March 14, 2023 - 4:00pm
Yesterday Florida Governor Ron DeSantis provided a statement to Tucker Carlson, saying that protecting Ukraine’s borders is not a vital American interest. “While the US has many vital national interests — securing our borders, addressing the crisis of readiness with our military, achieving energy security and independence, and checking the economic, cultural and military power of the Chinese Communist Party,” it read, “becoming further entangled in a territorial dispute between Ukraine and Russia is not one of them.”
Anti-interventionist attitudes are now a common feature of the populist Right, particularly on the issue of Ukraine. Prior to the midterm elections, then-House minority leader Kevin McCarthy asserted that there would be “no blank cheque” for Ukraine, while other MAGA Republicans like Marjorie Taylor Greene argued that America had “done enough”. Last night Donald Trump, with typical understatement, claimed that he was the only person who could prevent World War III. “With this administration, we could end up in World War III, because they don’t speak right,” said Trump. “They act tough when they should act nice, they act nice when they should act tough,” he added.
Against this backdrop and polls showing an increasingly war-weary public (particularly among Republican voters), the timing of DeSantis’s statement is noteworthy. As Florida Governor, DeSantis was never required to take a position on foreign policy issues, but as this New York Times piece notes, there was a period in which he was a much more conventional hawk. Back in 2015, he criticised President Obama for not providing arms to Ukraine, describing his refusal to do so as a “mistake”. Three years later, DeSantis then praised President Trump for providing weapons to Ukraine: “[Obama] did nothing when Russia invaded Crimea, made incursions into Ukraine,” DeSantis said. In contrast, Trump’s actions demonstrated “strength against Russia”.
Yet a closer examination of DeSantis’s statement to Carlson suggests that the Florida Governor’s dovish evolution may not be quite what it seems:
The framing of this statement appears to be geared against what could happen rather than what is happening. Indeed, no one in the Biden administration has mooted the idea of deploying American troops or giving Ukraine the capability to stage operations beyond its borders. Instead, DeSantis warns against “further entanglements”, which serves as more of a warning than a critique of US Government policy. There is no mention of peace negotiations or a deal.
Ukraine has sharply divided the populist Right from establishment Republicans. When (or if) DeSantis finally runs, the middle ground he is occupying may leave him vulnerable to attack from both sides. As primary season draws closer, eventually, he may have to choose.
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SubscribeMaybe Ron DeSantis personally would like to see unlimited US support of Ukraine in terms of money and hardware; Ron DeSantis the (potential) national leader knows that isn’t in America’s best interest.
Such dichotomy of thought in an adult isn’t odd, nor is it wrong.
This article is nothing more than a red herring. Sorry I fell for it.
This article is nothing more than a red herring. Sorry I fell for it.
Maybe Ron DeSantis personally would like to see unlimited US support of Ukraine in terms of money and hardware; Ron DeSantis the (potential) national leader knows that isn’t in America’s best interest.
Such dichotomy of thought in an adult isn’t odd, nor is it wrong.
National Review writers sound like they should be on suicide watch after how well they took DeSantis’s statement.
National Review writers sound like they should be on suicide watch after how well they took DeSantis’s statement.
It isn’t mysterious, he’s hedging for as long as he can, but as far as I can tell, De Santis is something of a sheep in wolves clothing (with regards to the American establishment) – he is courting isolationist/populist voters by not feeding into the war frenzy, but as the author says, his statements are carefully parsed to not give anything away.
This might or might not stay his stance on the matter, but my money is on him folding to the establishment war machine as soon as he’s in power (as with every president in my lifetime) and then it’ll be the Republicans turn at the wheel of misery.
Not Trump! He never folded. His problem is he did not under the utter depravity of all in Washington DC – and all the Vultures who circle it from Langly to Pentagon, to the 10,000 evil, sold their soul, Lobbyists – and the Deep State who Loath America – so the people he picked were against him, and he did not get it.
Now he does. Next time he will not be so stupid as to trust the Swamp animals.
Too late for that as I hope Trump realises that he has to stand down in 2024. But what you write is correct in as far as anyone who takes on the mantle of president must set out to tame and finally drain the swamp that is Washington DC. Otherwise there will be no America left.
