I never even figured out what the article is about, I have not got time to read it again – but I was there for a bit of the scene. Jesus Freaks, Moonies, Krishnas, Brethren of Jesus, and even lived in a commune just down from the Bagwan…. was there shortly after the salad bar was poisoned, haha, were some times. I was in on the building of a Central American Pentecostal Church once.. haha, the article made me nostalgic for the old days – but no mention of Rainbow, and Jesus Camp and Krishna camp…
I was one of the lesser known things of those years, a ‘Road Freak’, one of those guys who live on the road, solitary, hitching up and down, just leading the hard life, mostly broke, sleeping rough six months and year stretches, just out there – mostly in solitude, it is hard…
Freak meant then – someone who could not help themselves from doing that thing… Speed Freak, Acid Freak, Jesus Freak and a few of us Road Freaks… just could not stay off the road – although it has to be the hardest life there is, brutal hard, but after living in a building a wile, making some money – and off I would go… five years out of a pack not counting spells stopped to work and just to get uncoiled, over 50,000 miles hitched… almost always with no home to go to even if I wanted… I had moved to USA, and family were a continent away… just — I do not know what to call it, but just being on the road.
This is the time of the Musical Hair, Godspell, Jesus Christ Superstar. The Church missions for the homeless in the cities, the soup kitchens, the help when needed for the fringe who hit rock bottom – the Regular Churches where who were the safety net for the fringe back them. Before it became a NGO pot of gold – helping the down and out was done by the regular churches everywhere it was Charity…Religion was real then. Respected. People thought someone of faith was a bit better than those without it – you knew they had a moral base – because there are really bad people on the road – it is a hard place.
Too much to say of it – it was a time… But the thing is Religion, and Christianity almost totally, were real then. The fringe respected it – because you had learned a Christian will help you – because they believe in doing it. Even the bad people respected Christians – I guess there is a thing of no atheists in a fox hole…. Life on the fringe has that – life is always on the edge of chaos. It is dangerous, very, very, stressful, scary, tedious, you always are poor so need or want something, and disaster is always hanging over you.And it is not just they give you stuff you needed – they gave you affirmation – they Cared for you – and mostly no one else did (unless they could get something from you).
See – good people must have people in need – that is how they can satisfy their need to do good. And people in need, they have to have the good people to help them. That was a thing to those times – there was a lot of need, and also there was a lot of good, as one is linked to the other. The one who does the good – you can say they get every bit as much as the one who gets the good deed. IT is this humanity, and religion was often associated, it was good.
Modern people – they do not do any good – Government has taken that over. (Government make it all worse though) – wile the Church Charities – they knew the ropes – they helped but did not allow dependence – they helped out of Charity of spirit –
Like I say – Religion was much more real then – you saw its works – you felt its goodness, you took spirit from it even of you were not religious, you respected a religious believer.
Say you are really down – and some stranger just walks up and gives you $5 – out of the blue (I Never begged – but people could sense it it seemed – and I always got through) You cannot believe how that picked you up – it satisfied a need, you could get food or some drink that you needed – but what was as much was that this person – they saw you, and they reached into their wallet and gave you something they would rather have kept. (beggars in the cities asking for change – I do not give to them, they are parasites really) You were seen as a person, you just had what was affection in a harder than you can believe world – you were the recipient of goodness – it means a lot.
It is weird living down and out. Right away you realize you have disappeared! You have vanished – no one ever catches your eye, they look to your side, or past you, but never at you. You feel like a ghost. Then you never can go into buildings because you have no money to afford to be in one… It is like a Si-Fi movie where no one can see you – you see them – but you have become invisible. It is Weird – and it is hard, and you just watch the world and are an outsider, just out there with nothing to do, nothing to dispel discomfort and boredom and loneliness, and the constant stress of that life…
Life on the fringe – it is nothing like real life. And religion becomes real… more so then. Cults always used ‘Love Bombing’ to recrut. Life is so hard fringe – the members all focus on you, give you affection, and it is like heroin if you are worn down by the hard life…. Also so many people down and out – they never in their life have had love – no love from parents, or community – it is a hard world.
Religion – it was very different. It was good, it was really the most good thing out there. It was a code, it was to know no matter how low you had hit – a Christian still thinks you a person (instead of a prey animal like some on the fringe do…)
I am just rambling on because I have to go off now – but I have seen a lot of life, a lot of countries, peoples, craziness, crazy things, hard times, broken people, terrible things…. and religion – it is more real the further down in life you go because you see it in people – and see the lack of it in people just as clearly….and always – the religious leaning are better, because you see the real person when you are vulnerable – or they are….and people with a Christian spirit are just better people – and you see it when times are hard and you are helpless…….
Yep, I was right! Elliott Bjorn is Sanford Artzen. All the main traits are there:
The “I’ve been everywhere man” themeThe rambling, solipsistic narrative posing as mere btl commentThe story-teller ambition (always hoping for an enraptured audience)The refusal to restrict himself to a couple of dozen words to make his point when he can use a thousand
Thank you – more interesting than the article. Serious comment: would you consider writing a memoir of your experiences? If you go down a level from the helicopter overview I think it would make compelling reading. You will have to do something about those dots though.
.. is a collapsed colon
Yours faithfully,
Dotty….
You can bore for the universe can’t you. It was the people like you who destabilized and destroyed that variety “goodness” you recall so fondly. And this,we bourgeois people just walk past without “seeing the person”. Well.a few months ago I recalled that as I passed a beggar so I spoke to him,and -never again. He angrily told me I was nosy and just wanted him to tell me salacious stories of the sexual abuse he’d endured as a child and I was too lazy to go to the cash machine that was just over there. He definitely did not want me to be his new best friend or to engage or interact with me on any level. Which actually was fine with me and if I hadn’t just once tried to be “caring” this wouldn’t have happened. I’m not saying other people shouldn’t ,if they have warm personalities and engaging natures im just saying this “you just walk by” garbage is one more guilt trip.
Thankyou. You showed “the road” to me. Also the preciousness and fragility of that communion that is the interacting world, a point Dr Jordan Peterson makes tellingly.
I’m a Catholic and indeed hold that Catholicism is THE church founded by Christ with its apostolic charisms. So the sola scriptura freelance evangelical dance while I do not question its oftimes sincerity, remains in a post reformation disconnect from Christ present among us in His sacraments.
