched by the Death Jab?
There is zero superiority expressed by staying on topic, and guess what the topic is?
Hint: Not Outer Mongolia.
You seem to have a chip on your shoulder.
I don’t think the English are particularly noted for substance abuse. The Russians and the Irish are particularly noted for alcoholism, and the USA for opiate abuse, and cocaine, and Jamaca for smoking weed, but I don’t think that substance abuse is particularly what people think of when they think of the English. They think of the atrocities of colonialization and are appalled that so few Brits feel any remorse about what their country did to so many other parts of the world.
Bloody hell another high horsed American. You lot just keep coming.
What utter b*llocks, where did you learn such tosh?
If I may quote from a renowned Spanish philosopher, who had the misfortune to teach at Harvard, one Georges Santayana, this is what he had to say about the British Empire in 1912 :
“Never since the heroic days of Greece has the world had such a sweet, just, boyish master. It will be a black day for the human race when scientific blackguards, conspirators, churls, and fanatics manage to supplant him”.
Do you seriously contend that he was wrong?
I don’t think we have any lessons to learn about remorse from the nation that committed genocide of its native peoples and, until 50 years ago, practised apartheid in many of its states.
You Americans carry on, we’re not asking you to take lessons from us, but before you decide to make sweeping assumptions about ‘English substance abuse’, our love of a gin and the people living in our seaside towns, maybe you should understand what you’re talking about first.
Yes, you will do the teaching , owning as you do the Black British Prototype, which served as the World Model.
India, Ireland, the sun never set on British rapacity and greed, and no nation has more experience in genocide than England .
Shall we have another war?
I suppose without your hysterical fantasies your entire world view woukd collapse . Ever heard of the Mughal Empire, for example? The clue is in the word empire, and it was the second Moslem Empire to invade Hindu India.
Shall we have another war?
I suppose without your hysterical fantasies your entire world view woukd collapse . Ever heard of the Mughal Empire, for example? The clue is in the word empire, and it was the second Moslem Empire to invade Hindu India.
Good Lord!
You Americans carry on, we’re not asking you to take lessons from us, but before you decide to make sweeping assumptions about ‘English substance abuse’, our love of a gin and the people living in our seaside towns, maybe you should understand what you’re talking about first.
Yes, you will do the teaching , owning as you do the Black British Prototype, which served as the World Model.
India, Ireland, the sun never set on British rapacity and greed, and no nation has more experience in genocide than England .
Good Lord!
An American can lecture me on colonialism when they hand back Guam, Guantanamo, Puerto Rico, Hawaii and everything west of New England.
You R Wright
Wright could not be more absurdly wrong if he tried.
Wright could not be more absurdly wrong if he tried.
Why exclude New England? Does naming it that legitimize it,or would it be too hard to pretend England didn’t found it?
What ethnicity do you imagine accomplished the Western Expansion?
Was Captain Cook a Pole? How about Paulette?
Why was the English flag over each Island, and Hawaiian flags burned?
Was an American the first to make contact, or a Brit?
Was Hawaii a British Protectorate?
Do you know what you are on about? At all?
Ever heard of South and Central America?
Ever heard of South and Central America?
You R Wright
Why exclude New England? Does naming it that legitimize it,or would it be too hard to pretend England didn’t found it?
What ethnicity do you imagine accomplished the Western Expansion?
Was Captain Cook a Pole? How about Paulette?
Why was the English flag over each Island, and Hawaiian flags burned?
Was an American the first to make contact, or a Brit?
Was Hawaii a British Protectorate?
Do you know what you are on about? At all?
Irish alcohol consumption is below the European average, and DNA damage from the British Genocide is linked to alcoholism in Ireland.
It’s at once largely untrue, but to the extent that it is true, it is “:your” fault.
Why are there so money Americans on website that supposed be about Britain? Our constituencies? Why do you care about Margate or Ramsgate? Bet you wouldn’t even know where they were on the map! Did we ask you?
