What a depressing situation! I feel very sorry for the Italians – no economic growth for two decades, overrun by boats from Africa and now a Democracy in Name Only.
R Wright
2 years ago
“That Twenties’ whiff just gets stronger and stronger every day” – but without a single Italian man enough to march on Rome and end the whole farce it will remain just a growing stench.
Fair point. But it is worth recalling that Il Duce did not “march” on Rome but took a fast train from Milan.
D M
2 years ago
Italy may be in a sorry state but in truth governments in general,
at least in the West, don’t have very much power these days. Global corporations and technocratic elites have the power and membership of the EU and particularly use of the euro help them consolidate control. Look how impossible it was for Greece to do anything meaningful to protect themselves. UK’s extraction from eu and avoidance of the euro in principle enable them to have more control but we haven’t seen many benefits yet. Another factor is constitution – in Italy’s case there seems to be no practicable way of getting a strong and decisive proper populist government.
Last edited 2 years ago by D M
David Sharp
2 years ago
Thomas Fazi writes: “The pathological infantilism of Italy’s political class is the result of 20 years of external constraint — that is, of the country being essentially managed by outside forces, in particular the European Union.”
Sounds a lot like France, except that the French technopopulists have a lot more misplaced arrogance and self-assurance, many of them still being convinced that their country is actually on the winning side as part of the fantasized “Franco-German couple”.
The description of an infantile political class rings true for the UK as much as Italy. The shifting of levers of actual power from national parliaments to armies of unelected technocratic institutions began as an intrinsic part of Blairism and the deepening of the relationship with the EU. The hysterical antics and pantomines of our lightweight MPs are pure displacement activity, highlighting not masking their inadequacy snd impotence on the great affairs. Meanwhile, as if to fill the void, the technocrats during Covid have bared their teeth and developed an ugly taste for extra legal authoritarian power. Infantalism meets authoritarianism. An ugly mix.
Andrea X
2 years ago
TINA??
And what is a “Twenty’s whiff”?
Anyway, my bet is that Meloni will win the next elections hands down with Salvini employed as a human fan. Our only hope is that she will have enough vote to govern.
As to Draghi’s resilience/resistance, in recent decades prime ministers tend to last 1-2 years and then they burn out. Will he be any different?
TINA = “There Is No Alternative”, a sort of Eurozone motto for fiscal austerity imposed on southern countries.
I think the point that is being made is that Italian democracy is in shambles. It appears as if elections only affirm what is already imposed from above, particularly when one considers that both Lega and 5S went from alleged anti-establishment stances to exact establishment. When one considers that in last 10 years, the prime minister was not a party leader, but usually some sort of technocrat with a cobbled majority of opportunity, it really starts looking rotten.
Thanks. I had come across TINA before but couldn’t remember the meaning.
Yes, democracy is in a mess, this is why I feel that Meloni at the moment is the only candidate to do something about it (as the only one at the opposition and who voted against Mattarella) before becoming “establishment” too, just like the 5s movement.
Roger Inkpen
2 years ago
I’m always up for some EU bashing, but to blame the infantilisation of Italian politics on Brussels is nonsense. The Italians have no one to blame but themselves (and I think most know it). They’ve had 20 PMs in the past 40 years!
One set of politicians are unable to deliver their promises, so the instinct is to reject them and go for the next charlatan who promises “this time will be different”. And it turns they are just as bad.
Perhaps our politicians are the opposite, being so vague with any commitments they can never be accused of failing.
On the subject of head of state, I sit on the fence as I don’t think you’d start now with having a monarch, however much we respect the Queen. We can see how divisive electing an all powerful president like USA or France is, but these politically appointed presidents like Italy and Germany don’t look like any better a model.
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What a depressing situation! I feel very sorry for the Italians – no economic growth for two decades, overrun by boats from Africa and now a Democracy in Name Only.
“That Twenties’ whiff just gets stronger and stronger every day” – but without a single Italian man enough to march on Rome and end the whole farce it will remain just a growing stench.
Fair point. But it is worth recalling that Il Duce did not “march” on Rome but took a fast train from Milan.
Italy may be in a sorry state but in truth governments in general,
at least in the West, don’t have very much power these days. Global corporations and technocratic elites have the power and membership of the EU and particularly use of the euro help them consolidate control. Look how impossible it was for Greece to do anything meaningful to protect themselves. UK’s extraction from eu and avoidance of the euro in principle enable them to have more control but we haven’t seen many benefits yet. Another factor is constitution – in Italy’s case there seems to be no practicable way of getting a strong and decisive proper populist government.
The description of an infantile political class rings true for the UK as much as Italy. The shifting of levers of actual power from national parliaments to armies of unelected technocratic institutions began as an intrinsic part of Blairism and the deepening of the relationship with the EU. The hysterical antics and pantomines of our lightweight MPs are pure displacement activity, highlighting not masking their inadequacy snd impotence on the great affairs. Meanwhile, as if to fill the void, the technocrats during Covid have bared their teeth and developed an ugly taste for extra legal authoritarian power. Infantalism meets authoritarianism. An ugly mix.
TINA??
And what is a “Twenty’s whiff”?
Anyway, my bet is that Meloni will win the next elections hands down with Salvini employed as a human fan. Our only hope is that she will have enough vote to govern.
As to Draghi’s resilience/resistance, in recent decades prime ministers tend to last 1-2 years and then they burn out. Will he be any different?
TINA = “There Is No Alternative”, a sort of Eurozone motto for fiscal austerity imposed on southern countries.
I think the point that is being made is that Italian democracy is in shambles. It appears as if elections only affirm what is already imposed from above, particularly when one considers that both Lega and 5S went from alleged anti-establishment stances to exact establishment. When one considers that in last 10 years, the prime minister was not a party leader, but usually some sort of technocrat with a cobbled majority of opportunity, it really starts looking rotten.
Thanks. I had come across TINA before but couldn’t remember the meaning.
Yes, democracy is in a mess, this is why I feel that Meloni at the moment is the only candidate to do something about it (as the only one at the opposition and who voted against Mattarella) before becoming “establishment” too, just like the 5s movement.
I’m always up for some EU bashing, but to blame the infantilisation of Italian politics on Brussels is nonsense. The Italians have no one to blame but themselves (and I think most know it). They’ve had 20 PMs in the past 40 years!
One set of politicians are unable to deliver their promises, so the instinct is to reject them and go for the next charlatan who promises “this time will be different”. And it turns they are just as bad.
Perhaps our politicians are the opposite, being so vague with any commitments they can never be accused of failing.
On the subject of head of state, I sit on the fence as I don’t think you’d start now with having a monarch, however much we respect the Queen. We can see how divisive electing an all powerful president like USA or France is, but these politically appointed presidents like Italy and Germany don’t look like any better a model.