And your comments brought Mother Theresa and her Sisters of Charity to mind. She would enfold a dying street “vagrant” in arms of love as they died.
And its fascinating and horrifying to watch the west literally lose its mind as it now is being hollowed out in the post Christian reality of stark confusion and indeed madness. What is a woman?
From the sanity of Aristotle and Aquinas’ “Final Cause”, the end or purpose of things we arrive at Aristotle’s “Unmoved Mover”, that necessary ground to all being and change, Love. Why we are moved in our depths towards truth, beauty and the good a the very depths of our souls.
Thanks for putting us in touch with the wandering lost spirit seeking and sometimes finding love on the road.
Yep, I was right! Elliott Bjorn is Sanford Artzen. All the main traits are there:
The “I’ve been everywhere man” themeThe rambling, solipsistic narrative posing as mere btl commentThe story-teller ambition (always hoping for an enraptured audience)The refusal to restrict himself to a couple of dozen words to make his point when he can use a thousand
Thank you – more interesting than the article. Serious comment: would you consider writing a memoir of your experiences? If you go down a level from the helicopter overview I think it would make compelling reading. You will have to do something about those dots though.
.. is a collapsed colon
Yours faithfully,
Dotty….
You can bore for the universe can’t you. It was the people like you who destabilized and destroyed that variety “goodness” you recall so fondly. And this,we bourgeois people just walk past without “seeing the person”. Well.a few months ago I recalled that as I passed a beggar so I spoke to him,and -never again. He angrily told me I was nosy and just wanted him to tell me salacious stories of the sexual abuse he’d endured as a child and I was too lazy to go to the cash machine that was just over there. He definitely did not want me to be his new best friend or to engage or interact with me on any level. Which actually was fine with me and if I hadn’t just once tried to be “caring” this wouldn’t have happened. I’m not saying other people shouldn’t ,if they have warm personalities and engaging natures im just saying this “you just walk by” garbage is one more guilt trip.
Thankyou. You showed “the road” to me. Also the preciousness and fragility of that communion that is the interacting world, a point Dr Jordan Peterson makes tellingly.
I’m a Catholic and indeed hold that Catholicism is THE church founded by Christ with its apostolic charisms. So the sola scriptura freelance evangelical dance while I do not question its oftimes sincerity, remains in a post reformation disconnect from Christ present among us in His sacraments.
And your comments brought Mother Theresa and her Sisters of Charity to mind. She would enfold a dying street “vagrant” in arms of love as they died.
And its fascinating and horrifying to watch the west literally lose its mind as it now is being hollowed out in the post Christian reality of stark confusion and indeed madness. What is a woman?
From the sanity of Aristotle and Aquinas’ “Final Cause”, the end or purpose of things we arrive at Aristotle’s “Unmoved Mover”, that necessary ground to all being and change, Love. Why we are moved in our depths towards truth, beauty and the good a the very depths of our souls.
Thanks for putting us in touch with the wandering lost spirit seeking and sometimes finding love on the road.
Elliott Bjorn
1 year ago
I never even figured out what the article is about, I have not got time to read it again – but I was there for a bit of the scene. Jesus Freaks, Moonies, Krishnas, Brethren of Jesus, and even lived in a commune just down from the Bagwan…. was there shortly after the salad bar was poisoned, haha, were some times. I was in on the building of a Central American Pentecostal Church once.. haha, the article made me nostalgic for the old days – but no mention of Rainbow, and Jesus Camp and Krishna camp…
I was one of the lesser known things of those years, a ‘Road Freak’, one of those guys who live on the road, solitary, hitching up and down, just leading the hard life, mostly broke, sleeping rough six months and year stretches, just out there – mostly in solitude, it is hard…
Freak meant then – someone who could not help themselves from doing that thing… Speed Freak, Acid Freak, Jesus Freak and a few of us Road Freaks… just could not stay off the road – although it has to be the hardest life there is, brutal hard, but after living in a building a wile, making some money – and off I would go… five years out of a pack not counting spells stopped to work and just to get uncoiled, over 50,000 miles hitched… almost always with no home to go to even if I wanted… I had moved to USA, and family were a continent away… just — I do not know what to call it, but just being on the road.
This is the time of the Musical Hair, Godspell, Jesus Christ Superstar. The Church missions for the homeless in the cities, the soup kitchens, the help when needed for the fringe who hit rock bottom – the Regular Churches where who were the safety net for the fringe back them. Before it became a NGO pot of gold – helping the down and out was done by the regular churches everywhere it was Charity…Religion was real then. Respected. People thought someone of faith was a bit better than those without it – you knew they had a moral base – because there are really bad people on the road – it is a hard place.
Too much to say of it – it was a time… But the thing is Religion, and Christianity almost totally, were real then. The fringe respected it – because you had learned a Christian will help you – because they believe in doing it. Even the bad people respected Christians – I guess there is a thing of no atheists in a fox hole…. Life on the fringe has that – life is always on the edge of chaos. It is dangerous, very, very, stressful, scary, tedious, you always are poor so need or want something, and disaster is always hanging over you.And it is not just they give you stuff you needed – they gave you affirmation – they Cared for you – and mostly no one else did (unless they could get something from you).
See – good people must have people in need – that is how they can satisfy their need to do good. And people in need, they have to have the good people to help them. That was a thing to those times – there was a lot of need, and also there was a lot of good, as one is linked to the other. The one who does the good – you can say they get every bit as much as the one who gets the good deed. IT is this humanity, and religion was often associated, it was good.
Modern people – they do not do any good – Government has taken that over. (Government make it all worse though) – wile the Church Charities – they knew the ropes – they helped but did not allow dependence – they helped out of Charity of spirit –
Like I say – Religion was much more real then – you saw its works – you felt its goodness, you took spirit from it even of you were not religious, you respected a religious believer.
Say you are really down – and some stranger just walks up and gives you $5 – out of the blue (I Never begged – but people could sense it it seemed – and I always got through) You cannot believe how that picked you up – it satisfied a need, you could get food or some drink that you needed – but what was as much was that this person – they saw you, and they reached into their wallet and gave you something they would rather have kept. (beggars in the cities asking for change – I do not give to them, they are parasites really) You were seen as a person, you just had what was affection in a harder than you can believe world – you were the recipient of goodness – it means a lot.