I’m not so sure about that – Trump did try to pull out American troops from the Middle East (which is commendable, even though he was ignored), but he also had Soleimani assassinated (not that it helped, seeing as the Chinese still brokered an agreement between Iran and Saudi just recently) and his arguably biggest achievement (from a Republican perspective) was a giant tax cut for corporations.
Not exactly a stellar record for a populist who promised no more wars.
A swamp is actually one of the most lovely natural environments that exist. The medley between the water, the trees, the plants, and the air is stunning and beautiful. Admittedly, it is also deadly, because of gator, skeeters, and so on. (Leeches, etc.). People have this obsession with draining swamps, and it’s a real pity!
Too late for that as I hope Trump realises that he has to stand down in 2024. But what you write is correct in as far as anyone who takes on the mantle of president must set out to tame and finally drain the swamp that is Washington DC. Otherwise there will be no America left.
I’m not so sure about that – Trump did try to pull out American troops from the Middle East (which is commendable, even though he was ignored), but he also had Soleimani assassinated (not that it helped, seeing as the Chinese still brokered an agreement between Iran and Saudi just recently) and his arguably biggest achievement (from a Republican perspective) was a giant tax cut for corporations.
Not exactly a stellar record for a populist who promised no more wars.
A swamp is actually one of the most lovely natural environments that exist. The medley between the water, the trees, the plants, and the air is stunning and beautiful. Admittedly, it is also deadly, because of gator, skeeters, and so on. (Leeches, etc.). People have this obsession with draining swamps, and it’s a real pity!
I don’t think that DeSantis is a sheep. More wolverine and he did scare the nutters now trying to run Walt Disney’s wonderful gift to children and adults alike, with his theme parks and movies. I was privileged to visit both when visiting the US. My wife and I had our second childhood and had a blast.
He (Walt) must be turning in his grave with what has transpired over the last year or so.
They had a free ride and did’t appreciate it!
DeSantis 1 – Disney Corp 0
I actually agree with you on that – I read the “don’t say gay bill” and it’s incredible how such a tame piece of legislation (summary: no sex ed before fourth grade and no special focus on LGBT stuff) made so many democrats froth at the mouth, but some culture war red meat does not a populist make.
However, I am doubtful De Santis would stop American interventionism across the globe, which is why I called him an (establishment) sheep in wolves clothing – because he appears to be publicly entertaining that possibility.
I actually agree with you on that – I read the “don’t say gay bill” and it’s incredible how such a tame piece of legislation (summary: no sex ed before fourth grade and no special focus on LGBT stuff) made so many democrats froth at the mouth, but some culture war red meat does not a populist make.
However, I am doubtful De Santis would stop American interventionism across the globe, which is why I called him an (establishment) sheep in wolves clothing – because he appears to be publicly entertaining that possibility.
Not Trump! He never folded. His problem is he did not under the utter depravity of all in Washington DC – and all the Vultures who circle it from Langly to Pentagon, to the 10,000 evil, sold their soul, Lobbyists – and the Deep State who Loath America – so the people he picked were against him, and he did not get it.
Now he does. Next time he will not be so stupid as to trust the Swamp animals.
I don’t think that DeSantis is a sheep. More wolverine and he did scare the nutters now trying to run Walt Disney’s wonderful gift to children and adults alike, with his theme parks and movies. I was privileged to visit both when visiting the US. My wife and I had our second childhood and had a blast.
He (Walt) must be turning in his grave with what has transpired over the last year or so.
They had a free ride and did’t appreciate it!
DeSantis 1 – Disney Corp 0
It isn’t mysterious, he’s hedging for as long as he can, but as far as I can tell, De Santis is something of a sheep in wolves clothing (with regards to the American establishment) – he is courting isolationist/populist voters by not feeding into the war frenzy, but as the author says, his statements are carefully parsed to not give anything away.
This might or might not stay his stance on the matter, but my money is on him folding to the establishment war machine as soon as he’s in power (as with every president in my lifetime) and then it’ll be the Republicans turn at the wheel of misery.
Oh Come on Writer, you answered the fake question you post later; in the second and third line.
”saying that protecting Ukraine’s borders is not a vital American interest. ”
and
”becoming further entangled in a territorial dispute between Ukraine and Russia is not one of them.””
Because CIA and everyone else have been entangled up to their necks with them since 2005. Pushing Russia, arming Ukraine, changing their Leaders to push for NATO and EU membership to cause this war…….
Is that so hard?