You’re right, I don’t know where those two towns are. But I am very interested in Britain. I get a kick out people on both sides of the pond saying how happy they are they don’t live in the other’s country.
You’re right, I don’t know where those two towns are. But I am very interested in Britain. I get a kick out people on both sides of the pond saying how happy they are they don’t live in the other’s country.
Why are there so money Americans on website that supposed be about Britain? Our constituencies? Why do you care about Margate or Ramsgate? Bet you wouldn’t even know where they were on the map! Did we ask you?
Well, “atrocities of colonization” doesn’t come to mind when I think of Britain.
More money was spent building hospitals in our colonies and ex colonies than in building them in the NHS. Then there is every inch of road, railway, sewage plants, water supplies,.. etc.The colonies were an incredible drain on Britain.
Bloody hell another high horsed American. You lot just keep coming.
What utter b*llocks, where did you learn such tosh?
If I may quote from a renowned Spanish philosopher, who had the misfortune to teach at Harvard, one Georges Santayana, this is what he had to say about the British Empire in 1912 :
“Never since the heroic days of Greece has the world had such a sweet, just, boyish master. It will be a black day for the human race when scientific blackguards, conspirators, churls, and fanatics manage to supplant him”.
Do you seriously contend that he was wrong?
I don’t think we have any lessons to learn about remorse from the nation that committed genocide of its native peoples and, until 50 years ago, practised apartheid in many of its states.
An American can lecture me on colonialism when they hand back Guam, Guantanamo, Puerto Rico, Hawaii and everything west of New England.
Irish alcohol consumption is below the European average, and DNA damage from the British Genocide is linked to alcoholism in Ireland.
It’s at once largely untrue, but to the extent that it is true, it is “:your” fault.
Well, “atrocities of colonization” doesn’t come to mind when I think of Britain.
More money was spent building hospitals in our colonies and ex colonies than in building them in the NHS. Then there is every inch of road, railway, sewage plants, water supplies,.. etc.The colonies were an incredible drain on Britain.
He would have been a lot blunter than that (was my point).
I don’t like the superior tone, ‘English history of substance abuse’ we like to have a good time, heard the saying work hard, play hard? If you’d been raised in margate or ramsgate, you’d understand the appeal of a gin.
You have your fair share of problems too Mr usa, at least we’re not all hooked on opiates and painkillers, didn’t your own big pharma cause that? Wasn’t Afghanistan an American opiate war? All the people in Afghanistan growing poppies for the Americans on the hush? Then they decided they could cut out the middle man and you lost control. Part of the reason they haven’t enough wheat is because they all moved to cultivating poppies.
Quote: in October 2001 poppies were grown on around 74,000 hectares – 285 square miles.
The new figures showed production had increased more than four-fold in 15 years: now opium was being grown on 328,000 hectares – 1,266 square miles.
Source: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-47861444.amp
Brewing alcohol is as old as the hills, you read the iliad? Doesn’t noah get trollied in his vineyard in the bible and God tells him off? As are recreational drugs, history of substance abuse is not unique to England, neither is the brewing of alcohol, these things become problems in all places where they are the ONLY escape. You go visit Margate or Ramsgate, Chatham or Stroud if you’re feeling brave. Where hope goes to die. I spent a fair amount of time down there as a teenager, worrying my mum, no jobs, no hope, everything apart from £1 shops and betting agencies was either shut down or falling down. It’s probably only got worse. You’d have to be half cut to walk round and not immediately feel the urge to jump off the closest building….
These places need enormous investment, they look like no one’s bothered since 1900. And they probably haven’t.
I don’t think the English are particularly noted for substance abuse. The Russians and the Irish are particularly noted for alcoholism, and the USA for opiate abuse, and cocaine, and Jamaca for smoking weed, but I don’t think that substance abuse is particularly what people think of when they think of the English. They think of the atrocities of colonialization and are appalled that so few Brits feel any remorse about what their country did to so many other parts of the world.