It is weird living down and out. Right away you realize you have disappeared! You have vanished – no one ever catches your eye, they look to your side, or past you, but never at you. You feel like a ghost. Then you never can go into buildings because you have no money to afford to be in one… It is like a Si-Fi movie where no one can see you – you see them – but you have become invisible. It is Weird – and it is hard, and you just watch the world and are an outsider, just out there with nothing to do, nothing to dispel discomfort and boredom and loneliness, and the constant stress of that life…
Life on the fringe – it is nothing like real life. And religion becomes real… more so then. Cults always used ‘Love Bombing’ to recrut. Life is so hard fringe – the members all focus on you, give you affection, and it is like heroin if you are worn down by the hard life…. Also so many people down and out – they never in their life have had love – no love from parents, or community – it is a hard world.
Religion – it was very different. It was good, it was really the most good thing out there. It was a code, it was to know no matter how low you had hit – a Christian still thinks you a person (instead of a prey animal like some on the fringe do…)
I am just rambling on because I have to go off now – but I have seen a lot of life, a lot of countries, peoples, craziness, crazy things, hard times, broken people, terrible things…. and religion – it is more real the further down in life you go because you see it in people – and see the lack of it in people just as clearly….and always – the religious leaning are better, because you see the real person when you are vulnerable – or they are….and people with a Christian spirit are just better people – and you see it when times are hard and you are helpless…….
Those were some times though…..
Steve Murray
1 year ago
I was trying to think of a throw-away remark about Frisbee, but couldn’t be bothered in The End…
…which segues nicely with The Doors and the stage presence of Jim Morrison; echoes of messianic evangelism right there.
That era occurred within my young memory, followed by its dissipation via the breakup of the Beatles, the three day week (in the UK) and punk, a typically British antithesis to all the drug-fuelled nonsense that got spewed out during the late 60s. The Christianity aspect is interesting though, as an attempt by young people to connect more directly with a value system rather than through the established churches, but still needing its so-called “charismatic” leaders to push it into the spotlight.
I personally find the “charismatic” aspect off-putting; the whole cult of “personality” feeds into the current obsession with celebrity. My response to these types are to “turn off, tune out and drop in” to my local.
How can you have a “value system” that presumably means virtues like honesty,reliability,kindness and financial managing of one’s own resources so as not to depend on or cheat other people when your ‘faith’ also allows you to take drugs,engage in promiscuous sex (ok it doesn’t hurt you,it harms a lot of your partners,but still as theyre only dozy whores it doesn’t matter),drink copious amounts of alcohol,be cruel and nasty to honest people who stand in your way etc. I just do not ‘get” this version of faith. These people destroyed the world I was born into that they were dismantling by their cultural influence by the time I was about 10. And guess what now they’re all old and crumbly they’re writing songs about their wonderful partner they’ve been married to for 50 years and making tv shows about rambles in the Yorkshire Dales oh very rock and roll. But these people DESTROYED LIVES
How can you have a “value system” that presumably means virtues like honesty,reliability,kindness and financial managing of one’s own resources so as not to depend on or cheat other people when your ‘faith’ also allows you to take drugs,engage in promiscuous sex (ok it doesn’t hurt you,it harms a lot of your partners,but still as theyre only dozy whores it doesn’t matter),drink copious amounts of alcohol,be cruel and nasty to honest people who stand in your way etc. I just do not ‘get” this version of faith. These people destroyed the world I was born into that they were dismantling by their cultural influence by the time I was about 10. And guess what now they’re all old and crumbly they’re writing songs about their wonderful partner they’ve been married to for 50 years and making tv shows about rambles in the Yorkshire Dales oh very rock and roll. But these people DESTROYED LIVES
“My response to these types are to “turn off, tune out and drop in” to my local.. . ” and maybe share a pint with Jesus & Mo . . .? 😉
Steve Murray
1 year ago
I was trying to think of a throw-away remark about Frisbee, but couldn’t be bothered in The End…
…which segues nicely with The Doors and the stage presence of Jim Morrison; echoes of messianic evangelism right there.
That era occurred within my young memory, followed by its dissipation via the breakup of the Beatles, the three day week (in the UK) and punk, a typically British antithesis to all the drug-fuelled nonsense that got spewed out during the late 60s. The Christianity aspect is interesting though, as an attempt by young people to connect more directly with a value system rather than through the established churches, but still needing its so-called “charismatic” leaders to push it into the spotlight.
I personally find the “charismatic” aspect off-putting; the whole cult of “personality” feeds into the current obsession with celebrity. My response to these types are to “turn off, tune out and drop in” to my local.
Last edited 1 year ago by Steve Murray
AC Harper
1 year ago
There’s an idea that the dominant social concept of narrative in Europe is ‘there and back again’ – or the Hero’s Quest including the return to the village.
In the USA the social concept is ‘road trip’ where if you are unhappy where you are you move on to greener pastures.
Perhaps ‘moving on’ to a life after death is more compelling in the USA? And there will be plenty of story tellers helping with that journey.
AC Harper
1 year ago
There’s an idea that the dominant social concept of narrative in Europe is ‘there and back again’ – or the Hero’s Quest including the return to the village.
In the USA the social concept is ‘road trip’ where if you are unhappy where you are you move on to greener pastures.
Perhaps ‘moving on’ to a life after death is more compelling in the USA? And there will be plenty of story tellers helping with that journey.
LCarey Rowland
1 year ago
The bottom line is: In world history, there is only one person who died, and then lived to tell about it. I’m going with him. Jesus is Lord.
Do you want to live forever? Jesus is the way; that’s true and eternal life awaits you if you are willing to go with him, by acknowledging his victory over our worst enemy, death itself.
LCarey Rowland
1 year ago
The bottom line is: In world history, there is only one person who died, and then lived to tell about it. I’m going with him. Jesus is Lord.
Do you want to live forever? Jesus is the way; that’s true and eternal life awaits you if you are willing to go with him, by acknowledging his victory over our worst enemy, death itself.
Derek Smith
1 year ago
Is the author upset at the commercialisation of evangelical Christianity, or that it attempts to police its boundaries?
Then why is she blaming the anti commercialized hippies ?