The entire MAGA and Right has been anti war from day one! If I try to post a link to truth here (as in the platform Rumble, the only free speech platform) I get the dreaded:
”Awaiting for Approval”
You censor the truth here, but can link lies all you want. Writer – this is why you have absolutely no idea what is going on Politically in USA. obviously you rely on Youtube, Twitter, Facebook, Instagram….the Agenda has captured you, as it has most of the West.
Go to ‘Rumble‘ on your search. Click on that, then watch almost anything, like say
Steve Brannon’s War Room. ‘Redacted News’, ‘Infowars’, ‘Glen Greenwald’ Kim Iversen’ – and my favorite, ‘Salty Cracker’ whom any link gets your post deleted on Unherd:
”F__K Ukriane – I don’t give a F_*k about…” is how he expresses his feelings on the war, and complains like that about the money going there which needs to stay here. And MANY more, almost every one on Rumble is anti-war.
The Right – excepting the Uniparty Rhinos in DC have been 100% anti this war from the beginning.
The Right is OVER IT! The whole Neo-Con shi*. The billions and billions going to the politicians from the Military Industrial Complex. Losing every war after a $Trillion and 10 – 20 years! Vietnam, Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq – the Right is F__king Over these wars! The Right is appalled by this War – it is none of our business. Ukraine is Obama’s, Clinton’s, and Biden family’s Piggy Bank. Corrupt even by Hunter’s standards! We have no treaties there. No more 10% to big guys…..no more deaths and maiming and such for Political Proxy War.
PEACE NOW – Negotiate NOW has been the Right position from the start.
You warmongers have about destroyed Germany and the whole Europe. You completely destroyed Ukraine with your agenda World War III. Please search Colonel MacGregor (and Ritter) on Youtube for the truth on what you warmongers have done to Ukraine, please – you need to know.
Oh Come on Writer, you answered the fake question you post later; in the second and third line.
”saying that protecting Ukraine’s borders is not a vital American interest. ”
and
”becoming further entangled in a territorial dispute between Ukraine and Russia is not one of them.””
Because CIA and everyone else have been entangled up to their necks with them since 2005. Pushing Russia, arming Ukraine, changing their Leaders to push for NATO and EU membership to cause this war…….
Is that so hard?
The entire MAGA and Right has been anti war from day one! If I try to post a link to truth here (as in the platform Rumble, the only free speech platform) I get the dreaded:
”Awaiting for Approval”
You censor the truth here, but can link lies all you want. Writer – this is why you have absolutely no idea what is going on Politically in USA. obviously you rely on Youtube, Twitter, Facebook, Instagram….the Agenda has captured you, as it has most of the West.
Go to ‘Rumble‘ on your search. Click on that, then watch almost anything, like say
Steve Brannon’s War Room. ‘Redacted News’, ‘Infowars’, ‘Glen Greenwald’ Kim Iversen’ – and my favorite, ‘Salty Cracker’ whom any link gets your post deleted on Unherd:
”F__K Ukriane – I don’t give a F_*k about…” is how he expresses his feelings on the war, and complains like that about the money going there which needs to stay here. And MANY more, almost every one on Rumble is anti-war.
The Right – excepting the Uniparty Rhinos in DC have been 100% anti this war from the beginning.
The Right is OVER IT! The whole Neo-Con shi*. The billions and billions going to the politicians from the Military Industrial Complex. Losing every war after a $Trillion and 10 – 20 years! Vietnam, Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq – the Right is F__king Over these wars! The Right is appalled by this War – it is none of our business. Ukraine is Obama’s, Clinton’s, and Biden family’s Piggy Bank. Corrupt even by Hunter’s standards! We have no treaties there. No more 10% to big guys…..no more deaths and maiming and such for Political Proxy War.
PEACE NOW – Negotiate NOW has been the Right position from the start.
You warmongers have about destroyed Germany and the whole Europe. You completely destroyed Ukraine with your agenda World War III. Please search Colonel MacGregor (and Ritter) on Youtube for the truth on what you warmongers have done to Ukraine, please – you need to know.
DeSantis’s comment was a statement about keeping things in perspective. The Biden slide seems to have no end point. The Biden Administration announces reluctance and limits, and then blows through them weeks or months later. It is a kind of a path to Vietnam and one Ron wants to make clear has an end point before too long. Let Germany and France supply jets and other sophisticated hardware. Unlike the failed strategy under Obama in Libya, in Ukraine the strategy to “lead from behind” fits the situation.