I imagine Beveridge was aware of Hogarth’s Gin Lane and the English history of substance abuse.
Intriguing to imagine what Beveridge would have made of the vast ‘issues’ of relationship breakdown and substance abuse in driving the rise of poverty and despair in these grim areas – or whether he would have even understood those terms. Autre temps…
The writer conflates many different issues… and as a result can’t provide a solution for any of them.
Not mentioned in the article are the rough sleepers who do so from “choice.” The not insignificant number of people who don’t want to work and don’t want what they see as restrictions on their freedom.
Quite right it’s a poor article, mostly pointing out the bleeding obvious. Seaside towns have been homes for the poor since tourists stopped visiting them.
There are many reasons why people are poor; sometimes misfortune, sometimes bad choices. And sometimes some people are hard to help.
The writer points out that many of the poorest seeking help are employed on low wages. The thing is how to help? Or perhaps how can people help themselves?
The article is full of sad stories of serious poverty but no suggestions how to improve things.
In the UK pretty much all rough sleepers do so by choice. The only way you won’t have a hostel bed for a night is if you’re a hardened drug addict.
A recent survey of London’s rough sleepers revealed that a disproportionate amount of them were/are Scotch.
I think you’ll find that’s Scottish (though they may well have a bottle of the other stuff handy).
I believe many of them are ex-servicemen – trained for combat not for employment or housing themselves.
Irish surely. Ireland chucked out their
needy’ people to Britain till it became more prosperous in the ’90s . Up to the era of our beloved Windrush generation, the vast majority of our prisoners were Irish..
I think you’ll find that’s Scottish (though they may well have a bottle of the other stuff handy).
I believe many of them are ex-servicemen – trained for combat not for employment or housing themselves.
Irish surely. Ireland chucked out their
needy’ people to Britain till it became more prosperous in the ’90s . Up to the era of our beloved Windrush generation, the vast majority of our prisoners were Irish..
A recent survey of London’s rough sleepers revealed that a disproportionate amount of them were/are Scotch.
Quite right it’s a poor article, mostly pointing out the bleeding obvious. Seaside towns have been homes for the poor since tourists stopped visiting them.
There are many reasons why people are poor; sometimes misfortune, sometimes bad choices. And sometimes some people are hard to help.
The writer points out that many of the poorest seeking help are employed on low wages. The thing is how to help? Or perhaps how can people help themselves?
The article is full of sad stories of serious poverty but no suggestions how to improve things.
In the UK pretty much all rough sleepers do so by choice. The only way you won’t have a hostel bed for a night is if you’re a hardened drug addict.
The writer conflates many different issues… and as a result can’t provide a solution for any of them.
Not mentioned in the article are the rough sleepers who do so from “choice.” The not insignificant number of people who don’t want to work and don’t want what they see as restrictions on their freedom.
Unless UK GOV is going to make Med vacations illegal what exactly is the solution for Blackpool?
That is fundamentally the problem. Cute villages in Cornwall even South Coast resorts will always have a pull. Blackpool and Skeggie? Less. Their economies need diversifying, including support a w/e tourist economy.
You have a point.
I was in Blackpool a couple of years ago and I would pay extra to stay at work rather than spend a week there.
Yes, it is scary to help where people are dangerous. We need guards and police so there are safe places to invite people for help. Please, also, can rich criminal gangs stay away from ripping of goods meant to provide for poor people?
I wish people like Barack Obama, who was a community organizer to make a resume, could open his Rolodex now and find people to help fund guards to get students to school in Chicago. Charity changes when people become fat cats. He thinks a few souvenir sales jobs at his museum will pay back the city enough, though he will gain so much more through his museum. Tickle down…a few drops won’t change things. He should organize now he CAN. Same goes for the Meghan Harrys and so on.