More like the fall-in -line Di$$$co Punks of Less Than Zero OC
Evangelicals like to look good & make money
The anti-consumer Hippies are to.blame for the Total Control Society we are now entering. We are not totally in yet. They are still finally polishing up the software or whatever the current term is. Its ironic because those Hippies thought that the very new science of computer language would create a way to bypass the power and communication structures of control. In fact I recall the mid -1980s when the internet started up and email was new,how exciting was that,I wasn’t involved in any of it,I remember hearing in real life as well as in media,about the freedom of the alternative uncontrolled web world and thinking THEY won’t let that go on for long. Not if it can be taxed. And now from those hippies creating computer languages for an alternative society we are now on the brink of a totally controllable society.
The anti-consumer Hippies are to.blame for the Total Control Society we are now entering. We are not totally in yet. They are still finally polishing up the software or whatever the current term is. Its ironic because those Hippies thought that the very new science of computer language would create a way to bypass the power and communication structures of control. In fact I recall the mid -1980s when the internet started up and email was new,how exciting was that,I wasn’t involved in any of it,I remember hearing in real life as well as in media,about the freedom of the alternative uncontrolled web world and thinking THEY won’t let that go on for long. Not if it can be taxed. And now from those hippies creating computer languages for an alternative society we are now on the brink of a totally controllable society.
Then why is she blaming the anti commercialized hippies ?
More like the fall-in -line Di$$$co Punks of Less Than Zero OC
Evangelicals like to look good & make money
Derek Smith
1 year ago
Is the author upset at the commercialisation of evangelical Christianity, or that it attempts to police its boundaries?
Disputatio Ineptias
1 year ago
Probably would have been good to note that Frisbee was played by Jonathan Roumie who has taken the crowd-funded series, The Chosen, by storm. Kelsey Grammer is perhaps a more recognizable name, but Roumie is the one who will bring The Chosen crowd to the theaters to see this film.
“My soul is chosen by God so I can do anything with my body.”
Not exactly a Catholic Jesus idea.
More like, “How can we make a bunch of money, etc & still go to heaven !” ” Oh be Chosen already” !o!
Sounds more like Extreme Calvinism to me. I was born as one of God’s Elect and am predestined Saved thus even if I live a life of sexual transgression and murder it doesn’t matter. My late Father was,I’m quick to state a good,kind,gentle and cultured man who took care of his family but he KNEW he was one of the 144K.Gods Elect,all who would be saved from humanity to praise God forever. Whether my Dad was right or wrong only God knows but I mention this to show how there are people who believe this kind of Iam saved idea. Luckily my Dad did not do bad things.
Sounds more like Extreme Calvinism to me. I was born as one of God’s Elect and am predestined Saved thus even if I live a life of sexual transgression and murder it doesn’t matter. My late Father was,I’m quick to state a good,kind,gentle and cultured man who took care of his family but he KNEW he was one of the 144K.Gods Elect,all who would be saved from humanity to praise God forever. Whether my Dad was right or wrong only God knows but I mention this to show how there are people who believe this kind of Iam saved idea. Luckily my Dad did not do bad things.
“My soul is chosen by God so I can do anything with my body.”
Not exactly a Catholic Jesus idea.
More like, “How can we make a bunch of money, etc & still go to heaven !” ” Oh be Chosen already” !o!
Last edited 1 year ago by Mark M Breza
Disputatio Ineptias
1 year ago
Probably would have been good to note that Frisbee was played by Jonathan Roumie who has taken the crowd-funded series, The Chosen, by storm. Kelsey Grammer is perhaps a more recognizable name, but Roumie is the one who will bring The Chosen crowd to the theaters to see this film.
Mark Duffett
1 year ago
No doubt there is a lot of truth here, but talk about leaving stuff out. It’s a bit incongruous to go on about Frisbee having been written out of the histories, yet not even mention the Biblical basis for the charismatic ‘stuff’, Acts chapter 2. It’s right there in the other name for the movement: Pentecostal.
Mark Duffett
1 year ago
No doubt there is a lot of truth here, but talk about leaving stuff out. It’s a bit incongruous to go on about Frisbee having been written out of the histories, yet not even mention the Biblical basis for the charismatic ‘stuff’, Acts chapter 2. It’s right there in the other name for the movement: Pentecostal.
leculdesac suburbia
1 year ago
Speaking of Rasputin, I hope Roumie goes on to play him in an updated version of Alan Rickman’s portray in 1996.
I’m assuming Roumie is urgently trying not to get typecast as his role in the Chosen weaves on for the next two years while he’s starred in this. He refers to himself humorously as “TV Jesus” and is very religious, and as a result I suspect is getting sick of being on the receiving end of millions of faith-starved people projecting their Jesus craving onto him.
I hope for his sake he gets a dark role ASAP, because he’s done a fabulous job understanding “the motivation” underlying a Jesus–he basically plays him like a Buddhist monk, and the underlying light humor of Roumie’s Jesus is vital to the success of the show.
He needs to break the spell of obsessed fans and play Charles Manson….or Rasputin. Show what it’s like for people to become obsessed with handsome religious “leader” who’s intrinsically evil–it’d be a powerful lesson for many people.
leculdesac suburbia
1 year ago
Speaking of Rasputin, I hope Roumie goes on to play him in an updated version of Alan Rickman’s portray in 1996.
I’m assuming Roumie is urgently trying not to get typecast as his role in the Chosen weaves on for the next two years while he’s starred in this. He refers to himself humorously as “TV Jesus” and is very religious, and as a result I suspect is getting sick of being on the receiving end of millions of faith-starved people projecting their Jesus craving onto him.
I hope for his sake he gets a dark role ASAP, because he’s done a fabulous job understanding “the motivation” underlying a Jesus–he basically plays him like a Buddhist monk, and the underlying light humor of Roumie’s Jesus is vital to the success of the show.
He needs to break the spell of obsessed fans and play Charles Manson….or Rasputin. Show what it’s like for people to become obsessed with handsome religious “leader” who’s intrinsically evil–it’d be a powerful lesson for many people.