The Russians are trying to draw us in so they can take their gloves off — see “bumping” the American Predator drone over the Black Sea which was spying on Russian maritime forces. We keep poking the Bear. Sooner or later, the Bear will poke back. Caution and prudence are warranted.
‘Ol Joe, “not ly’in folks”, is pushing China, Russia, Iran, and Saudi Arabia together to protect a rather flaccid, feckless Europe. Not a long term winner. Europe needs to lead — forcefully.
DeSantis’s comment was a statement about keeping things in perspective. The Biden slide seems to have no end point. The Biden Administration announces reluctance and limits, and then blows through them weeks or months later. It is a kind of a path to Vietnam and one Ron wants to make clear has an end point before too long. Let Germany and France supply jets and other sophisticated hardware. Unlike the failed strategy under Obama in Libya, in Ukraine the strategy to “lead from behind” fits the situation.
The Russians are trying to draw us in so they can take their gloves off — see “bumping” the American Predator drone over the Black Sea which was spying on Russian maritime forces. We keep poking the Bear. Sooner or later, the Bear will poke back. Caution and prudence are warranted.
‘Ol Joe, “not ly’in folks”, is pushing China, Russia, Iran, and Saudi Arabia together to protect a rather flaccid, feckless Europe. Not a long term winner. Europe needs to lead — forcefully.
I’m wholeheartedly in support of helping the Ukrainians by giving them equipment, training and other aid, but if the quote from de Santis is accurate, I have no problem with his position. Earlier in the piece, however, it was mentioned that he could see no American national interest in that conflict. If that’s true, he’s being dangerously shortsighted. Ever since Putin came to power he has moved aggressively against other countries, not only Ukraine, in an obvious program to restore the vast geographic extent of the former USSR — even though Russia is still huge. So it seems highly likely that IF Putin wins in Ukraine, he will move against other former Soviet satellites including, but not limited to, the Baltic states — which are now NATO members, as is the US. And in that case, direct US military involvement would be required. It follows that doing all we can to help Ukraine today is a prudent and farsighted policy.
I’m wholeheartedly in support of helping the Ukrainians by giving them equipment, training and other aid, but if the quote from de Santis is accurate, I have no problem with his position. Earlier in the piece, however, it was mentioned that he could see no American national interest in that conflict. If that’s true, he’s being dangerously shortsighted. Ever since Putin came to power he has moved aggressively against other countries, not only Ukraine, in an obvious program to restore the vast geographic extent of the former USSR — even though Russia is still huge. So it seems highly likely that IF Putin wins in Ukraine, he will move against other former Soviet satellites including, but not limited to, the Baltic states — which are now NATO members, as is the US. And in that case, direct US military involvement would be required. It follows that doing all we can to help Ukraine today is a prudent and farsighted policy.
Even if he were a dove, once he gets in the oval office, he will have a different viewpoint. Every president does.
And however isolationist one may be, giving eastern Europe back to Russia is probably not a vote winner.
Even if he were a dove, once he gets in the oval office, he will have a different viewpoint. Every president does.
And however isolationist one may be, giving eastern Europe back to Russia is probably not a vote winner.
As long as just a few GOP reps still support the war (as most GOP senators do), there’s little chance of a funding cut off. Dan Crenshaw is a good example.
And of course DeSantis waffles. He may be evil, but he’s not stupid.
Yeah, he really handled Hurricane Ian like a mustache-twirling villain, and signing a bill giving parents rights in education was satanic, and running a massive state so well that 1200 people – a day – move to Florida is evil.
I guess being a smart, competent, effective, principled chief executive is evil, if you’re none of those things.
CNN or the NYT must have used the term recently.
CNN or the NYT must have used the term recently.
Yeah, he really handled Hurricane Ian like a mustache-twirling villain, and signing a bill giving parents rights in education was satanic, and running a massive state so well that 1200 people – a day – move to Florida is evil.
I guess being a smart, competent, effective, principled chief executive is evil, if you’re none of those things.
As long as just a few GOP reps still support the war (as most GOP senators do), there’s little chance of a funding cut off. Dan Crenshaw is a good example.
And of course DeSantis waffles. He may be evil, but he’s not stupid.