I never even figured out what the article is about, I have not got time to read it again – but I was there for a bit of the scene. Jesus Freaks, Moonies, Krishnas, Brethren of Jesus, and even lived in a commune just down from the Bagwan…. was there shortly after the salad bar was poisoned, haha, were some times. I was in on the building of a Central American Pentecostal Church once.. haha, the article made me nostalgic for the old days – but no mention of Rainbow, and Jesus Camp and Krishna camp…
I was one of the lesser known things of those years, a ‘Road Freak’, one of those guys who live on the road, solitary, hitching up and down, just leading the hard life, mostly broke, sleeping rough six months and year stretches, just out there – mostly in solitude, it is hard…
Freak meant then – someone who could not help themselves from doing that thing… Speed Freak, Acid Freak, Jesus Freak and a few of us Road Freaks… just could not stay off the road – although it has to be the hardest life there is, brutal hard, but after living in a building a wile, making some money – and off I would go… five years out of a pack not counting spells stopped to work and just to get uncoiled, over 50,000 miles hitched… almost always with no home to go to even if I wanted… I had moved to USA, and family were a continent away… just — I do not know what to call it, but just being on the road.
This is the time of the Musical Hair, Godspell, Jesus Christ Superstar. The Church missions for the homeless in the cities, the soup kitchens, the help when needed for the fringe who hit rock bottom – the Regular Churches where who were the safety net for the fringe back them. Before it became a NGO pot of gold – helping the down and out was done by the regular churches everywhere it was Charity…Religion was real then. Respected. People thought someone of faith was a bit better than those without it – you knew they had a moral base – because there are really bad people on the road – it is a hard place.
Too much to say of it – it was a time… But the thing is Religion, and Christianity almost totally, were real then. The fringe respected it – because you had learned a Christian will help you – because they believe in doing it. Even the bad people respected Christians – I guess there is a thing of no atheists in a fox hole…. Life on the fringe has that – life is always on the edge of chaos. It is dangerous, very, very, stressful, scary, tedious, you always are poor so need or want something, and disaster is always hanging over you.And it is not just they give you stuff you needed – they gave you affirmation – they Cared for you – and mostly no one else did (unless they could get something from you).
See – good people must have people in need – that is how they can satisfy their need to do good. And people in need, they have to have the good people to help them. That was a thing to those times – there was a lot of need, and also there was a lot of good, as one is linked to the other. The one who does the good – you can say they get every bit as much as the one who gets the good deed. IT is this humanity, and religion was often associated, it was good.
Modern people – they do not do any good – Government has taken that over. (Government make it all worse though) – wile the Church Charities – they knew the ropes – they helped but did not allow dependence – they helped out of Charity of spirit –
Like I say – Religion was much more real then – you saw its works – you felt its goodness, you took spirit from it even of you were not religious, you respected a religious believer.
Say you are really down – and some stranger just walks up and gives you $5 – out of the blue (I Never begged – but people could sense it it seemed – and I always got through) You cannot believe how that picked you up – it satisfied a need, you could get food or some drink that you needed – but what was as much was that this person – they saw you, and they reached into their wallet and gave you something they would rather have kept. (beggars in the cities asking for change – I do not give to them, they are parasites really) You were seen as a person, you just had what was affection in a harder than you can believe world – you were the recipient of goodness – it means a lot.
It is weird living down and out. Right away you realize you have disappeared! You have vanished – no one ever catches your eye, they look to your side, or past you, but never at you. You feel like a ghost. Then you never can go into buildings because you have no money to afford to be in one… It is like a Si-Fi movie where no one can see you – you see them – but you have become invisible. It is Weird – and it is hard, and you just watch the world and are an outsider, just out there with nothing to do, nothing to dispel discomfort and boredom and loneliness, and the constant stress of that life…
Life on the fringe – it is nothing like real life. And religion becomes real… more so then. Cults always used ‘Love Bombing’ to recrut. Life is so hard fringe – the members all focus on you, give you affection, and it is like heroin if you are worn down by the hard life…. Also so many people down and out – they never in their life have had love – no love from parents, or community – it is a hard world.
Religion – it was very different. It was good, it was really the most good thing out there. It was a code, it was to know no matter how low you had hit – a Christian still thinks you a person (instead of a prey animal like some on the fringe do…)
I am just rambling on because I have to go off now – but I have seen a lot of life, a lot of countries, peoples, craziness, crazy things, hard times, broken people, terrible things…. and religion – it is more real the further down in life you go because you see it in people – and see the lack of it in people just as clearly….and always – the religious leaning are better, because you see the real person when you are vulnerable – or they are….and people with a Christian spirit are just better people – and you see it when times are hard and you are helpless…….
Those were some times though…..
Some revealing background info there. Although I suspect, also some toxic nostalgia. Worthy of an upvote.
Yep, I was right! Elliott Bjorn is Sanford Artzen. All the main traits are there:
The “I’ve been everywhere man” themeThe rambling, solipsistic narrative posing as mere btl commentThe story-teller ambition (always hoping for an enraptured audience)The refusal to restrict himself to a couple of dozen words to make his point when he can use a thousand
Ah yes!! NOW I remember that guy – Sanford Artzen – same schtick. Well put N Satori!!
Ah yes!! NOW I remember that guy – Sanford Artzen – same schtick. Well put N Satori!!
Thank you – more interesting than the article. Serious comment: would you consider writing a memoir of your experiences? If you go down a level from the helicopter overview I think it would make compelling reading. You will have to do something about those dots though.
.. is a collapsed colon
Yours faithfully,
Dotty….
I always enjoy your esoteric posts Mr Bjorn. Within the post-fried synapse words is a kernel of truth.
Agreed. The kernal here is to those who wish to see the end of Christianity. A post-Christian world would be a very, very dark place.
We are already in it.
We are already in it.
Agreed. The kernal here is to those who wish to see the end of Christianity. A post-Christian world would be a very, very dark place.
You can bore for the universe can’t you. It was the people like you who destabilized and destroyed that variety “goodness” you recall so fondly. And this,we bourgeois people just walk past without “seeing the person”. Well.a few months ago I recalled that as I passed a beggar so I spoke to him,and -never again. He angrily told me I was nosy and just wanted him to tell me salacious stories of the sexual abuse he’d endured as a child and I was too lazy to go to the cash machine that was just over there. He definitely did not want me to be his new best friend or to engage or interact with me on any level. Which actually was fine with me and if I hadn’t just once tried to be “caring” this wouldn’t have happened. I’m not saying other people shouldn’t ,if they have warm personalities and engaging natures im just saying this “you just walk by” garbage is one more guilt trip.
Ralph Ellison: The Invisible Man
Thankyou. You showed “the road” to me. Also the preciousness and fragility of that communion that is the interacting world, a point Dr Jordan Peterson makes tellingly.
I’m a Catholic and indeed hold that Catholicism is THE church founded by Christ with its apostolic charisms. So the sola scriptura freelance evangelical dance while I do not question its oftimes sincerity, remains in a post reformation disconnect from Christ present among us in His sacraments.
And your comments brought Mother Theresa and her Sisters of Charity to mind. She would enfold a dying street “vagrant” in arms of love as they died.
And its fascinating and horrifying to watch the west literally lose its mind as it now is being hollowed out in the post Christian reality of stark confusion and indeed madness. What is a woman?
From the sanity of Aristotle and Aquinas’ “Final Cause”, the end or purpose of things we arrive at Aristotle’s “Unmoved Mover”, that necessary ground to all being and change, Love. Why we are moved in our depths towards truth, beauty and the good a the very depths of our souls.
Thanks for putting us in touch with the wandering lost spirit seeking and sometimes finding love on the road.
Some revealing background info there. Although I suspect, also some toxic nostalgia. Worthy of an upvote.
Yep, I was right! Elliott Bjorn is Sanford Artzen. All the main traits are there:
The “I’ve been everywhere man” themeThe rambling, solipsistic narrative posing as mere btl commentThe story-teller ambition (always hoping for an enraptured audience)The refusal to restrict himself to a couple of dozen words to make his point when he can use a thousand
Thank you – more interesting than the article. Serious comment: would you consider writing a memoir of your experiences? If you go down a level from the helicopter overview I think it would make compelling reading. You will have to do something about those dots though.
.. is a collapsed colon
Yours faithfully,
Dotty….
I always enjoy your esoteric posts Mr Bjorn. Within the post-fried synapse words is a kernel of truth.
You can bore for the universe can’t you. It was the people like you who destabilized and destroyed that variety “goodness” you recall so fondly. And this,we bourgeois people just walk past without “seeing the person”. Well.a few months ago I recalled that as I passed a beggar so I spoke to him,and -never again. He angrily told me I was nosy and just wanted him to tell me salacious stories of the sexual abuse he’d endured as a child and I was too lazy to go to the cash machine that was just over there. He definitely did not want me to be his new best friend or to engage or interact with me on any level. Which actually was fine with me and if I hadn’t just once tried to be “caring” this wouldn’t have happened. I’m not saying other people shouldn’t ,if they have warm personalities and engaging natures im just saying this “you just walk by” garbage is one more guilt trip.
Ralph Ellison: The Invisible Man
Thankyou. You showed “the road” to me. Also the preciousness and fragility of that communion that is the interacting world, a point Dr Jordan Peterson makes tellingly.
I’m a Catholic and indeed hold that Catholicism is THE church founded by Christ with its apostolic charisms. So the sola scriptura freelance evangelical dance while I do not question its oftimes sincerity, remains in a post reformation disconnect from Christ present among us in His sacraments.
And your comments brought Mother Theresa and her Sisters of Charity to mind. She would enfold a dying street “vagrant” in arms of love as they died.
And its fascinating and horrifying to watch the west literally lose its mind as it now is being hollowed out in the post Christian reality of stark confusion and indeed madness. What is a woman?
From the sanity of Aristotle and Aquinas’ “Final Cause”, the end or purpose of things we arrive at Aristotle’s “Unmoved Mover”, that necessary ground to all being and change, Love. Why we are moved in our depths towards truth, beauty and the good a the very depths of our souls.
Thanks for putting us in touch with the wandering lost spirit seeking and sometimes finding love on the road.
I never even figured out what the article is about, I have not got time to read it again – but I was there for a bit of the scene. Jesus Freaks, Moonies, Krishnas, Brethren of Jesus, and even lived in a commune just down from the Bagwan…. was there shortly after the salad bar was poisoned, haha, were some times. I was in on the building of a Central American Pentecostal Church once.. haha, the article made me nostalgic for the old days – but no mention of Rainbow, and Jesus Camp and Krishna camp…
I was one of the lesser known things of those years, a ‘Road Freak’, one of those guys who live on the road, solitary, hitching up and down, just leading the hard life, mostly broke, sleeping rough six months and year stretches, just out there – mostly in solitude, it is hard…
Freak meant then – someone who could not help themselves from doing that thing… Speed Freak, Acid Freak, Jesus Freak and a few of us Road Freaks… just could not stay off the road – although it has to be the hardest life there is, brutal hard, but after living in a building a wile, making some money – and off I would go… five years out of a pack not counting spells stopped to work and just to get uncoiled, over 50,000 miles hitched… almost always with no home to go to even if I wanted… I had moved to USA, and family were a continent away… just — I do not know what to call it, but just being on the road.
This is the time of the Musical Hair, Godspell, Jesus Christ Superstar. The Church missions for the homeless in the cities, the soup kitchens, the help when needed for the fringe who hit rock bottom – the Regular Churches where who were the safety net for the fringe back them. Before it became a NGO pot of gold – helping the down and out was done by the regular churches everywhere it was Charity…Religion was real then. Respected. People thought someone of faith was a bit better than those without it – you knew they had a moral base – because there are really bad people on the road – it is a hard place.
Too much to say of it – it was a time… But the thing is Religion, and Christianity almost totally, were real then. The fringe respected it – because you had learned a Christian will help you – because they believe in doing it. Even the bad people respected Christians – I guess there is a thing of no atheists in a fox hole…. Life on the fringe has that – life is always on the edge of chaos. It is dangerous, very, very, stressful, scary, tedious, you always are poor so need or want something, and disaster is always hanging over you.And it is not just they give you stuff you needed – they gave you affirmation – they Cared for you – and mostly no one else did (unless they could get something from you).
See – good people must have people in need – that is how they can satisfy their need to do good. And people in need, they have to have the good people to help them. That was a thing to those times – there was a lot of need, and also there was a lot of good, as one is linked to the other. The one who does the good – you can say they get every bit as much as the one who gets the good deed. IT is this humanity, and religion was often associated, it was good.
Modern people – they do not do any good – Government has taken that over. (Government make it all worse though) – wile the Church Charities – they knew the ropes – they helped but did not allow dependence – they helped out of Charity of spirit –
Like I say – Religion was much more real then – you saw its works – you felt its goodness, you took spirit from it even of you were not religious, you respected a religious believer.
Say you are really down – and some stranger just walks up and gives you $5 – out of the blue (I Never begged – but people could sense it it seemed – and I always got through) You cannot believe how that picked you up – it satisfied a need, you could get food or some drink that you needed – but what was as much was that this person – they saw you, and they reached into their wallet and gave you something they would rather have kept. (beggars in the cities asking for change – I do not give to them, they are parasites really) You were seen as a person, you just had what was affection in a harder than you can believe world – you were the recipient of goodness – it means a lot.
It is weird living down and out. Right away you realize you have disappeared! You have vanished – no one ever catches your eye, they look to your side, or past you, but never at you. You feel like a ghost. Then you never can go into buildings because you have no money to afford to be in one… It is like a Si-Fi movie where no one can see you – you see them – but you have become invisible. It is Weird – and it is hard, and you just watch the world and are an outsider, just out there with nothing to do, nothing to dispel discomfort and boredom and loneliness, and the constant stress of that life…
Life on the fringe – it is nothing like real life. And religion becomes real… more so then. Cults always used ‘Love Bombing’ to recrut. Life is so hard fringe – the members all focus on you, give you affection, and it is like heroin if you are worn down by the hard life…. Also so many people down and out – they never in their life have had love – no love from parents, or community – it is a hard world.
Religion – it was very different. It was good, it was really the most good thing out there. It was a code, it was to know no matter how low you had hit – a Christian still thinks you a person (instead of a prey animal like some on the fringe do…)
I am just rambling on because I have to go off now – but I have seen a lot of life, a lot of countries, peoples, craziness, crazy things, hard times, broken people, terrible things…. and religion – it is more real the further down in life you go because you see it in people – and see the lack of it in people just as clearly….and always – the religious leaning are better, because you see the real person when you are vulnerable – or they are….and people with a Christian spirit are just better people – and you see it when times are hard and you are helpless…….
Those were some times though…..
I was trying to think of a throw-away remark about Frisbee, but couldn’t be bothered in The End…
…which segues nicely with The Doors and the stage presence of Jim Morrison; echoes of messianic evangelism right there.
That era occurred within my young memory, followed by its dissipation via the breakup of the Beatles, the three day week (in the UK) and punk, a typically British antithesis to all the drug-fuelled nonsense that got spewed out during the late 60s. The Christianity aspect is interesting though, as an attempt by young people to connect more directly with a value system rather than through the established churches, but still needing its so-called “charismatic” leaders to push it into the spotlight.
I personally find the “charismatic” aspect off-putting; the whole cult of “personality” feeds into the current obsession with celebrity. My response to these types are to “turn off, tune out and drop in” to my local.
How can you have a “value system” that presumably means virtues like honesty,reliability,kindness and financial managing of one’s own resources so as not to depend on or cheat other people when your ‘faith’ also allows you to take drugs,engage in promiscuous sex (ok it doesn’t hurt you,it harms a lot of your partners,but still as theyre only dozy whores it doesn’t matter),drink copious amounts of alcohol,be cruel and nasty to honest people who stand in your way etc. I just do not ‘get” this version of faith. These people destroyed the world I was born into that they were dismantling by their cultural influence by the time I was about 10. And guess what now they’re all old and crumbly they’re writing songs about their wonderful partner they’ve been married to for 50 years and making tv shows about rambles in the Yorkshire Dales oh very rock and roll. But these people DESTROYED LIVES
“My response to these types are to “turn off, tune out and drop in” to my local.. . ” and maybe share a pint with Jesus & Mo . . .? 😉
How can you have a “value system” that presumably means virtues like honesty,reliability,kindness and financial managing of one’s own resources so as not to depend on or cheat other people when your ‘faith’ also allows you to take drugs,engage in promiscuous sex (ok it doesn’t hurt you,it harms a lot of your partners,but still as theyre only dozy whores it doesn’t matter),drink copious amounts of alcohol,be cruel and nasty to honest people who stand in your way etc. I just do not ‘get” this version of faith. These people destroyed the world I was born into that they were dismantling by their cultural influence by the time I was about 10. And guess what now they’re all old and crumbly they’re writing songs about their wonderful partner they’ve been married to for 50 years and making tv shows about rambles in the Yorkshire Dales oh very rock and roll. But these people DESTROYED LIVES
“My response to these types are to “turn off, tune out and drop in” to my local.. . ” and maybe share a pint with Jesus & Mo . . .? 😉
I was trying to think of a throw-away remark about Frisbee, but couldn’t be bothered in The End…
…which segues nicely with The Doors and the stage presence of Jim Morrison; echoes of messianic evangelism right there.
That era occurred within my young memory, followed by its dissipation via the breakup of the Beatles, the three day week (in the UK) and punk, a typically British antithesis to all the drug-fuelled nonsense that got spewed out during the late 60s. The Christianity aspect is interesting though, as an attempt by young people to connect more directly with a value system rather than through the established churches, but still needing its so-called “charismatic” leaders to push it into the spotlight.
I personally find the “charismatic” aspect off-putting; the whole cult of “personality” feeds into the current obsession with celebrity. My response to these types are to “turn off, tune out and drop in” to my local.
There’s an idea that the dominant social concept of narrative in Europe is ‘there and back again’ – or the Hero’s Quest including the return to the village.
In the USA the social concept is ‘road trip’ where if you are unhappy where you are you move on to greener pastures.
Perhaps ‘moving on’ to a life after death is more compelling in the USA? And there will be plenty of story tellers helping with that journey.
There’s an idea that the dominant social concept of narrative in Europe is ‘there and back again’ – or the Hero’s Quest including the return to the village.
In the USA the social concept is ‘road trip’ where if you are unhappy where you are you move on to greener pastures.
Perhaps ‘moving on’ to a life after death is more compelling in the USA? And there will be plenty of story tellers helping with that journey.
The bottom line is: In world history, there is only one person who died, and then lived to tell about it. I’m going with him. Jesus is Lord.
Do you want to live forever? Jesus is the way; that’s true and eternal life awaits you if you are willing to go with him, by acknowledging his victory over our worst enemy, death itself.
The bottom line is: In world history, there is only one person who died, and then lived to tell about it. I’m going with him. Jesus is Lord.
Do you want to live forever? Jesus is the way; that’s true and eternal life awaits you if you are willing to go with him, by acknowledging his victory over our worst enemy, death itself.
Is the author upset at the commercialisation of evangelical Christianity, or that it attempts to police its boundaries?
Then why is she blaming the anti commercialized hippies ?
More like the fall-in -line Di$$$co Punks of Less Than Zero OC
Evangelicals like to look good & make money
The anti-consumer Hippies are to.blame for the Total Control Society we are now entering. We are not totally in yet. They are still finally polishing up the software or whatever the current term is. Its ironic because those Hippies thought that the very new science of computer language would create a way to bypass the power and communication structures of control. In fact I recall the mid -1980s when the internet started up and email was new,how exciting was that,I wasn’t involved in any of it,I remember hearing in real life as well as in media,about the freedom of the alternative uncontrolled web world and thinking THEY won’t let that go on for long. Not if it can be taxed. And now from those hippies creating computer languages for an alternative society we are now on the brink of a totally controllable society.
The anti-consumer Hippies are to.blame for the Total Control Society we are now entering. We are not totally in yet. They are still finally polishing up the software or whatever the current term is. Its ironic because those Hippies thought that the very new science of computer language would create a way to bypass the power and communication structures of control. In fact I recall the mid -1980s when the internet started up and email was new,how exciting was that,I wasn’t involved in any of it,I remember hearing in real life as well as in media,about the freedom of the alternative uncontrolled web world and thinking THEY won’t let that go on for long. Not if it can be taxed. And now from those hippies creating computer languages for an alternative society we are now on the brink of a totally controllable society.
Then why is she blaming the anti commercialized hippies ?
More like the fall-in -line Di$$$co Punks of Less Than Zero OC
Evangelicals like to look good & make money
Is the author upset at the commercialisation of evangelical Christianity, or that it attempts to police its boundaries?
Probably would have been good to note that Frisbee was played by Jonathan Roumie who has taken the crowd-funded series, The Chosen, by storm. Kelsey Grammer is perhaps a more recognizable name, but Roumie is the one who will bring The Chosen crowd to the theaters to see this film.
“My soul is chosen by God so I can do anything with my body.”
Not exactly a Catholic Jesus idea.
More like, “How can we make a bunch of money, etc & still go to heaven !” ” Oh be Chosen already” !o!
Sounds more like Extreme Calvinism to me. I was born as one of God’s Elect and am predestined Saved thus even if I live a life of sexual transgression and murder it doesn’t matter. My late Father was,I’m quick to state a good,kind,gentle and cultured man who took care of his family but he KNEW he was one of the 144K.Gods Elect,all who would be saved from humanity to praise God forever. Whether my Dad was right or wrong only God knows but I mention this to show how there are people who believe this kind of Iam saved idea. Luckily my Dad did not do bad things.
Sounds more like Extreme Calvinism to me. I was born as one of God’s Elect and am predestined Saved thus even if I live a life of sexual transgression and murder it doesn’t matter. My late Father was,I’m quick to state a good,kind,gentle and cultured man who took care of his family but he KNEW he was one of the 144K.Gods Elect,all who would be saved from humanity to praise God forever. Whether my Dad was right or wrong only God knows but I mention this to show how there are people who believe this kind of Iam saved idea. Luckily my Dad did not do bad things.
“My soul is chosen by God so I can do anything with my body.”
Not exactly a Catholic Jesus idea.
More like, “How can we make a bunch of money, etc & still go to heaven !” ” Oh be Chosen already” !o!
Probably would have been good to note that Frisbee was played by Jonathan Roumie who has taken the crowd-funded series, The Chosen, by storm. Kelsey Grammer is perhaps a more recognizable name, but Roumie is the one who will bring The Chosen crowd to the theaters to see this film.
No doubt there is a lot of truth here, but talk about leaving stuff out. It’s a bit incongruous to go on about Frisbee having been written out of the histories, yet not even mention the Biblical basis for the charismatic ‘stuff’, Acts chapter 2. It’s right there in the other name for the movement: Pentecostal.
No doubt there is a lot of truth here, but talk about leaving stuff out. It’s a bit incongruous to go on about Frisbee having been written out of the histories, yet not even mention the Biblical basis for the charismatic ‘stuff’, Acts chapter 2. It’s right there in the other name for the movement: Pentecostal.
Speaking of Rasputin, I hope Roumie goes on to play him in an updated version of Alan Rickman’s portray in 1996.
I’m assuming Roumie is urgently trying not to get typecast as his role in the Chosen weaves on for the next two years while he’s starred in this. He refers to himself humorously as “TV Jesus” and is very religious, and as a result I suspect is getting sick of being on the receiving end of millions of faith-starved people projecting their Jesus craving onto him.
I hope for his sake he gets a dark role ASAP, because he’s done a fabulous job understanding “the motivation” underlying a Jesus–he basically plays him like a Buddhist monk, and the underlying light humor of Roumie’s Jesus is vital to the success of the show.
He needs to break the spell of obsessed fans and play Charles Manson….or Rasputin. Show what it’s like for people to become obsessed with handsome religious “leader” who’s intrinsically evil–it’d be a powerful lesson for many people.
Speaking of Rasputin, I hope Roumie goes on to play him in an updated version of Alan Rickman’s portray in 1996.
I’m assuming Roumie is urgently trying not to get typecast as his role in the Chosen weaves on for the next two years while he’s starred in this. He refers to himself humorously as “TV Jesus” and is very religious, and as a result I suspect is getting sick of being on the receiving end of millions of faith-starved people projecting their Jesus craving onto him.
I hope for his sake he gets a dark role ASAP, because he’s done a fabulous job understanding “the motivation” underlying a Jesus–he basically plays him like a Buddhist monk, and the underlying light humor of Roumie’s Jesus is vital to the success of the show.
He needs to break the spell of obsessed fans and play Charles Manson….or Rasputin. Show what it’s like for people to become obsessed with handsome religious “leader” who’s intrinsically evil–it’d be a powerful lesson for many people.